Apple needs to stop being so reliant on the menu bar for non-pro apps

[WilliApple]

Im talking about the full screen player in Music, not full screen the app:

The menu bar is important and useful. Apple needs to double and triple down on the menu bar.

Let's definitely not ditch the Menu Bar

Hard pass. Let’s not ruin MacOS for the sake of coddling iPad users.

We don't need to remove functionality just because some people are familiar with iPad OS, or migrating from Windows.

As you can with most Mac apps, clicking the third dot takes you into fullscreen mode without ever having to visit the menu bar. A CONSISTENT behaviour across MacOS.

Also, getting rid of the menu bar is a horrible idea. It exists for a reason and has been around since the original Macintosh. Removing the menu bar would break literally every app as every app uses it.

I am not saying to remove the menu bar, just add a button in the app. Make it easier for newer users until they are ready to discover the Menu Bar.

 

[code-m]

The macOS vs iPadOS war rages on I see

Also, getting rid of the menu bar is a horrible idea. It exists for a reason and has been around since the original Macintosh. Removing the menu bar would break literally every app as every app uses it.

I like the full screen app experience on iPadOS but dislike it on macOS where I find it comforting to see the familiar menu bar, it’s like a breadcrumb where I won’t get lost 😁

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

These same users then complain that it needs more functionality, there is no pleasing anyone. Maybe Apple should make a simple mode, advance and expert that way it covers all bases and we won’t have to endure these ridiculous threads.

All power users want is sideloading, power apps on iPadOS, and a desktop mode similar to Samsung DeX. That's it. This is stuff the Galaxy Tabs already figured out.

 

[boss.king]

I am not saying to remove the menu bar, just add a button in the app.

Apple needs to ditch the menu bar​

I think you're not all that clear on what you're saying

But to address your point, it's about balance. Some controls are essential and need to be front and centre at all times, but if you start cramming everything into an app window then the UI gets cluttered. The menu bar allows them to include all the functionality they want in a place that's still really accessible, even if it's not a 1:1 copy of a much less feature-rich OS like iPadOS.

You're clearly used to how things work on an iPad, but to copy over elements from a touch-based UI to one controlled by a mouse and keyboard would not always be a great experience. I'm not saying Apple always gets this balance right — lately they've been hiding more and more basic controls under hover states, which is a usability downgrade — but they're right to keep the two interface designs more distinct.

 

[maflynn]

Why can’t it just be like DOS?, so intuitive, simple, less cpu resources, etc etc /s 😝

Actually many people do prefer the CLI and eschew the GUI, because it is faster in many respects. The Linux servers I use and support don't have any sort of fancy pants gui

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

I like the full screen app experience on iPadOS but dislike it on macOS where I find it comforting to see the familiar menu bar, it’s like a breadcrumb where I won’t get lost 😁

Get a notch Macbook. The menu bar is moved up in the added notch space in fullscreen. Not to mention having the battery percentage and clock available while fullscreen while nothing's cutting into the content is very nice.

 

[mectojic]

It's actually the opposite problem. Developers aren't using the menu bar anymore, creating a ton of inconsistency in where to find a certain function. This nonsense began with Microsoft Word in the early 2010s and spread like a virus to every other app.
The menu bar was the cleanest, purest way to find settings, so long as the developer put them in their appropriately titled menus i.e. Window refers to manipulating a window, View refers to matters of perspective/zoom.

 

[WilliApple]

It's actually the opposite problem. Developers aren't using the menu bar anymore, creating a ton of inconsistency in where to find a certain function. This nonsense began with Microsoft Word in the early 2010s and spread like a virus to every other app.
The menu bar was the cleanest, purest way to find settings, so long as the developer put them in their appropriately titled menus i.e. Window refers to manipulating a window, View refers to matters of perspective/zoom.

I actually support Microsoft on this. I would rather if Apple catches on to this and starts copying Microsoft. It just made Microsoft Word easier to use than pages.

 

[Apple Knowledge Navigator]

I don’t think the issue is with the menu bar but Apple’s reluctance to port the app to Mac with any real effort. There are many aspects to Freeform that could be improved, though unfortunately they seem happy with it having a touch-centric design.

 

[Basic75]

Maybe Apple should make a simple mode

They did make a simple mode of macOS. It's called iPadOS.

 

[Basic75]

Make it easier for newer users until they are ready to discover the Menu Bar.

As things stand Apple is already treating its users like idiots in too many places. Please don't add another big one.

 

[russell_314]

this is a bad user experience for those who are coming from an iPad or even Windows. Windows is very accessible with tabbed file explorer windows, while with macOS, it isn't so accessible.

I think your issue is macOS is different from Windows. Well, yes yes it is. Why would you come from Windows if you want Windows? You come to macOS or use macOS because you want macOS. If I wanted to use Windows, I have my Windows desktop.

As to being similar to iPadOS, I think you're going to get your wish in a few years because the Mac is going to go to touch screen and many of the UI features in iPadOS are going to be part of macOS. Ventura is just the start of this transition.

Part of going to a new operating system is learning how it works. It's not going to work like the other one because it's a different operating system and people like it because of that difference. There's no reason to make two operating systems the same because why have two at that point.


This is my favorite YouTube channel when it comes to the basics of macOS. He goes over a lot of stuff I don't know.

macmostvideo

Subscribe to MacMost to watch daily video tutorials about how to get the most from your Mac, iPad and iPhone! This show focuses on the "how to." You'll learn how to use macOS and the apps that come with your Mac. MacMost also features news, commentary reviews geared toward the casual personal...

www.youtube.com

 

[usagora]

Actually many people do prefer the CLI and eschew the GUI, because it is faster in many respects. The Linux servers I use and support don't have any sort of fancy pants gui

Plus CLI makes you feel like a real computer whiz to use!

 

[russell_314]

As things stand Apple is already treating its users like idiots in too many places. Please don't add another big one.

Unfortunately, this is part of having a large customer base. You have to make your products usable by the largest percentage possible of your customer base. If 20% can't figure out the power button turns on the computer, you make it where all the buttons turn on the computer. Your smarter customers will still use the power button but the ones that are just smashing buttons trying to figure out which one it is will still be able to use the computer. This is really a change Apple made... Not a joke!

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

I am not saying to remove the menu bar, just add a button in the app. Make it easier for newer users until they are ready to discover the Menu Bar.

Then that's not macOS, that's Windows 12.

macOS is designed so everything is in one bar where you can always find it, and have multiple windows like they're sheets of paper on a desk so whatever is forefront is what's the menu bar. It keeps it simple for the tech illiterate. It's why they've had this UI design since 1984.

 

[klasma]

I’m more annoyed that controls are often in different places between the iPhone and iPad version of an app. And that the keyboard layouts are different. It makes sense in the context of the respective device, but it messes up your muscle memory when switching between them.

 

[Unami]

I actually support Microsoft on this. I would rather if Apple catches on to this and starts copying Microsoft. It just made Microsoft Word easier to use than pages.

Maybe you're using the wrong OS... Personally I think, Word's "Ribbons" are just a horrible, work-slowing mess and Microsoft's "featuritis" of cramming every conceivable function into every app and finding five different but still obscure and convoluted ways of doing the same thing is a real productivity-killer. Although, some people seem to like that.

Just today I had to use three different Windows system apps to print something and every one of these apps had a different way and icon for getting to the print dialogue. They can't even keep consistency between their own apps. As an employee I don't care, it's my company's problem when everything takes three times longer and that I have to call the service desk once a week because something stops working. Privately, as somebody who's also self employed... I couldn't afford using windows for work.

 

[Jumpthesnark]

I actually support Microsoft on this. I would rather if Apple catches on to this and starts copying Microsoft. It just made Microsoft Word easier to use than pages.

MS Word is a hellscape of bad GUI. I feel like doing anything means you needed to be one of the engineers who designed it, because different related things (or sometimes the same things) are squirrelled away in different places. I do NOT want Apple to copy Microsoft.

My 2 cents as someone who is completely over using Windows and all MS Office apps. I realize that others come to this differently and would think "how can you use Photoshop or Lightroom when they're complex programs with all kinds of tools and different ways to manage and change those tools?" and I can only answer that it's because I've been using both pretty much daily, for years.

All of that means we learn the software we like and get used to how things are done. Microsoft isn't about to change their menus for me, and Apple isn't going to change their OS for you. We all have to learn the new stuff if we want to use it.

 

[Analog Kid]

MS Word is a hellscape of bad GUI. I feel like doing anything means you needed to be one of the engineers who designed it, because different related things (or sometimes the same things) are squirrelled away in different places. I do NOT want Apple to copy Microsoft.

My 2 cents as someone who is completely over using Windows and all MS Office apps. I realize that others come to this differently and would think "how can you use Photoshop or Lightroom when they're complex programs with all kinds of tools and different ways to manage and change those tools?" and I can only answer that it's because I've been using both pretty much daily, for years.

All of that means we learn the software we like and get used to how things are done. Microsoft isn't about to change their menus for me, and Apple isn't going to change their OS for you. We all have to learn the new stuff if we want to use it.

I just spent way more of my life that I care to admit helping someone create a graph in Excel... It should have been simple-- one table plotted as two lines with a common x axis but different y axes scales and then a little formatting for aesthetics. So many places to look and hunt for configuration options.

None of which seemed to involve the menubar, toolbar or freaking "ribbon", but rather panes and panels that open through arcane selections and right clicks.

 

[sam_dean]

Would this change improve the GUI further? If yes what improvements are to be expected?

 

[Analog Kid]

Does anyone know the history of why Windows has a menu per window and Mac has one globally? Was it just Microsoft wanting (or needing) to be different from MacOS, or was there a UX theory involved?

I know each has it's proponents-- either always knowing to look in one place and not wasting so much real estate, or having the menu close to the content without having to change with context. That feels like virtue retrospectively mapped to the decision by adherents of the platforms though.

I personally hate the hiding menubar in the more recent MacOS versions and have disabled it. I love my desktop wallpaper as much as the next person, but in the end I'm sitting in front of this thing to get stuff done.

 

[GMShadow]

I actually support Microsoft on this. I would rather if Apple catches on to this and starts copying Microsoft. It just made Microsoft Word easier to use than pages.

I think you want a PC running Windows. Most of us do not.

 

[macsound1]

Im talking about the full screen player in Music, not full screen the app:
View attachment 2153105







I am not saying to remove the menu bar, just add a button in the app. Make it easier for newer users until they are ready to discover the Menu Bar.

I don't understand what this screenshot illustrates. There's no UI except the song progress bar.

 

[WilliApple]

I don't understand what this screenshot illustrates. There's no UI except the song progress bar.

It also shows the lyrics, but that screenshot was from when I was in school who blocks Apple Music.

 

[Juuro]

Im talking about the full screen player in Music, not full screen the app:

Then you have to click on the green dot in the player if you want the player in full screen:

Oh, that ******** of an UI is called Ribbon!? Ok. I remember that I still was a windows user when Microsoft startet that mess. I suppose that was one reaseons that brought me to the Mac 15 years ago. And as I have to use Windows Apps every other month at work I see that git got much worse in those 15 years. Who on earth thinks it would be a good idea to put a huge pile of icons in three rows over the whole width of the window and that in multiple tabs? No one on earth can remember behind which of those 300 icons the function I need is hiding this time. And then do it different in each and every app even if it's made by the same company. I suppose some people in a forrest near seattle thought that would be an extremely great idea! 😳

PS: I just removed the "New tab" and the "View tab overview" icons from my Safari window, because I was suprised they are even there. 🙃