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Apple on MacBook Neo Design: 'We're Certainly Not Making Any Compromises'
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G5isAlive
Contributor
"If wishes were horses, beggars would ride."
Tahoe is here. Keep on complaining or learn to use it, your choice, because most likely the design language is here for the next few years. The most you can realistically wish for is Apple hears you and tones it down in October (you only have to wait 8 months) in the next macOS 🙂
In the meantime, Neo is clearly not for 'I remember when' tech nerds, but a younger more flexible demographic who will adapt right away to Tahoe along with the other design choices. They might even find it fun and cool. Now we know who Apple was planning for.
Neo isn't for you, or even me, but I am glad it's here to expand Apple's price range and customer base. That's a good thing for all of us.
jlc1978
macrumors 604
If I was a Mac developer I"d welcome the NEO since it represents Apple's first attempt, in a long time, to reach a wider demographic. If it works out that means an expanded customer base for developers.
tennisproha
macrumors 68020
My workflow requires multiple apps and tabs at times, not as high right now as I've seen it previously.
I have an ad blocker.
I'm still not clear what shelf-life means in this case. If yes, are you basing that on OS and security updates?
As far back as I recall, OS updates generally go on for quite a few years past discontinuation, and security updates go quite long past that. I looked up a couple examples like the 2012 MacBook Pro which got major OS updates for about 7 years past discontinuation, and has actually been getting security updates ever since with the last one just this year. Then I looked at the 2013 Mac Pro to see if it's a counter example since it wasn't updated forever. That one did only get major OS updates for 2-3 years after discontinuation, but that's an extreme case because it was sold for 6 years. But it did get its last security update only two years ago, so those seem to go on for ages.
But the Neo is a brand new device, so as I said to the other person, I don't see a reason to assert only 4-5 years of shelf-life even if that's defined by only major OS updates. There just doesn't seem to be a precedent for that at this first stage of a Mac's life cycle. Again, the most definite thing we can say is simply that it's an unknown since it's the first consumer A chip Mac, and not to mention AS Macs are still so new that none have lost any support yet.
turbineseaplane
macrumors Penryn
Perhaps unpopular opinion, but I'd take something preowned like this for the same $599, all day long and twice on Tuesdays.
jlc1978
macrumors 604
I suspect many MR readers would, but those are not nearly as readily available and unless an Apple refurb likely no eligibility or AppleCare or Apple warranty. They really aren't an option for most of teh NEO target audience, or even MR readers.
You clearly aren't the NEO's target audience and likely would not be happy with one. I'm not either but can see why it is a great device for its intended market. YMMV
So your wired memory is a grand total of 2.34GB, most of the rest is compressed and backgrounded, and the swap means you've spiked a few times beyond your current use. So even with your workflow your browser isnt using 26GB to "just browse the web". You should be using a machine with 24GB to avoid swap, but 16 is fine and you could probably make do with 8, albeit with a lot of swapping *and* your use case isnt typical of a student...
Abazigal
Contributor
Sure, if you can find one. By that logic, I can also say that because my cousin is willing to sell me a similar model at $100, every other Mac is overpriced in comparison. It’s not a phenomenon that’s scalable to the millions of people looking to get one for themselves.
There is a wider point to be made about how Apple’s device sales fail to capture the impact of the 2nd hand market (eg: someone who buys a refurbished iPhone may not make Apple any money, but they will go on to buy additional accessories and apps, of which Apple gets a cut). But that is another discussion for another day.
No MagSafe, only 8GB RAM, and an iPhone SoC. Even if it was only for FaceBook, I wouldn’t buy someone a laptop without MagSafe.
I7guy
macrumors Westmere
We are going to have a new Apple offspring in the house soon. I hope Mrs. i7guy enjoys her new Neo.
At some point he might want to play games on the computer, so I'm sorry to say apples are crappy at gaming, not because hardware limits, but most games(AAA) are not available for the Mac.
G5isAlive
Contributor
It's a fine choice. It's your choice. Might even be my choice. But that doesn't take away from the fact, for some people, their choice is the NEO, and that for them, that is a fine choice too. They don't have to rationalize that choice to you and me, and conversely we shouldn't imply they are stupid for their personal choice. They know their needs better than we do. Choice is great don't you think?
I am sure you, like myself, have been asked from friends and family more times than we can count 'what Mac should I buy?' My ego is not involved, I don't assume I know their whole situation, nor do I feel the need to pry, so when asked I always take time to research a variety of options, including the refurbished store, then a lower cost Apple option, and then a higher priced Apple option. And I explain the virtues of each choice. Maybe once someone has gone the refurb route. Usually they want a new machine. It's half and half whether they go lower priced or higher, new Apple computer.
The Neo represents another option to present. And I have no problem presenting it. It's a Mac.
eltoslightfoot
macrumors 68040
No, you bring up a good point. For a few people, like my parents, it would be okay. They buy a crap Windows laptop every other year anyway, so while the Neo would cost more, it would be a much better experience than the junk they buy. For most people, I would recommend something a little more future-proof however.
I also think that developers are going to have to get better at using less RAM as it will be a constraining factor the next few years. So, maybe the 8GB in the Neo won't be that big of a deal 4 years from now.
G5isAlive
Contributor
I hear you... It's for some people, clearly not all people. I am not going to be too compassionate towards people that buy a NEO with the idea of routinely running photoshop, blender or Logic Pro. As such, I am not worried about developers supporting it even with only 8 Gb Ram. Apple's marketing is pretty on point with 'every day tasks'
I also have been thinking about your thoughts on lifetime of the NEO (posted over several posts), and agree it's not to be used for 10 years, though people here continue to surprise me with how they can nurse old tech along. Your argument being (if I understand it), that it's not a good long term value. Agreed the original owner probably wont keep it 10 years. Where I disagree is the NEO will at least partially be bought as a child's first computer during a time their needs will be changing rapidly (no jokes.). And so its lifetime might naturally be 4 or 5 years for the original owner. At that point it doesn't have to be e-waste, for someone it will be a great deal at $100... thus making the cost of ownership roughly $100 per year. Not too shabby. And allows for future grown with changing needs.
It's hard to predict how many people will get this or need this or want this... because Apple is going after a new market. but of the people that ask me about new Macs, I have probably referenced the Walmart M1 deal to at least half of them. I will include the NEO to those people now. Time will tell. But yes, I predict it will sell well enough to stick around for a while.
In two days the numbers will start coming out. I for one plan to visit my local Apple Store to see for myself. Exciting times. My challenge will be not to get one 'just because.' Sighs. My wife would rightfully kill me. Except maybe if I got her a cute color.. hmmmmm
Rafagon
macrumors 68000
If they're entering uni for computer graphics or animation, then I agree with you. If they're going to major in English, History, or Journalism, I think 8 GB is plenty.
liorzzz
macrumors newbie
As a gamer myself, I am fully aware of that.
I moved to play on PS5 and it is much better in a lot of things- the best is that you don't need to be in a constant rush to get the latest hardware. He should be fine with that as well 🙂
Thank you for pointing it out.
With respect, the context is important — they said they weren't "making any compromises”, I just listed the compromises. I never said they weren’t reasonable for the price point, like the entry-level iPad, just don’t say you are not doing something you clearly are doing — just say you are doing them for the right reasons.
No disagreement what so ever — just don’t say "no compromises” — say “”This is why the compromises are in your best interest”.
Just don’t lie and say "no compromises”, say “carefully thought out compromises to keep largely the same experience”. Speaking in absolutes undermine the legitimate benefits.
You misunderstand my point — my issue wasn’t that no compromises should be made, nor that the price point shouldn’t be reached — just don’t lie and say "no compromises”... say the “carefully thought out compromises”.
Didn’t have an issue with any of that — just don’t lie and say "no compromises”, say why you made them and why they were a reasonable choice.
Compromises makes sense, just don’t make them then say "no compromises”.
I almost never use the magsafe ports on my personal MBA or work MBP FWIW, easier just to use the same cables for everything. Anything that ever comes with me, my phone, airpods, ipad, kindle, battery pack, external mouse… all use USBC. hell, even the electric lighter and battery powered fan I keep in my bag use USBC. Why carry an extra cable?
And at home I have USBC cables for all those devices and more by the couch, on my desk, etc. again, why leave one special cable out?
And when I’m docked on my desk the machines are getting power from the dock… through USBC/thunderbolt
dburkhanaev
macrumors 6502
I’m with you. The complaining is weird. The last time I bought a budget windows machine near the $400 price point and the machine was decent was back in 2009 and it was my first year of college buying a Toshiba Satellite.
At $599 today on the windows side is a very flimsy plastic case, 8gb ddr4 RAM, maybe 512gb SSD, and a 1080p display if you’re lucky. It’ll come with Windows 11 and you’ll be shocked to find that intel still has Celeron chips and yes, they’re still slow as snails racing on a salt slick.