Apple on MacBook Neo Design: 'We're Certainly Not Making Any Compromises'

[dburkhanaev]

Some people here talking like compromise is a bad thing and that this is the *only* MacBook available. If you choose to get this product despite needing a MacBook Air and MacBook Pro for your workflow, then you're the one who compromised, not the product. For the segment of the market this is aimed towards, this thing is more than enough.

way more than enough. This is possibly a boon. I’ve used $400-$600 Windows driven PCs and it’s painful.

 

[Detnator]

You misunderstand my point — my issue wasn’t that no compromises should be made, nor that the price point shouldn’t be reached — just don’t lie and say "no compromises”... say the “carefully thought out compromises”.

Ok, then perhaps you misunderstood the article headline and the quoted Apple spokesperson:

“Apple on MacBook Neo Design:…”

“It's undeniably a MacBook, we're certainly not making any compromises on the design…”

Line it up next to a MacBook Air and aside from color, and slightly different dimensions, you won’t notice a difference. If it looks like a Mac, and quacks like a Mac…

They could have used cheap plastic that breaks easily, or other options, and that none of the other Macs are made of, look, or feel like, but they stuck to the same design principles of the rest of the Mac lineup.

Where’s the lie?

 

[dburkhanaev]

Boiling down the term "design" to only refer to the housing materials and shape is disingenuous at best.

She wasn’t the head of software. They were interviewing the head of industrial design. That’s pretty much her wheelhouse. The rest is for other people. Maybe that’s the missing context here. This was strictly an interview discussing the build quality which I imagine will feel very solid.

 

[dburkhanaev]

I hope so!

Having a zillion 8GB RAM macOS devices out there might make them give a hoot about macOS again.

Tahoe is a flaming dumpster fire.

There are tons. They’re called iPhones. I am in agreement that Apple seriously needs to do something about leftover bugs hanging around in the macOS and iOS/ipadOS, but they’ve got tons of 8gb devices running some version of macOS.

 

[Detnator]

"'We’re certainly not making any compromises', right? 😄 There is a USB 2.0 port—a speed that debuted 26 years ago! While the other port is fine you're using an A18 Pro, not an A19 Pro; not only is there no Face ID, but Touch ID is exclusive to the high-end version. Add in only 8GB of RAM and a low-brightness, 500-nit LCD, and that’s five compromises already. 😄

Then you have the iPhone 17 Pro, which is faster and capable of significantly more storage and RAM (up to 2TB with 12GB RAM) but held back by iOS. Or an M-series iPad that could run rings around that A18 Pro MacBook, yet it’s crippled by iPadOS. It’s a damn joke."

500 nits is “low brightness”?? You can’t be serious. It’s the same brightness as the Air for one.

And have you seen the brightness on laptops on not just PC laptops at this price but at every price level? PC laptops that cost more than a MacBook Pro are still 400 nits.

LG’s flagship 32” 6K display is 360-450 nits. For $2000.

Your whole post has to be a joke. You’re comparing Apple’s base model $500 laptop that runs rings around every other laptop on earth at its price against Apple’s flagship phone and tablet at almost twice the price.

It’s great that you’re trying to compare apples to apples but you’re not even doing that right.

 

[dburkhanaev]

Best Mac ever was the 12” PowerBook 😍

I have one. Unfortunately for me I need to find it a loving home where someone might appreciate it.

 

[I7guy]

"'We’re certainly not making any compromises', right? 😄 There is a USB 2.0 port—a speed that debuted 26 years ago! While the other port is fine you're using an A18 Pro, not an A19 Pro; not only is there no Face ID, but Touch ID is exclusive to the high-end version. Add in only 8GB of RAM and a low-brightness, 500-nit LCD, and that’s five compromises already. 😄

Then you have the iPhone 17 Pro, which is faster and capable of significantly more storage and RAM (up to 2TB with 12GB RAM) but held back by iOS. Or an M-series iPad that could run rings around that A18 Pro MacBook, yet it’s crippled by iPadOS. It’s a damn joke."

With this logic one can claim the Honda Civic is a compromise because it’s not as roomy as an Escalade and not as fast as a Porsche.

The Neo may not be for you but it’s not compromised.

 

[dburkhanaev]

It's fine for college students. I went to college with a x286 desktop with 2MB RAM and was fine as a math major in the 90's. I remember for most of my advanced math and physics classes the teachers wouldn't allow calculators or computers anyway. If you need AI to do your college work for you, you shouldn't go.

But if for some reason you do. The A18 has powerful AI cores as it was introduced new for the iPhone 16.

 

[dburkhanaev]

8Gb Ram maybe is actually good. Natural way of limiting kids access to AI🤣

Not on this computer. The A18 was introduced for AI. Even with 8gb RAM. It’s an iPhone 16 pro SOC. It can handle AI.

 

[Detnator]

Steve Jobs: 'Design is not just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works.'

Take a quote out of context and you can make it say anything you want. And you’re doing that with both Steve’s and Molly’s quotes.

1. Steve was right - there are all kinds of design, and how something works is one of those kinds, and so is its physical build and look. Apple considered all those things important then and still does.

2. She’s the head of industrial design, being interviewed about her part in the Neo. She was specifically referring to the look, physical build quality and (dare I say it again, industrial) design, and clarifies that multiple times in the interview.

Needless to say, there’s nothing wrong or compromised about the Neo’s functional design any more than the Mac mini is compromised compared with the Mac Studio or the MBA vs the MBP, or a base MBP vs a maxed out one. Heck otherwise the Mac Studio and Mac Pro are compromised - they don’t even have a display, keyboard or mouse!!

 

[dburkhanaev]

I would say any compromise is right out of the Apple play book, the two USBC ports being uneven for instance, given Apples bulk buying power and leverage I can't help thinking they would have gotten a way better per unit price going for the higher grade port for both, or at least to make so little difference cost wise to make no difference. The real reason is most likely a punitive one along the lines of this ' this is all you can have at this price point, should have gone for the upgrade' Apple maintaining product differentiation.

It’s an iPhone 16 SOC. you’re lucky it’s getting a second port at all.

 

[dburkhanaev]

Dell looks good

For five minutes. And then their matte finished, brush aluminum colored plastic, looks faded and then the computer just looks old and worn out. Even if it isn’t.

 

[dburkhanaev]

USB 2.0 is there for printing. Don’t see students using thumb drives these days when you can upload to the cloud.
Time Machine backups will take a while but those can be run at night. I’m guessing that’s Apple’s logic.

I would use the USB 3 port for a backup. But at 450mb/s you can still use thumb drives and other small data transfers quickly enough.

 

[Detnator]

I would say any compromise is right out of the Apple play book, the two USBC ports being uneven for instance, given Apples bulk buying power and leverage I can't help thinking they would have gotten a way better per unit price going for the higher grade port for both, or at least to make so little difference cost wise to make no difference. The real reason is most likely a punitive one along the lines of this ' this is all you can have at this price point, should have gone for the upgrade' Apple maintaining product differentiation.

Your conspiracy theory has no basis in facts. Seems you don’t understand how these things work.

As the previous person above replied, it’s an iPhone chip, that can normally only support one USB port of any kind, but they figured out how to make it support two.

Sure, they could have put an M-series chip in it for better USB support but not at this price. 99% of users of this thing will rarely use one port other than for charging let alone two. Why should they be forced to pay for more?

And that’s the case for every “compromise” in this machine. They don’t want or need more. Why should they pay for it? And if they do, they can still pay for it as has been the option for before this machine existed. Buy the MBA, or MBP.

All the hullabaloo about the 12” rMB having only one port so can’t charge it and plug in anything else at the same time… they fixed that for this one. Maybe for this Neo they should have provided only one USB3 port and MagSafe, but people would still complain.

Want a very budget friendly Mac laptop at a price lower than every other Mac laptop ever made (since 1991), you now have that option, and not only is it a Mac but it trounces every other laptop at this price in every practical way, while still giving you macOS.

Want something better? No worries. You still have that option as well, in spades.

What’s the problem?

 

[dburkhanaev]

I’d honestly rather it be plastic if it meant getting some other features.

The old unibody plastic or the iPhone 5c stuff. They make Apple TV and chargers and AirPods out of plastic so they are good with it.

Give it full USB and 16gb ram and backlit keys and it’s golden. Chip is perfect fine sitting between M1 and M2 in capability, for the majority of people especially if they can get Tahoe back to the same performance as Sequoia.

It has full USB 3. The USB 2 port is a bonus and wasn’t expected on an iPhone SOC. You also can’t get 16gb of RAM on the A18 chip. It’s an entry segment portable with a unibody aluminum frame that will likely feel fairly snappy in day-to-day operations. For the intended audience

 

[Detnator]

I know you are going to go hard to bat for them but this quote (taken from the full interview on dezeen.com) is just outright false. Is she really trying to claim that older technology hasn't been used in this product?!

Your reading comprehension skills need work.

The entire interview she’s talking about her part in the machine: the industrial design.

Apple has for decades provided older less powerful chips for less $. The Macintosh LC ran a 68020 when the 68040 Quadra’s were around.

There is nothing false in anything she is saying.

 

[Detnator]

I can get a cheaper priced laptop that does better than this put together device .

Sure you can. Show us. (And not used or refurb).

 

[eltoslightfoot]

I’m with you. The complaining is weird. The last time I bought a budget windows machine near the $400 price point and the machine was decent was back in 2009 and it was my first year of college buying a Toshiba Satellite.

At $599 today on the windows side is a very flimsy plastic case, 8gb ddr4 RAM, maybe 512gb SSD, and a 1080p display if you’re lucky. It’ll come with Windows 11 and you’ll be shocked to find that intel still has Celeron chips and yes, they’re still slow as snails racing on a salt slick.

Okay, look, why can't you just say it's a great mac at a cheap price? I don't know where you are looking, but I literally found this Lenovo Ideapad 3 right now at best buy for $100 less than the Macbook Neo: twice the RAM, twice the hard drive, a really good Processor (Definitely not Celeron) AMD Ryzen 7 5825U, decent chassis, famed Thinkpad-like keyboard, and 10 hour battery life.

Lenovo IdeaPad Slim 3 15.6" Full HD Touchscreen Laptop AMD Ryzen 7 5825U 2022 16GB Memory 512GB SSD Arctic Grey 82XM00LMUS - Best Buy

Shop Lenovo IdeaPad Slim 3 15.6" Full HD Touchscreen Laptop AMD Ryzen 7 5825U 2022 16GB Memory 512GB SSD Arctic Grey products at Best Buy. Find low everyday prices and buy online for delivery or in-store pick-up. Price Match Guarantee.

www.bestbuy.com

Does it match the Neo? Well not on processor speed, screen brightness, or battery life. But it has more and faster ports (including a separate power port), double the RAM and SSD, and is far from as slow as "snails racing on a salt lick". Oh and you save a hundred bucks.

Heck for the same price I can get an HP Omnibook 5 Flip 2-1 that has 16 GB Ram, an Intel Core 7 150U, 512GB SSD, and a touchscreen with freaking stylus.

HP OmniBook 5 Flip 2 in 1 14" 2K Touch Screen Laptop Intel Core 7 150U 2024 16GB Memory 512GB SSD Glacier Silver 14-fp0023dx - Best Buy

Shop HP OmniBook 5 Flip 2 in 1 14" 2K Touch Screen Laptop Intel Core 7 150U 2024 16GB Memory 512GB SSD Glacier Silver products at Best Buy. Find low everyday prices and buy online for delivery or in-store pick-up. Price Match Guarantee.

www.bestbuy.com

So, again, the Neo wins on battery life, screen brightness, battery power, and on the processor. The HP wins on screen size, twice the RAM and SSD, backlit keyboard, tons of ports and separate power port, touch screen, and a freaking stylus.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

Sure you can. Show us. (And not used or refurb).

See above.

 

[seek3r]

Okay, look, why can't you just say it's a great mac at a cheap price? I don't know where you are looking, but I literally found this Lenovo Ideapad 3 right now at best buy for $100 less than the Macbook Neo: twice the RAM, twice the hard drive, a really good Processor (Definitely not Celeron) AMD Ryzen 7 5825U, decent chassis, famed Thinkpad-like keyboard, and 10 hour battery life.

Lenovo IdeaPad Slim 3 15.6" Full HD Touchscreen Laptop AMD Ryzen 7 5825U 2022 16GB Memory 512GB SSD Arctic Grey 82XM00LMUS - Best Buy

Shop Lenovo IdeaPad Slim 3 15.6" Full HD Touchscreen Laptop AMD Ryzen 7 5825U 2022 16GB Memory 512GB SSD Arctic Grey products at Best Buy. Find low everyday prices and buy online for delivery or in-store pick-up. Price Match Guarantee.

www.bestbuy.com

Does it match the Neo? Well not on processor speed, screen brightness, or battery life. But it has more and faster ports (including a separate power port), double the RAM and SSD, and is far from as slow as "snails racing on a salt lick". Oh and you save a hundred bucks.

Heck for the same price I can get an HP Omnibook 5 Flip 2-1 that has 16 GB Ram, an Intel Core 7 150U, 512GB SSD, and a touchscreen with freaking stylus.

HP OmniBook 5 Flip 2 in 1 14" 2K Touch Screen Laptop Intel Core 7 150U 2024 16GB Memory 512GB SSD Glacier Silver 14-fp0023dx - Best Buy

Shop HP OmniBook 5 Flip 2 in 1 14" 2K Touch Screen Laptop Intel Core 7 150U 2024 16GB Memory 512GB SSD Glacier Silver products at Best Buy. Find low everyday prices and buy online for delivery or in-store pick-up. Price Match Guarantee.

www.bestbuy.com

So, again, the Neo wins on battery life, screen brightness, battery power, and on the processor. The HP wins on screen size, twice the RAM and SSD, backlit keyboard, tons of ports and separate power port, touch screen, and a freaking stylus.

Both of those have *substantially* lower res lower quality displays than the neo, substantially more anemic graphics (and worth remembering btw that a nice chunk of that extra RAM is going to need to get allocated to the iGPUs along with the need for ram duplication), they’re both a pound heavier than the neo, cruddier chunkier plastic builds, have worse cameras, I suspect worse keyboards, definitely worse trackpads, come with windows 11 home edition (not pro) and, maybe most importantly, are sold out and appear to have been for months, which means you cant actually buy them at that price.

It really doesn’t matter what the list price is if I can’t actually buy it

 

[Jumpthesnark]

Just don’t lie and say "no compromises”, say “carefully thought out compromises to keep largely the same experience”.

If you read the interview, she said "It's undeniably a MacBook, we're certainly not making any compromises on the design and that's really important." So if we're being pedantic, perhaps quote her correctly, and in context.

She's talking about the design and materials. Period. Not the features you described here:

Maybe not cheaper materials, but cheaper components in some cases — like the non-haptic track pad, slower SSD, non Display P3 screen, non-backlit keyboard, non Wi-Fi 7 connectivity, and no thunderbolt.

Molly Anderson is the head of Apple's industrial design team. She is discussing the industrial design concepts that went into the Neo. Not the technology underlying the trackpad, or the color space of the screen, or other features.

Anderson said, "The goal was to make a beautiful product that could reach many more people." She's discussing design and materials, and you're calling her a liar for not discussing things that aren't the topic of the interview.

The interview is in a publication about design. She is talking about design. The MR article uses a headline that is about the Neo's design, and it says "Apple has insisted that it did not make any design compromises," so that's the topic being discussed here.

 

[jlc1978]

Both of those have *substantially* lower res lower quality displays than the neo, substantially more anemic graphics (and worth remembering btw that a nice chunk of that extra RAM is going to need to get allocated to the iGPUs along with the need for ram duplication), they’re both a pound heavier than the neo, cruddier chunkier plastic builds, have worse cameras, I suspect worse keyboards, definitely worse trackpads, come with windows 11 home edition (not pro) and, maybe most importantly, are sold out and appear to have been for months, which means you cant actually buy them at that price.

Anyone can find something selling for less, what it comes down to is what you value. If the Neo matched those PC specs people would complain about battery life, outdated processors, screen NITS (which they are already whining about), etc. The NEO isn't for everybody nor perfect, but it certainly is a good machine for the intended audience.

If you read the interview, she said "It's undeniably a MacBook, we're certainly not making any compromises on the design and that's really important." So if we're being pedantic, perhaps quote her correctly, and in context.

She's talking about the design and materials. Period. Not the features you described here:

Some people seem to take literally what was said, and ignore the actual message or context. Others just like criticize. Some actually discuss things rationally.

Welcome to MacRumors...

 

[neuropsychguy]

Maybe, but I have been there too many times when I make recommendations that start out as overkill and end up just right as the "tech guy." My father-in-law used the Dell 15 XPS laptop I recommended for 10 years. It was overkill when he started using the thing, but a decade later it was still hanging on. That laptop ended up costing him $120 a year. What a bargain!

I recommend this thing (the Neo) to someone, it has a shelf life of like 4 years tops--maybe 5 years. Not good. It just isn't a good deal. Same in the Windows world. My dad buys a $400 piece of junk every year. If he would pay twice as much, it would last SO much longer.

So maybe what you are saying is true, but then again, maybe not. A previous generation Macbook Air is going to last FAR longer than this Neo for what a $100 more? And I just can't bring myself to recommend it, that's okay that you can.

So a Dell XPS that effectively cost $120 a year is a bargain, but a $600 laptop that should last 4-5 years ($120 - $150 per year) "just isn't a good deal"? I'm not sure how the logic of that statement works.

 

[neuropsychguy]

What’s the problem?

The problem is that some people want Apple to sell products for less than they do, even if Apple would lose money on them.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

So a Dell XPS that effectively cost $120 a year is a bargain, but a $600 laptop that should last 4-5 years ($120 - $150 per year) "just isn't a good deal"? I'm not sure how the logic of that statement works.

The difference is in the quality of the device. I will have FAR fewer compromises with a $1200 Macbook or $1200 windows device.

But, I have since come around that people clearly know what these devices are and are not, and if a person is fine with all the issues (lack of usb ports--especially good ones, no backlight on the keyboard, only 8 GB of RAM, small hard drive, etc.,) then, yes, I agree with you.

I will say the, "why can't my Macbook Neo play game 'x' (Cyberpunk 2077)?" posts are going to be crazy in a month or two on Reddit.