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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cu1JMbSLPvc

It hasn't even come out yet. Give it a few years before declaring it a rousing success.

Apple has been known to develop great ideas and royally F up the execution.

While that's true, it's highly likely to work, at the very least as a long-term business plan strategy – people are gonna want to use their phones to make payment rather than unnecessarily carrying around a wallet full of little plastic cards, as it makes sense to them from both practical and (if it works as it should) security angles (lost/stolen phones cannot be used to defraud anywhere near as easily as cards would).

Do the maths, and this really is one of Apple's biggest earners, for relatively little effort once launched and running smoothly.

Think about it, when this (or if this fails, Apple Pay v2!) eventually rolls out worldwide for people's everyday spending, collecting 0.15% per transaction is A LOT of money, even for Apple.

Americans alone spent last year $14 trillion on shopping. At 0.15% that's $21 billion. If Apple got 20% of that spending through Apple Pay; that's $4.2 billion.

Say Europe has the same figure; that's another $4.2 billion.
Add the same figure again for other (non-US/EU) developed countries; yet another $4.2 billion.
And perhaps add double that figure for the rest of world's shopping spending; another $8.4 billion.

We get to $21 billion EACH AND EVERY year in Apple Pay revenue for Apple, and that'd be growing. That's 12% of Apple's current annual revenue, so hardly chump-change.

And even if their other product lines started to slow in uptake, this one would grow year-on-year, as people will spend money on non-Apple things regardless.
 
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Can't see this being available in the UK anytime soon
The UK doesn't need this in the way that the US does. The UK moved over to secure "Chip and Pin" credit card processing in 2004 - ten years ago. In the US, you still sign pieces of paper when you use your credit card. For them secure credit cards are still a novelty.
 
I'm a loyal apple fan, but I'm going to let the rest of the world beta test this for me. Recall how just plain wonderful and obvious the cloud sounded when Apple introduced .Mac? That had serious issues. They dumped that and tried again with MobileMe. Still had big issues. They dumped that and tried again with iCloud - and that still has issues even now... I'm not saying Apple are incompetent, just that they are often too aggressive rolling out immature software - in part because the whole thing was typically a too minimally tested super secret at launch time.

I get that somebody has to take the first step, and Apple is a fine leader, but we're talking about managing my money here so I'm going to enter conservative mode and watch this play out for a while.
 
Is this going to be available outside of the United States?

I doubt it. Have you seen how many countries have iTunes Radio?

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Can't see this being available in the UK anytime soon

I can't either even though if it was I would definitely use it. It would also sway me to upgrade my 4s to a 6 - at the moment when my contract expires I'm likely to go with the 5s.
 
I really find it disappointing it's only going to be available in the United States at first. So far I have seen how easy it is to use, I would LOVE to have it in the Netherlands! :p

The worst thing is that it isn't only Apple Pay that won't be available here in a while. Siri and iTunes Radio aren't working in the Netherlands either. Apple is really falling behind on support for features in different countries... :(
 
The UK doesn't need this in the way that the US does. The UK moved over to secure "Chip and Pin" credit card processing in 2004 - ten years ago. In the US, you still sign pieces of paper when you use your credit card. For them secure credit cards are still a novelty.

Very true, but there are still reasons I like the idea behind Apple Pay:
- more secure than chip and pin : http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2008/02/26/chip-pin-terminals-vulnerable-to-simple-attacks
- more secure than wave pay - need to use Touch ID to pay, wave pay is always "on" so anyone scanning past my wallet could in theory deduct up to £20 from my credit card.
- the merchant can't skim the mag stripe and doesn't get to see my name/sig/security digits
- less cards carrying around in my wallet = thinner wallet
- more secure if I lose my phone - anyone finding it can't use my Apple Pay (I lose my wallet, they have my cards).
- More secure online, all these sites that store card details that are getting hacked is getting worrying - with the token system with Apple Pay that should no longer be a problem.
 
:apple:pay is clearly just to sell iPhones, nothing more. If it also makes money, great.

I suspect that it will roll out in Europe in 2015 and the uptake will be far quicker than the US, mainly because we already have lots of retailers with NFC card readers so the underlying system is already there.
 
Very true, but there are still reasons I like the idea behind Apple Pay:
- more secure than chip and pin : http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2008/02/26/chip-pin-terminals-vulnerable-to-simple-attacks
This has nothing to do with Apple Pay. This is an issue on the terminal side, not on the card side. Besides, it's a relatively minor issue that has already been fixed and has never been exploited.
- more secure than wave pay - need to use Touch ID to pay, wave pay is always "on" so anyone scanning past my wallet could in theory deduct up to £20 from my credit card.
This is a business choice. Convenience/speed versus risk. Doesn't mean any of the technologies is more secure than the other.
- the merchant can't skim the mag stripe and doesn't get to see my name/sig/security digits
Chip and PIN doesn't use the magstripe, so irrelevant.
- less cards carrying around in my wallet = thinner wallet
True.
- more secure if I lose my phone - anyone finding it can't use my Apple Pay (I lose my wallet, they have my cards).
Yeah, but your PIN is in your head and your fingerprint is on the device, so theoratically, is Apple Pay really more secure? My opinion: one call to the bank and your card is blocked, whether physical on or your iPhone, so not really an issue at all for both technologies.
- More secure online, all these sites that store card details that are getting hacked is getting worrying - with the token system with Apple Pay that should no longer be a problem.
Very true.

Apple Pay isn't really more secure than anything else (except for card not present transactions), however, it is much more convenient.

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:apple:pay is clearly just to sell iPhones, nothing more. If it also makes money, great.
This is pretty much true for everything Apple does regarding to the iPhone. :confused:

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I'm a loyal apple fan, but I'm going to let the rest of the world beta test this for me. Recall how just plain wonderful and obvious the cloud sounded when Apple introduced .Mac? That had serious issues. They dumped that and tried again with MobileMe. Still had big issues. They dumped that and tried again with iCloud - and that still has issues even now... I'm not saying Apple are incompetent, just that they are often too aggressive rolling out immature software - in part because the whole thing was typically a too minimally tested super secret at launch time.

I get that somebody has to take the first step, and Apple is a fine leader, but we're talking about managing my money here so I'm going to enter conservative mode and watch this play out for a while.
Not really. Your overestimating Apple's part in the complete transaction chain. All Apple is really doing is providing you with the option for authenticating yourself to a POS terminal using your iPhone. That's it. The complete transaction itself is still managed as usual (or at least for the most part). So actually Apple Pay has little to do with the cloud. All your credentials are stored locally.
 
Mostly because it's not super clear that my credit union Visa won't work. This is in contrast to how google wallet seems to work with any credit card and to the consumer it would make sense that any card that can be used to make purchases through itunes should work. I guess for Apple Pay there is more needed on the back end to work intimately with banks than just processing a credit card payment???
It's very clear on apple.com which institutions have implemented VISA's Token Service (or mastercard's equivalent) for implementing Apple's implementation of the EMVco tokenization standard called Apple Pay.

If your Credit Union isnt listed, too bad.

Google Wallet is **** for this reason you state, no tokenization, all processed through a proxy credit card account they control.

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The UK doesn't need this in the way that the US does. The UK moved over to secure "Chip and Pin" credit card processing in 2004 - ten years ago. In the US, you still sign pieces of paper when you use your credit card. For them secure credit cards are still a novelty.
Ignorance like this will keep the UK in the dark ages.

Chip and pin protects from skimming.

With Chip and pink the store still gets your PAN, they can still store it, they can still be hacked for it... Such as recent examples from Neiman Marcus, Target, and Home Depot.

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So Apple pay will only work with a handful of the largest banks in the nation? Suddenly it becomes useless to anyone using a slightly smaller, or regional, bank... Kinda pointless if BANKS have to opt in, too; it is bad enough that retailers have to opt in (if more understandable).

Retailers only have to implement NFC.
Their NFC terminal and payment processor relays the token (which looks just like a visa acct number) to VISA. And they handle it in their Token Service. And report back authorization.

The issuing bank has to implement and connect into the VISA token service, so the tokens can be registered.
 
- more secure than wave pay - need to use Touch ID to pay, wave pay is always "on" so anyone scanning past my wallet could in theory deduct up to £20 from my credit card.
Yeah and someone can also pick pocket your wallet or your phone.
 
Users will be able to set up Apple Pay in Passbook or through the Settings app, as up to eight credit or debit cards be connected with an iTunes account or by scanning one in with the iPhone's camera. Every card connected to the service will allow users to access a number of features, including the ability to see a simple transaction list, the ability to turn on push notifications, and an area that allows quick access to a bank's phone number and an accompanying app. Passbook will also be able to automatically update an expired card with a new expiration date without the need to re-enter information.

So are my card details connected to my iTunes account?
 
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While that's true, it's highly likely to work, at the very least as a long-term business plan strategy – people are gonna want to use their phones to make payment rather than unnecessarily carrying around a wallet full of little plastic cards, as it makes sense to them from both practical and (if it works as it should) security angles (lost/stolen phones cannot be used to defraud anywhere near as easily as cards would).

Do the maths, and this really is one of Apple's biggest earners, for relatively little effort once launched and running smoothly.

Think about it, when this (or if this fails, Apple Pay v2!) eventually rolls out worldwide for people's everyday spending, collecting 0.15% per transaction is A LOT of money, even for Apple.

Americans alone spent last year $14 trillion on shopping. At 0.15% that's $21 billion. If Apple got 20% of that spending through Apple Pay; that's $4.2 billion.

Say Europe has the same figure; that's another $4.2 billion.
Add the same figure again for other (non-US/EU) developed countries; yet another $4.2 billion.
And perhaps add double that figure for the rest of world's shopping spending; another $8.4 billion.

We get to $21 billion EACH AND EVERY year in Apple Pay revenue for Apple, and that'd be growing. That's 12% of Apple's current annual revenue, so hardly chump-change.

And even if their other product lines started to slow in uptake, this one would grow year-on-year, as people will spend money on non-Apple things regardless.
Fantastic, how much do we get.
 
Irrelevant if it is true or not. There will be a Samsung paid blogger posting YouTube videos about how to 'easily' hack it two days in. Even if the vids are revealed to be fake after 2 hours the damage is still done. I'm still hearing people talking about that bendgate nonsense that was debunked weeks ago :(

A few years ago there were links to a website flying around that demonstrated how Samsung had all the cool iPhone features on their phone in 2006. Turned out to be _almost_ real websites where the year "2007" of an event had been changed to "2006".

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Apple Pay isn't really more secure than anything else (except for card not present transactions), however, it is much more convenient.

There is one big difference: With Apple Pay, the merchant doesn't know your credit card number. So if another merchant loses tens of millions of credit card numbers, or some merchant hires a crooked employee who writes down credit card numbers, you are safe from that if you use Apple Pay.
 
Or is that just blind loyalty to Apple?

The rest of us in the world will continue having our time wasted.... How exactly is apple pay faster than contact less payments ?

Wasting your time is changing your shopping habits to shop in places that offer one payment system ;)

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Yup , introducing something that is so awesome but only works under certain conditions or locations ;)

Make me think of the amazing FireWire , thunderbolt etc etc.
Went to the Apple Store on the weekend to enquire about hooking up two non thungerbolt minitors to an air with a friend. He was very unimpressed when he realized it meant buying two apple screens with thunderbolt. He already had two very good monitors at home. This is EXACTLY what apple is about. It's really simple if you use what they tell you to use .

It won't be long until everyone offers it. If Apple does something, it explodes. No one cared about NFC before. Now almost every store will implement it within a year or two. Watch and see. And yes, Apple Pay is a hell of a lot more convenient than pulling out cards.

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That should light a fire under them.

I'm sure it won't matter, and that's fine. At least they'll know why I'm switching though. If enough people do the same, they'll start to care. They'll have to. ;)
 
:apple:pay is clearly just to sell iPhones, nothing more. If it also makes money, great.

I suspect that it will roll out in Europe in 2015 and the uptake will be far quicker than the US, mainly because we already have lots of retailers with NFC card readers so the underlying system is already there.

Well Europe is rather broad. And in the European country I live in, there are almost no retailers with NFC.
 
Should be interesting to see how fast Apple Pay is adopted by retail stores in general.

Very interesting indeed. I have this feeling most are underestimating just how big this will be for Apple. This seems to be exactly what mobile payments should be.

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Mostly because it's not super clear that my credit union Visa won't work. This is in contrast to how google wallet seems to work with any credit card and to the consumer it would make sense that any card that can be used to make purchases through itunes should work. I guess for Apple Pay there is more needed on the back end to work intimately with banks than just processing a credit card payment???

Good guess!

The banks are required or need to support the secure transactions in their software systems. Some place on the net there was a thread with a guy claiming to be a developer with a bank that spent crazy hours on bringing all of this together. It isn't a trivial thing to support.
 
So are my card details connected to my iTunes account?

No. You have the option to allow the card on your iTunes account as the default but you can add other cards there and they are stored locally on the device. If you get a new phone you'll have to add the cards back in again, which I see could be cumbersome but if it means that they don't have my info stored in the cloud somewhere that's more security for me.
 
C'mon Apple! Enable this in the UK already! We already have the infrastructure. We already have people doing this on their phones daily. There is simply no reason why Apple Pay cannot be activated in the UK right now.
 
You're greatly exaggerating other people's posts. You obviously have a problem with their enthusiasm towards Apple Pay, so you're trying to make them seem irrational. Is it too much to ask for to just let people be happy?

Being able to pay with apple's is making us happy.
I have got a whole basket of them !
 
What Apple should do is buy these NFC readers in huge quantities at a very good price and then offer them to small merchants for a nominal fee or even free. This would really get the ball rolling on Apple pay.
Edit: in Exchange for an Apple pay logo decal in every window.

Think iPad Air 2'here. I can see the iPad shipping with the readers either as a special model or option.
 
No. You have the option to allow the card on your iTunes account as the default but you can add other cards there and they are stored locally on the device. If you get a new phone you'll have to add the cards back in again, which I see could be cumbersome but if it means that they don't have my info stored in the cloud somewhere that's more security for me.

Just a slight correction. None of the actual credit card information is stored locally on the device or on Apple's servers anywhere. A secure token is created when you submit the card info and this is the only piece of information stored locally on the NFC secure element on the iPhone. Nobody's actual information is stored anywhere, locally or otherwise.
 
Seriously, the NSA stuff is getting old. The NSA doesn't care about the underwear you just bought at Walmart.

Google, on the other hand...

Except Google doesn't come and throw you in a cage when you do something they don't like. And you don't HAVE to use their services. And they don't assume you're doing something wrong. They do work for the gov just as much as Apple though...
 
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