Apple Promotes Face ID as Even Easier and More Secure Than Touch ID in Humorous New iPhone Ad

[gnasher729]

How is your phone storing a 3D mapping of your face more 'creepy' than your phone storing your fingerprints? For the record, I don't think either of these things are 'creepy' as long as the biometrics are encrypted and never leave the device -- which, according to Apple, is the case.

The biometrics not only doesn’t leave your device, it also isn’t accessible to any software on the device. All that software can do is ask “is the user looking at the phone” and get the answer “yes” or “no” or “cancelled” (or errors like “no biometrics stored” or “device doesn’t support biometrics”
[doublepost=1562820864][/doublepost]Any evidence for that? Years ago when iPhoto added face recognition one lady posted “nobody can keep my twin sons apart, but iPhoto does”.

Faceid doesn’t work like the human eye. For example Apple showed models with total war paint make up, who were completely unrecognisable to humans, and FaceId worked.

 

[gnasher729]

This ad is in response to experiences like this.

Plus, if Face ID is as great as Apple claims then why do the new Macbook Air and Macbook Pro have Touch ID instead? Such fragmentation.

That’s what two idiots in south east Asia posted. They figured out that they could train FaceId to recognise a 3D mask of your face. What they didn’t say is that you can only do that if you have the device pass code, and with the device passcode you are either the legitimate owner, or you can delete the legitimate owners FaceId and add your own.

What they did was like saying “if you have the keys to my home, you can enter, go to the garage, find a hammer, use the hammer to smash a window, climb through the window and rob me”.

Since this story was totally debunked two years ago, why are you bringing it up again?
[doublepost=1562821822][/doublepost]

Then how is it in the ad it says the probability is 1 in 50000 for Touch ID? Is it not 1 in a billion since fingerprint is unique? Or does it mean that Apple Touch ID sensor or software is unreliable at best because the probability is 1 out of 50000? Or perhaps they mislead us with this ad regarding with the security of the two services they provide so that people will upgrade.

Your fingerprints are not always the same. Use some tools, or cut your finger, and your finger prints get damaged. So requiring a 100% match wouldn’t work.

Apple has to decide what counts as “match” vs no match. They could accept only one in a million fingerprints of other people, but then your own fingerprints would fail more often.
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Touch ID is one in 50,000 ?? And millions of people are using that for banking, email, logins etc???

If I lose my bank card or you steal it, chances are 3 in10,000 that you guess my PIN in the three attempts you have, so it is 15 times better. But there are people who hang around ATMs with a camera, trying to find your passcode if you use your card, and then steal your card. Lots of ways to steal your money that don’t work with touchid.

 

[Lalatoon]

Your fingerprints are not always the same. Use some tools, or cut your finger, and your finger prints get damaged. So requiring a 100% match wouldn’t work.

Apple has to decide what counts as “match” vs no match. They could accept only one in a million fingerprints of other people, but then your own fingerprints would fail more often.

I experienced that, cut my fingers with a kitchen knife and fingerprint sensor did not recognized my finger because of the scar.

But it does not answer the question how is Face ID much more secure than Touch Id. The argument you gave above applies to Face ID.

How did they come up with only 1 in 50000 for Touch ID while for Face ID it suddenly is 1 in 1m? I fear that this more of marketing not of true security assessment of their product. In that case misleading consumer to buying their product which is not more secure than the previous one or perhaps maybe inferior.

 

[knirirr]

If information gained by apps via API calls to the Face ID system is able to be transmitted to third parties, that's a problem. You don't know that that's happening, I don't think.

That data are being transmitted from the phone due to advertising SDKs has been established, and it's also clear that Apple aren't enormously keen on allowing users to prevent this.
It's also possible for apps running on the phone to interact with the camera, although I don't know the full extent of what's going on there, of course.

You're simply conjecturing that, in your estimation, it could happen.

Yes, that's right.

Now, as for things that privacy proponents should worry about today ... your face is almost certainly captured on anywhere from five to five hundred cameras on any given day.

Yes, I am also worried about that. It's difficult to deal with, unlike a facial recognition sensor on my phone which can be easily avoided by the simple expedient of not buying a new iPhone (my 8 will last some time yet).

 

[dk001]

The biometrics not only doesn’t leave your device, it also isn’t accessible to any software on the device. All that software can do is ask “is the user looking at the phone” and get the answer “yes” or “no” or “cancelled” (or errors like “no biometrics stored” or “device doesn’t support biometrics”
[doublepost=1562820864][/doublepost]Any evidence for that? Years ago when iPhoto added face recognition one lady posted “nobody can keep my twin sons apart, but iPhoto does”.

Faceid doesn’t work like the human eye. For example Apple showed models with total war paint make up, who were completely unrecognisable to humans, and FaceId worked.

After testing an X last year (for 30 days) and now using an XS Max for a couple of weeks, I have to say that Face ID is far less accurate than Touch ID. Especially in non-vertical situations. Both have their hits and misses I find I am using my password far more often under Face ID than I ever was under Touch ID. A lot more. Still, it is my new work device so I need to get used to it.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

actually they are competition less, there is only 1 other competitor which is Android and Windows on desktop. Compare to something with real competition like automobile market, airline carriers, fast food...etc

You can’t say they are competition less and then say they have only 1 other competitor. 1 competitor means that “competition less” is incorrect. Little completion, maybe, but even that’s not true based on the following”

These are Apple’s competitors in the Mobile space, MUCH more than just 1. Grouping all competitors under “Android” just to make it sound like fewer would be like grouping Burger King, McDonald’s and Wendy’s under “Burgers” as if there’s no distinction between them.

 

[Tech198]

How can it be unlocked if you never go to home screen?

 

[MacBH928]

You can’t say they are competition less and then say they have only 1 other competitor. 1 competitor means that “competition less” is incorrect. Little completion, maybe, but even that’s not true based on the following”
View attachment 847742
These are Apple’s competitors in the Mobile space, MUCH more than just 1. Grouping all competitors under “Android” just to make it sound like fewer would be like grouping Burger King, McDonald’s and Wendy’s under “Burgers” as if there’s no distinction between them.

Your competition is on the hardware level, I am talking about the platform level. Its either iOS or Android, this is just 1 step away from a monopoly which is 1 provider, here we have 2. If there were other companies that build iOS phones like on the Android side, then I can consider that there is competition, but if you want iOS you HAVE to choose Apple's FaceID only iPhone.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Your competition is on the hardware level,

Not really MY competition, the way folks who study this industry refers to competition.
Having 1 competitor, especially when that competitor sells VASTLY better (Group all Android together and they consistently outsell iOS) doesn’t equate to competitonless.

The point you’re trying to make, that iOS doesn’t have competition, just isn’t true as long as Android exists (and Tizen and KaiOS).

 

[Hi Tek]

Based on what I've read here. Kind of a long post. But I just read every comment up to this point: My $0.02

• I like Face ID more overall. I'll never forget the time I cut my finger using a kitchen knife, I had a bandage around my thumb, I had to add my index finger. I did try my left thumb but I use my iPhone in my right hand so I always had to remind myself not to use that hand
• This whole "can't unlock while lying in bed": if screen orientation is on and you are using the iPhone sideways while laying down, it does unlock. Period. Also, I have a dock on my nightstand for watch + iPhone, I lean over and tap my screen when I wake up in the morningBOOM, iPhone unlocked, so between the orientation suggestion and my charge dock situation, the whole "can't use in bed" thing doesn't apply to me at all
• Apple Pay:

cashier: "cash or debit"
me: "CC/debit" - (if for some reason I'm not using Apple Watch to pay) - *cashier inputs button to prompt POS terminal / at the time same time or a few seconds before, I'm double clicking power button for Apple Pay/card selection. I already double clicked so I won't need to do it again, I tap my card as I have mine and my wife's card in wallet, done. If I had Touch ID I would have to do all that but the final step is to have device recognize my finger, POS reads me tap, done. I feel TouchID process is longer and always have, but that's just my exp. personally.

*don't wait until prompted by POS to use Apple Pay. But I mean really if you have an Apple Watch your missing out on paying fast while looking cool doing it at the same time lol.*

• If I need to go hide somewhere in PUBG and text fiancé because Apple Watch just isn't enough for some situations. I tap my screen laying FLAT ON MY GAMING DESK, and voice dictate to her to quickly respond - while still playing Xbox.. (Face ID unlocked so that I could tap message notification. I rarely pick up my iPhone to unlock, then reply to message)
• again, hands get dirty, wet, etc. I know that I have to wipe my hands on something in order to use Touch ID, Picking up my phone to have it just unlock so I can scrub back 30sec to something funny I heard on a podcast I'm listening to while doing dishes is great, and it's something I appreciate often
• glasses: I can only speak for sunglasses, Summer started a bit late where I am, I totally forgot while changing songs in the car that I'm wearing sunglasses, still unlocking no issues, no delay.
• TouchID // FaceID detection:
• Anyone ever see that episode of Punisher (Netflix) where he needed access to an iPhone with touchID? he chopped dudes thumb off and took it with him, then took the finger out of his pocket, and unlocked the iPhone. I laughed at that scene and think of that when I read threads topics like this one

TouchID - reading a long paragraph, screen starts to dim "whoops need to wake it and let it know that even know I haven't touched the screen in 30-60sec, I'm still looking at my iPhone screen.
FaceID - unlock once. read the same paragraph until it makes sense with no pressure to read quickly before having to tap the screen again. FaceID hardware see's that your attention is on the screen even know you've been reading the same reddit post for 4mins because, well, Reddit... Which I use multiple times a day. That's another thing I appreciate

The only time I have issues with FaceID is when if the iPhone is facing directly as I'm looking down, in certain environments (gas station that has very bright lights) - I can understand from a tech stand point that the scanner won't see me as well so I angle/centre the iPhone more towards my face/iPhone is seeing more of me and less of the ceiling, it will work. But that's somewhat rare but definitely the only time I have FaceID issues. Touch ID is still being sold for people in this thread who want an option.. We're sitting here complaining about what's better. Imagine a world where Apple ONLY had FaceID iPhones for sale on the market...

Ultimately it's pretty clear this all boils down to personal experience (and/or maybe you had a faulty device? lol). I would say whatever makes your day-to-day better, use it. Both options are there, and I'm sure they will be for a long time (iOS)

 

[ipponrg]

But I mean really if you have an Apple Watch your missing out on paying fast while looking cool doing it at the same time lol.*

If it makes you feel better, sure!

 

[MacBH928]

Not really MY competition, the way folks who study this industry refers to competition.
Having 1 competitor, especially when that competitor sells VASTLY better (Group all Android together and they consistently outsell iOS) doesn’t equate to competitonless.

The point you’re trying to make, that iOS doesn’t have competition, just isn’t true as long as Android exists (and Tizen and KaiOS).

would you say that the USA has competition on carriers if all it had was Verizon vs AT&T?

 

[Hi Tek]

If it makes you feel better, sure!

I like to minimize human interaction

 

[Unregistered 4U]

would you say that the USA has competition on carriers if all it had was Verizon vs AT&T?

Since Verizon and AT&T = 2 carriers, then yes there is competition. If carriers = 1, only THEN is there no competition.