Apple Pushes Back Against iPhone USB-C Regulations in India

[SPUY767]

I don’t understand the issue. I suppose the reason for this is that Apple wants to continue selling less expensive iPhone SE, 12, 13 and 14 there for as long as possible without switching them all to USB-C? If this is the case, why cannot they indeed replicate the EU rules, so only the devices released after a certain date need to comply?

And then the government got involved and nothing ever progressed ever again and they all lived miserably ever after. The end.

 

[5232152]

Another case of governments getting too big for their boots.

Defending companies over people is, as the young say it, pretty delulu.

 

[H2SO4]

I'm not one to defend Apple, but grandfathering in existing phones that Apple still sells makes sense to me.

Right but if they'd have switched sooner, (they've were first in use on phones 8 years ago), they'd still be making those phones, albeit with USBC.

 

[SnowCrocodile]

Oh please. Apple want cheap labour that is far enough away that they don't have to worry about to many legal issues. That's the price of 'being held by the balls'.
If they want to have full control of their operation as is so often touted they need to build a sweat shop in Cupertino right next to that spaceship.

Yes. And ?

There’s plenty of smaller poor countries with cheap labor. You don’t need a billion plus country to set up a plant with 30k workers assembling parts shipped from all over the world. Spread them around and make assembly scalable so the volume can be quickly shifted between plants without disruption. Then India can decide if dictating USB-C ports on locally sold legacy designs is worth only getting one plant for local production instead of a dozen plants for global production. Because neither Apple nor Indian politicians are really watching out for the average Indian citizen, most of whom can’t afford an iPhone. Apple is trying to cut production costs, and the Indian government is flexing its muscles for political reasons.

 

[CarAnalogy]

I don't understand how new regulations can just be like "oh this phone wasn't USB-C back in 2020 so it can't be sold anymore". I don't know seems a bit too far IMO, it is one thing to say all new devices from this date going forward need to to be xyz compliant based on this new law/regulation

Exactly, I really don't understand the problem here. India's stance appears to go against common practice. And Apple's response is completely reasonable, 18 months is not actually that long to completely change everything it would take to eliminate sale of all but the newest model, or retroactively upgrade older models (without completely wrecking Apple's economic planning in the process.) What India's government appears to be asking for is unreasonable.

 

[5232152]

And then the government got involved and nothing ever progressed ever again and they all lived miserably ever after. The end.

Yes, because the USB-C standard has never been upgraded ever. 🥴
Show me any (proper) evidence of goverment killing innovation that stopped innovation that would not have harmed the end user at the end.

 

[H2SO4]

Yes. And ?

There’s plenty of smaller poor countries with cheap labor. You don’t need a billion plus country to set up a plant with 30k workers assembling parts shipped from all over the world. Spread them around and make assembly scalable so the volume can be quickly shifted between plants without disruption. Then India can decide if dictating USB-C ports on locally sold legacy designs is worth only getting one plant for local production instead of a dozen plants for global production. Because neither Apple nor Indian politicians are really watching out for the average Indian citizen, most of whom can’t afford an iPhone. Apple is trying to cut production costs, and the Indian government is flexing its muscles for political reasons.

They've run the numbers and decided that they are where it's best to be. Unless your research with capability, supply chains and intercontinental legalities can advise them otherwise?

 

[toobravetosave]

sounds like them unintelligently trying to force apple to invest in more indian iPhone manufacturing...or a very short sighted politician was in charge of the lawyer

 

[drzen]

I am aware of this. However it was reported that Apple was also planning to use India as their new global assembly center. They may want to reconsider.

Still will happen. If there is global destabilization leading to WW, India will be a strong US ally, certainly not China. Apple is very farsighted in its business decision making.

 

[ItsASpider]

You know what could have solved this? If they hadn't dragged their feet on this for years. These rules have been years in the making, both in the EU and India. Heck, the EU even request a voluntary co-operation to self-regulate in the market so it would have to legislate it. Apple tried to run out the clock to cash in as much as they could and now they find out they were constantly holding their hands in the fire. Had Apple listened (or more specifically, actually followed through on their promises) to the EU nearly a decade ago, these laws wouldn't even exist at all. Tough luck...

 

[IG88]

Right but if they'd have switched sooner, (they've were first in use on phones 8 years ago), they'd still be making those phones, albeit with USBC.

Sure. But with a rule like that, it's typical to grandfather in existing devices that previously were allowed before the rule was made.

 

[wood1208]

Just add USB-C to lightening adapter in package. In 2-3 years, Indian consumers will move to iPhone 15 and newer which has built in USB-C.

 

[JosephAW]

There's an old motto: do more than is expected and soon more will be expected.

 

[floral]

I don't really get the big deal, if we have to deal with every phone before the 15 having a lightning port, why shouldn't they?

 

[SnowCrocodile]

Defending companies over people is, as the young say it, pretty delulu.

As is equating governments with people.

Name one major global tech product to come out of the EU since Nokia. And even that one was from a tiny country that is unlike most of the rest of EU. You’d think that in the last 30 years, a major powerhouse like Germany or France would be able to produce a global service or tech product that rivals anything made in the US ?

On the other hand you have Korea, Japan, China which do come up with some crazy good tech.

Don’t get me wrong, I am not a libertarian and strongly believe in common sense market regulation. But it does seem that there’s such thing as “too much and too slow”.

 

[mrat93]

After Apple divorced his first lover, China...

Apple's relationship with his new lover India is also in trouble...

Apple is urgently looking for its next lover🤣🤣🤣

(Wow, did that hit a nerve with some people? haha)

simply epic, sir

 

[SnowCrocodile]

They've run the numbers and decided that they are where it's best to be. Unless your research with capability, supply chains and intercontinental legalities can advise them otherwise?

Did they also take into account the political developments?

Numbers are only one part of the story. Apple is getting burned in China precisely because they are too much driven by the numbers.

 

[SnowCrocodile]

Still will happen. If there is global destabilization leading to WW, India will be a strong US ally, certainly not China. Apple is very farsighted in its business decision making.

It is a whole lot more complicated than that. The 3rd world is unpredictable. What if in 20 years, the relationship with China stabilizes, but India elects someone more radical than Modi, who decides to start a war with Pakistan, or they align themselves with Russia against the West yet again? Look at Turkey, not so long ago our major ally.

The only way to avoid falling into the same trap all over again is to spread the manufacturing over multiple countries, and favor smaller countries which are less likely to develop grand global ambitions and start arguing with the neighbors over controlling trade routes.

 

[neuropsychguy]

You know what could have solved this? If they hadn't dragged their feet on this for years. These rules have been years in the making, both in the EU and India. Heck, the EU even request a voluntary co-operation to self-regulate in the market so it would have to legislate it. Apple tried to run out the clock to cash in as much as they could and now they find out they were constantly holding their hands in the fire. Had Apple listened (or more specifically, actually followed through on their promises) to the EU nearly a decade ago, these laws wouldn't even exist at all. Tough luck...

The Lightning port was only introduced in 2012. It is way superior to the 30 pin connector and all USB connectors at the time. Apple also said it was the connector for the next 10 years, which gives stability in accessories. USB C came out in 2014. Apple was supposed to switch "nearly a decade ago" to a new port only 2-3 years after introducing Lightning? USB C did not become ubiquitous until a few years ago. If Apple switched sooner on iPhones it would have helped but Apple is at most 2-3 years "late".

 

[ItsASpider]

Sure. But with a rule like that, it's typical to grandfather in existing devices that previously were allowed before the rule was made.

That's not actually very common at all. Usually when laws like these go into effect, they apply to everything (and sucks to be you if you already were selling a product that doesn't adhere to them) or there is a cooldown period in which they can get rid of stock but no longer produce, but that also is limited to a deadline and not just "we already were producing this so it is fair game".

As is equating governments with people.

Name one major global tech product to come out of the EU since Nokia. And even that one was from a tiny country that is unlike most of the rest of EU. You’d think that in the last 30 years, a major powerhouse like Germany or France would be able to produce a global service or tech product that rivals anything made in the US ?

On the other hand you have Korea, Japan, China which do come up with some crazy good tech.

Don’t get me wrong, I am not a libertarian and strongly believe in common sense market regulation. But it does seem that there’s such thing as “too much and too slow”.

My dude, just because you are unaware of Europe's involvement in tech, doesn't mean that they don't have any. There is a plethora of technology that originated in the EU. Spotify for one of the larger brands in consumer services. I guess you prefer to ignore the vast majority of the automobile industry that is based on European technology? Did you know that the vast majority of acquisitions Apple does these days are all European companies?

The Lightning port was only introduced in 2012. It is way superior to the 30 pin connector and all USB connectors at the time. Apple also said it was the connector for the next 10 years, which gives stability in accessories. USB C came out in 2014. Apple was supposed to switch "nearly a decade ago" to a new port only 2-3 years after introducing Lightning? USB C did not become ubiquitous until a few years ago. If Apple switched sooner on iPhones it would have helped but Apple is at most 2-3 years "late".

I said "nearly a decade ago". You also cannot have it both ways with "stability in accessories" when you're talking about the company that literally broke all compatibility for its Mac line for the sake of USB-C while its accessories partners already had to produce USB-C accessories for mobile devices due to the iPad having moved years ago. Meanwhile, "only 2-3 years late"? USB-C celebrates its 10th anniversary next year. When Apple introduced the MacBook Pro with USB-C (7 years ago) that was completely uncommon for laptops while they already were mainstream for higher-end to mid-end phones. USB-C was already common on low-end devices 5 years ago. They are not "2-3 years late".

 

[Infodataset]

I dont have a comment for europe union since europe have not only big user but also have better salaries so they have bigger userbase and EU can take advantage of it.


But really?do india government think they can compare with europe for their iphone userbase? Someone still dreaming

 

[5232152]

As is equating governments with people.

Name one major global tech product to come out of the EU since Nokia. And even that one was from a tiny country that is unlike most of the rest of EU. You’d think that in the last 30 years, a major powerhouse like Germany or France would be able to produce a global service or tech product that rivals anything made in the US ?

On the other hand you have Korea, Japan, China which do come up with some crazy good tech.

Don’t get me wrong, I am not a libertarian and strongly believe in common sense market regulation. But it does seem that there’s such thing as “too much and too slow”.

I don't have defend Europe, because I have made so such claim. If your love for Apple goes as deep as I read into your message you could easily compare the European approach: Don't do it first. Do it best.

Thinking Korea, Japan and China has no legislation? What?

Enjoy your phone, computer, smart TV, tablet with a CPU produced in a European produced ASML machine.

 

[SnowCrocodile]

That's not actually very common at all. Usually when laws like these go into effect, they apply to everything (and sucks to be you if you already were selling a product that doesn't adhere to them) or there is a cooldown period in which they can get rid of stock but no longer produce, but that also is limited to a deadline and not just "we already were producing this so it is fair game".


My dude, just because you are unaware of Europe's involvement in tech, doesn't mean that they don't have any. There is a plethora of technology that originated in the EU. Spotify for one of the larger brands in consumer services. I guess you prefer to ignore the vast majority of the automobile industry that is based on European technology? Did you know that the vast majority of acquisitions Apple does these days are all European companies?

The automotive industry is an old established industry. So is heavy manufacturing. They rely heavily on the past achievements and past investments. German heavy machinery is still some of the best in the world.

I am talking about new technology that just emerged in the past 30 years. Where are EU’s Apple, Samsung, Microsoft, Amazon, Dell, Google, Tesla, SpaceX, just to name a few ? I am not, for a single moment, implying that Europe lacks the talent. And they certainly don’t lack the funds. So, why did all that talent and resources fail to create a single global powerhouse?Sorry, Spotify is a great service, but it’s no Apple.

 

[iPay]

> India's IT ministry is said to have decided to review its request in light of the meeting and will reach a decision later.
Sounds like chaa pani may help clarify the situation and maintain good relationships.

 

[The_Gream]

AFAIK: India has been nothing but trouble for Apple since the push to move production there.
Their production rates are worse than China. Their quality is worse. India has some crazy “Has to be made in India” laws/view points if you want to even try to have market share there.

Their money would be better spent, buying out some Central American nations and converting them to Apple production facilities. At least, with this we know they will have good environmental polices in place 😬