Apple Releases the MacBook Pro

[Frobozz]

I got the same config. What else is there to upgrade unless you want 2GBs of iRam

I think that model is actually a pretty good value over the entry considering
+ harddrive
+ ram
+ graphics card
+ processor

I agree. If you were to just add the value of those extras they pretty much throw in the extra processor speed for a nominal charge.

 

[Frobozz]

Not true at all. My new G4 PB 17" easily gets 5 - 6 hours on a battery charge and I don't use power saving features also keep my screen at near full brightness.

I can easily play 3.5 hour movies on DVD without a battery recharge.

Don't go spreading FUD. The new G4 PB do very well on battery life.

You're unique, unless the last revision of the PB was *much* better that all previous ones, including the January 2005 release I use every day at work. Conincidentally, it lasts no more than 3.5 hours on a charge with full screen brightness. That ain't FUD ... that's fact. It's just not what you are seeing.

 

[SiliconAddict]

Please refrain from making such lame arguments.. so what are you gonna do when your battery catches on fire and burns your "Macbook Pro" to a crisp?

Not like it is so durable or looks so good either, a year down the road your palm rests will start pitting! Meanwhile on an Acer's carbon fibre(tm) chasis it will probably still look like new.. more style, more speed, and CHEAP!

Hmm. I’ve noticed a trend over the last 10 years has has been ever increasing. It started off with geeks who enjoy rolling their own computers, it then progressed to the average consumer. This trend is what I term SUVing your computer. That being needing to have the uber grestest hardware in it. The idea being its going to be so much more powerful then the next step down, and will be less likely to be obsolete in the near future. The problem with this thinking is that it’s flawed with Apple computers. Yes with Windows you need to have X Mhz to even run the OS or run it at a decent clip. This is less the case with OS X. If you look at X over the last 5 years the performance has actually been increasing from OS generation to OS generation. So the need for some uber zippy, complete top of the line CPU is less critical. (I’d be a liar though if I didn’t go with the 1.83Ghz PowerBook* because of its speed over the 1.6Ghz PowerBook*.) But lets be honest here. The practical difference between the Acer’s 2Ghz CPU and the PowerBook’s* 1.83Ghz is in reality going to be negligible. Will there be a difference? Yes of course because 1 + 1 = 2. I’m certain that difference will be made up with battery life, and is made up in weight. That is where Apple shines. That is why you are paying a premium. It’s not about getting the uber latest hardware. It’s about getting hardware that meshes into a sexy system that also just happens to do a good balancing act between performance, features, and battery life.
Does anyone here really have any doubt that Apple could have easily put a 2Ghz chip into their new PowerBook* if they really wanted to? I consider that balancing act one feature more important then the .17Mhz speed difference, and all the additional bells and whistles found on it. Honestly? I’m sick of dealing with Dell computers, Toshiba computers, etc day in and day out that have nothing but features crammed in them with no though as to if that is really the best design all the while cutting corners here and there. (As an example going from the superior Synaptics touchpad to Alps and OMG can you tell the difference. When I setup computers I have to use external mice because the touchpad drives me nuts.)
Now I know this sounds like I’m making an excuse for Apple. Maybe on some level it is, but it’s the truth as well. Apple makes an all around good package that you do spend more on. Now if you aren’t willing to spend that money that’s fine. The beauty of individual choice no?
But I have to ask why you are here complaining if that is the case. It’s like having a Porsche user group meeting at your Porsche dealer and someone shows up bitching about the price. It doesn’t make any sense. If you like these systems buy them. If you don’t then don’t buy them. Complaining about them isn’t going to change anything. Then again I’m one to talk. How many years have I been bitching about the G4 Powerbooks?

As for style. Bah. That is relative. One person’s style is another’s pile ‘o crap. However I’ve yet to have anyone comment that the PowerBook looks like crap. *shrugs*

 

[yankeefan24]

Does anyone know if i should get the regular hard drive or the 7200 RPM. when i say that, i mean, would i have any clearcut advantages. How much faster does it open applications etc, if at all??? Confused, but will get one.

 

[alec]

Some general observations after everything:

Mac users are very fickle. A lot of you got what you wanted in a lot of ways but are still nitpicking.

Also, do not price compare versus PC's. A lot of what you pay for with Mac's is the ability to run Mac OS.

Third, stop complaining about pricing. This is a Pro computer. This is for professionals whose professional salary allows them to afford a professional computer. If you can't afford it or are complaining about pricing -- guess what -- it wasn't targetted towards you! So buck up, because you weren't meant to have a MacBook Pro in the first place.

 

[BigHat]

Not a bad way to describe it

Maybe I don't actually understand what 'pitting' really is...I was guessing it would look like microscopic acne scars.

It's in a 1"x2" area located at about the 4 o'clock positon to the trackpad. Right where the right edge of my hand rests. It's a minor issue to me, but it's there. It is pitted with small pits, but the surface at the bottom of the pits is darker. Unless it contains some material (skin cells and oil) that darkens it (I can't clean it away though) I have to assume I've penetrated some finish and that it's not solid AL.

 

[SiliconAddict]

Does anyone know if i should get the regular hard drive or the 7200 RPM. when i say that, i mean, would i have any clearcut advantages. How much faster does it open applications etc, if at all??? Confused, but will get one.

You’ll get a moderate performance boost. Is it worth $100 though? No idea. www.barefeats.com did a few benchmarks of 5400 vs. 7200 RPM drives. Some of the 'marks showed fairly significant performance boosts. Some didn't. IMHO if 100GB is good enough for you I’d go for it. Personally? I’m waiting for the 160GB 7200 RPM drives to ship. I’ll upgrade then.

 

[SiliconAddict]

So buck up, because you weren't meant to have a MacBook Pro in the first place.

I wasn't?

Oh crap!

*Cancels his order*


Woah. Thanks alec for straightening me out.

 

[Di}{iE]

This is one area where you're definately wrong. Apple should have at least put another USB port on there to replace the FW800 that is gone. Having just 3 data ports (2 USB and 1 FW400) is hardly what I would call "Pro". Your average PC these days comes with at least 4 USB 2.0 ports. The lack of data ports on this model makes it feel less professional, like it couldn't meet all of your demands. Ask anyone on these boards, MacBook Pro could use another USB port.

Very true, I for one would love more USB ports, but I don't think it "breaks" the computer. I do a lot of audio recording using a Tascam US-122 and an Oxygen 8 keyboard, both of which are USB. Combine that with an external keyboard+mouse, and my digital camera, I'd need at least 4 usb ports myself. Using a hub isn't a big deal at all on the desk, but if you want to go mobile I can see that a hub might seem restricting. I guess my comment for this is if you are lugging around so many USB peripherals that you need 4 ports for them, what's the big deal with bringing a hub too?! I definately see your point tho, and agree more USB wouldn't have been a bad idea.

As for me, I am starting my residency this summer and am moving 4 times in the next year, so I need to retire my aging 933 Quicksilver and get a portable. This computer couldn't have come out at a better time! YAY!

 

[Di}{iE]

Does anyone know if i should get the regular hard drive or the 7200 RPM. when i say that, i mean, would i have any clearcut advantages. How much faster does it open applications etc, if at all??? Confused, but will get one.

If you go /w the 5200rpm, your system will definately be bottlenecked by your drive speed. However, a faster drive means more power and less battery life. Choose wisely..... Do what I did and upgrade to 7200, but change the RAM from 1gb to 2x512mb and it evens out the price.

 

[nagromme]

I hope there will be solutions for the new ExpressCard/34 slot to provide s-video or additional fire wire ports. but that will be expensive.

I think S-video (and composite video) will come via a ~$20 adapter that goes on the DVI port. (Like the one that goes on the 12" PowerBook's mini-DVI port.) The need to give presentations to TV isn't at all rare. Why is this adapter not on sale yet? I don't know, but the laptops aren't even shipping yet so I'm not--YET--worried.

Firewire 800 is dead, face it.

I think not. Taking it away from the pro laptop is only a minor issue for me--my external drive IS FW800, but I know I'm not truly taking much advantage of that speed.

But I still expect pro desktops will keep FW800. No reason to think otherwise yet.

Are the new IntelMacs 64 Bit ?

No. Intel has ANOTHER great new round of chips coming later this year that is 64-bit, dual core, and derived from this new (non-Pentium!) architecture. Code-name Merom for laptops, Conroe for desktops. I'm curious about the latest Merom/Conroe timetable myself.

But remember, 64-bit sounds good on paper but doesn't yet benefit most uses.

 

[Surreal]

That's using a cardbus, which is outdated and not available on the MacBook Pro. The new ExpressCard is on the MacBook Pro.

i thought that, but what that means is that all i can find are pages about expresscard as a standard. no expresscard products. just info about expresscard. BUT does this mean that there may be the possibility of bus powered firewire?

 

[faintember]

However, a faster drive means more power and less battery life.

Well if the drive accesses data faster, then it could be called upon for shorter amounts of time vs. slower HD's. Battery power has more to do with display brightness, optical drive use and processor use than HD speed.

 

[nagromme]

change the RAM from 1gb to 2x512mb and it evens out the price.

Cool--somehow I didn't notice you could do that! Saves US$100 (or $90 if you got the edu discount), and 1 GB is more than enough for most people anyway. I'll be recommending this option to friends.

 

[Di}{iE]

Well if the drive accesses data faster, then it could be called upon for shorter amounts of time vs. slower HD's. Batter power has more to do with display brightness, optical drive use and processor use than HD speed.

Quoted from http://www.mobilityguru.com/2003/10/31/fast_and_furious/

The rpm of the hard drive, or more precisely the rpm of the spindle on which the disks sit, is one of the most important parameters of hard-drive performance. Because as the rpm increases, the latency for data transfer is reduced, and the internal data rate rises. Thus the following simple rule holds true: The faster the disks turn, the faster data can be transferred. This has a positive effect on system performance.

Assuming that all other parameters of the hard drive remain the same, the higher rpm means higher power consumption as well. The higher energy use in turn results in a lower battery life.

 

[faintember]

Quoted from http://www.mobilityguru.com/2003/10/31/fast_and_furious/...blah blah blah

I went from the original 4200 rpm HD in my PB to an 5400 rpm HD with no, i repeat NO loss of battery life.

Besides, if a higher rpm drive uses more power, it would decrease battery life, but if it has to spin up less than a slower drive it should even out.

 

[SiliconAddict]

Well if the drive accesses data faster, then it could be called upon for shorter amounts of time vs. slower HD's. Batter power has more to do with display brightness, optical drive use and processor use than HD speed.

Exactly right and benchmarks have proven this. There is very liffle difference in battery drain between a 5400 and a "good" 7200 drive. Again I reference http://www.barefeats.com/hard61.html

 

[CalfCanuck]

Cool--somehow I didn't notice you could do that! Saves US$100 (or $90 if you got the edu discount), and 1 GB is more than enough for most people anyway. I'll be recommending this option to friends.

Actually, most people who want to run Pro apps on a Macbook Pro would benefit from 2 GB - as digital images get huge, and people have muliple images open at the same time, applications like Photoshop demand loads of RAM.

I'm not sure this is the best option for future upgrades, as you'd have to pull RAM to upgrade.

 

[Surreal]

firewire 800 cards for expresscard have been announced. full stop

that's all. i cant even find specs for the cards....just that they will exist

 

[faintember]

I'm not sure this is the best option for future upgrades, as you'd have to pull RAM to upgrade.

Agreed....$100 is not that big of a deal on an machine that is this expensive.

 

[SiliconAddict]

firewire 800 cards for expresscard have been announced. full stop

that's all. i cant even find specs for the cards....just that they will exist

Now if only we could upgrade later to a dual layer burner people's bitching might subside.

 

[Di}{iE]

I went from the original 4200 rpm HD in my PB to an 5400 rpm HD with no, i repeat NO loss of battery life.

Besides, if a higher rpm drive uses more power, it would decrease battery life, but if it has to spin up less than a slower drive it should even out.

I take it by the speed of your response, you weren't interested in the article ;-) Did you actually time the battery life, or you just don't percieve a difference. Take a look at these results.

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-11412_7-6395404-6.html?tag=arw
(look halfway down at battery life graph)

Summary:
CPU: 1.73GHz, Hard drive: 4,200rpm, Memory: 512MB
BATTERY LIFE 195min

CPU: 1.73GHz, Hard drive: 5,400rpm, Memory: 512MB
BATTERY LIFE 188min

EDIT: I see some other conflicting data posted as well, however it is not "real world", it is just the theoretical power requirements. These small differences in watts add up over hundreds of minutes. I will settle this as there IS a difference, but of only a few minutes, nothing drastic. Agree?

 

[darwin022]

ordered... 1.83 duo with 120GB drive. I chose the slower 120GB drive over the 7200rpm drive for battery life and spinup/spindown reasons... I dunno, seemed like the better option. If I want, I can plug a FW400 160GB 7200RPM drive in.

Ordering 1GB of RAM from Crucial around Feb. 1

 

[Di}{iE]

ordered... 1.83 duo with 120GB drive. I chose the slower 120GB drive over the 7200rpm drive for battery life and spinup/spindown reasons... I dunno, seemed like the better option. If I want, I can plug a FW400 160GB 7200RPM drive in.

Ordering 1GB of RAM from Crucial around Feb. 1

More RAM will reduce the need to spin up the drive and conserve battery, good choice!

 

[Randall]

i thought that, but what that means is that all i can find are pages about expresscard as a standard. no expresscard products. just info about expresscard. BUT does this mean that there may be the possibility of bus powered firewire?

Yes, you should and will see this in the near future. This is bleeding edge technology we're talking about, which is why there are very few devices for it currently. But it should be the norm in the next 2-3 years. You have to remember that cardbus was the standard for laptops since 1991, so the transition will take a little time.