Apple Removes Fortnite From App Store [Update: Epic Files Lawsuit Against Apple]

[smetvid]

Epic knows what it’s doing... Baiting Apple during an antitrust investigation. Apple took the bait, and I’m sure it will catch the eye of lawmakers and investigators. Bravo!

How is it an antitrust case to have rules to use a market? Every developer knows the rules and agreed to the rules when they joined the developer program. None of this is ever a mystery to developers.

There is nothing here to draw the attention of law makers because Apple didn't do anything anti competitive. They have a market place and there is a cost to be part of that market place. If a developer doesn't like it they can go elsewhere.

If Epic is suffering from the 30% fee then their own business model is flawed and not well thought out. Goods should be charged for with that fee in mind. They are looking at it as a 30% loss on Apple and not a 30% bonus on other platforms.

 

[@Brett]

Being that Epic is 40% Chinese owned they may want to be careful the way Trump is currently. Also all devs know the rules and to actively bypass could also get them into trouble also. It is technically a contractual breach as they have agreed to terms.

 

[Analog Kid]

Once again, a one time fee is ok. IT is NOT ok, when Apple wants to charge 30% of everything you do on the business. especially if you offer a service. That is just plain ridiculous.

It used to be that going to the store and buying a good game was $50 or more. Now that game is free to download and then they make the money up on these stupid IAPs. A one time fee doesn't work in that world.

 

[ArPe]

All deliberately by Epic. They knew what they were doing.

If users want to buy content or subscriptions for Prime, Spotify, Netflix, Epic Game Store, Steam, etc there is nothing stopping them from doing so in the web browser or desktop app. Their purchases will be in the mobile app. No loss.

But when you’re taking advantage of an App Store then you as a developer need to contribute to the floor rent, the maintenance costs, the moderation costs, the SDK development costs, the server costs, the payment processing costs.

 

[JM]

yep but apple denies you from creating your own distribution channels thats the whole argument that you seem not to get they cant create their own store apple wont let it exist there are a few stores that would jump at the chance say Silo

Epic didn't create the iPhone. Epic didn't create the AppStore (storefront to distribute apps to ALL iPhone users)

Apple offers a TREMENDOUS opportunity for developers to create an app and get it out to millions of cell phone users. That kind of established marketing platform/storefront is worth something. Apple says it's worth 30% of your profits. Seems like a reasonable business deal.

Epic (and all developers) are paying for the opportunity to make more money than they otherwise would if they weren't on iOS devices.

 

[sigsegv]

It’s in the TOC you (and just about every other iOS user) likely clicked agree to when you first setup your phone. Maybe it’s debatable, but you can’t say you didn’t know what you were getting yourself into, or what the “official stance” on this is.

Doesn't matter. You can't contract yourself out of antitrust law; in fact that's precisely what the law is there for - to stop these abusive practices.

 

[JPack]

App Store is over 10 years old, how can it now be in violation of anti-trust law?

The rules changed over 10 years.

 

[mrarick]

Let me get this straight-- Epic games, one of the largest game manufacturers in the world with one of the most popular games is suing Apple over being a monopoly?

Get over yourselves, Epic. If you want to be on iOS, play by the rules.

 

[jonblatho]

App Store is over 10 years old, how can it now be in violation of anti-trust law?

Apple's increasing push into competing with apps and services that can only exist on iOS in the App Store by fiat.

 

[sidewinder3000]

Clever 1984 ripoff. Too bad it’s bunk. “Epic Games has defied the App Store monopoly” = Epic games is greedy and decided to break the rules and not pay Apple what they owe them.

 

[Kierkegaarden]

Pure arrogance. This has nothing to do with their customers — it seems to be only promoting their own cavalier attitude and self interest.

If I know the rules, and I knowingly violate them — am I smart, or just a fool? What is the point of having rules in the first place?

 

[jetrois]

You may own the phone but not the software running on it. That belongs to Apple. That “Licence Agreement” that you agreed to when you first turned it on? It’s all in there and we’ll worth a read.

You are free to install whatever software you like and from any source. Apple doesn’t have to make it easy for you.

Maybe. I see these eulas going extinct of u look at it right

edit

What I mean to say is the software and hardware married so closely at it could be seen as inoperable without it and it could be considered a part of the device which means you own that software theoretically

 

[playtech1]

So a small App Store can charge 30% but a big one cant? As Walmart opens more stores is forced to make a smaller margin on the products is sells?

Sometimes that's exactly how it works. A Mom and Pop store that charges a hefty margin is a different thing to Walmart doing the same - clearly Walmart has a bigger impact on consumers. Competition law usually sets a threshold of a having a substantial effect on consumers.

The point is that if a company occupies a dominant position, competition law says that the government can step in and require them to behave in a way that doesn't abuse that position. I have no idea whether a court will view a 30% revenue share as too much, but it's going to be a very interesting legal case.

It could have some pretty wide-ranging implications for other store fronts, like Steam and (ironically) the Epic Games Store itself.

 

[m11rphy]

When I buy a PC I don't have to pay 30% to Microsoft or Intel (or Dell, etc) for every software purchase and in-app transaction I do on that machine.

Ditto for Steam; I don't have to use it.

Apple locks their platform down and there's no escape for consumers and sellers. This "feature" coming to a Mac soon no doubt...

But when you buy an xbox you have to pay Microsoft a % every time you buy a game, same with Sony and playstation. You can buy online or at a store but Microsoft and Sony still get their cut

 

[JetBlack7]

If you don't agree with the terms, then why would you go against them? Better yet, why do you want to be on said platform?

 

[jonblatho]

A business that gets access to tens of millions of users. Would your business even exist if not for the App store?

Man, how did we make it through the first decade of this century when physical software retail was dwindling and before the App Store launched in 2008?

 

[the8thark]

Epic know they broke the rules and knew the game would get pulled. They expected this to happen.
Epic is not going after Apple for this directly. My best guess is they will put every single deal Apple has done which resulted in their App store fees being less than 30%. Epic will cry "what about pur preferential treatment too" and demand a better deal from Apple.

Epic can't win vs the pulling of fortnight. That's a cooked turkey by this point. However Epic can win vs the inconsistency over the 30% (ie the lower than 30% deals Apple has done).
I feel Epic should lose this because it'svindictive, greedy and goes against the App Store ToS they agreed to. However get the wrong judge in the wrong jurisdiction and the result could be very different.

As a final note I'm sure Apple's lawyers will go through every single deal made between the Epic store and developers. If Epic has made any deals to any specific developers that lowered the cut Epic take, you can be sure that will be shared in court. Apple now have an opportunity to expose all the Epic store dirt.

 

[Paradoxally]

Good job Apple. These devs want to make billions by not following the rules.

 

[jahall05]

We've been needing regulation on stuff like this for a while now. The EU is so far ahead of the US it's insane.

The whole "Apple's store, Apple's rules" would only be reasonable if Apple allowed you to run your own store or go somewhere else. "Just buy Android then" only works until you think about it for more than two seconds. Imagine if that were your car. "Don't want to buy Ford's super expensive tires and full maintenance plan? Just don't buy a Ford! Sell it and get a Chevy!"

Yeah, no. That childish gibberish doesn't work on anyone mature enough to know otherwise.

Given the release of the documents we've read -- it's pretty clear it's just pettiness on Apple's part and has absolutely --ZERO-- to do with making a better device or ecosystem. Anyone who says otherwise is factually incorrect.

I love my boyfriend’s VW, but it requires a transmission service at 400 dollars every 40,000 miles. Great car, fun to drive. I bought a Hyundai because the transmission service is half the price and only needs done every 60,000 miles instead. Not sure what your point was...most mature people buy either what they want with the caveats or what works for them the best based on a mix of things like cost, features, etc. You buy an iPhone for a lot of reasons... I like the App Store being secure and I personally prefer Apple process my payments. If a developer wants to participate they pay the Apple tax. But nobody is forcing them to participate and they had to sign the developer agreement and they knew ahead of time what the rules were.

 

[jonblatho]

If you don't agree with the terms, then why would you go against them?

…because you disagree with them? Did you read what you wrote?

 

[m11rphy]

The rules changed over 10 years.

The 30% didn't same then, same now

 

[JM]

When I buy a PC I don't have to pay 30% to Microsoft or Intel (or Dell, etc) for every software purchase and in-app transaction I do on that machine.

Ditto for Steam; I don't have to use it.

Apple locks their platform down and there's no escape for consumers and sellers. This "feature" coming to a Mac soon no doubt...

You don't pay 30% to Apple when you buy a game on the appstore 😂 That's the developer deciding to pass on that 30% Applestore fee to you the consumer.

Get mad at Epic for doing that. They don't HAVE to charge that extra 30% to you the consumer. 😂

 

[GizmoDVD]

Apple needs Fortnite more than Fortnite needs Apple.

*here comes the Apple's rules folks*

Apple just can't get out of their own way when it comes to gaming lately.

Apple does not need Fortnite.

Epic has a failed launcher they need to support

 

[DanTheMan827]

What Epic could've done is turned v-bucks into a "physical" item (like a postcard)

 

[Paradoxally]

Apple needs Fortnite more than Fortnite needs Apple.

*here comes the Apple's rules folks*

Apple just can't get out of their own way when it comes to gaming lately.

You're dreaming if you think this. Battle Royale's come and go, Apple will long be standing after that genre dies down. Remember when PUBG was king?