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Apple Researching Methods to Detect 'Consumer Abuse' in Portable Devices
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Survey after survey disagrees with you.
What is this, your opinion? The real world numbers show the opposite.
The thing is, this data would be more accurate than just a sensor that goes to POSITIVE when it's too hot or too cold. If they saw that the LCD broke when the temp was at -5 degrees F, then they would say that's in spec. But if it was that code before, worked fine for months and then broke from something else that's covered, they'd be able to tell and you probably WOULD still get your device covered. Did people ever thing of that?
Same with the water sensors. A better one could tell when it was wet and when it broke and if they were related. Rather than just voiding your warranty outright.
Except the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence.If Apple saw you had a phone for 6 months and it didn't register even the slightest drop... I'm sure you'd be singled out for tampering. A better method would be either creating a random generator to simulate "normal use" and writing over with that. Or copying another users data.
Correct. People seem to not realize the underwriting side of the warranty equation that costs Apple money from Insurance corporations.
They aren't here to try and screw people over on this one. They want the most complete and accurate picture to help them with their end and insurance underwriters.
I'm curious. All the people who are against this because replacing damaged phones is "good customer relations" and "not that expensive."
So you folks are fine with shoplifting, then?
Because those arguments also apply to just stealing an iPhone from the store.
So you folks are fine with shoplifting, then?
Because those arguments also apply to just stealing an iPhone from the store.
This doesn't apply simply to iPhones. This could prove extremely problematic for devices that are regularly opened by users, like laptops and desktops.
hang on...i have a cell phone that's been dropped probably 10 times in the last 3 years and still works perfectly. it got dropped into a toilet by my son, and after a day of drying out, it worked perfectly still.
I have insurance through AT&T on our phones (5 dollars a month for both of our phones). If something happens to the phone, they replace it. Since I'm paying 100 bucks a month, it's financially in their best interest to keep me paying. If my phone breaks and they won't replace it, I'll just cancel my service and go somewhere else where they will.
Am i correct that AT&T won't insure an iphone? I remember reading that last year when I was thinking about upgrading to an iphone. No way will I get a cell phone with a huge monthly plan that doesn't have insurance against damage on it.
Add this whole "consumer abuse sensors" concept to a lack of insurance as a purchasable option, and you've got to be kidding me...no chance in hell.
A new iphone costs them, what, 50 bucks to make, now? If you have 5 dollar a month insurance on one of those and you somehow break it every 10 months, they still come out even by replacing it for you.
I really thought I was going to be in the market for an iphone soon, but with all the things they've been doing lately, I'm thinking it's time to look elsewhere...
I hope they haven't been secretly implementing this in ipods and laptops already, because I've got those things, and I don't want to find out the hard way that my laptop got "too hot" in its bag 6 months ago and now they won't cover the broken hinge on my screen that happened yesterday...
I have insurance through AT&T on our phones (5 dollars a month for both of our phones). If something happens to the phone, they replace it. Since I'm paying 100 bucks a month, it's financially in their best interest to keep me paying. If my phone breaks and they won't replace it, I'll just cancel my service and go somewhere else where they will.
Am i correct that AT&T won't insure an iphone? I remember reading that last year when I was thinking about upgrading to an iphone. No way will I get a cell phone with a huge monthly plan that doesn't have insurance against damage on it.
Add this whole "consumer abuse sensors" concept to a lack of insurance as a purchasable option, and you've got to be kidding me...no chance in hell.
A new iphone costs them, what, 50 bucks to make, now? If you have 5 dollar a month insurance on one of those and you somehow break it every 10 months, they still come out even by replacing it for you.
I really thought I was going to be in the market for an iphone soon, but with all the things they've been doing lately, I'm thinking it's time to look elsewhere...
I hope they haven't been secretly implementing this in ipods and laptops already, because I've got those things, and I don't want to find out the hard way that my laptop got "too hot" in its bag 6 months ago and now they won't cover the broken hinge on my screen that happened yesterday...
Right, just like when my iMac started to blow smoke out of the back vents. Guess what someone like you at the apple store said to me? They told me that they wouldn't replace it because I "had probably put a cigarette in my iMac." He didn't even look. So if you want to talk to me about people lying about damage, look at people like yourself.
But guess what, all was good in the end. My mom had an attorney at her office call Apple for me. I got a new iMac, and that "Genius" was out of a job.
Don
My Mac Pro comes with a manual showing me how to open it. Why would Apple suddenly have a problem with that now?
Because soon enough, they're going to say that opening it violates the warranty.
Don
Seems to me that a sensor would have been a big help here. You could have demanded that the genius run the scans.
In your case you couldn't do that and he was able to just say 'get lost.' This is a case where this type of sensor would have helped the consumer.
Big Brother is watching
I totally disagree with the idea that Apple is going to spy on us in this way. How are they going to determine what the shock level is for it to be an abused device? What is going to happen to users who are trying to get something else fixed, like a bad head phone jack when this thing gets setup.
When does this turn into "let's watch what else they are doing and report it to appropriate agencies"? I think that this is way past the scope of providing a product and then spying on us when we use it.
I believe that if you buy a product and it isn't built well enough to withstand general usage than it should be recalled. I wish we had standards at the government level that would define what is within acceptable limits. Kind of like the Lemon Laws for cars.
I totally disagree with the idea that Apple is going to spy on us in this way. How are they going to determine what the shock level is for it to be an abused device? What is going to happen to users who are trying to get something else fixed, like a bad head phone jack when this thing gets setup.
When does this turn into "let's watch what else they are doing and report it to appropriate agencies"? I think that this is way past the scope of providing a product and then spying on us when we use it.
I believe that if you buy a product and it isn't built well enough to withstand general usage than it should be recalled. I wish we had standards at the government level that would define what is within acceptable limits. Kind of like the Lemon Laws for cars.
So you're opposed to sensors because of things you imagined?
I'd prefer to judge this based on reality, not made up things.
That's actually a reason to WANT this kind of system. The system will help tell what actually caused the damage. I wanted to replace my harddrive and the AppleCare warranty actually "allows" this. Although replacing the harddrive means my warranty no longer covers harddrive related issues. The difficulty comes in proving that something isn't a harddrive related issue.
A system like this could actually help Apple determine if it was or wasn't related to the harddrive as well. Follow what I'm saying?
The AppleCare warranty never has been supposed to cover Accidental Damage. You can go to other places like www.squaretrade.com to get that if you want it.
The warranty that AT&T offers is usually through a 3rd party underwriter. A company that probably doesn't want to ensure the >$500 retail cost of a new iPhone, but there are people that will.
So, you went to Chicago, your iPhone was in you backpack, while you walked around for an hour in -10F weather. Now, if anything ever happened to that iPhone sometime later, Apple can tell you to take a hike on the warranty.
The amazing thing is, how many idiots there are, who would swallow everything Apple dishes out.
The amazing thing is, how many idiots there are, who would swallow everything Apple dishes out.
I agree with you 100%. I would further add that it isn't just with Apple hardware. People in general have that entitlement attitude. They think they are OWED something. I see it every day at work. I think Apple is right to protect themselves here. How many times have we seen videos on youtube of people dropping their iphone in a pool, or heard of dropping an ipod in the toilet? This country has become incredibly irresponsible. Whether it is with their consumer products or financially. And most people think they should be entitled to replacement hardware from Apple for being careless and/or stupid. I think Apple would be able to lower prices even more if they found a way to end this abuse by the majority of the irresponsible population using their products. So I am all for it. Go Apple!
This honestly sounds like an attack on jailbreaking to me, but what they will find is that those that jailbreak their phones will find ways to eliminate the fact that they did so from the phone's memory. People will find ways around these things.
My Google Mobile app was approved on the App Store. Why would Apple suddenly pull it now?
It only takes small steps and people obeying for Apple to control our devices. It begins with App Store, “consumer abuse” detection methods and soon you find out you can’t turn on your phone without Apple’s approval.
yep.. i'm sure somebody already said this, but apple has never covered jailbroken phones under the warranty. why would they? that would rub apple the wrong way on multiple levels, if they don't even allow apps from people that compete with their partners, how could they find it in their half-eaten-fruit-shaped hearts to support hacked software?
not saying they're related, but.. it's all contrary to apple's philosophy of a 'streamlined user experience' which they're the sole provider for, and carry all of the responsability for.
if it helps them, great. they already have tools to learn about water damage (the mentioned sensors, and checking for corrosion, etc) but a friend of mine works behind a genius bar, and he says one of the toughest parts is having to decide whether to replace a brand new iphone because of a tiny crack in the casing that may or may not have been caused by the user. if they implement it correctly, this might help.
I said it in a forum without a citation, so yes, it is my opinion and experience.
Dell: Had an issue with the logic board and DVD drive, they had a technician at my desk within 24 hours to repair the problem.
Apple: Similar problem with DVD drive an logic board. They wanted me to leave my MBP at an Apple Store for 5 to 7 days. After a few heated emails and phone conversations, i negotiated that down to one day. Which in my opinion is still unacceptable.
My computer is not just a toy, it's my livelihood. If I don't have my computer for 5 to 7 days, I do not work for 5 to 7 days. If I do not work for 5 to 7 days, my clients get very unhappy with MY level of customer service. Survey's might be nice if I didn't have my own experience with which to base my opinion.
I still don't want a sensor that records everything that happens to a device. Granted, a sensor would have helped my situation. But it's not much of an issue anymore.
Anytime the the Genius Bar gives me any trouble, I just have to have a lawyer call Apple, and guess what, I can go in and get a new whatever.
I did it with my iMac, and I did it with my iPhone, that they refused to replace, because "Black iPhones don't get the cracks."
I've had my fair share of bad experiences at the genius bar, and I find that a lawyer makes a huge difference.
I don't want Apple knowing every time my iPhone falls two feet onto carpet, so they can use that as justification to deny a replacement. They're turning into big brother.
Don
Yay for Apple! Be sure to define abuse so you can fix less, make them buy more!! Screw people so you can add 50 cents to the stock price!!!
That's the dream
*rolls eyes* Apple's always been a sick corporate entity at heart... they just aren't selling their Power Mac 604e's w/proprietary hardware for $5,000 anymore :/
Paranoid much? It doesn't make sense. If they did this then people would stop buying them.
If Apple wouldn't let me upgrade my ram or my hdd on my own I'd never buy another Apple computer and I think a lot of people would be doing the same thing. There is a line and I think they have enough sense not to cross it.
I wish the same to your syster and mome dude.
That is my way to charge the "manofacturer abuse" after they sell me an expensive item that is gonna brake itself without any reason just days after the warranty expires.
Just 2 weeks ago I had my 17" mac book pro besides me and it pronted me for a mac osx software update, I said yes. When finished the computer restarted and that was it. It didn't start up again. I took it to the apple store and the mother board was fried.
Did I abused it? no, I was working on my mac pro actually and had skype on the other MBP.
Now, whay should I pay $1000 or buy a new computer if my 17" MBP lost the 1 year warranty just 3 month ago?
Photoshop.
I do not have the means to hire lowyers and suit apple and stuff, so I do what I can.
My experiences with Dell have ranged from 1 week to 5 months to get a problem fixed. (And the 5 month problem took up about 20 hours on the phone with them over that time.) Most of this is my wife's family, but of the last 4 Dells they've bought, 3 of them showed up broken and it took hours on the phone to get a replacement.
So good thing you've been lucky so far, I guess!
I don't like the idea of this. I like to upgrade my Notebooks and Jailbreak my devices for 3rd party software that Apple don't allow on their App Store and if I had an Apple TV I would probably crack that open and stick a 500GB HD in instead of the 40GB-120GB it ships with and I'm likely to jailbreak that to run Boxee.
There are just so many different circumstances where going against Apples wishes benefits the consumer but just because I've done these changes doesn't mean I should be penalised if some fault with their manufacturing or design means I cannot get a replacement unit.
Example: I jailbreak my iPhone and then the screen dies due to a circuit failuer but they wont fix or replace the iPhone because it was Jailbroken something completely unrelated to the fault.
I have no issue with them using sensor data to detect people dropping it or physically damaging a device (Water damage and such) but checking for tampering that doesn't cause the device to break is I think going to far.
There are just so many different circumstances where going against Apples wishes benefits the consumer but just because I've done these changes doesn't mean I should be penalised if some fault with their manufacturing or design means I cannot get a replacement unit.
Example: I jailbreak my iPhone and then the screen dies due to a circuit failuer but they wont fix or replace the iPhone because it was Jailbroken something completely unrelated to the fault.
I have no issue with them using sensor data to detect people dropping it or physically damaging a device (Water damage and such) but checking for tampering that doesn't cause the device to break is I think going to far.