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Apple Seeds Second macOS 13 Ventura Release Candidate to Developers

gank41 said:
Sorry to all the "Oh man look at THIS long post" folks, I know I've been told I explain things in too much detail (to to to to toDAY Junior!) sometimes.. Hopefully these details will help the few other folks I've seen on here with similar problems like mine. 😓🎃✌️ 🤜 🤛
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I don’t have a similar problem, I just wanted to tell you that I really appreciate your attitude in trying to help others.
 
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drmacnut said:
Meanwhile, my MacBook Air M2 seems to be stuck on Ventura beta 13.0 (22A5321d) and perpetually claims it is "up to date". Go figure.
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What if you set Software Update to restore defaults, reboot, and then reinstall the beta profile again?
 
gank41 said:
What if you set Software Update to restore defaults, reboot, and then reinstall the beta profile again?
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Thanks gank41. That worked a treat. Actually, it appears that my dev seed program profile had been removed —I assume by 22A5321d at some point— and I hadn't even noticed. Reinstalled profile and it's happily downloading 12.12GB of RC2 right kow. I appreciate your help!
 
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mrfunnypenguin said:
I have been on the public beta since at least July 24. Every new beta update does not seem to really fix anything, I wonder if it really is a new build sometimes.
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weird, I am having no issues at all, so I guess I agree with you, not fixing anything that is not broken to begin with
 
If I'm on the beta program, will I be pushed the final release on the 24? Or do I have to unenroll
 
Mr. Dee said:
You gotta be brave if you are really planning to install this when it hits GM. I personally believe it probably won't be stable until 13.5.
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I am assuming you are basing that on something? But maybe not, I have had no issues with any beta version of Ventura, so I'm guessing it is already stable. I'm on an M1 MBP so maybe you are referencing anything of potential on an Intel Mac?
 
There are so many problems with iOS 16.1 and Ventura, even after Ventura RC2 that I doubt there will be a final release on the 24th. In my case, the worst is with iOS 16.1RC. I have been in contact with Apple support and they are experiencing serious problems with iMessage and Facetime ... I have had Apple devices since 2008 and I have never experienced as many problems as with iOS 16. ..., and Ventura

This is by far the worst update I've experienced...
 
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MauiPa said:
I am assuming you are basing that on something? But maybe not, I have had no issues with any beta version of Ventura, so I'm guessing it is already stable. I'm on an M1 MBP so maybe you are referencing anything of potential on an Intel Mac?
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So I guess you speak for every single beta tester and all 140 million active Macs. You must have snuck in their house and business and created a hidden dual boot config to confirm your findings. 🙄
 
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GuilleA said:
I believe this will be the first time I won't upgrade. There's nothing worthy in Ventura, at least not for me.
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I believe that stage manager is a huge improvement, it is for me. But not worth updating for all those errors in Ventura
 
MauiPa said:
Can't say I agree with that. system settings is great, no issues at all. you are complaining about the design?
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Yes, the design is the entire issue. They're going against their own human interface design guidelines by making you unnecessarily scroll and click to find and change settings. There's a reason that desktop and touchscreen UIs are different. I'll go ahead and steal someone's more in-depth thoughts:
  1. Controls are awkwardly placed. By placing the labels on the left edge and their respective toggles on the right edge, your focus must now move all the way from the left edge to the right edge. I find that extremely disorienting, especially because the divider lines are extremely faint.
  2. Awkward navigation hierarchy. Very few Mac apps ask you to select something from a sidebar, click something in the detail pane, and then have the entire content pane be replaced with a new content pane, with a back chevron button. Apps that do that are usually browser. It's an interaction paradigm that I find awkward.
  3. Some of the panels just look bad. The wallpaper panel for example attempts to save space by having wallpapers in the same category be laid out horizontally. It then tries to >jam all the categories vertically. Now it's much harder to find wallpapers from a category, and going between categories is similarly just as hard because it now necessitates a lot of scrolling. The trackpad gesture "videos" are remarkably sterile.
  4. Infinitely expanding vertical lists. The Wi-Fi settings page for example lists all of the available networks. There are however more settings below the list. Since macOS hides scrollbars by default, it's now incredibly hard to find them. More "you won't know you can interact with it until your mouse cursor is over it" design decisions. The text field to change the computer name looks nothing like a text field; it looks like a regular label. It's only when you mouse over that the background color changes, suggesting that it's editable. That's bad design. "Design is not just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
  5. Perhaps, the most egregious problem I see, is that this will encourage further lazy and thoughtless additions of settings. I understand the OS has grown more complex over the years, and putting more controls under System Preferences can be hard. But that's exactly what Apple used to be good at: work around constraints and design something that works well. The old System Preferences app, for all its flaws, had setting panels that clearly demonstrated craft and thoughtfulness. This new System Settings design, thanks to its pervasive use of scrolling lists, will encourage people at Apple to just throw in more settings in the lists with little thought, since SwiftUI makes it so easy to. I bet by macOS 15 we'll see the lists for the panels grow even longer, and settings will be just as hard to find, if not more so, as they are in System Preferences today.
I hate it because it is clear evidence that Apple has lost its touch when it comes to desktop user interfaces. System Settings reeks of a cost-saving measure to me: the SwiftUI rewrite benefits them by allowing them to think less carefully about new toggles, and the iOS/macOS design unification benefits them by allowing them to think even less carefully about what a desktop user interface should look like and behave in general.
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dylanthomas said:
Yes, the design is the entire issue. They're going against their own human interface design guidelines by making you unnecessarily scroll and click to find and change settings. There's a reason that desktop and touchscreen UIs are different. I'll go ahead and steal someone's more in-depth thoughts:
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I couldn't agree more... It's fine to streamline a user interface if it makes sense. But it doesn't, and never will. macOS and iOS cannot be combined. It is completely misinterpreted and completely beside the point!
 
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I tried beta 6 or 7 on my M1 Air besides bugs battery was sort of meh, can someone confirm if it's same as Monterey or Big Sur?
 
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GuilleA said:
I believe this will be the first time I won't upgrade. There's nothing worthy in Ventura, at least not for me.
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The weather app based on dark sky is worth it. Its available for the new iOS, IPadOS and MacOS

www.macrumors.com

Everything New in the iOS 16 Weather App

Apple in iOS 16 made some notable changes to the Weather app, adding new types of notifications and increasing the information you can see about...
www.macrumors.com www.macrumors.com
 
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bartolo5 said:
If I'm on the beta program, will I be pushed the final release on the 24? Or do I have to unenroll
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The last Dev or PB release dependent on your profile. The profile keeps you on the beta cycles so you see that update. The public release is virtually the same as the final RC release. There might be a single character change sometimes on the build. I've been running the gold master or final RC for years, no issues.

Obviously if you remove the dev or PC profile the public release shows as a update.
 
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MauiPa said:
no leaks for me
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Other than something to do with VPN earlier no memory leaks, most of the issues seemed to be against earlier versions of Safari 16.1 not freeing up memory when you were using a couple of sVoD web sites (one at a time) that I saw. Now it's extremely rare to happen with first RC it happened once after several hours of use with multiple windows, multiple tabs. You can always go develop menu -> Empty Caches if it happens then wait a few seconds, back to where it should be. So far nothing seen on RC2.
 
urbanman2004 said:
Anyone know if Ventura is compatible w/ Intel Macs?
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We had a couple verify they installed RC2 on intel Macs.
The following Mac computers are supported by macOS Ventura:
  • MacBook (2017 and newer)
  • MacBook Air (2018 and newer)
  • MacBook Pro (2017 and newer)
  • Mac mini (2018 and newer)
  • Mac Studio (2022)
  • iMac (2017 and newer)
  • iMac Pro (2017)
  • Mac Pro (2019 and newer)
 
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Realityck said:
The last Dev or PB release dependent on your profile. The profile keeps you on the beta cycles so you see that update. The public release is virtually the same as the final RC release. There might be a single character change sometimes on the build. I've been running the gold master or final RC for years, no issues.

Obviously if you remove the dev or PC profile the public release shows as a update.
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When/How does the "Help" system get updated? Even in RC2 the help pages I see are all macOS12. Is that done via the web on official release day and not via a software update?
 
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