Apple Seeks Ban on Sales of Revised Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1N in Germany

[divinox]

Thus, WP7 and Windows 8 Tablets, etc. Lateness upon lateness upon lateness.

Sometimes its good to be late. It allows for time to re-think.

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Apple fans often use this tactic of claiming that an Apple product sells more than any particular model of a competing product.

This is pure horse-hockey - because the fact that other manufacturers offer more options and choice is not a bad thing.

Samsung sells a lot more smartphones than Apple - in a fair number of different models. If no particular Samsung model sells more more than the best selling Iphone model - it means nothing. Samsung is still outselling Apple.

It reminds me of ancient history - when Apple was selling the space-egg Imacs in the toxic-colored plastic. Apple fans insisted on combining the sales figures for the SKUs for the different colors - yet not combining the HP Pavilion XXX with 256MiB RAM and a 233 MHz CPU with the HP Pavilion XXY with 512 MiB and 266 MHz (and the Pavilion XXZ and Pavilion XX* and other variants of the same system...).

HP was selling far more Pavilion XX* systems than Apple, but Apple fans claimed that Imacs were the most popular systems by this trick.

Some things don't change....

We will see it repeat very soon, i am sure. In fact, aren't we already seeing it? Take the iPad2 for example, how is that one model? And, when we're fed data about iPad sales, isn't that iPad 1 and 2? Same goes for their computer line. For example, even if they were splitting MBA numbers up in screen sizes (which i doubt) they still have different models within each chassi.

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If I had IBM I'd sue the pants off Apple. Shoot, Apple wasn't even the first to coin the word "pad" referring to a tablet. IBM was. ThinkPads were originally supposed to be tablets (see this model).

http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Category:700T

They ended up using the name for computers as well, not to mention.. tablets!

The rounded off rectangle with a dark bezel was IBM's thing also.
http://paulsdeals.com/Computer/comppics/ibm-monitor.jpg

(Not to mention Casio and others actually used black LCD bezels.. most gameboys had them... hrmm!!!

Weiser called them Pads over at PARC in the late 80's, or at very least in early 90's.

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Then provide them. So far you are the one making stuff up.

People want iPhone or iOS they only have 3 choices (3GS, 4 and 4S)
You want Android you have a long list.
You want WP7 again long list of phone
BB - wide list.

Increase models do increase the sales but not by much more it just splits the market and a smaller share for each one.

So yes samsung would more than likely still have more sales than Apple. Sales of each iPhone would go down and at most only a minor increase in total sales.

More models just means that the person buying the phone has to compromise less to get what they want.

Actually, you have more choice than that.

3GS 8Gb
4 8Gb
4S 16Gb 32Gb 64Gb

For some reason though, that is supposed to read as "one", or at best "three".

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Comparing the iPads to a CRT moitor are quite different designs. CRT's are not flat, and the bezel is also flush with the screen.



Ok, looks like you were talking about something different, my mistake.

Xerox PARC Pad, ç:a 1991. His examples were bad, but what he said was still true.

 

[Lennholm]

I'd be interested to see you support that assertion.

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Your assertions assume that Apple wouldn't sell more than they are now if they were given the same range of offerings that Samsung now has.

Why would they? Having more choices doesn't magically spawn new customers out of nowhere.
Do you really think that Apple wouldn't create more choices if they thought it led to significantly increased sales?

 

[divinox]

Why would they? Having more choices doesn't magically spawn new customers out of nowhere.
Do you really think that Apple wouldn't create more choices if they thought it led to significantly increased sales?

...led to significantly increased profits. More on point that way.

 

[Lennholm]

Thus, WP7 and Windows 8 Tablets, etc. Lateness upon lateness upon lateness.

Apple is also late sometimes, how else could they have claimed they re-invented the phone if they had been first?
Whats to say MS wont re-invent the tablet with Win 8?

 

[KnightWRX]

Why would they? Having more choices doesn't magically spawn new customers out of nowhere.
Do you really think that Apple wouldn't create more choices if they thought it led to significantly increased sales?

Look, guy just doesn't want to be wrong. He went in to defend this premise :

Samsung's newest smartphones were getting spanked by the 2yr old 3GS.

So of course he had to move the goal posts all the way to the left field. Trying to play home base on this one, he lost simply based on the sales figures.

 

[Ryan John]

Apple fast becoming the most pathetic excuse for a company bar none. Give it a rest, let the tabs fight it out in sales rather than the courts.

Sheer bloody minded stupidity.

 

[0098386]

I always forget the name of that device, but I wonder how the makers of that Scratchbook/pad thing feel right now?

 

[adder7712]

But samsung was first with the design!

http://www.androidauthority.com/behold-samsungs-ipad-made-in-2006-21278/

Then people will argue "it's a photo frame hurr durr" but it's façade is very familiar.

 

[Lennholm]

Then people will argue "it's a photo frame hurr durr" but it's façade is very familiar.

When something that is not a phone resembles an iPhone it's "They stole the design from iPhone!!!" but when the iPad resembles a pre-existing device that is not a tablet it's "So what, it's a completely different kind of device!".
Talking about that photo frame, the fanboys always say "but look at the back, the iPad looks nothing like it"... Hmm, why don't you take a look at the back of the Galaxy Tab 10, it looks nothing like the iPad

 

[danahn17]

Lost marketshare. Pretty sure I've read before one of the biggest deterrent to switching from one platform to another is the investment in apps/media.

Also wasn't Apple's argument for banning the galaxy tab is that a potential apple customer would buy a GT instead and that customer would be forever lost to apple? Surely making a smaller profit off the initial device sale is better losing a customer locked into future ecosystem sales and device upgrade sales.

Wait... so it's okay for Apple to get customers and lock them into their ecosystem but its not okay for a competitor to do the same? If anything, Apple's tight integration throughout its products makes it harder to switch to a competitor (Samsung/Android neither have nor require you to use an iTunes-like program for example).

I love Apple and have a lot of their products and even took my share of ridicule when Apple wasn't the hip, cool company it is today.... but honestly, this is getting a little ridiculous. In some ways, their business tactics are worse than Microsoft when MS was the big, evil empire and Apple was struggling to survive.

 

[goosnarrggh]

EMPHATICALLY, NO! DON'T give it a rest! Apple has not only the right, but the obligation to defend its patents. If it doesn't, it loses them, plain and simple.

If you're talking about patents, then you've got it all wrong. Any company has the right to choose not to enforce its patents against any possible infringement, without impacting its ability to continue to enforce them against any other possible infringements.

You were thinking about trademarks with respect to companies having an obligation to defend each and every possible infringement lest they risk the trademark becoming genericized.

In this specific case in Germany, where neither patents nor trademarks (in the traditional sense of the word) were involved in granting the injunction, I'm not sure where European registered community designs lie within the spectrum of the ability to apply discretion in choosing to pursue infringements.

 

[The Great Boony]

Samsung ripped off the iPad.

It's plain and simple.

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This forum is becoming Anti Apple, with so many Android trolls.

Anyone know of any decent Apple sites?

 

[Oletros]

Samsung ripped off the iPad.

It's plain and simple

Cook, Schiller and all the people at Apple are stupid, they're wasting a lot of money in lawyers when they can hire you if this is so clear.

 

[Mattie Num Nums]

Why not let the consumer decide what product they want.

The most ironic thing is Apple fans are mostly the Occupiers crying for freedom and fairness yet the company they support are doing the exact same thing they are rallying against.

 

[Dr McKay]

So why do you keep buying Apple gear and then posting about how much you hate Apple on an Apple-centric forum?

Maybe because he likes his Apple gear? You can like a companies products without having to like the company.

I bought iPods, iPhones and an iPad because I love them as products. I don't care about Apple as a company, and sometimes I lose a great deal of respect for Apple over how it behaves, but that doesn't mean I'll stop buying stuff from them.

Same reason I use Windows, because I like it, and play on my Xbox 360, because I love the games for it. I really could not care less about Microsoft.

Sony and Samsung don't matter at all to me either, but it didn't stop me buying a Vaio and a Samsung TV. Infact I actually dislike Sony. Your problem LTD is that you seem to put too much of a personal face on a company. You stick up for Apple like it is a great personal friend to you, like you go out drinking and watch the game together. You artificially limit your consumer choices based on personal likes and dislikes of companies; when in reality, none of them really care about you on the same level that you do about them.

 

[perealb]

It's a question of patents. Whether Apple copied from somebody else and got away with it is irrelevant since there is a system to be hold accountable. Companies should file for patents and fight for them in court. If you miss the boat, you're screwed.

 

[iEvolution]

This forum is becoming Anti Apple, with so many Android trolls.

Anyone know of any decent Apple sites?

I'm actually glad to see many fans can see when Apple is making some bad choices.

Apple is a great company and I do like their products but some of their business practices are questionable at times.

 

[AlterEg0]

Apple is making a lousy new impression on me

You are a little late to this party.

 

[Bubba Satori]

I can hear the late turtlenecked overlord spinning in his urn over your statement.

Stop it. I'm running out of keyboards.

 

[Stratus Fear]

The only fact stated here was that Samsung sells more phones than Apple and that "per model" sales are irrelevant to this figure and just a way to spin this into a positive for Apple.

You haven't at all proven it irrelevant. Besides, isn't that your opinion?

Samsung offers diversity, Apple offers simplicity. 2 models, both working fine since both companies are shipping tons of units. It just happens it worked better for Samsung in Q3 2011. To claim either is doing poorly is plain ludicrous.

I don't recall seeing anyone claim anything of the sort.

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Why would they? Having more choices doesn't magically spawn new customers out of nowhere.
Do you really think that Apple wouldn't create more choices if they thought it led to significantly increased sales?

I think Apple would do whatever pads the bottom line more. Increased sales don't necessarily mean increased margin. It's been pretty clear to see that while Samsung sells more phones (or at least did in one quarter) Apple continues to make more money. I think pointing that out and that they sell more per model is perfectly relevant and a validation of their sales strategy.

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Look, guy just doesn't want to be wrong. He went in to defend this premise :



So of course he had to move the goal posts all the way to the left field. Trying to play home base on this one, he lost simply based on the sales figures.

From the guy that is calling his opinions fact.

Hilarious.

Your original claim was that it's irrelevant. I pointed out why it's not and that you're wrong. Then all of a sudden we're talking about opinions, but then you shifted back to calling it a fact. Talk about shifting the goal posts. Is this how you usually debate? I'd be surprised if that doesn't get you on anyone's ignore list.

 

[KnightWRX]

From the guy that is calling his opinions fact.

Hilarious.

Your original claim was that it's irrelevant.

It is irrelevant in the context of the post I was responding to. I don't state my opinion as a fact. But feel free to keep moving the goal posts, maybe Apple will send you a gift card for having defended them on the forum against that pesky thing called reality.

 

[OneMike]

Apple is going overboard with this one.

 

[Stratus Fear]

It is irrelevant in the context of the post I was responding to. I don't state my opinion as a fact. But feel free to keep moving the goal posts, maybe Apple will send you a gift card for having defended them on the forum against that pesky thing called reality.

Ah, the ad homs are strong with this one. Just one step away from that dreaded "fanboy" word. That and you still can't point out what makes it irrelevant. You simply keep claiming that it is.

You said Samsung sells more phones than Apple. It's perfectly fair to point out that Apple sells more phones per model in their lineup, as a point of how strong their sales strategy is while not having a large offering of products. Sure, Samsung knows how to sell in greater volume, there's nothing wrong with that either.

Edit: I'm not sure I've ever seen anyone here accusing anyone else of taking complementary Galaxy Tabs for defending Samsung in these forums. I'm sure it's happened, but upon a cursory glance, I'm not finding it. Where do people get off making similar comments in the other direction? Ridiculous.

 

[Rodimus Prime]

Ah, the ad homs are strong with this one. Just one step away from that dreaded "fanboy" word. That and you still can't point out what makes it irrelevant. You simply keep claiming that it is.

You said Samsung sells more phones than Apple. It's perfectly fair to point out that Apple sells more phones per model in their lineup, as a point of how strong their sales strategy is while not having a large offering of products. Sure, Samsung knows how to sell in greater volume, there's nothing wrong with that either.

Edit: I'm not sure I've ever seen anyone here accusing anyone else of taking complementary Galaxy Tabs for defending Samsung in these forums. I'm sure it's happened, but upon a cursory glance, I'm not finding it. Where do people get off making similar comments in the other direction? Ridiculous.

No you do keep moving the goal post. You keep doing the same thing trying to cover up for the fact that Samsung sells more than iPhone. Even if Apple sold more models they would not out sell Samsung. Just like Android is more popular than iOS.

iOS cover all ranges from cheap crap to high end.

 

[Stratus Fear]

No you do keep moving the goal post. You keep doing the same thing trying to cover up for the fact that Samsung sells more than iPhone. Even if Apple sold more models they would not out sell Samsung. Just like Android is more popular than iOS.

iOS cover all ranges from cheap crap to high end.

Really? I keep covering up that Samsung sells more phones overall?

I even said in my previous post that they do and that there's *nothing wrong with that.* That Apple sells more per model is a statement of contrast and fact. It can be argued conversely that saying Samsung sells more phones than Apple is covering up the fact that they sell less of each model and thus make less margin than Apple per unit sold. Therefore, you have a messed up definition of "covering up" and "moving goal posts." Moving the goal posts here has been "oh, but we're actually talking about opinions, not facts" and various commentary on how something is irrelevant and a critique on my debate style rather than, you know, trying to debate and actually make a direct response to what I said. Sigh. But hey, if you don't have an argument, try to discredit the arguer and not his argument (since you can't discredit the argument).

That, and you still have yet to substantiate the underlined part. It's perfectly reasonable to assume that Android as a whole would always sell more than Apple, seeing as how Apple is but one manufacturer, but given just Apple and Samsung, there is little fundamental reason that, given everything else holding constant, Apple could not sell as many iPhones if they had as many models as Samsung does Android phones. I'm not even sure why this is that much of a debate. And with as many factors as there are in the market, it could go either way. Apple might sell more, they might sell less, they might break even with Samsung. To point it definitively in any direction is kind of dumb.