Apple Shares New Ad Showcasing Portrait Lighting Mode on the iPhone 8 Plus

Discussion in 'MacRumors.com News Discussion' started by MacRumors, Sep 30, 2017.

  1. citysnaps macrumors 68040

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    #176
    But no knowledge about the internals of the current iPhone 8, necessary engineering trades, and unused volume. Therefore, your confident assertion is just a... guess. And, unsourced.

    Sure, battery capacity could be reduced, and/or the phone made larger. But that's an undesirable consequence.
     
  2. chucker23n1 macrumors 68000

    chucker23n1

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2014
    #177
    Correct.

    With a much larger taptic engine, for starters.

    To the end that you made an asinine claim and can't back it up.
     
  3. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #178
    "You can soar with the eagles or wrestle in the mud with the pigs"

    What experience do either of you have in the tech and telecom industries that warrant your opinions having any merit?
     
  4. citysnaps macrumors 68040

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    #179
    Product manager, systems architect/engineer (hardware and signal processing), and hardware design engineer. In both commercial telecom and aerospace realms.
     
  5. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #180
    With who?

    Umm...product management is considerably different than engineering (as you should well know).

    And you should also be looking at the last two years....until we see the teardowns of the 8/8+, we won't know about the real estate of the camera modules.

    There was certainly real estate in the last two revisions that Apple could have accommodated the camera modules from the + model in the smaller handset.
     
  6. citysnaps macrumors 68040

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    #181
    Of course product management is different. Sometimes you have to do it, though - especially if you're the system architect. And?

    Various companies in both the commercial and aerospace electronics equipment/products world. Also a lot of systems engineering and design in wireless telecom.
     
  7. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #182
    Ok, so you worked at some startups. Guess this should be expected. You're in the bay area after all. Good for you!
     
  8. deanthedev Suspended

    deanthedev

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2017
    Location:
    Vancouver
    #183
    Argument from authority. A logical fallacy. Because I’m an expert in a certain field anything I say regarding that field must be correct.

    As pointed out above you know nothing of Apples criteria for the smaller iPhone. Would another camera module fit? Sure, after you relocate other components and reduce the size of others to make it fit. And without knowing what Apple has specified for those other components you can’t make any claim as to why they only put in one camera.

    Where do you place the components currently occupying the space where the second camera would go? What if one of those was an RF amplifier? Can you move it and still retain the same performance when using the cellular radio? Or do you now have to completely redesign your antenna because you’re relocating the amplifier? And if you redesign the antenna, what other components does that affect?

    Your comments sound like those from someone who builds their own gaming rigs and thinks they’re qualified to comment on how Apple builds their MacBook. It’s just a CPU, RAM, SSD, video card and motherboard, after all. Should be easy to swap one for another, right?

    Edited. BTW, there have been tear downs of the iPhone 8. Perhaps you want to look at them and tell us how to rearrange everything to fit the camera?
     
  9. citysnaps macrumors 68040

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    #184
    All were startups. And all were acquired by much larger companies, the last looking for wireless infrastructure expertise.
     
  10. fischersd macrumors 601

    fischersd

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    #185
    This is a subjective debate, as none of us work in the handheld engineering department at Apple (if we did, we wouldn't be allowed to participate in these discussions).
    I've had a fair amount of experience with handheld engineering previously. I'm saying the higher end camera in the + model is entirely a marketing choice, not an engineering choice. That you have virtually the same components of the 6 in the SE model should also give you an indication of what Apple's engineers are capable of.
    The handheld roadmap at Apple is likely similar to that of other companies, planned years in advance.
    You'll see features of the + camera migrate to the smaller handheld as new features are developed to differentiate the larger handheld.
    It's all about generating more revenue. Getting the bigger up-sell.
     
  11. citysnaps macrumors 68040

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    #186
    Yes, that's your guess/assertion. And so far not backed by facts.


    "This is a subjective debate, as none of us work in the handheld engineering department at Apple (if we did, we wouldn't be allowed to participate in these discussions)."


    Yup, therefore my response, right before the above quote.
     
  12. JosephAW macrumors 68000

    JosephAW

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  13. hot ham water macrumors newbie

    hot ham water

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    #188
    That breathy “singing” crap all pop stars use now is the downfall of music.
     
  14. fourthtunz macrumors 6502a

    fourthtunz

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    Maine
    #189
    heh, to add more fuel to the fire..they removed the headphone jack and put a speaker on that end..speaker on
    each end of the phone. I bought the 8+ and I love it. I don't understand all the bickering about something that has already been released..anyhow, as you were :)
     
  15. manu chao, Oct 2, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2017

    manu chao macrumors 603

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    #190
    Really? Recording two video streams (from both cameras) for a few minutes takes up a lot of storage on the phone?
    Third-party camera apps can save the raw data from the iPhone's camera(s). This started with iOS 10 last year and is possible with the iPhone 6s or later (if I remember it correctly).
    You do realise that the dpi metadata values in images is completely superfluous and irrelevant? There is practically no situation where it is used for anything (except to troll people like you into complaining about it).

    What it says in theory is how large (physically, in inches) an image should be displayed (divide the pixel count of an image by the dpi value and you get inches). But that instruction is essentially never honoured. Put an image into a document and image box you create in the document determines the physical size of the image (and that is assuming the document is printed or viewed at its nominal dimensions). Put an image into a webpage and it is either displayed at 100% in terms of pixels (poorly coded webpages) and thus at whatever dpi the display has, or it is displayed at whatever size the page layout assigns to the image. View an image in an image viewer and it is either viewed at an application-determined thumbnail size, filling the application window (or a subsection of the application window), at fullscreen size or at 100% (which again means using the dpi of the monitor).

    Only when printing there might a print option to use the dpi of the image. But why anybody would choose that instead of selecting a physical size is a big mystery.
    --- Post Merged, Oct 2, 2017 ---
    You don't do yourself any favours by pretending that the whole back of the 8 would be available for the camera module without incurring any compromises. There is a good reason the camera module on all iPhones up until the X was in a location that put it 'besides' the screen and not behind it. There simply is more depth available in the areas of the phone that are not screen (or home button, front camera, loudspeaker, proximity sensor). That is the reason why the dual cameras in the iPhone 6/7/8 Plus are oriented horizontally.

    The iPhone X only breaks with this because there is no area with no screen (or other front-facing elements).
    Yeah, sure. You can keep telling that to yourself that nobody cares about the screen size of their phones. Apple moving from 3.5" to 4" and 4.7" (at the same price point) has nothing to do with (most) people preferring larger screens (at least larger than 3.5" or 4"). And nobody got a Plus iPhone because of they wanted a larger screen. All the millions of people who have professed so are lying.

    Of course, limiting the dual-camera to the Plus phone is mostly about revenue and component cost (adding the dual camera to the non-Plus phone would not only reduce revenue by reducing the number of Plus phones sold, it would also reduce margins on the non-Plus phone because it would increase the component cost of the non-Plus phone). But the Plus phones also are smidgen thicker and 10.8 mm wider (which helps to avoid having the width of the dual camera module + flash collide with the speaker and possibly other components there at the top).

    But you don't help your argument with making ludicrous statements such as that there would be no incentive to pay more for the Plus model if it had the same camera module as the non-Plus phone or that the whole back of the phone would be an equally well-suited position for the camera module.
     
  16. GrumpyMom macrumors 603

    GrumpyMom

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    Sep 11, 2014
    #191
    It's actually a pretty "retro" sound I remember from music I heard when I was a kid in the 1970's. I can't remember if that was 60's or 70's music, but this definitely is not new.

    The problem is that all the pop acts are starting to sound alike. This woman sounds like the duo from Lucius, and goodness knows whom they are emulating.

    Even Taylor Swift is turning into Katy Perry, Rihanna and Beyoncé with all the same recycled symbolism and depressing dysfunctional imagery those women ended up going with. I miss the dancing sharks.
     
  17. bruinsrme macrumors 603

    bruinsrme

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2008
    #192
    I agree. I was going to skip this generation but when I saw the wireless charging I was all in.
    Based on the reports, the risks of the 8/8p expansion-gate is extremely high something like 1 in 10 million. I might be swayed to return mine.

    Show me a tire company that manufactures tires for automobiles that hasn’t had a failure on a vehicle and I will buy that tire.

    Failures are impossible to avoid. Just ask Firestone.
     
  18. Pilgrim1099 Suspended

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2008
    Location:
    From the Midwest to the Northeast
    #193
    I've noticed that there were times you mentioned you were a photographer from the Bay area. Was this your professional side gig or a hobby? I'm just asking because of your views on photography and Apple's cameras versus DSLRs, etc, while coming from the engineering side of things in the telecom and aerospace industries.
    --- Post Merged, Oct 2, 2017 ---
    I never use the print option for images to hard copies on 8 x 10 paper. I used to do that years ago before the advent of tablets and smartphones came about which made it easier to carry a digital portfolio of the work I do. I do mostly illustration work by hand and digitally. However, when it comes to creating something that is for print, usually 300 dpi is the standard, especially if it's for t-shirts ( probably close to 600 if need be but I go with vector done on Illustrator ).

    The images originally shot on iPhone would be a bit too big to upload, so I usually have to scale them down so that the file size is smaller and easier to post up. Most of the time, when it comes to Instagram or other social media, it's not a problem as it's automatic. But at certain times, when on iPad Pro, I use Pixelmator scale them down or Photoshop on the desktop.

    On the other hand, when I start out with digital art, I do it on the iPad Pro and then export the piece to the desktop when I have to. On Procreate, I go with either 150 or 300 dpi for high resolution work. That way, when they're done, I can save another copy as a 'web ready' image. Low res images online usually make it hard for image thieves to really print them out in detail to be sold and this is already a huge problem in the comics or publishing industry where artists have their works stolen. Or thieves claiming credit to the work that's not their's.

    As far as third party apps allowing RAW format, I didn't realize that but might look into it if the situation arises when I have to take still photography on large artwork ( I have a tripod and horizontal bar for the camera to shoot to the floor or surface with a bluetooth remote. It's pretty handy ). I usually go with the Olloclip lens time to time when I want to play with the wide or fisheye effect, or maximum zoom which are really helpful.

    But it's when I'm shooting images for reference, I have no intention of using them for print and just refer to them when doing a project. When I really want to take a photo of something to incorporate into a file for image manipulation for print, this is something I have to keep in mind. Because of that, when you bring in a 72 dpi image straight from iphone, in whatever size in inches it's at ( I think 24 x 24? ), the last thing you want to do is to 'upscale' 72 to 300 which would make it appear somewhat fuzzy, or even increase file size unnecessarily.

    On Camera +, there is Qualty and Format menu option ranging from JPEG ( download, normal and high ) and to TIFF. It also has 'Save RAW Photo' option.

    That last part just surprised me when I recently look at this app a while ago this morning. It looks like I'll have to use that app for specific projects and the stock Camera app only for basic image referencing or social media purposes.
     
  19. manu chao macrumors 603

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    Jul 30, 2003
    #194
    A dpi number only makes sense when attached to a physical size (like a physical piece of paper or a monitor) or to a document that has physical dimensions attached to it like a Word or PDF document. An image doesn't have a physical size before it is displayed on a monitor or printed on paper (or other material). It is only the number of pixels that determines the size of an image file (plus things like bit depth and compression) and how much information it can contain. Changing the dpi number of an image doesn't change the image size (in terms of MB) nor how much information it contains. Adding a dpi number is only a roundabout way of attaching a desired physical print or display size.
     
  20. Asianpork macrumors member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    #195
    So, does anyone else use the Stage Light mono feature in portrait mode strictly for jokes only?

    I'm no expert, but every picture I've taken with that feature looks like a horrible photoshop cut out job done using a laptop trackpad. I have no idea how people are achieving such good results because that mode only produces hot garbage.

    Seen many reviews of the iphone 8+ on Youtube and not single reviewer seriously recommended this feature.

    Besides that, though, the camera rocks and the bokeh effect is MUCH more refined now then when it was first introduced.
     
  21. MacLoveMacHate macrumors member

    MacLoveMacHate

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    Sep 5, 2017
    #196
    From what I've seen in reviews, the lighting options are quite as successful in the average users', but as an ad it works. That's marketing, folks.
     
  22. polterbyte macrumors 6502

    polterbyte

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    Brazil
    #197
    Quite cool, indeed! It keeps the texture and details of the objects, which is mandatory if this features is to be useful. So far, so good. I've been looking at some of the sample photos from the unveiling of the new iPhones, and I see that the quality there is not the best, and in some cases, the effect downright destroys the photo. It's different than hat users such as yourself have been publishing, and this is good news, indeed.
     
  23. chucker23n1 macrumors 68000

    chucker23n1

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    Dec 7, 2014
    #198
    Digital images don't have a dpi. Not 72, not 300. If you do want to print a pixel-based image to a physical medium like paper, though, you have to decide how many pixels make up an inch, so you have to pick a dots per inch (technically, pixels per inch would be the more correct term).

    It's not a matter of quality; it's choosing a conversion. You can increase the dots per inch and have more detail on the printed page, at the loss of a smaller image. Or have a bigger, but less detailed image.
     
  24. AFDoc macrumors 68030

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    Colorado Springs USA for now
    #199
    The woman in the vid seems very strange looking to me..... kinda hurts my eyes..... kinda cool commercial though...

    it's almost like her head is too big for her body.... like a human bobble head.
     
  25. PCMA macrumors member

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    #200

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