Apple Sold Fewest Macs in Any Quarter Since 2010 as Nearly Entire Lineup Was Outdated

[DNichter]

Then it's a self fulfilling prophecy. Apple doesn't update them because people don't buy them and people don't buy them because Apple doesn't update them.

As for ARM I am confused by some people's fascination with this processor. It's a nice processor but it's not the answer to languishing Mac updates.

If you don't consider three and four years frequent then why do you continue to use frequent in your responses?

Possibly. Either way, that's where we are at. We know a Mac Pro is coming and I am sure they have plans for a mini of sort. I think the move to ARM will give Apple more control over the form factors, release schedules, features, etc. that they can produce. I went back to some of our discussion and I didn't see the word frequent, but if you point out specifically what I said, I am sure I can provide you with what I meant by it.

 

[Roadstar]

iPads are being sold instead of MacBooks which I don’t understand as the MacBook is still so much better. The only advantage for me having an iPad Pro is being able to use easily outside on construction site with its pencil.

For me another iPad advantage is the built-in LTE. I wish Apple offered a laptop with that option.

 

[Black Tiger]

Let us not discount product longevity as a factor. I am on my third iMac from Apple, purchased in late 2012. It is still running as good today as it did the day I purchased it and there just is no reason for me to upgrade. This is actually the longest I have held on to a computer simply because it is outstanding. Now I can’t speak for all users, but I suspect that I’m not the only one in this position. I still see businesses running the thicker iMacs that date back to 2009, even. Additionally, while I would agree that smart phones and tablets can not replace a Mac, many day to day tasks have shifted to those platforms. I think desktop-class computers simply have matured to the point where sales are never going to be through the roof.
With regards to “high prices” of the MacBook Pro, let us keep in mind that some equivalent machines under Jobs, such as the PowerBook g4 *started* at $3400. And that was over a decade ago. That price would be closer to $4500 today.

 

[Tozovac]

Did you have a point?

Sure. I take issue with Apple today vs. 10 years ago (too much focus on fashion instead of function to the point that things are less intuitive, durable, and serviceable/expandable vs. 10 years ago), so I'm just trying to make light of: as they let their computer offerings go stale and less fun to use & own, isn't that soon going to affect their ability to focus hard on design & development of important things like animojis and making something less thick and less serviceable and less expandable and less intuitive than last year's offering. After all, what’s the likelihood they’ve moved their hard-core engineering work to iPads?

 

[jlseattle]

My vote is they are working on quality of their products over quantity and speed. If you want a constantly updated product Dell computers (very inferior) are updated regularly. I know it's easy to blame and sad new stuff isn't coming out continually. But when it does, enjoy your new purchase and wait for the new iterations. Don't cry over milk that hasn't been spilled yet.

 

[bluecoast]

iPad Mini 3/4 still has the A8 SoC and going on 4 years without updated SoC! LOL! Still sell around 18% of total iPad sales however. Apple just does not bring itself to do an update yet! Rumor has it that Apple is planning a 2020 release, which put it nearly 6 years without an SoC update!

It’s shameful and embarrassing how Apple still keeps old products live.

We don’t know what Steve would do but I don’t ever remember him keeping old tech for sale.

Apple under Jobs would kill things like the iPod mini (it sold loads) as he felt there was something better that they could do.

I think he would’ve loved iPhone X, EarPods and the Watch - and probably the HomePod.

But I feel that he would’ve regarded the rest of Apple’s lineup as boring.

And it is. It’s boring.

 

[cBraunDesign]

It's really hard not to view all of this in light of your own personal experience. I'll use myself as an example. My wife and I own a small business and we use two Macs for our whole operation. One is a older 2012 MBP, the other is a 2015 MBP (with the discreet GPU). We have two iPhones, a 7 and a 7+. We also have two iPads. A second generation and an Air. None of these products are current, but one of them needs of replacing.

You better believe both of the MBPs are still being used simply because Apple doesn't make a computer that fits our needs better than these. I would LOVE to spend my money on new Macs. The problem is that Apple doesn't make what we need, no matter the price point. They did in 2015, they don't now.

I'm stuck, because there's just no way I'm ever going to consider buying a Windows notebook. And unless the Thunderbolt 3 peripheral market suddenly matures and the USB folks figure out how to keep all the different protocols straight, the new MBPs just aren't appealing.

For me, it honestly has nothing to do with the suspect keyboards. I'd be willing to take that risk if they were a few microns thicker and included a MagSafe connector, an SD slot, and an HDMI port.

Like many of you, I'm afraid these slow Mac sales will lead Apple to abandon the line further, rather than invest in it and make it great again.

 

[0958400]

What happens to a tree when its roots die?
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I think most buyers are waiting for the fall updates and possible new MacBooks (sub 1k). Good thing for Mac users is that the devices have longevity, so they can wait a few months more to update.

24 months so far and counting.

 

[benlukes]

Tim is managing the company, not providing every level of guidance regarding the creativity and product design, etc. Others in the company are contributing as equally if not more when it comes to any lackluster designs or release schedule. The company is stable, extremely profitable, and still coming out with innovative products. Tim's job is to maintain the creative culture, encourage and foster new ideas from others within the company, work the supply chain, and be the public-facing representative. He's done a pretty good job at that.

I think you are right about Tim Cook's role, but if that's true then it is clear he is no Steve Jobs replacement (which I guess should be clear anyway).

 

[pl1984]

Possibly. Either way, that's where we are at. We know a Mac Pro is coming and I am sure they have plans for a mini of sort. I think the move to ARM will give Apple more control over the form factors, release schedules, features, etc. that they can produce. I went back to some of our discussion and I didn't see the word frequent, but if you point out specifically what I said, I am sure I can provide you with what I meant by it.

Sure thing. Post #313:

Maybe my wording was incorrect then, they only appeal to a small number of users. Therefore they don't warrant frequent updates. Most businesses work this way with their products.​

 

[Salaryman Ryan]

People demand yearly mac refreshes akin to the iPhone, but don't understand there's no groundbreaking hardware advances to justify it. If people want to shell out 3K every year for the sake of a new laptop shell, maybe apple should oblige them.

No need for ground breaking updates. People just want Apple to keep Mac hardware up to speed with the rest of the industry. A good example is the Mac Mini. I bet a lot of people would be happy if Apple just refreshed the hardware.

 

[DNichter]

Sure thing. Post #313:

Maybe my wording was incorrect then, they only appeal to a small number of users. Therefore they don't warrant frequent updates. Most businesses work this way with their products.​

Ah okay. So yes, with those two devices being such a small part of Apple's Mac lineup, I don't feel that they should be updated every 1-2 years (that would be frequent to me).

 

[pl1984]

Ah okay. So yes, with those two devices being such a small part of Apple's Mac lineup, I don't feel that they should be updated every 1-2 years (that would be frequent to me).

Fair enough. So how do you explain the three and five year stagnation?

 

[Substance90]

My 2017 MBP hits the sweet spot for me. Reliable, compact and easy to travel with, loads of excellent I/O, beautiful wide gamut display, and macOS.

Forgot to add the sarcasm tag?

 

[pat500000]

Well...where are the macs?

 

[DNichter]

Fair enough. So how do you explain the three and five year stagnation?

That's really for Apple to explain. They are going to make business decisions based on what will drive revenue. I'd imagine neither did much for them in that regard, but I think Apple wanted to save face a bit with the Mac Pro since they botched the trash can design and want to cater to the "Pro" segment with a modular design that they can update more frequently, while keeping the same design.

 

[benlukes]

Let us not discount product longevity as a factor. I am on my third iMac from Apple, purchased in late 2012. It is still running as good today as it did the day I purchased it and there just is no reason for me to upgrade. This is actually the longest I have held on to a computer simply because it is outstanding. Now I can’t speak for all users, but I suspect that I’m not the only one in this position. I still see businesses running the thicker iMacs that date back to 2009, even. Additionally, while I would agree that smart phones and tablets can not replace a Mac, many day to day tasks have shifted to those platforms. I think desktop-class computers simply have matured to the point where sales are never going to be through the roof.
With regards to “high prices” of the MacBook Pro, let us keep in mind that some equivalent machines under Jobs, such as the PowerBook g4 *started* at $3400. And that was over a decade ago. That price would be closer to $4500 today.

That is part of it, I suppose, but from my own experience: the only reason I haven't purchased a replacement for my early 2011 MacBook Pro is because I can't stomach the idea of purchasing the current MacBook Pros. Can't upgrade RAM, can't replace the SSD, can't easily replace the battery, only one type of port...totally ridiculous...and only to get a thinner and lighter machine? I would be happy to have a marginally thicker and heavier laptop to have those features, and I bet that is true of most professional users.

Yes, it's great my computer has lasted this long, but the only reason it has needed to is that Apple doesn't make a product I want to buy anymore.

As for cost, again comparing to my current 2011 machine, I would have to spend vastly more money, something like twice as much, now to get a comparable replacement for this computer. And the 2011 model was much better relative to the competition of its day than the current model, and even is absolutely better in many regards (mentioned before). Electronics should be getting cheaper.

 

[pl1984]

That's really for Apple to explain. They are going to make business decisions based on what will drive revenue. I'd imagine neither did much for them in that regard, but I think Apple wanted to save face a bit with the Mac Pro since they botched the trash can design and want to cater to the "Pro" segment with a modular design that they can update more frequently, while keeping the same design.

You're in agreement this is Apple's issue and not Intels?

 

[dantroline]

I know I'm the minority here but I may very well never buy a Mac ever again.

Apple is the reason Toys R Us and similar businesses have been going under. It makes toys. Even the Mac lineup is in danger of becoming toy-like. In some respects they took Unix and crippled it by shoehorning it into a desktop experience, reducing a lot of its flexibility - I don't really criticise them for that, Mac makes a great OS for what it's worth, but they got the taste for toy making and they are running with it.

We need another viable alternative OS to Windows. My next Mac will be a Hackintosh - within the next few weeks, to replace my ageing Mac Minis. I don't care anymore about Apple's hardware updates, since they are nowadays so disappointing.

 

[benlukes]

It’s shameful and embarrassing how Apple still keeps old products live.

We don’t know what Steve would do but I don’t ever remember him keeping old tech for sale.

Apple under Jobs would kill things like the iPod mini (it sold loads) as he felt there was something better that they could do.

I think he would’ve loved iPhone X, EarPods and the Watch - and probably the HomePod.

But I feel that he would’ve regarded the rest of Apple’s lineup as boring.

And it is. It’s boring.

I can take boring as long as it's capable of meeting my needs. It isn't.

 

[bladerunner2000]

As long as they app performs well and gets their task done, I don't see why not. No, I don't.

You ever try to render anything in Premiere/After Effects/Final Cut?

 

[pl1984]

Let us not discount product longevity as a factor. I am on my third iMac from Apple, purchased in late 2012. It is still running as good today as it did the day I purchased it and there just is no reason for me to upgrade. This is actually the longest I have held on to a computer simply because it is outstanding. Now I can’t speak for all users, but I suspect that I’m not the only one in this position. I still see businesses running the thicker iMacs that date back to 2009, even. Additionally, while I would agree that smart phones and tablets can not replace a Mac, many day to day tasks have shifted to those platforms. I think desktop-class computers simply have matured to the point where sales are never going to be through the roof.
With regards to “high prices” of the MacBook Pro, let us keep in mind that some equivalent machines under Jobs, such as the PowerBook g4 *started* at $3400. And that was over a decade ago. That price would be closer to $4500 today.

Keep in mind the longevity of those systems is, at least partially, made possible by the ability to upgrade them. Furthermore Macs (and PCs) have reached a level where many users tasks can be done just fine on older equipment. However when you're in the market to buy a new Mac it's difficult to pay such a high price and not get the latest technology available.

 

[DNichter]

You're in agreement this is Apple's issue and not Intels?

I feel that it's a bit of both after reading through and hearing arguments from both sides. The way I see it - Apple builds machines a certain way (thin, light, different cooling ability per machine, not power hungry), so they need to adhere to that when choosing the proper Intel processor. Then they need to consider profitability, manufacturing, marketing, release schedules, OS updates, etc. and have to weigh whether or not it is all worth it just to keep a semi regular schedule of updates to their Mac line. I suppose Apple takes it all into consideration and feels that it just may not be worth it sometimes. It's unfortunate for those that need it, but it's ultimately what makes Apple so successful at the same time. This is mainly why I think developing their own chips could free them from it's reliance on Intel and create their own path and do things they want to do. Balancing that with still catering to the Pro market will be key in the coming years.
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You ever try to render anything in Premiere/After Effects/Final Cut?

Nope, remember I don't do any real work - I use an iPad Pro.

 

[bladerunner2000]

Nope, remember I don't do any real work - I use an iPad Pro.

So then why should your simple needs and simple processors also be the only choice for professionals that are tied to the Mac?

 

[benlukes]

Being a long time Mac user this comes as no surprise. Apple are no longer producing Macs suitable and sufficiently productive for the pro user. For the pro user a maxed out late 2012 15" Retina MacBook Pro is more suitable and productive than the latest offering providing a assortment of ports not USB-C only. It has a keyboard that makes sense and is reliable.

Moving on to the iPhone. Apples obsession with thinness as with the MacBook Pro compromises have been made. A major show stopper is no headphone jack. Apples assumption that all consumers are going to go out and purchase Bluetooth headphones is absurd. Oh and that prostrate and protruding camera.

All Apple decisions these days are made in the boardroom these days with the interest of the shareholder being of most importance whilst showing scant regard for the consumer.

Yes it is a cliche but since the passing of Steve Jobs Apple has utterly lost focus and direction.

Mac user since 2001.

I agree with all of this. I've been a Mac user since about 1992. I've been distraught the past couple years over the idea of having to replace my MacBook Pro with the current crap products. After going to a laptop repair shop for a repair issue on my current 2011 MacBook Pro and expressing my concerns there, the technician told me there are still a lot of good refurbished MacBook Pros from that era available.

There is a good chance I will take that route when I do finally upgrade...a better product for significantly less money, and a lost sale for Apple.