Apple Staff Complain About Plans for Return to Office Work in Letter to Tim Cook

[ArPe]

Depends what work people do.

If there needs to be more hands on approaches and team meetings and people testing the apps and products in person and together then they have to go to the office.

If they don’t go to the office it will create lag times and bottle necks and then it will take a little longer for everything especially bug fixes. Takes too long already.

 

[Abazigal]

I can only speak for myself and my workplace but online meetings are so much more effective than meetings on-site. Don’t see a reason why everyone has to be on-site for a meeting. Some can be remote, some on-site.

My experience is opposite, but then again, as a teacher, I admit my experiences probably aren’t in line with the rest of the corporate world.

 

[brendu]

Remember when employees did what their bosses said without whining and crying endlessly? Pepperidge Farms remembers…

I get these guys and gals think they can work from home just as well but, tough. You do what your boss says. If you’re so valuable.. go somewhere else that lets you work from home. Stop crying like bratty children. Lots of talented people would gladly take one of those jobs without bitching about everything they don’t like.

Between the boomers greed and my generations laziness and demand for instant gratification, it’s a wonder society is functioning at all.

 

[ricketysquire]

I'm not a fan of WFH, it's okay maybe once a week or as needed, but this hybrid model is a terrible idea. I don't understand the mindset or housing situation of those folks who love WFH. My home is a home, a place to relax not to work 8+ hours a day.

What kind of housing do they live in? Many of us live in cheaply built apartments or homes with thin walls. There's nothing like trying to go heads down but you're unable to due to lawn mowers, construction, loud neighbors and other noises. Even with high end noise canceling headphones you can't block all sounds. Office buildings are far better constructed and suited for, I don't know, work? I can live with the sounds of my coworkers talking, that's a normal expected sound, but when it's lawn mower right outside of your cheaply constructed apartment, it's something else.

On top of it all, work-life balance is atrocious for work from home, this last year has been the most stressful so far. Just because your working from home doesn't mean that your workday doesn't end. It's as if employers are taking advantage of this fact, and demanding you be available at 8 or 9 PM, nothing like getting a message from your boss as you're falling asleep at 11 PM. At least in the office, you can wrap up the day and head home. There's some clear physical separation with work and home. If you work from home, work is always there.

I support teams all day and so many folks have bad internet connections, or are having trouble with their equipment or using their computer. Things that take a second in-person become 15 minute affairs. This impacts productivity.

I'm not some fan of "Pro-Victorian" working conditions, I just think it's an employer's responsibility to provide a suitable place where work can be done. My home isn't it and if someone is able to and wants to work 100% remotely that's great, but it shouldn't be forced on us.

To me work from home seems like an easy way for businesses to cut cost, hiring people in low cost of living areas or having employees move and cutting their salary. Also saving money on office expenses and utilities, all while pretending to be a "progressive open-minded" organization.

 

[UrbanJoe1]

So much for “build it and they will come”

 

[Silverstring]

Feel free to continuously try and talk down to me just because I don't agree with you 100%. I've already stated that you're correct most people who work from home are just as productive or even more, go back and read all my replies I never state that the work doesn't get done or the person is lazy about the actual work load.

You're wrong, I'm happy to answer you. Also, you wrote I sounded "dumb AF", and I'm the one belittling you? Just want to make sure I have that straight.

I've only stated it's lazy to not wanna come in to work even though it's safe to do so......

What's inherently lazy about it, though? To reject doing something that isn't necessary isn't "lazy", it's smart. I don't know many people who think it's efficient or effective to do unnecessary things, regardless of they difficulty involved. You might call doing unnecessary things "lazy", I would say "a waste of time". I'm saying if people's work can be done without going in...they shouldn't go in.

these are cry babies who are upset Tim said come to the office 72 hrs a pay period, IF THE KIDS GOTTA GO, THEN WE ALL SHOULD GO and shoulder the responsibility we all have to our community and our fellow man in trying to return some normalcy to ALL OF OUR LIVES.

Answer the question......If it's safe for the kids then why should the adults be treated any differently? I continue to hammer this point home because a office building like the Stargate apple built for these BUMS is no different than a school (well we all know the school is inadequate in comparison) it houses a large number of people in a closed in space where verbal interaction is key to the environment, if the kids have no choice but to do as the school system and the adults tell them then it's perfectly OK for a company paying the money that apple pays to ask their employees to BRING DAT @$$.

I disagree with your premise that school and work are the same, or that kids and adults should be treated with similar circumstances. I think the situations should be treated differently because they are different. Part of the function of schooling is entrusting the care of children to another physically-present authority, to free parents up so they can pursue work to provide for themselves and their families.

To put it more simply: an adult is responsible enough to work at home without physically present supervision. A child is not, for obvious reasons like latchkey laws. They're in danger if totally left to their own devices.

I'm confident that, in many of these jobs—which I don't know the exact nature of, either—verbal interaction isn't key to the environment. Even if it were, there are phone calls, and even video meetings where cues like body language can be read. So there you go: verbal interaction is preserved, without physical proximity.

Go ahead and belittle me and talk to me as if I'm some toddler or inferior being ......I still breathe and continue to get money either way🤷🏽‍♂️💯🙌🏼😎

I don't wish you any ill—why do you make all of these weird assumptions?—but congratulations and I'm happy for you! We may have different ideas, but I—no sarcasm or snark—hope you live a very long life with financial and resource security.

 

[Zeke92]

I don't think asking for someone you pay hundreds of thousands per year to come in for 3 days per week is a big ask. Especially since it's a lot harder for a company like Apple to contain leaks with everyone working from home.

How so? Leakers will leak information regardless. Where are you deriving this information? lol. If the 100k job can be done at home … it can be done at home. It doesn’t matter

 

[jnog88]

What balance? Just go to work. For Gods sake, they work in a building that is a beautiful modern day feat of engineering, surrounded by fruit orchards. Their nice air conditioned offices filled with natural light…

They make it sound like Tim is asking them to report to the coal mines at 4AM starting in September.

Remember folks, these narcissistic brats are going to be the ones running all our businesses in 20-30 years. Enjoy normalcy while you can😉

Speaking as an introvert who’s worked from home for 15 months and who was working in a beautiful, newly renovated building, I don’t want to go back to the office.

I save $150 a month in commuting expenses and 35-40 hours a in commuting time. My company isn’t willing to reimburse me for either of those things. My work has been done as expected and on time the entire pandemic.

I don’t have a need to be in the office the 5 days a week they are requiring as of late August.

I understand this completely and while I think Apple’s set up of only 3 days required in the office is quite flexible, believe they should definitely provide for exceptions for fully remote work which I’m sure they will do after this!

 

[ArPe]

How so? Leakers will leak information regardless. Where are you deriving this information? lol. If the 100k job can be done at home … it can be done at home. It doesn’t matter

There is more chance for leaks like this. I sign NDAs with all my clients, but if I get hacked, show something to my family and friends, or I misplace something drive then the data will leak and I’ll be fked.

 

[BWhaler]

How do we know it’s a “large group?”

petition is unsigned.

 

[thatsmyfish]

NO…..realists and not MSM fed …..(fill in the blank….).

When someone calls you jealous and your response is NO it’s a fairly big tell.

 

[Ihm]

As an european it is so funny to watch the antisocial „american dream“ and „american way of life“ with the lack of solidarity.
This century and the internet showed your pure ignorance and irresponsibility for everyone and everything outside the USA to the rest of the world. And now you‘re starting to show your real face even to your fellow citizens when they are not in line with your perverted economical ideology and the Hobson’s Choice driven conduct.
Apple is NOT a righteous and saintly company. They are running sweatshops in Asia and paying average to low salaries to the majority of their employees.
Tim Cook is NOT the cool and honest guy he is acting for the media.
He would give a s*** to green economy if it isnt en vogue and has no positive impact to apples image. Think about it just for one minute:

Why the biggest and richest company in the world is not capable to manufacture their whole high-priced products in their home country?

Blind obedience and the lack of own view led Europe into two world wars.
Good tip: Begin to think out of the box and logical.

 

[Apple_Robert]

Good on them for standing up for themselves.

More like being greedy and trying to manipulate Apple for more of what they think they are entitled to (for some mysterious reason).

Edited to add: I think Apple was very generous with employees during the Pandemic.

 

[ChromeAce]

Hopefully they sent this using iMessage so they can tell if it was even read.

 

[Halikaarn]

Reading these comments... no wonder the labor movement is so down these days. Lots of wannabe CEOs that can't appreciate a novel situation resulting in progressive change.
I expect many 👎...
People who are hating on these employees... where do you work? What is your job? What is your commute? What is your pay? Are you satisfied with all of that? Please respond truthfully.

 

[Apple_Robert]

I am remote now too and love it for the same reasons. Do not miss the stress, time lost and financial hit of commuting. Also, as the caretaker for my mom, I am grateful to be working from home.

Don't forget the other perk of being able to peruse MR.

 

[Silverstring]

I get so much more done remotely than I ever did in the office. 5-6pm is my second wind and I’m not spending it fighting with traffic. I can turn the computer on at 10pm if I had a brainstorm.

Exactly!

The other argument totally disregards that rushing to get out the door, maybe missing breakfast to not be late, having (potentially) less sleep to account for commuting time, and the process of commuting itself—dealing with traffic and/or rubbing elbows on public transit—has zero effect on cognitive load...which is amazing to me.

Even as someone who doesn't work remote, I know that having a stressful commute, for example...already wears down someone's processing ability, and can even have negative reverberative effects on someone's interpersonal work interactions that day. Avoiding/conserving that cognitive battery can and does literally make someone more productive!

...but some people think that isn't a thing at all, and I don't understand why. It makes me think of managers throughout my career who only think of "cost" in terms of $$$, but completely discount other human capital/productivity costs...which is far too common in the work world.

 

[macpro2000]

Get back to work people. No reason not to.

 

[cardfan]

Couldn’t imagine a worse job than working at apple as one of the grunts. Glad I own my own firm. We’ve pretty much fired anyone who hasn’t returned to work by now.

 

[Jason2000]

Entitled spoiled brats. Fire them all. My wife and I have been back to the office now for almost a year. Get over it.

 

[thatsmyfish]

Remember when employees did what their bosses said without whining and crying endlessly? Pepperidge Farms remembers…

I get these guys and gals think they can work from home just as well but, tough. You do what your boss says. If you’re so valuable.. go somewhere else that lets you work from home. Stop crying like bratty children. Lots of talented people would gladly take one of those jobs without bitching about everything they don’t like.

Between the boomers greed and my generations laziness and demand for instant gratification, it’s a wonder society is functioning at all.

There’s an argument to be made that the people working 80 hour weeks or in coal mines without safety precautions should have quit their whining or moved over for someone else to take their job. Instead society adjusted.

Your point is fair. If workers make unreasonable demands, it’s harmful. This is not unreasonable. Telework is demonstrably proven. Apple admits that a more relaxed policy works fine. The workers are requesting a further relaxation of the policy.

If they want to fire everyone, they can. Good luck filling the jobs with the bad press. This forum is filled with people desperate to do their jobs and are no different than the people who respond to “save the pet” posts with “I would take him for a minute if not for XYZ.”

They’re not qualified and live nowhere near Cupertino.

Plenty of businesses can’t open today because employers made an unacceptable employment offer. Apple’s offer isn’t unacceptable, but unemployment is low. They need to compete against the other guys.

 

[Zeke92]

Me, me, me.

The letter says nothing about what’s good for the company. What about people who prefer working on site? Why are they forced to collaborate using Zoom?

NO ONE said that people who want to go in can’t. It’s for the people who don’t want to go in unnecessarily. What don’t you all get? Everyone is really over pushing collaborative parts in the software world. We literally sit in silence with each other with our headphones on most of the day

 

[urnotl33t]

A large group of Apple employees are opposing the company's plans to require three days of in-person work a week from September, according to a internal letter seen by The Verge.

In the detailed letter sent yesterday afternoon, addressed to CEO Tim Cook and the company's executive leadership, the Apple employees said that they want a more flexible approach where those who want to work remotely are able to do so.



Earlier this week, Tim Cook sent a note to Apple employees explaining that they will need to return to the office for at least three days a week starting in September. Teams that require in-person work will return to the office for four to five days a week, but most employees will still be able to have two days of remote work. Employees will also be able to work entirely remotely for up to two weeks every year, but the remote work requests will need to be approved by managers.



The new remote working policy is a distinctive easing compare to the company's previous working from home policy, but some Apple staff believe that the new plan does not go far enough and is "not sufficient in addressing many of our needs."

Benefits of more flexible work highlighted by the employees included diversity and inclusion in retention and hiring, tearing down previously-existing communication barriers, better work-life balance, better integration of existing remote workers, and reduced spread of pathogens.



The letter reportedly began in an Apple Slack channel for "remote work advocates" with around 2,800 members. As many as 80 employees are said to have been involved in writing and editing the note.

The letter summarised its formal requests as follows:



See the full letter at The Verge for more information.

Article Link: Apple Staff Complain About Plans for Return to Office Work in Letter to Tim Cook

I’m soooooo gonna get voted down and flamed for this, but I’ll bite the flame-bait:

I agree with the folks and their letter. They make valid points. As humans, I agree with them. Key word: humans.
(Here’s where I get attacked)…

Hypothetically, had this been the policy in 2006-ish, the iPhone would not have been the disruptor it was *initially* (later, it likely would have but not until one or two revisions). Why?

One random day an employee walked by that HR person’s office and accidentally noticed she was using the FingerWorks multitouch panel because of her wrist injury. That was the reason iPhone had multitouch on Day 1. It was going to be a plastic screen like iPod. They changed it at almost the last minute because of this accidental finding.

Yes yes yes, the third iteration would have had it in this alternate universe, but having it Day 1 was the ultimate surprise and truly justified no hardware keyboard.

This was only possible with in-office activities. As a company, you need this random genesis, this chemical mixture and percolation. It’s hard to put into words for a generic conversation, but these are the reasons.

We do know of the stories of people who had their marriages and lives destroyed because of the iPhone development and that’s incredibly sad for all involved. As humans, this is terrible. Apple, and many other companies, does ask too much of its people.

I do think we can find a balance, tho. The conversation still needs to happen. A new “benefit package” may need to be developed post-COVID. Things just might be different after all. Maybe.

“May you live in interesting times”.

 

[JokerGengy]

You're wrong, I'm happy to answer you. Also, you wrote I sounded "dumb AF", and I'm the one belittling you? Just want to make sure I have that straight.


What's inherently lazy about it, though? To reject doing something that isn't necessary isn't "lazy", it's smart. I don't know many people who think it's efficient or effective to do unnecessary things, regardless of they difficulty involved. You might call doing unnecessary things "lazy", I would say "a waste of time". I'm saying if people's work can be done without going in...they shouldn't go in.


I disagree with your premise that school and work are the same, or that kids and adults should be treated with similar circumstances. I think the situations should be treated differently because they are different. Part of the function of schooling is entrusting the care of children to another physically-present authority, to free parents up so they can pursue work to provide for themselves and their families.

To put it more simply: an adult is responsible enough to work at home without physically present supervision. A child is not, for obvious reasons like latchkey laws. They're in danger if totally left to their own devices.

I'm confident that, in many of these jobs—which I don't know the exact nature of, either—verbal interaction isn't key to the environment. Even if it were, there are phone calls, and even video meetings where cues like body language can be read. So there you go: verbal interaction is preserved, without physical proximity.



I don't wish you any ill—why do you make all of these weird assumptions?—but congratulations and I'm happy for you! We may have different ideas, but I—no sarcasm or snark—hope you live a very long life with financial and resource security.

You make good points about the kids, their attention span and safety regarding being at home by themselves and attempting to learn. But let's go with the facts here, Tim is meeting his staff half way, I don't think it's unfair for him to expect that they do the same, He's not forcing everyone to the same rules, if certain employees have circumstances that require them to be home (sick parents, sick children etc) they can reach out to HR and see what the next steps would be for them and their situation. But I stand by what I said, If the kids gotta go back, then it's safe for all the able bodied people who must return to work when asked to do so....do so.
I appreciate the constructive argument that we "Remotely" 😎 been having and I also wish you nothing but the best my G..........and I also appreciate that you take DAT @$$ in when asked, I definitely saw you mentioned you don't work at home, so that tells me you like a good argument aswell 🤣😂🤣

 

[Silverstring]

Get back to work people. No reason not to.

I'm confused...the work didn't stop just because people weren't physically present, did it?

Remote work is still...work.