Apple vs. Mac OS X Hackers

[Mr. Mister]

When Apple sees what's good for it, they'll spend time achieving complete hardware compatibility and then releasing the OS for the PC.

Seriously though, I see no harm in OSX86Project's methedology other than the fact that it's impossible to obtain a version of OS X that will run on the PC legally, so you can't exactly buy it in stores, and indirectly encourages piracy.

 

[rjgjonker]

the creators of Apple are allowed to set up the rules. if they want to sell both hardware and software together for a better experience, well that's their choice.

if you don't agree, steal it or don't use it as it is intended...fine..whatever
but
1. you lose your integrity and respect from others (excluding from socially disabled people)
2. people start wondering why your spent you free time doing stuff like that...wich leads back to number 1
3. it's illegal. (if you create something and people abuse it because they have a different 'opinion'...well you're not motivated to improve or create again) and it's not even an opinion, just a bad education lol

I never steal things, I have never stolen anything and I wouldn't do it to get OS X working on a non-Apple computer. So that's a moot point. In fact, I don't even see how stealing would help installing Mac OS X on a computer.

I don't care to lose respect from some random idiots who act like it's their religion to 'protect' Apple from people doing what they want with the software they bought fairly and honestly. Those are the people that are socially disabled. Get a life, please, or at least stop wasting your time annoying other people. It's a far more useless spending of time than installing Mac OS X on a computer that isn't supported by Apple.

Point 3 is just plainly a lie. I'm not going to go into that again. I can understand that you really want to be silly EULA clauses to be legally valid, but, well, they're not. I'm afraid you're going to have to live with that.

 

[nataku]

I don't care to lose respect from some random idiots who act like it's their religion to 'protect' Apple from people doing what they want with the software they bought fairly and honestly.

lolz. 😀 😀 😀


Cloud9, just let him be. no use arguing with someone who will never accept any rule. 🙂 believe me, i've tried.

 

[ezekielrage_99]

Agreed, however, putting it in a non-Apple computer is not right.

True.

Mac OSX on non-Apple hardware is like the diet coke of computing, half Apple not quiet Apple enough 😉

 

[gnasher729]

They do. Apple sells Mac OS X 10.4 "Tiger" on the Apple Store and in a lot of retail shops, including their own. It is the full version, which is installable on any supported PowerMac. They did the same with 10.3 and 10.2 and I suppose they will do the same with 10.5 again. The difference will be that 10.5 supports the IA-32 platform as well as the PowerMac platform.

There is the difference that with all previous MacOS X versions, it was quite impossible to install them on computers that didn't have MacOS 9 or MacOS X installed before, so Apple didn't bother to print "Update" on the MacOS X boxes. With MacOS X 10.5 for Intel, the situation will be different. There might be over hundred million non-Apple machines out there that would be technically capable of running MacOS X 10.5 for Intel. Apple will not sell MacOS X 10.5 in a form that makes it legal to run on those machines, unless that is exactly what is intended. In other words, it may be legal (or maybe not) to install a retail version of MacOS X 10.4 Tiger on a PC, but Apple doesn't care much because it is not possible anyway; with 10.5, Apple will care.

 

[gnasher729]

Even if it were downloaded from the internet, it's still not stealing because no one's been deprived of it. It's just copyright infringement. In order for something to be stolen, someone must be deprived of it.

"Stealing" is a word in the English language, and "theft" is a legal term in English speaking countries (where English is the main language), and the translation of the word is a legal term in many other countries. The legal definitions are slightly different from country to country; for example, in German it is not "to deprive someone else" but "to enrich yourself", which would clearly cover the case where you download from the Internet without the legal owner losing anything (it is not theft in German law for other reasons).

An interesting thing (and I disagree with it strongly) is that in the USA, the consequences for "Copyright Infringement" seem to be much harsher than for theft. The copyright holder can ask for a quite insane amount of money for "statuory damages" (that is, he can claim damages, and doesn't have to prove exactly what the damages are. To me, it would seem that the damages caused by an illegal download of a CD could not possibly be higher than the purchase cost of that CD, at least if the copyright holder sells the CD to anybody who comes up with the money).

 

[gnasher729]

sure, but if you buy a ferrari gearbox and are able to use it in your hyundai, who's to stop you?

In the UK, you are fine as long as you don't take that Hyundai onto a public road. Replacing the engine means that the car loses its road certification; your car insurance will be void, and driving it on a public road is illegal.

PS. Does anybody know if Bill Gates ever got a US road certification for his Porsche 959?

 

[gnasher729]

No, but I mean to say that arguing about how hacking OSX is... "against the EULA" or some such really looks very hilarious in the face of the fact that this Maxxus guy seems to be in russia, and please allow me to point to this site: www.allofmp3.com, allegedly run by russian mafia.

Just curious: Have you or has anybody else ever seen any actual evidence that allofmp3 is connected to the russian mafia in any way, anything that goes beyond clueless posts on slashdot?

 

[BenRoethig]

True.

Mac OSX on non-Apple hardware is like the diet coke of computing, half Apple not quiet Apple enough 😉

Like diet coke, that is not necessarily a bad thing.

 

[Arcus]

so you can't exactly buy it in stores, and indirectly encourages piracy.

So by your logic , becuase you can't buy pot in stores it indirectly encourages pot smoking. Id say someone has been smoking pot for sure...

 

[Arcus]

In the UK, you are fine as long as you don't take that Hyundai onto a public road. Replacing the engine means that the car loses its road certification; your car insurance will be void, and driving it on a public road is illegal.

PS. Does anybody know if Bill Gates ever got a US road certification for his Porsche 959?

Never heard of such a thing as US road certification.

 

[daveslc]

Economics of becoming a Software Company

When Apple sees what's good for it, they'll spend time achieving complete hardware compatibility and then releasing the OS for the PC.

Seriously though, I see no harm in OSX86Project's methedology other than the fact that it's impossible to obtain a version of OS X that will run on the PC legally, so you can't exactly buy it in stores, and indirectly encourages piracy.

Apple should see what's good for it. If they sell an iMac for $1500, how much profit do they make? Maybe $500-$700 in parts alone, but they had to invest $800-$1000 to do make that money. And, they only have <5% of the market.

If they sold one copy of OSX for $129, they make about $125 since it's really cheap to make a cd/dvd. And they can still make cool computers for those that want the best technology.

As another poster mentioned, there are maybe 100,000,000 pc's out there,all dying because they have clogged registry's etc that need OSX.

So Apple has a choice, make a few computers for a few people and make a few pennies, or they can make a few computers for those same few people *and* sell a better operating system to the masses of PC owners that would help change the rest of the world.

Maybe then, they will 'invest' in Microsoft to prop it up.

Didn't apple make this same mistake in the mid '80's?

 

[gwangung]

Apple should see what's good for it. If they sell an iMac for $1500, how much profit do they make? Maybe $500-$700 in parts alone, but they had to invest $800-$1000 to do make that money.

Um, no.

Look at the SEC statements. They state the profit and margin figures.

And remember, the operating margin from hardware ALSO gets plowed into software R&D.

Sorry, but the numbers don't add up.

 

[rjgjonker]

Just curious: Have you or has anybody else ever seen any actual evidence that allofmp3 is connected to the russian mafia in any way, anything that goes beyond clueless posts on slashdot?

I would actually welcome it if the Russian mafia made their money in an honest way for a change! 😉
I think it's just some American notion that everything Russian must have something to do with the mafia. I wouldn't give it too much attention. It seems highly unlikely that they are behind a company that sells music legally.

 

[Mr. Mister]

So by your logic , becuase you can't buy pot in stores it indirectly encourages pot smoking. Id say someone has been smoking pot for sure...

Unfortunately for your flimsy analogy, installing Mac OS X on hardware that isn't officially supported with no devious intent has no meaningful parallels to adding mildly psychoactive chemicals to your bloodstream.

Try having an argument before you start arguing.

 

[cloud 9]

lolz. 😀 😀 😀


Cloud9, just let him be. no use arguing with someone who will never accept any rule. 🙂 believe me, i've tried.

i had a laugh with that post...like this...'hahaha'

In fact, I don't even see how stealing would help installing Mac OS X on a computer.

huh...what does he mean 'stealing helps installing'?

 

[cloud 9]

Apple should see what's good for it.

that's your problem, you're too kind.

You're concerned with what is best for Apple, instead of letting Apple choose what is best for them. 😛

 

[imacg517]

Sorry complete newbie but whats the deal with Viruses on Mac..

Please clear this up Im not sure what people are on about "they" say Mac dont get Viruses but ya tell me more?????

Yahoo news reports on hidden messages placed by Apple into Mac OS X for Intel to warn would-be hackers. The latest version of Mac OS X revealed a short poem:



Apple confirmed that it had placed these messages into the Mac OS software hoping "it, and many other legal warnings, will remind people that they should not steal Mac OS X."

It appears that that may not have been the only approach Apple may have taken, as a message on OSX86Project.org Forums indicates that they have been issued a DMCA violation notice:


The OSX86Project.org and forums discussed methods/attempts to run Mac OS X on PC hardware.

 

[ezekielrage_99]

Like diet coke, that is not necessarily a bad thing.

But doesn't the nutra sweet in Diet Coke increase the risk of getting cancer?

And why do only fat people drink Diet Coke (it doesn't look like it works)?

So my *NEW* theory is that using Mac OSX on non Apple hardware is like having Diet Coke and therefore using Mac OSX on non Apple hardware will make you fat and increase the risk of getting cancer. Enjoy 😀

 

[ezekielrage_99]

Please clear this up Im not sure what people are on about "they" say Mac dont get Viruses but ya tell me more?????

Mac OS, Linux, Windows all get virus but the serverity of a virus on a Mac or Linux system is no where nearly as bad as getting one on a Windows system.

 

[nataku]

Please clear this up Im not sure what people are on about "they" say Mac dont get Viruses but ya tell me more?????

this is completely irrelevant to the topic being discussed. 🙄

 

[MacAttackJack]

If I Buy It, It's Mine!

😎

Ok! I own and operate about every kind of computer and Operating System out today. As long as I purchase a license for each installation (or not as with Linux), I can legally install many different OS's on any computer I choose.

Steven Jobs has already stated himself, when the MacIntels come out he won't do anything to keep you from installing Microsoft Windows XP (or whatever version) on those MacIntels. That's because he legally has no recourse. The reason is quite simple! There is nothing either company can do about you either installing Windows XP on a Mac (using Virtual PC) or the fact that I now have Mac OS-X running on a PC with linux OS and running as a Virtual Machine. It's bought and paid for and there are many, many of these installations out there, but most of all because it's a matter of "Function" to run a machine the way I see fit! The only illegal thing being done wrong at this OSX86Project.org Forums, is people are stealing the software, not that they're trying to run the OS on an Intel machine. Notice that the hidden warnings Jobs speaks of refer to theft only!

The reason!!! Running a different OS on any computer is a matter of "Function", not "Copyright", and not "Patent"!!! So legally no company can tell you what or how to use their product or keep you from setting the disk you purchase on fire if you so choose. If I want, I can put it in a microwave oven and zap it for use as a coaster on my desk. They can put up roadblocks if they choose, but they can't stop me. As long as I don't attempt to reverse engineer, or infringe on Copyright, I can (if possible) install it on any machine I choose. Just like Stevie boy can't force me to only have OS-X installed on my Mac! You too have the right to have Linux, Windows XP, and OS-X on your machine right now via Virtual PC or as with future MacIntels, a straight up dual boot system (or better yet with a triple boot and Linux as my preferred system).

I really don't understand all you fanatical Mac Addicts anyway. Obviously the rest of the world doesn't think Macs are so great or you'ld have a larger market share. Even Linux has leaped ahead of you people in number of installations, because it is more versatile, runs on any architecture, and is now wholeheartedly supported by your former processor maker "IBM"! On top of that it's free! Who is Steven Jobs and Bill Gates most afraid of? Why Linux of course! It threatens their monopolistic control and is taking a bigger share of the pie money out of their pockets. Today there is very few computers that don't benefit from "Open Source" software or programs. Even your own beloved Apple and for sure Microsoft who are openly shipping commercial grade server software with their 64 bit OS and are about to pull an old discarded BeOS file system out to enable instant search capability in Vista. It will as BeOS did be sitting on a virtual database without the headache that Apple uses in maintaining one for instant search.

Apple has no corner on the market, and your Macs are not as great as you're led to believe. Apple keeps you all blinded and trapped with few games, DRM'd to hell, an almost totally hidden system and now Apple will further keep you under their thumb with a new fully DRM'd chipped Intel machine on the way to a store near you. I just plain won't accept that!

So go ahead live in your oh so narrow little world ruled over by a giant ego'd dictator in Steven Jobs. I'll just continue to use all of the resources available to me to make sure I'll always be in control of my own machines. Then if I choose to dine on a little Mac OS-X one night with Photoshop, some Win XP (or Vista) the next to game on, I will. Plus I will always be able to enjoy the Freedom and Luxury of "open source" Linux whenever I want. Remember, it has been said "Never Put All of Your Eggs in One Basket" and it is oh so true in the computer world! 😀

 

[ezekielrage_99]

😎

Ok! I own and operate about every kind of computer and Operating System out today. As long as I purchase a license for each installation (or not as with Linux), I can legally install many different OS's on any computer I choose.

Good points with your post, I totally agree how Steve Jobs has cornered parts of the OS market and how Steve want Mac OS only running on a Mac. The Linux points are pretty true as well but more from a commercial viability stand point rather from the "average" home user needs/wants/ability.

I'm just waiting for WINE for Mac OSX, should be sweet.

 

[janstett]

Never heard of such a thing as US road certification.

It means having the car road-legal, certified by the DOT, etc. It has to meet impact regulations, pass crash tests, etc. The 959 was a Porsche supercar from the late 80's. Bill had a problem with his 959 because so few of them were ever produced and even fewer came stateside, the government had it impounded because it was not road legal. It's the same reason the Lamborghini Countach was uglied up with add-on bumpers, to make it US road legal.

However, today most cars are designed to pass in all regions of the world, so unless you have something really funky like an Ariel Atom, it's accounted for on the drawing board.

 

[bu113t]

Good points with your post, I totally agree how Steve Jobs has cornered parts of the OS market and how Steve want Mac OS only running on a Mac. The Linux points are pretty true as well but more from a commercial viability stand point rather from the "average" home user needs/wants/ability.

I'm just waiting for WINE for Mac OSX, should be sweet.

Have you tried using "Q" for running Windows on a Mac? They have an initial universal binary that ive heard runs quite well on intel macs.