Apple Will Face Lawsuit Over Phone-Switching iMessage Issue

[Gasu E.]

I keep reading comments that that there was no way to resolve this, when in fact there have always been multiple ways to resolve it. All Apple has done with this new utility is make the situation easier to deal with.

Of course the issue should be addressed, and Apple needs to continue to do more about it. It's not only good business, it's just plain nice to care about the problems this has caused for many people.

My disagreement is with those who believe it's someone else's responsibilty to fix it for them, rather than fixing it themselves when they can. It was an Apple design decision (albeit a dubious one), not something that's objectively "broken."

It surely has been a real problem-- you do agree with that, right? Now, you state that there have always been ways to resolve it-- I've been reading that previous workarounds were either unreliable or failed to cover all common use cases. But even if you are right; since Apple created the problem, wasn't it Apple's responsibility to document the various workarounds, and make sure that documentation was readily available? Did they do that?

 

[C DM]

There may be a problem, but is a lawsuit the answer to these sorts of things..?

Talk about 1st world problems - and 1st world solutions...

Unfortunately it seems that it's an answer as far as getting the party responsible for the problem to actually face it and deal with it given that they have been avoiding it as much as they could for years. So, yeah, it shouldn't have come to this, but I'd nothing else was being done about it, then why not have something that would finally push for a resolution harder after all this time?

 

[dcorban]

Her again? Is she the only judge in California or something?

I started reading the article and thought, I hope it isn't that Lucy woman again. Yep, of course it is.

 

[cfedu]

Great story! This is such a great story, that I have to admit that I'm glad that you had to suffer through it, just so I could hear it! Expect to see it "written into my next screenplay"...

The iPhone hijacked my sim card card in the 30 seconds that it took to connect to the network. I did not sign into anything or make any text messages, I simply tested the signal strength.

My Ex wife called telling me that kids had lice when I dropped then off in Montreal. I sent my sister a text to check her kids. She returned the text saying " I think you exwife is a crazy bitch making this stuff (lice) up" well that and many other text message never made it to me as they ended up delivered as iMessages a week later. I found out a week later, My 9 year old son received about 50 iMessages once he had wifi again.



I could have been a lot worse if my girlfriend had sent me some dirty text messages!! Beside what my sister said everything else was kinda rated G

 

[69Mustang]

Thanks for the helpful comment. I had no idea how much I didn't understand.

Call me a snarky idiot or whatever you want. The fact is these people aren't paying attention to what's going on with their devices, but then they blame Apple. Just as I wasn't paying attention to my devices and thought they were broken.

If you still don't get the connection I can't help you.

I've never called anyone in this forum an idiot so I'm not sure where that came from. It seems you're overlooking the fundamental issue. iMessage is, for the lack of a better term, hijacking a person's phone number when it relates to messaging. It not only affects the person who switched from an iPhone but contacts who still use iPhones. I will lay out a scenario.

Me, you, dumastudetto, and AppleScruff1 all have iPhones. We message each other daily because we participate in a team competitive quilting bee. Dumastudetto gets a new Note 4 because his iP6+ bent when he farted (it was in his back pocket).* You get an update that we need new patches because our "Dem bezels tho" patches were deemed controversial. You send a message to everyone to bring "Taylor Swift for President" patches. Dumastudetto doesn't get the message because your message to him was hijacked by iMessage. We end up losing the bee to Sister Mary Margaret, her cousin and two janitors working the bingo hall. Since Dumastudetto made us lose, we drug him and sell him to gypsies for a bag of oranges.

Dumastudetto didn't know about the issue with iMessage because Apple doesn't tell customers about the "gotcha" when you leave their ecosystem. There's no documentation they provide that tells you that your phone number, in essense, still belongs to them when it comes to messaging. It's word of mouth and even the offered solutions only work some of the time.

No other phone manufacturer ties up your number if you switch vendors. Neither should Apple. Point is, this is a problem 3 years in the making and Apple had plenty of opportunity to address the issue before the lawsuit.

*If you know dumastudetto, this would crack you up. Duma would murder his family before he left Apple. Actually he would murder everyone before leaving Apple.

 

[Rogifan]

It made sense when text messages cost a lot, and unlimited data was free.

Now, of course, the opposite is often true.



It's like Facetime. Apple got people to drop Skype with the promise that Facetime would be an open standard. Whatever happened with that?

Skype isn't available on iOS?

 

[RMferrer]

This should be quite obvious that if you switch to an android device you will not be able to use iMessage, you should have noticed that it does not work at all when you message your android buddies... unless you are the biggest moron on earth you need to be advised about this fact...

What you fail to understand is that it's not the capability of receiving iMessages, but rather text messages in general. Even when I turned off iMessage, I was stored as iMessage capabale on iPhone users ( my contact in blue letters when texting).

The only work around was having to call the majority of my contacts and have them delete my number and re-save me again(storing my contact number in green letters).

Of course my issue was short lived because I was allowed to use my personal cell for work.

 

[RMferrer]

Couldn't she have just disabled iMessage before switching to a new phone? So for her not disabling iMessages, she is now entitled to damages?

Yes she could have, but anyone who had her saved as a contact and an iPhone user would still be sending her iMessages even when she switched. I had to tell a number of my contacts to delete me and re-save my number.

 

[RMferrer]

There was a solution. Turn off iMessage from your phone before you switch. If you have switched put your sim back into said phone and disable it.

Except it's not that simple. As stated before anyone who has you stored in their contacts as an iPhone user will continue to send you iMessages even if you followed those steps.

 

[Mlrollin91]

Yes she could have, but anyone who had her saved as a contact and an iPhone user would still be sending her iMessages even when she switched. I had to tell a number of my contacts to delete me and re-save my number.

The thing is I have never had that problem when friends of mine have switched from iOS to Android or even Windows. They would disable iMessage before activating the new phone and when they activated their new phone, they would receive SMS messages from me.

 

[C DM]

The thing is I have never had that problem when friends of mine have switched from iOS to Android or even Windows. They would disable iMessage before activating the new phone and when they activated their new phone, they would receive SMS messages from me.

While quite a few others did.

 

[H2SO4]

Apparently. I think she likes being in the limelight so if it goes against apple then it'll be in the news.

My feeling too strangely enough. I’m probably wrong though.

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You may not see the difference; and even I may not see much of a difference. But I believe the Mods here do. They seem to care much more about outright aggression than hurt feelings.

Yep. As long as you can find a way to call someone a douche in a roundabout way they are fine with it here.

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…….. this would crack you up.

Mission accomplished. That was a very fine read indeed.

He’s not the only one though. Some of the vitriol toward any criticism of Apple or their products/endeavours on here is just mind boggling.

 

[Cheryl King]

I don't get it- She left apple by switching to Galaxy- and now she wants iMessage? She needs to stay on the apple devices to get their services- this is ludicrous! Did someone make this up?

 

[JustThinkin']

It surely has been a real problem-- you do agree with that, right? Now, you state that there have always been ways to resolve it-- I've been reading that previous workarounds were either unreliable or failed to cover all common use cases. But even if you are right; since Apple created the problem, wasn't it Apple's responsibility to document the various workarounds, and make sure that documentation was readily available? Did they do that?

Yes, it's a real problem. And even a real pain for some people.

As I've gone back and read more about it, it appears some people genuinely couldn't resolve it, no matter what they did. But there are multiple ways to solve it, as I said, and these have worked for many, many people. Of course this fact does nothing to relieve the pain for those who continue to have an issue.


As for the documentation, I don't think it's the public's job to prescribe how Apple should disseminate the solutions. But people also shouldn't have to pay for $20 support calls to fix this, as one poster suggested has happened. If this is accurate, Apple should refund these people immediately - in fact proactively, if their record-keeping system enables them to track these cases. If they don't, then a class action lawsuit is in order.

But other than this a lawsuit's not appropriate here. Apple shouldn't be punished for providing more messaging functionality than anyone else. That's the tradeoff with Apple - even though it's a bit insidious, they allow more interoperability and functionality than others - and usually with minimal effort. But at the same time they try to get you into their ecosystem and presume you'll stay there. You have to decide whether it's worth it.

 

[H2SO4]

Apple shouldn't be punished for providing more messaging functionality than anyone else.

Can you elaborate on the above part for me please?

 

[BoulderAdonis]

You are 100% correct. But put yourself in her shoes. If you suddenly were unable to receive texts from your friends with iPhones (unless they deactivated iMessage), wouldn't it really suck? I wouldn't be able to receive well over half my texts. People act like this is some trivial matter.

I didn't say I wouldn't be pissed off about needing to tell all my iOS friends to explicitly send me SMS messages or I wouldn't get them (due to not having an iMessage client on my android phone).

But let's not say she couldn't receive *ANY* SMS messages from her carrier. Flat out wrong.

Apple should have released iMessage for android / windows phone also. Not just a tool to remove your number from iMessage. Would have been a constant blue bubble reminder of how the better half lives.

 

[JustThinkin']

I've never called anyone in this forum an idiot so I'm not sure where that came from. It seems you're overlooking the fundamental issue. iMessage is, for the lack of a better term, hijacking a person's phone number when it relates to messaging. It not only affects the person who switched from an iPhone but contacts who still use iPhones. I will lay out a scenario.

Me, you, dumastudetto, and AppleScruff1 all have iPhones. Dumastudetto gets a new Note 4 because his iP6+ bent when he farted (it was in his back pocket).*

*If you know dumastudetto, this would crack you up. Duma would murder his family before he left Apple. Actually he would murder everyone before leaving Apple.

I really enjoyed your creative story, even though it provided no new information.

However, I have to admit I was a bit dumfounded when you started off with "Me, you, dumastudetto, ...." After all, you essentially called me stupid in every sentence of your previous post. You have good things to say, so don't sell yourself short by putting yourself first.


I agree with you - I believe Apple should have addressed this earlier if the problem's as prevalent as many now say it is.



BTW, the 67 Mustang was better!

 

[JustThinkin']

Can you elaborate on the above part for me please?

I only meant that they were the ones (in fact the only ones who dared to, I believe) bypass the carriers' cash cow text messaging systems.

 

[flyinmac]

BTW, the 67 Mustang was better!

I'll take the 64 and a half

 

[dollystereo]

This should be quite obvious that if you switch to an android device you will not be able to use iMessage, you should have noticed that it does not work at all when you message your android buddies... unless you are the biggest moron on earth you need to be advised about this fact...

you must read the article, it isn't about that.

 

[flyinmac]

Apparently. I think she likes being in the limelight so if it goes against apple then it'll be in the news.

Judges themselves don't pick their cases, except to recluse themselves from one if they can find a way / grounds to get out of it.

 

[dollystereo]

They should separate SMS with iMessage.

 

[JustThinkin']

I'll take the 64 and a half

I'll just take a Shelby and I'll be fine. I can settle for a GT500KR or a Hertz model - no need to be picky.

 

[flyinmac]

Why would Apple have to be compelled to support customers who stopped buying their product and went to someone else? If anything, Apple could have used this as a strong barrier to prevent users from leaving the iOS ecosystem.

Imagine if you purchased a PC from Dell, and you got your e-mail is an account at your Internet Service Provider, let's say Comcast (just cause it's a name that most know, certainly not because it's the best).

Later, you decide you don't want to use a Dell computer anymore, and you buy a Mac. But, even though you've set your brand new Mac up to connect to your Internet Service Provider, you are unable to receive your email. You didn't change your e-mail address, you're still using the same Internet Service Provider (unfortunately Comcast). And, yet you cannot get your e-mails to be received on your shiny new expensive Mac.

People are sending their messages to you the same as they always have, you've properly set up your new machine on the same ISP, and yet nothing arrives in your inbox.

You then call Apple for support, and yet they can't help you. You call Comcast, and they can't help you. You call Dell, and find out that your e-mail address is forever tied to that Dell computer. You will not receive e-mail messages from other people who use Dell computers. And, they provide you no way to get your email messages ever again from any other Dell computer user, unless you either buy another Dell computer or go back to using your old Dell computer. Now, for entertainment purposes, we are going to pretend that Dell holds 60 to 70 percent of the computer market.

If you had purchased your last machine from anyone other than Dell, you'd still be getting your email messages.

Who do you think you're going to blame that issue on?

Let's assume Dell ignores your requests to fix this problem for you... now what?

Sure, you could get a new e-mail address. But, that's not always practical, some people have a lot of things tied up with their current phone numbers and e-mail addresses. In some cases, changing your contact information could cost you a lot of business (because who can really go and update everyone who's received a published phone book immediately).

All of this because you naively assumed that you could buy a new computer and connect it to your same ISP and everything would be OK (as everyone would have expected).

I bet if we adapted the current story to fit the names and situation above, all the Apple defenders would be screaming to burn Dell to the ground.

This is the very same scenario. And, the very actions that are illegal and penalized under monopoly laws. And, it doesn't have to be deliberately created to function this way. If the end result is this effect, it will be penalized. Particularly when a company is not responsive to immediately resolving the issue upon first becoming aware of it.

 

[Santabean2000]

Unfortunately it seems that it's an answer as far as getting the party responsible for the problem to actually face it and deal with it given that they have been avoiding it as much as they could for years. So, yeah, it shouldn't have come to this, but I'd nothing else was being done about it, then why not have something that would finally push for a resolution harder after all this time?

Ummmmm... because it's hardly a big deal... Certainly not worthy of court action.

Reeks of "I can make some money here".

This really is just another 'only in America' story.

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Unfortunately it seems that it's an answer as far as getting the party responsible for the problem to actually face it and deal with it given that they have been avoiding it as much as they could for years. So, yeah, it shouldn't have come to this, but I'd nothing else was being done about it, then why not have something that would finally push for a resolution harder after all this time?

Imagine if you purchased a PC from Dell, and you got your e-mail is an account at your Internet Service Provider, let's say Comcast (just cause it's a name that most know, certainly not because it's the best).

Later, you decide you don't want to use a Dell computer anymore, and you buy a Mac. But, even though you've set your brand new Mac up to connect to your Internet Service Provider, you are unable to receive your email. You didn't change your e-mail address, you're still using the same Internet Service Provider (unfortunately Comcast). And, yet you cannot get your e-mails to be received on your shiny new expensive Mac.

People are sending their messages to you the same as they always have, you've properly set up your new machine on the same ISP, and yet nothing arrives in your inbox.

You then call Apple for support, and yet they can't help you. You call Comcast, and they can't help you. You call Dell, and find out that your e-mail address is forever tied to that Dell computer. You will not receive e-mail messages from other people who use Dell computers. And, they provide you no way to get your email messages ever again from any other Dell computer user, unless you either buy another Dell computer or go back to using your old Dell computer. Now, for entertainment purposes, we are going to pretend that Dell holds 60 to 70 percent of the computer market.

If you had purchased your last machine from anyone other than Dell, you'd still be getting your email messages.

Who do you think you're going to blame that issue on?

Let's assume Dell ignores your requests to fix this problem for you... now what?

Sure, you could get a new e-mail address. But, that's not always practical, some people have a lot of things tied up with their current phone numbers and e-mail addresses. In some cases, changing your contact information could cost you a lot of business (because who can really go and update everyone who's received a published phone book immediately).

All of this because you naively assumed that you could buy a new computer and connect it to your same ISP and everything would be OK (as everyone would have expected).

I bet if we adapted the current story to fit the names and situation above, all the Apple defenders would be screaming to burn Dell to the ground.

This is the very same scenario. And, the very actions that are illegal and penalized under monopoly laws. And, it doesn't have to be deliberately created to function this way. If the end result is this effect, it will be penalized. Particularly when a company is not responsive to immediately resolving the issue upon first becoming aware of it.

Or, the user could accept some responsibility, do the tiniest bit of research, solve his/her own problem - and move on.

[Not to absolve Apple of their responsibilities either...]