Apple Working on AR/VR Headset With 8K Displays and No Smartphone or Computer Tether

[Abazigal]

I suppose I might be interested to wear an AR glass similar to an episode of "Black Mirror" where they can display information about a user given their social media. But isn't that pretty creepy?

Which is why I am thankful Apple is making this set of AR glasses, and not Google. Because Apple gets good design while Google doesn't. That's why the Google Glasses flopped, because Google just didn't have a flipping clue what passed for good taste from the consumer's perspective, and what didn't.

Not to mention that any such piece of tech from Apple will likely have an easier time winning over the consumer than if it were released by Google, Facebook or even Snapchat. The trust and branding power is there. Apple has also been working on its own proprietary tech such as W1 wireless standard, custom processors, Face ID etc and I believe these will all pay handsome dividends when it comes to wearables, where you will want solid wireless connectivity, power efficiency and a form of hands-free control.

Apple will find a way to have the AR glasses meaningfully augment our vision, without any of the inherent creepiness or privacy issues you find being mentioned into those sci-fi movies. That I have no doubt.

It's no surprise iOS 11 emphasised AR. Apple is using their iPhone market share to mainstream AR and taking this opportunity to find out what sorts of AR resonate with the users, and which don't. Just like how the Apple Watch took on certain features of the phone where it made sense (such as Apple Pay, fitness tracking and actionable notifications), I believe that's what the AR glasses will do as well. Take on additional functionality from your iphone where it makes sense given the form factor (eg: what tasks are handy to do on a phone but you find a pain to have to keep taking your phone out and unlocking to do?).

The parts are all there. What's left is for Apple to put them together when the time is ripe and release the product when they feel the market is ready. And you can be sure Apple will prime the market prior to this.

Just another page out of the classic Apple playbook. You can see it coming a mile away; doesn't mean you can do anything to stop it.

 

[jeremiah256]

Apple makes less than 8% of their revenue from traditional (laptops and desktop) computers. And this isn’t something new. This has been the case since the iPhone was introduced, approximately when everyone started noticing consumer purchases of laptops and desktops were slowing. Yet, at the same time, Apple's total revenues have been steadily growing year after year. So, while Macs and macOS are still important ($6B plus per quarter), let’s not kid ourselves that there is a path to growing traditional computer sales.

Moves by everyone toward non-traditional computing is reasonable, logical, and inevitable. To not explore AR/VR would be fiscally irresponsible of Apple.

 

[venom600]

What makes this “leak” believable for me is when they say they have plans for a second faster version before the first one is even released. That is very typical Apple behaviour; withholding technology from the first version specifically to sell an upgraded seconded generation.

It's very typical electronics behavior. Camera manufacturers are notorious for it... they have tech planned out a decade in advance in many cases. It's why RED was such a disrupter. Tech development innovations don't come in regular intervals but investors and consumers expect new products in regular intervals, so companies have to hold back.

 

[panjandrum]

Interesting if true. I've been gaming stereoscopically for almost a decade at this point and even that adds a tremendous amount of immersion to gaming. I've been been eagerly waiting to purchase a full VR rig until the major issues have been addressed (the limited time I've spent using "full" VR rigs has demonstrated that I won't be happy with the resolution of the existing equipment, and can't stand the screen-door effect - and since I've already got excellent stereoscopic setups I'm less willing to jump-in than I might otherwise be). The 8k resolution per-eye should address the screen-door effect effectively, and if you can run a title at high-enough resolution that should take care of the resolution issue as well assuming Apple incorporates excellent upscaling.

Whatever they come up with has got to be cross-platform though, if they want it to actually sell.

 

[ipponrg]

I think it's worse than that. The only people intertested in AR are those in advertising. You look at a billboard it shows you the latest deals, gives links to a webpage, directions to shops etc Once it's linked in to your social media and "it" knows what you like oh boy the skys the limit...

On a side note, it will probably use Yelp for this curation and be just as bad as their Apple Maps integration

 

[MrGuder]

With an apple logo on each side everyone will know you spent 150 grand...isn't that what it's all about anyway? Lol

 

[travelsheep]

My 2017 MBP ports work fine.

Perhaps you should consider a trip to the Genius Bar to have yours looked at?

There's NOTHING they could look at !

 

[ipponrg]

You can be pro-Apple and still be right. It’s hard for me to reference articles he has written that are subscriber-only, but by and large, he has been pretty accurate when it comes to analysing Apple’s strategies and their financial results.

There's a difference in how a pro-Apple analyst analyzes vs one that is fair. In many of his articles, he's simply regurgitating the positive spins of Apple. I ask again what benefit do financials do for you? Are you option trading? We already know that they make a large profit per unit, yet they are not globally dominating. We all know they are sitting on a huge cash pile and looking to burn it to get into different industries. Even with their huge cash pile, they are behind on many dependency points such as Siri, Macs, and several integration services.

You can read through these articles and see that the Ben views the organization as a whole objectively instead of regurgitating financial results and actions. Surprisingly, his 2016 article is still relevant 2 years later.

https://stratechery.com/2016/apples-organizational-crossroads/
https://stratechery.com/2017/apples-strengths-and-weaknesses/

That's why the Google Glasses flopped, because Google just didn't have a flipping clue what passed for good taste from the consumer's perspective, and what didn't.

Google Glasses are still pretty successful in surgery. Isn't it funny that Google seems to have more application in worldly problems (e.g. classrooms/schools and medical fields) than Apple? For a company like Apple with all this excess cash, they still seem to be trying to make a higher than necessary profit to please shareholders. Isn't this a bit ... contrary to their mission statement?

Just another page out of the classic Apple playbook. You can see it coming a mile away; doesn't mean you can do anything to stop it.

Hilarious how you mention classic Apple playbook. The Apple playbook is full of audibles and a lot of punts. I'm expecting AirPower to finally have some news @ WWDC in June, 10+ months after they were first announced. Classic Apple playbook.

If I were thinking like Apple and wanted to integrate landmarks into the AR experience, I would use Yelp again because I don't have the resources to stand up my own data set for POIs just like Apple Maps.

 

[springsup]

So it's "not tethered", but you still need a dedicated box that it's wirelessly tethered to, for it to actually work... If that's actually the case, it sounds like it's still in early prototype phases, and not ready for shipping until it can stand on its own without the need for a secondary box.

I'm sure Apple, of all people, would love to remove the need for the secondary box.

That said, even the most stylish of these headsets won't be something you'd want to wear on the street (*cough*Google Glass*cough*). So why would they compromise the fidelity of the experience in favour of ultra-portability? Even if they looked nice, there's a big-brother aspect to it that they won't be able to shake.

To repeat: I don't think Apple is going to try and build a headset you would wear on the street.

Maybe they decided that a better strategy was to look at this like a games console - a device which is "stationary" but can pack in better hardware to provide a more immersive experience. Unlike games console manufacturers, Apple has a much broader software reach. They could do a lot to drive the development of engineering and medical software and push these devices in to education. Maybe their device strategy is more about the software?

We don't know all of the hardware features, either - imagine if this machine was capable of driving multiple headsets, so all students in the classroom could see and interact with shared virtual experiences? I'm not sure you could really do that without a centralised box. It also emphasises augmented reality - students could still see each other without stupid digital avatars.

The device should fit the strategy. An ultra-portable AR headset would have its own limitations.

 

[73CortinaV8]

I'm sure other people have pointed this out, but this is simply impossible. 4k video @ 60fps and 12-bit color spews data at a rate of something like 15 megabits per second. 4k for each eye would be 30 mb/s. For 8k you'll need a lot more - perhaps 100Mb/s per channel. 8k has 16 times the number of pixels as 4k.

WiGig tops off at 7Gbs.

And that's just to carry the content. Can't imagine the ridiculous video card required to generate the content.

8k wireless VR is 15 years off.

 

[Sadman88]

Good thing it'll cost an arm and a leg!

 

[Baymowe335]

Nail its coffin closed, more like. They might get the tech right, but who‘s going to develop content for yet another closed ecosystem OS? There is hardly any VR content today.

Think longer term. Listen to Apple. They have huge plans for AR/VR.

 

[Williesleg]

Not gonna happen with Timmy Cook.

 

[BruceEBonus]

Have you actually tried AR?

Personally I think VR is overrated but AR is incredible and has endless possibilities both for home users and in industry (I actually work in oil and gas and we have been using hololens on site already on our latest project). I absolutely think it will be the next revolution in computing.

For professional applications like that then I can see it being pretty damned useful. And for medical purposes etc. But for dumb Joe at home .. headsets are too much hassle as was proved with the crashing failure of 3D televisions with glasses And do you kmow. I was one of the first early adopters!

 

[9081094]

Focus? Lol this company has billions and billions of cash. You make it sound like they can only focus on one thing at a time!

Well past history (6+ years) hasn’t proven they’re capable of having multiple focus except money.
I haven’t seen a good computer out of Apple’s gaat in years. Maybe the iPads are good but they’re crippled by iOS which is stagnant for years.

 

[mcdj]

This just in; it’s gonna be called the eyePod. Oh, and the 8K per eye thing is actually the price.

 

[9081094]

That’s why you need Apple, a company who gets both technology and aesthetics, to show them how it’s done.

You’re old school. Apple used to be like that but they ruined the Macs for years now and today’s iPhones aren’t a perfect example either.

There’s a reason why today, there is only the Apple Watch market. Because only Apple has the design and technical chops to make a smartwatch worth wearing.

Wonder how long they’ll stay on top. But hey, Apple isn’t about marketshare but in delivering the best (= grabbing the profits)

General tech analysts have been getting Apple wrong since time immemorial. I am getting very frustrated by how they don’t seem to understand business in general, or Apple. And as a result, completely and utterly fail to see the bigger picture.

Maybe the tech analyst are less focused on profits but are more concerned about the consumers and how Apple could sustain market share. You don’t have to be a genius to see that it’s a mess at the moment. A total mess in hardware and software.

Maybe the tech analysts see through those hollow phrases of Tim: the Mac mini is a very important product for us; the MacBook Pro touchbar disaster, Siri disaster, maps disaster, AppleTV which has nothing more to offer than what’s already build in smart tv’s; the stagnant state of iOS and MacOS... to name a few.

Those analyst see Apple getting pushed out of China and India where other vendors selling more capable devices for a fraction of the prize. And please don’t mention they just copy Apple because it’s Apple copying the rest these days.
[doublepost=1525025478][/doublepost]

Which is why I am thankful Apple is making this set of AR glasses, and not Google. Because Apple gets good design while Google doesn't. That's why the Google Glasses flopped, because Google just didn't have a flipping clue what passed for good taste from the consumer's perspective, and what didn't.

How can you be so sure... nothing has come to market yet. At the moment google is more successful as Apple in areas once dominated by Apple.

Google now vs Siri
Chromebooks vs iPads
Google home vs HomePod
Android vs iOS
G suite vs iWork
Google maps vs Maps
Google photos vs photos

Even the one lens camera on the Pixel is hard to beat.

Google is much further ahead in many areas that once belonged to Apple.

You think google is going to sit and rest with AR/VR?

I think Google is very far ahead of Apple in key areas like AI and I don’t see that changing.

 

[zuj]

How about designing a computer for creative professionals for a change?

Apple is getting seriously garbled in consumer electronics and selling online media.

 

[9081094]

Not to mention that any such piece of tech from Apple will likely have an easier time winning over the consumer than if it were released by Google, Facebook or even Snapchat. The trust and branding power is there. Apple has also been working on its own proprietary tech such as W1 wireless standard, custom processors, Face ID etc and I believe these will all pay handsome dividends when it comes to wearables, where you will want solid wireless connectivity, power efficiency and a form of hands-free control.

That’s the sad part of it all. Apple has been proven 6+ years now that their only focus is getting the most money from consumers. They have proven to their customer base who relied on Apple hardware that any investment in Apple hardware is a bad investment.

The consumer of today has grown up with Gmail, all things google and Facebook. They don’t care that much about privacy because it’s invisible. Their care about having the latest and the greatest and unfortunately Apple isn’t there anymore.
[doublepost=1525026359][/doublepost]

How about designing a computer for creative professionals for a change?

Apple is getting seriously garbled in consumer electronics and selling online media.

They’ve neclected the computer side because there isn’t the money to be made and they’ve been milking the iPhone business too much that they created the deserved image of overpriced and under delivering.

 

[DevNull0]

Not sure that I care what they develop anymore: no matter how good it is, it then won't be updated for 5 years, and will then be dropped. No more Apple monitor. No more Airport. No Mac Pro updates in 5 years. No Mac Mini updates ... woeful.

Being so unhappy, maybe it's time to switch to a different manufacturer?

So you're happy with a company that roles out new products with huge fanfare and "can't innovate my ass", then leaves the product to rot on the vine for 5 years while stringing along the customers with platitudes about how important said product is in their lineup? Then kills the neglected product when they can't string the customers along anymore?

You really think that's a good way for a company to treat its customers?

And you really think people who are disgusted by such practices should not get to voice their complaints?
[doublepost=1525030964][/doublepost]

The 8k resolution per-eye should address the screen-door effect effectively, and if you can run a title at high-enough resolution that should take care of the resolution issue as well assuming Apple incorporates excellent upscaling.

The resolution has nothing to do with the screen door effect. It's caused by the physical size of the pixel compared to the pixel spacing. If you have 1,000 dots per inch but each dot is 1/10,000th of an inch the screen is going to be mostly blank and when you view it through your headset optics will have a horrible screen door effect. But if you have 100 dots per inch and each dot is 1/101th of an inch, you will have tiny gaps between the dots and not much screen door effect.

Do you think a 4k TV has less screen door than a 720p or SD TV?

 

[citysnaps]

So you're happy with a company that roles out new products with huge fanfare and "can't innovate my ass", then leaves the product to rot on the vine for 5 years while stringing along the customers with platitudes about how important said product is in their lineup? Then kills the neglected product when they can't string the customers along anymore?

You really think that's a good way for a company to treat its customers?

And you really think people who are disgusted by such practices should not get to voice their complaints?

"So you're happy with a company..."

If you're referring to Apple, yes, I'm extremely happy with my 5K iMac, 2017 MBP, Watch, HomePod, and iPhone X. Zero complaints, other than the OLED display on my X.


"And you really think people who are disgusted by such practices should not get to voice their complaints?"

If you're really disgusted, vote with your wallet and purchase other manufacturers' products. That's the best and quickest recourse people have. And if enough people express their disgust in that manner, the manufacturer will take notice and change their direction. Why reward any company with your dollars if you're not happy, and disgusted with their practices and direction? That makes zero sense.

While snarky complaints that are generally juvenile in nature from a handful of people on tech forums are certainly amusing and adorable to read, they'll have zero sway with any manufacturer.

 

[Abazigal]

You’re old school. Apple used to be like that but they ruined the Macs for years now and today’s iPhones aren’t a perfect example either.

Wonder how long they’ll stay on top. But hey, Apple isn’t about marketshare but in delivering the best (= grabbing the profits)

Eventually, yes, I agree that nothing lasts forever (thankfully).

But I believe that Apple will go on to be insanely successful and profitable for a good long time to come. Going on to parrot “Apple is doomed” year after year just so you can go “Aha, I told you so” when that day does inevitably come strikes me as being extremely counter-intuitive.

Yes, you may eventually be right, but you would also have been wrong enough times during this interval that in the greater scheme of things, you would have been wrong.

Maybe the tech analyst are less focused on profits but are more concerned about the consumers and how Apple could sustain market share. You don’t have to be a genius to see that it’s a mess at the moment. A total mess in hardware and software.

Maybe the tech analysts see through those hollow phrases of Tim: the Mac mini is a very important product for us; the MacBook Pro touchbar disaster, Siri disaster, maps disaster, AppleTV which has nothing more to offer than what’s already build in smart tv’s; the stagnant state of iOS and MacOS... to name a few.

Those analyst see Apple getting pushed out of China and India where other vendors selling more capable devices for a fraction of the prize. And please don’t mention they just copy Apple because it’s Apple copying the rest these days.
[doublepost=1525025478]

The way I see it, these self-styled analysts are more interested in generating click bait for the page views than they are in genuinely understanding Apple and what makes it tick.

How can you be so sure... nothing has come to market yet. At the moment google is more successful as Apple in areas once dominated by Apple.

Google now vs Siri
Chromebooks vs iPads
Google home vs HomePod
Android vs iOS
G suite vs iWork
Google maps vs Maps
Google photos vs photos

Even the one lens camera on the Pixel is hard to beat.

Google is much further ahead in many areas that once belonged to Apple.

You think google is going to sit and rest with AR/VR?

I think Google is very far ahead of Apple in key areas like AI and I don’t see that changing.

Google probably has the edge in software but sucks in hardware. I think Apple will still have the advantage when it comes to delivering the final experience in a compelling package that makes me want to use it. All the more when it comes to something like wearables.

1) Hardware / software integration? Check.
2) Established manufacturing chain? Check.
3) Control over key technologies such as W1 chip? Check.
4) Established ecosystem? Check.
5) Owning the best customers to market to? Check.

Meanwhile, google is having difficulty just keeping a smartphone in stock. If you are an iPhone user, Apple’s own offering is likely still going to play best with your other devices.

 

[Brandhouse]

This is something to be excited about.

 

[panjandrum]

The resolution has nothing to do with the screen door effect. It's caused by the physical size of the pixel compared to the pixel spacing.

OK, to be a bit pedantic about it, 8K resolution should help resolve the screen-door effect assuming Apple doesn't design 8K screens that are physically huge so that the space between pixels also increases, which obviously wouldn't be the case when designing a headset... But as you add pixel-density on the *same size display* the spacing between them decreases. If you look for them on YouTube you can find magnified examples comparing the screen-door effect of various headsets, including a couple that are 4k-per-eye, and you'll see that the screen-door effect definitely decreases as the resolution increases (or, at least, it does on any display I've ever seen.)

 

[ipponrg]

OK, to be absurdly pedantic about it, 8K resolution should resolve the screen-door effect assuming Apple doesn't design 8K screens that are physically huge so that the space between them also increases, which obviously isn't the case when designing a headset... But as you add pixel-density on the *same size display* the space between them also has to decrease, to pack them in. If you look for them on YouTube you can find magnified examples comparing the screen-door effect of various headsets, including a couple that are 4k-per-eye, and you'll see that the screen-door effect decreases as resolution increases.

A related video:

Keep in mind that the screen door effect could in theory still happen if the size of each pixel size in 8K is very small compared to its pixel spacing.