Apple's NFC Ambitions Extend Beyond Apple Pay to Building Security, Transit Ticketing

[Tech198]

of course, you could accidentally leave your phone at home, or your phones out of battery...

Two biggest killers with NFC payments., this is why we use plastic..

Your probably more likely to have your wallet on you always anyway since all your personal stuff is in there, but what if at any point your pulled over ? u won't be able to produce your ID. opps.

I'm just saying the more places that get NFC, terminals, turn styles etc, the more we'll have issues and need to better make sure our phone is alive and kicking before we go out always...

There will be no "oh wait, i forgot" anymore.

 

[guzhogi]

I wonder how metro card & building security would work? Would you need a separate Passbook app for each system, or would all the metro systems agree to use the same system? For building security, if instead of physical keys, we used NFC to open doors, can this be extended to a pulled printing system? It could save a lot of money from wasted printing, plus make printing of confidential information more secure. It would take a massive amount of resources upfront to implement, but it would be very helpful.

 

[Thunderhawks]

So, now NFC is the big thing in Apple's cosmos.
Why?
I think they had to work on all that stuff, Apple Pay, transit ticketing, etc. for a long time not just one year, right?
Or did Apple decided in January 2014 that NFC could be useful for the above mentioned ideas?!

Therefore my question: Why wasn't NFC included in the iPhone 5s?
They knew that NFC will be needed in a future iPhone (and "future" here is defined as one year). So, why not including it??

I really love this company, truly I do. Steve and Apple shaped me and how I think about life and about my career path since I am 10 (1994).
But right now, Apple is playing games with its customers and I don't like it.
I can remember 1997 so I never criticised Apple's high margins. I am always happy when they crush the competition.

But, there are loyal customers guys like you and me that pay the higher price because we love Apple (in the past when they were small and now, ruling the industry) we know that the products are worth it but looking on this behaviour (also the iPad Mini update) makes me feel bad.
Right now, Apple doesn't treat their customers with respect.

You have absolutely ZERO knowledge about negotiations with partners and what time these took for Apple Pay to be accepted .

You have ZERO knowledge about the various stages of Apple's (not chips which could be used off the shelf) chip development Apple was working on.

You have ZERO knowledge of software timing, team programmer specialists availability and capacity.

And yet, you complain about what Apple does.

New technologies leave older devices behind all the time.

If it's really that important for you, trade in your 5S and buy a 6 or wait.

Apple decides what they launch when and all the complaining isn't going to change that.

I am not always happy with their products and where they are going.

MBP 17" discontinued
Mini a disaster
Apple Watch wait and see
Newer MacBooks can't be upgraded etc. etc.

Maybe it's time you buy other brands or cut down your expectations.

 

[Crzyrio]

So, now NFC is the big thing in Apple's cosmos.
Why?
I think they had to work on all that stuff, Apple Pay, transit ticketing, etc. for a long time not just one year, right?
Or did Apple decided in January 2014 that NFC could be useful for the above mentioned ideas?!

Therefore my question: Why wasn't NFC included in the iPhone 5s?
They knew that NFC will be needed in a future iPhone (and "future" here is defined as one year). So, why not including it??

I really love this company, truly I do. Steve and Apple shaped me and how I think about life and about my career path since I am 10 (1994).
But right now, Apple is playing games with its customers and I don't like it.
I can remember 1997 so I never criticised Apple's high margins. I am always happy when they crush the competition.

But, there are loyal customers guys like you and me that pay the higher price because we love Apple (in the past when they were small and now, ruling the industry) we know that the products are worth it but looking on this behaviour (also the iPad Mini update) makes me feel bad.
Right now, Apple doesn't treat their customers with respect.

Its not as easy as saying we plan on rolling out NFC in 2014 lets start putting NFC in this iPhone 5.

When it comes to these things, there are a LOT of other parties at play. Yes apple might have known they were going to use NFC in the future but I very much doubt they knew exactly when.

It would not have made sense to place a NFC chip on to the iPhone 5 when they didn't even have all their partners lined up and the deals struck with companies.

This is especially true with how quickly technology moves ahead

 

[Rogifan]

I hope they open up NFC so that other apps can take advantage of contactless payment on other networks, rather than forcing 'Apple's way or the highway'.

You mean like how Apple allows other app stores on their devices or allows apps to redirect to web stores in-app for IAP. Not happening. Apple didn't devlop Pay and add NFC for the benefit of Google Wallet.

 

[rdlink]

Not totally surprising. Cook said at the keynote that Apple wanted to replace the wallet, and that they were going to start with payments.

 

[SanJacinto]

You have absolutely ZERO knowledge about negotiations with partners and what time these took for Apple Pay to be accepted .

You have ZERO knowledge about the various stages of Apple's (not chips which could be used off the shelf) chip development Apple was working on.

You have ZERO knowledge of software timing, team programmer specialists availability and capacity.

And yet, you complain about what Apple does.

New technologies leave older devices behind all the time.

If it's really that important for you, trade in your 5S and buy a 6 or wait.

Apple decides what they launch when and all the complaining isn't going to change that.

I am not always happy with their products and where they are going.

MBP 17" discontinued
Mini a disaster
Apple Watch wait and see
Newer MacBooks can't be upgraded etc. etc.

Maybe it's time you buy other brands or cut down your expectations.

Yes! Sorry. Apple is always right, never makes mistakes. I am such a stupid customer I can't believe I have an own opinion.
And now, because of your message I finally realise that I am really using old technology. My poor iPhone 5S, already decades old and dismissed.

 

[rdlink]

You mean like how Apple allows other app stores on their devices or allows apps to redirect to web stores in-app for IAP. Not happening. Apple didn't devlop Pay and add NFC for the benefit of Google Wallet.

But it doesn't matter, because Google Wallet will benefit from Apple Pay. And I am fine with that, as long as Apple Pay gains tractions. The Android people can use their less convenient and less secure method of NFC payments if they want, because it won't affect me.

 

[bawbac]

Awesome!
Keep them phones out even more for those "grab N' dash" phone thieves that are ever increasing, especially in transit stops.

*You know you leave finger prints all over your phone, that can easily can be copied with various methods. So now they don't need to know your security code once they have your iPhone.

 

[gnasher729]

That would be perfect, but for public transit, definitely disable the thumb-scan, especially if you're in a line of people who are in a hurry, agreed??

They might change the software so that you can do the finger scan a few seconds ahead of time.

 

[octothorpe8]

It would be great if my phone replaced my metrocard!

But how else will we New Yorkers be able to identify and mock visitors who can't figure out how to quickly swipe a Metrocard?

 

[gnasher729]

of course, you could accidentally leave your phone at home, or your phones out of battery...

Two biggest killers with NFC payments., this is why we use plastic..

NFC itself uses very little power, that's why it can be built into debit and credit cards. With a careful design, the iPhone might just keep a bit of spare power for this instead of draining the battery to the last bit.

 

[Tech198]

Would u rather have your iPhone stolen or your credit card ??

 

[djphat2000]

Yawn. This is nothing new. Apple should have been doing this NFC stuff at least three to four years ago, about the same time when the rest of the industry was doing it.

Its a shame too because I really hoped Apple would position themselves at the forefront of NFC technology. Right now, they're still at the back. And has locked it down much more than everyone else for no real reason.

I wouldn't say for no reason. More likely how they could do it right, and security of course.

 

[2457282]

I know the MTA in NYC has publicly stated interest in using NFC/personal devices to replace the MetroCard by 2019, so this seems like a good fit.

It really would be awesome. Imagine the day when getting into a building or train or plane or paying only requires a phone. I could go on especially when we start looking at the home kit and health kit application. They seem to be going slow, but if they keep doing it right, the future is bright.

 

[Patriot24]

Hopefully buildings don't start turning off their electronic badging systems completely and trains don't go back to 100% paper tickets as a result.

</sarcasm>

 

[djphat2000]

Will be interesting to see how Apple pushes this technology, especially when many retailers are trying to pull away from Apple Pay in order to institute their own NFC payment system partnerships (a la CVS' announcement last week).

From the looks of it, they are not doing NFC at all. Some kind of bar code scanning thing. Which will be another application, and another bank account to setup, etc. Not just walk up, and pick card on your phone, and thumb print, GO.

I think it will not do well.

 

[Nanotyrns]

zoom zoom

I was thinking this weekend that this would be great for services like Car2Go, rapid transit and the like. I love to use the 10-Ride ticket books for RTD here in Denver and yeesh would it be awesome (and crazy convenient) to be able to purchase the fares through an app then just use my phone on the bus.

I know others feel differently about how groundbreaking Pay is, but I think it will be as big as the introduction of the App Store itself. NFC is one of those technologies that's enjoyed limited use up until this point but now has the potential to go really big.

Right now there are probably hundreds of developers that can't sleep at night because their heads are exploding with ideas about how to use this.

 

[dannyyankou]

But how else will we New Yorkers be able to identify and mock visitors who can't figure out how to quickly swipe a Metrocard?

I love mocking people who fumble around for 30 seconds for bus change.

But seriously, I've had to replaced too many cards that were "damaged". Nfc would be a great alternative.

 

[kwikdeth]

its all fun and games till the building management decides they arent going to accept AppleLock and shuts it off over the weekend

 

[gotluck]

This would continue to push apple ahead of Android and force google to follow. I would absolutely love this.

I believe this can already be done on android

NFC is not locked down on android and can be utilized by developers for nonpayment functions

It is on an app by app basis for each particular vendor

 

[medazinol]

Apple has never been first to market with lots of technology but when they do it's always with a "go to market" strategy. NFC is no different.

By using the secure enclave in the new iPhone and iPad CPUs they have an extremely secure way of handling payment systems with tokenization. Nobody else has this and this will result in Apple's payment system spreading like wildfire in all sorts of ways.

This effectively puts Apple into a first-mover situation where everyone else plays catch-up. Apple is very good at playing technology chess.

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I believe this can already be done on android

NFC is not locked down on android and can be utilized by developers for nonpayment functions

It is on an app by app basis for each particular vendor

This will prove to be the wrong way of doing it. Apps store data and that data can be compromised. Apple's way stores nothing about the user or his credit cards. It's simply a "token" that's one-way encrypted and sent to the card issuer.

 

[JeffyTheQuik]

CVS and Rite Aid management are looking at it to unlock the doors to their 24 hour stores.

Stay tuned!

 

[gotluck]

This will prove to be the wrong way of doing it. Apps store data and that data can be compromised. Apple's way stores nothing about the user or his credit cards. It's simply a "token" that's one-way encrypted and sent to the card issuer.

Yes that's how wallet currently functions, but that doesn't mean everything using NFC on android functions in that manner. For example, the old version of google wallet worked the same way as apple pay, before google was able to bring it to all android phones through host card emulation (which results in a security downgrade like you said).

 

[henryngan2006]

Does NFC work with RFID? Cos we have been using RFID card called "Octopus card" in Hong Kong for like 20 years in daily transactions in store and train stations.