Apple's Share of Computer Sales Surpasses 10% in U.S.

[mrblack927]

In a post about apple having 10% the equivalencies s/b on a ratio of 90/10 not 1/1

not saying it is that ratio but your wrong on being equal.

You're wrong. When someone says something, and then someone else jumps in to say, "Hey, it goes both ways," the false equivalence has been set up. That is how society uses that phrase. It is implied by the way it was set up.

Interesting that you should say that. Your claim is that your way of interpreting it matches society's general interpretation. Yet, when someone else comes along (another member of society) and disagrees with you, you say he's wrong. How can this be when, by virtue of the fact that more people disagree with you than agree with you, he's by-definition voicing the opinion of society?

And for the record, I agree with Avalontor. He made no mention of any quantitative equivalence. If you want to infer something, that's fine. But at least recognize that it's your interpretation, not everyone's.

 

[NebulaClash]

Interesting that you should say that. Your claim is that your way of interpreting it matches society's general interpretation. Yet, when someone else comes along (another member of society) and disagrees with you, you say he's wrong. How can this be when, by virtue of the fact that more people disagree with you than agree with you, he's by-definition voicing the opinion of society?

And for the record, I agree with Avalontor. He made no mention of any quantitative equivalence. If you want to infer something, that's fine. But at least recognize that it's your interpretation, not everyone's.

OK, I'll be fair and grant you your point that I could be the one who is wrong. I don't think so, although I do grant I was wrong in understanding samcraig's motives in saying what he said. And I jumped on him faster than I should have, because I grant you can interpret his words other than the way I did.

I work with words. I know how society as a whole users such phrases; it's my profession to know language and how it's used. So if I make a very firm assumption about such matters, it's based on my professional background. It's what I do for a living, so I tend to rely on my expertise.

That said, I certainly could be wrong. I just see this particular technique used so often in media stories, I've become hypersensitive to its appearance. But this is a casual forum where choice of word is not as carefully studied and sloppiness occurs.

But I was wrong in inferring something that turned out to be not the case.

 

[samcraig]

OK, I'll be fair and grant you your point that I could be the one who is wrong. I don't think so, although I do grant I was wrong in understanding samcraig's motives in saying what he said. And I jumped on him faster than I should have, because I grant you can interpret his words other than the way I did.

I work with words. I know how society as a whole users such phrases; it's my profession to know language and how it's used. So if I make a very firm assumption about such matters, it's based on my professional background. It's what I do for a living, so I tend to rely on my expertise.

That said, I certainly could be wrong. I just see this particular technique used so often in media stories, I've become hypersensitive to its appearance. But this is a casual forum where choice of word is not as carefully studied and sloppiness occurs.

But I was wrong in inferring something that turned out to be not the case.

Well I find this a bit ironic. My job is all about words. And I am a believer and study of Semantics. I would think that you, given your profession and your testimony (grin) above that you would be more careful with YOUR words and would have immediately conceded that YOU were the one that misinterpreted.

I hate to start something up now that we've made "peace" - but your actions and the statement above are contrary in my opinion. You either value words and their meanings - or you are - dare I say - careless with their meanings. Or I guess - somewhere in the middle since I don't believe in Black and White scenarios

Sorry - Again - not trying to be contrary - just found your last post very interesting and concerning as well. But I am glad you ultimately acknowledge the misinterpretation. At the end of the day - that's more important.

 

[wirelessmacuser]

This is great news. I've been waiting and watching for Apple to finally crest the 10% mark...

 

[NebulaClash]

Well I find this a bit ironic. My job is all about words. And I am a believer and study of Semantics. I would think that you, given your profession and your testimony (grin) above that you would be more careful with YOUR words and would have immediately conceded that YOU were the one that misinterpreted.

I hate to start something up now that we've made "peace" - but your actions and the statement above are contrary in my opinion. You either value words and their meanings - or you are - dare I say - careless with their meanings. Or I guess - somewhere in the middle since I don't believe in Black and White scenarios

Sorry - Again - not trying to be contrary - just found your last post very interesting and concerning as well. But I am glad you ultimately acknowledge the misinterpretation. At the end of the day - that's more important.

As I say, I was wrong to jump to a conclusion based on a message board post. I do indeed get sloppy when I post here. I write it quickly without proofreading and post it. Mistakes happen here that do not happen in more formal settings. That's the disconnect you perceive.

 

[samcraig]

As I say, I was wrong to jump to a conclusion based on a message board post. I do indeed get sloppy when I post here. I write it quickly without proofreading and post it. Mistakes happen here that do not happen in more formal settings. That's the disconnect you perceive.

Fair enough.

 

[ericinboston]

It's nice to see Apple's computer marketshare hit 10% finally...after like 20 years of waiting.

What would be nice is if Apple could keep pecking away at the personal computer marketshare and get around 20% or 30%. However, I don't see that happening for a long time unless Apple reduces its prices to make them a bit more affordable to the average consumer. I'm sure people will reply stating that it is already affordable hence the growth...but that's not entirely true...there will always be segments of consumers who have money to burn or are willing to buy the higher-priced-unit.

If/when the iMacs ever come down to ~$800 without sacrificing the tech specs, I'll buy one. $1200 for the baseline iMac (tech specs are good but not great for $1200 IMO) is just too expensive for a basic computer for my (or others) needs. The Mini is a choice, but after buying all the accessories to make it a computer "system" (keyboard, monitor, mouse), you're over $1000 also.

But for now my 2007 Mini is just fine.

 

[Vulpinemac]

Commodity pricing

It's nice to see Apple's computer marketshare hit 10% finally...after like 20 years of waiting.

What would be nice is if Apple could keep pecking away at the personal computer marketshare and get around 20% or 30%. However, I don't see that happening for a long time unless Apple reduces its prices to make them a bit more affordable to the average consumer. I'm sure people will reply stating that it is already affordable hence the growth...but that's not entirely true...there will always be segments of consumers who have money to burn or are willing to buy the higher-priced-unit.

If/when the iMacs ever come down to ~$800 without sacrificing the tech specs, I'll buy one. $1200 for the baseline iMac (tech specs are good but not great for $1200 IMO) is just too expensive for a basic computer for my (or others) needs. The Mini is a choice, but after buying all the accessories to make it a computer "system" (keyboard, monitor, mouse), you're over $1000 also.

But for now my 2007 Mini is just fine.

One thing I don't think you'll ever see from Apple is commodity pricing; as a company, Apple is out to make a profit and by cutting nearly $400 off their current base model price you're cutting almost all their current apparent profit margin. Personally, I think a significant piece of that profit goes to ensuring decent customer service--which costs more than you think.

They appear to have cut their prices somewhat, but it appears to be through getting better prices on the components they use rather than by cutting their profits. After all, the more of something you buy, the lower the cost on that something; with Apple selling so many more machines now than they did even 5 years ago, they've reached a breakover point where they get a better discount on components.

 

[NebulaClash]

And remember what was already pointed out in this thread, that Apple's market share of the higher end computer market is considerably more than 20-30% already. It's only when you count up the entire market, which includes whole fleets of cheap boxes for business, that you get this 10% figure.

Apple has a very workable model. They ignore the low-end side almost completely. They aim for those people who see value in buying a higher end product. They get profit by selling them, even as car dealers make more money from their high end products.

So while the other PC manufacturers gain great market share numbers, a decent chunk of that is in the low-profit low end of the market, constantly trying to squeeze out a little bit of money in the race to the bottom of pricing. Let 'em have it. As long as the Mac market is big enough to draw development of software (it is), Apple is fine.

Just a few years ago their market share as about a third as big. They were profitable then, and they most certainly are profitable now as they grow and grow and grow.

 

[Rocketman]

This is great news. I've been waiting and watching for Apple to finally crest the 10% mark...

Because Macs last longer than PC and have far higher resale value, if only Apple maintains 10% annual share for 4-5 years it will become majority installed share soon.

It wouldn't hurt to see Mac be 15% of annual sales though.

If they made a utility computer for POS and displays, and other manless tasks, they could finally get notable share.

Rocketman

 

[dgree03]

Here is what I dont understand, why are apple consumer on this forum so HAPPY that apple make ridiculous profit on their laptops and desktops?? I dont get it, unless you own stock.. why do you feel like your getting an ok deal?

I mean look I bought a 17in macbook pro, but after doing ridiculous research that was very good value. Not to mention I got a ridiculous discount... otherwise I wouldnt of bought it at all.

Apple makes money off of charging you premium prices for mediocre internals, wrapped in a pretty package.

 

[NebulaClash]

Here is what I dont understand, why are apple consumer on this forum so HAPPY that apple make ridiculous profit on their laptops and desktops?? I dont get it, unless you own stock.. why do you feel like your getting an ok deal?

I mean look I bought a 17in macbook pro, but after doing ridiculous research that was very good value. Not to mention I got a ridiculous discount... otherwise I wouldnt of bought it at all.

Apple makes money off of charging you premium prices for mediocre internals, wrapped in a pretty package.

Well, we think the package is more than pretty (though it is), it's functional. The Macbook Pro, for instance, has the kind of solid feel you rarely get elsewhere. A solid block of aluminum is carved out to make the body of the laptop. When you pick it up it feels premium. Some people like that.

Mostly we like Apple because of the software, however. I'm sure we'd be happy to pay less for the hardware, but we accept the cost because we like the software so much.

 

[DogHouseDub]

But I thought Apple died in 2001...

http://www.fool.com/duelingfools/2001/duelingfools01090502.htm

 

[dgree03]

Well, we think the package is more than pretty (though it is), it's functional. The Macbook Pro, for instance, has the kind of solid feel you rarely get elsewhere. A solid block of aluminum is carved out to make the body of the laptop. When you pick it up it feels premium. Some people like that.

Mostly we like Apple because of the software, however. I'm sure we'd be happy to pay less for the hardware, but we accept the cost because we like the software so much.

OSX is a good OS, no doubt. It must be just a mindshare thing? I mean I use Win7 and OSX and they both have pros and cons..

 

[Hal Itosis]

Just to chip in, that quote originally came from Douglas Adams (author of the Hitchiker's Guide books), who was an avid Mac fan.

Oh cool... that's good to know, thanx. [no wonder that phrase always makes me chuckle.]

What a privilege it must be for us to be graced with your presence. I'm surprised you've lowered your standards and left your "much better sites" to come here.

Most sites attempt to segregate the 'information sharing' areas from the 'constant complaints & endless crusades' section. No so here. Every single news item is fertile ground for major battlefront activity. It normally doesn't bother me (i eat trolls for breakfast, or just ignore them depending on my mood at the time). But it gets tiresome on occasion... especially when unwarranted (like back a page or two, from earlier this morning).

I come here mainly for news and rumors (and try to troubleshoot problem Macs when i can). But it's quite clear that some visitors come here purely for the purpose of starting some *****. I guess it's a hobby for them. Sometimes it seems that MR encourages that hobby. Controversy feeds page hits i suppose.

As someone who has been on the internet for so long, could you please tell me what's so special about "Demi Gods"?

Perhaps you've donated some bread to MR? [at any rate, the term "Demi God" is not nearly so universally known as the " " emoticon.]

Peace, out.

--

Really? I have to laugh at this because (even as an Apple owner of several devices) I question the sense of humor of at LEAST 90 percent of the people on this forum....

Aye, and there's the misunderstanding perhaps. The original quote (and my revision thereof) would apply to the Mac community at large... which is not equivalent to "this forum" (not by a long shot).

 

[Smoother]

What people has got to understand is that a lot of people in their late teenage and 20s use macs but the for the rest it might even be like 6% for mac. So people thinking "well half of my class got macs it should be higher" are not thinking about all of their parents got pcs or the fact that a large majority of the population are not very interested in either design or technical stuff or that most people buy cheap computers.

 

[NebulaClash]

OSX is a good OS, no doubt. It must be just a mindshare thing? I mean I use Win7 and OSX and they both have pros and cons..

They do have their pros and cons, but this is Win7 we're talking about. It took them long enough to come up with Win7, right? Mac users have been enjoying their OS for years.

It's not just a mindshare thing. There really is a cleaner look to OS X (for the most part). It feels like it's serving you, not that you have to change to fit it.

 

[PowerGamerX]

They do have their pros and cons, but this is Win7 we're talking about. It took them long enough to come up with Win7, right? Mac users have been enjoying their OS for years.

It's not just a mindshare thing. There really is a cleaner look to OS X (for the most part). It feels like it's serving you, not that you have to change to fit it.

Oooo I really bet you probably never used OS X when it came out. It was a piece of **** until 10.3 and 10.4, and although 10.4 was decent, and I never liked 10.3 very much, and neither were as good as Windows XP SP2 in my honest opinion. I consider Leopard the first complete version of OS X. I don't find OS X much cleaner than Vista or 7, just slightly easier on the eyes due to less plain white, I have trouble with bright white.

I might be in the minority, but I've had more problems with OS X than I ever had with any version of Windows. Granted, that doesn't mean Windows is better by any margin, I love my Apple stuff, but I've never had any problems with Microsoft or their products.

 

[pr5owner]

The big difference is usability. I can't even use a windows laptop never mind a netbook. I respect that other people think differently and obviously there is no real data storage on an iPad.

what exactly are you trying to do on a windows laptop that you are unable too?

my older Asus 1005 netbook was running 2 VM guest OS's (for vpn connections to diffrent clients) and multitasking tons of applications (outlook, word, chrome, FF, opera, excel) and ran them all fine at the same time.

on top of all that, windows ultimate 64bit was installed

 

[samcraig]

They do have their pros and cons, but this is Win7 we're talking about. It took them long enough to come up with Win7, right? Mac users have been enjoying their OS for years.

It's not just a mindshare thing. There really is a cleaner look to OS X (for the most part). It feels like it's serving you, not that you have to change to fit it.

So damned if you do/damned if you don't? Mac users bash Microsoft for not having a good OS. Then they DO have a good OS and Mac users say well it took them long enough... and we still like ours better...

Funny...

and I love love love my macbook pro. But the design is a bit flawed. No one can tell me that having a sharp corner by the wrists is a good design. No one

 

[revelated]

Base-model laptops for $2500+ ??? That must have been in the late '80s or early '90s. I bought my second Mac Laptop, running OSX in 2003 or earlier for $700. (10" MB 700MHz G3)

It's been a LOOOONNNG time since Apple's been at the "bottom of the barrel" with laptops...8 years or so. I suspect you may be suffering from Rip Van Winkleitus. Better check your calendar, mine says 2010.

Oh, and Scully is out; Jobs is back.

No dude. Almost all of the PowerBooks were overpriced and the very last one was I believe 2005. $2700 for a machine that really wasn't all that powerful compared to Windows machines at the time. I bought Big Poppa - the Gateway P7805u - $1500 flat out and it ran circles around anything Apple had at the time. Huge machine, but my point is, even during the PPC era, the prices were inordinately high compared to the Intel pricing.

 

[k995]

Here is what I dont understand, why are apple consumer on this forum so HAPPY that apple make ridiculous profit on their laptops and desktops?? I dont get it, unless you own stock.. why do you feel like your getting an ok deal?

I mean look I bought a 17in macbook pro, but after doing ridiculous research that was very good value. Not to mention I got a ridiculous discount... otherwise I wouldnt of bought it at all.

Apple makes money off of charging you premium prices for mediocre internals, wrapped in a pretty package.

Yes its the only company I know where certain people are happy to pay extra and dont mind the huge profit margings. Got to hand it to them they know their PR.

 

[OllyW]

Yes its the only company I know where certain people are happy to pay extra and dont mind the huge profit margings. Got to hand it to them they know their PR.

Some people would even be happy to pay more!

Agreed. There's still the up-front cost factor, though. I hear a lot of PC users says they'd love a Mac but they're too expensive. Price of entry is $1000+. Of course over time, a Mac is definitely a better value proposition, as evidenced by record Mac sales during the recession.

Every penny I paid for my MacBook Pro was money well-spent. I would have even been willing to pay a little more.

 

[PlipPlop]

They do have their pros and cons, but this is Win7 we're talking about. It took them long enough to come up with Win7, right? Mac users have been enjoying their OS for years.

It's not just a mindshare thing. There really is a cleaner look to OS X (for the most part). It feels like it's serving you, not that you have to change to fit it.

OSX 10 was dreadful it was only until 10.1 came out was it usable. You couldn't even burn disks with 10 and it crashed a lot.

 

[kamm]

This 10% is pathetic in my eyes - I thought they must have at least 20% with this crazy PR and marketing budget...


...but apparently not even in the US (forget worldwide) they managed to get out of the single-digit ghetto.

Kinda sad performance after 30 years of existence and again, it turns pathetic when you consider how much money they blow on marketing and feeding Mossberg-type slimeballs to push their stuff in the media.