Are Apple iBooks Next?

[Rincewind42]

Re: Re: Re: And they´re of! 6 more month of lovley rumors!

Originally posted by murak
Yes, I was wrong, after looking it up it was just a rumor. But still, it doesn´t sound right to compare a G3 and a G5 when it comes to power draw. I don´t have the facts but I picture that Altivec makes more difference (when it comes down to total power draw) on G3 than on G5. Right, no?

Relatively speaking, yes the Altivec unit would add a larger % power draw on a G3 than on a G5, but in absolute terms I think the L2 cache draws about the same amount of power.

Again, I am wrong. Yes, OSX does use Altivec. BUT does it make a big difference? Again I picture that the mojor factors that make OSX faster is RAM, Cache and a good 3D card. Right, no?

Except perhaps on the G5 it is nearly impossible to saturate the RAM bus without Altivec. So yes, the implication that has is that I don't think the G3 can saturate it's system bus (probably a really big reason why Apple hasn't upgraded the iBook to DDR Ram). In getting bit to the screen, the video card does mean more than the CPU, but there are specific tasks that can't be done on the GPU, and those will be faster on a machine with a G4 than a G3. And pretty much anything that talks to Quicktime will be faster on a G4 than on a G3 (which is probably more than you think).

You will have to exuse my bad english, I thought that it was a nice thing to say. Sorry

No big deal. It's not that it isn't a nice thing to say, it's just something you usually say to a girl

 

[yojimbo]

Re: Re: Re: Re: And they´re of! 6 more month of lovley rumors!

>Except perhaps on the G5 it is nearly impossible to saturate the RAM bus without Altivec. So yes, the implication that has is that I don't think the G3 can saturate it's system bus (probably a really big reason why Apple hasn't upgraded the iBook to DDR Ram). In getting bit to the screen, the video card does mean more than the CPU, but there are specific tasks that can't be done on the GPU, and those will be faster on a machine with a G4 than a G3. And pretty much anything that talks to Quicktime will be faster on a G4 than on a G3 (which is probably more than you think).


Agreed. But I found that the cost of using SDR is now more than DDR since SDR is no longer demanding as DDR at this moment. (Though retail price of DDR may still be ahead the SDR) Though DDR won't improve the overall performance very much, Apple may change to DDR in iBook, cost effective. Also as a way to fool user that they have improved the speed alot though they just increase a 100 mhz in the future CPU upgrade.

Anyway very nice post Rincewind42!!

 

[Abstract]

Sorry for going offtrack, but for those who hope that Apple lowers the price of the iBook, I'd like to say that I hope they don't. The iBook is already at a great price. If they cut the price of the iBook, then they may cut corners during production or something. I'm not quite sure what to say except that the money they cut has to come from somewhere, and I hope that it isn't from the iBook's themselves.

Also, a smaller notebook would cost more than a bigger one, while a 10" would definitely be expensive. Apple is one of the few companies that would make a compact laptop like the iBook cheaper than the bigger systems. I think that's great, and I just wanted to point that out.

Also, why can't the iBook get the G4 as well sans the "pro" features like Bluetooth, FW800, USB 2.0 and APEx?? Why can't we have a 12" and 14" iBook with a G4 1GHz AND have a 12" PB with the 1GHz they recently announced? If the only differentiator between the iBook and PB are the "pro" features, then so be it. Keep the resolution where it is for all I care.........I don't. I'd rather the iBook use the G4 if it will result in a faster machine.

 

[macphoria]

Sorry for going offtrack, but for those who hope that Apple lowers the price of the iBook, I'd like to say that I hope they don't. The iBook is already at a great price. If they cut the price of the iBook, then they may cut corners during production or something. I'm not quite sure what to say except that the money they cut has to come from somewhere, and I hope that it isn't from the iBook's themselves.

I don't know. I don't think Apple is a company that cuts corners. But then, things do change.

 

[JSRockit]

I'm thinking we'll see a redesigned iBook with a 1Ghz G3 at MWSF.
I hope they either kill the 14" model or give it SXGA+ resolution.

 

[lmalave]

Originally posted by true777
There definitely is a market for this, even if you're not personally interested (look at my Japanese train reference above). If they made the screen 10" or so, they could probably fit a CD-ROM drive and still keep it very small and light.

See, us girls don't like to log around big ugly backpacks... it would be great to have a little thing you could actually have on you all the time, but that's still a reasonably featured notebook. I would buy a 3.6 lb 10" iBook for $ 699 or 799 right away... the reason I still don't have an iBook or PB is that they're still too big for me. I'd like something tiny, and I don't think I'm the only one.

BTW - unrelated remark - wouldn't the XServe be due for an update even before the iBook?

The abovementioned Fujitsu is a 10.6" widescreen, and it's about 3 1/2 pounds with optical drive. I think it's still about a thousand pixels wide, too, so all you're really giving up is a little bit of vertical screen space. Thing is, though, the 12" size really hits a sweet spot in terms of size - they're selling quite a few of both the 12" iBooks and 12" PowerBooks. So I think a 10" would have to be in addition to 12", not a replacement for it. If they came out with a 10.6" widescreen iBook that would definitely be my next laptop purchase, though. For me a 10.6" widescreen would be perfect since I do mostly web browsing, text editing, and iTunes. So basically, I'd just have to doe a bit more scrolling is all...

 

[JSRockit]

Originally posted by lmalave
The abovementioned Fujitsu is a 10.6" widescreen, and it's about 3 1/2 pounds with optical drive. I think it's still about a thousand pixels wide, too, so all you're really giving up is a little bit of vertical screen space. Thing is, though, the 12" size really hits a sweet spot in terms of size - they're selling quite a few of both the 12" iBooks and 12" PowerBooks. So I think a 10" would have to be in addition to 12", not a replacement for it. If they came out with a 10.6" widescreen iBook that would definitely be my next laptop purchase, though. For me a 10.6" widescreen would be perfect since I do mostly web browsing, text editing, and iTunes. So basically, I'd just have to doe a bit more scrolling is all...

The Fujitsu P5000 actually has better resolution than the iBook...it is just smaller at 10.6". The iBook is 1024x768. The Fujitsu is 1280 x 768. It is almost as good of res as the 15" pBook. However, the extra vertical res of the pBook makes a huge difference.

 

[Macco]

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
Sorry. I meant to hit edit but I hit quote instead.

eMac
G4 Processor (Motorola)
1.33 GHz (Combo): $599
1.42 GHz (SuperDrive): $699
Low-cost educational system. Due to unreliable chip production, all G4's will be reserved for this line only, ensuring a somewhat reliable supply. Product line marked for cancellation in near future as the G5 improves in price-performance.

iBook
G5 Processor
10":
1.2 GHz Combo: $799
1.4 GHz SuperDrive: $899
12":
1.4 GHz Combo: $899
1.6 GHz SuperDrive: $999
14":
1.4 GHz Combo: $1099
1.6 GHz SuperDrive: $1199
Popular educational system. Also a popular personal system. Like the original iBook, which coexisted with Lombard and Pismo, this iBook shares the same processor type with the PowerBook. Widescreen. New enclosure.

iMac
G5 Processor
SuperDrive
17"
3 GHz
$1299
Reduced to a single product at a single attractive price point, incidentally that of the original Bondi Blue iMac. 17" screen only--15" screens are marked for extinction. Includes the same optical audio out that the G5 has today--ideal system for home entertainment. Evolved enclosure (compare the Kihei iMacs to the original Bondi iMacs and you'll see what I mean)

PowerBook G5
SuperDrive Standard
12"
1.8 GHz
$1599
2.0 GHz
$1799
15"
2.0 GHz
$1999
2.5 GHz
$2199
17"
2.5 GHz
$2599
More aggressive price cuts. Performance same across line, except for the 12" due to heat problems. All screens are widescreen. New enclosure.

Power Mac G5
Dual 2.5 GHz: $1599
Dual 3.0 GHz: $1999
Dual 3.33 GHz: $2199
There is no single processor. Price drops to $1599 for a Dual 2 GHz, the same entry-level price as the Blue and White G3. The 3.33 GHz is IBM overachieving. IBM promised a 1.8 GHz 970 and we got 2 GHz. If they promised Apple 3.0 GHz, there's a good chance they'll overshoot that one too. Same enclosure, possibly slightly modified.

Notes:
G5 Processors will be at either 90 nm or 60 nm, allowing their use in notebooks.

Price for the G5 processor will be low because IBM can mass-produce them cheaply at Fishkill.

All products except the eMac will use a G5 version of the Universal Motherboard Architecture. R&D costs for this UMA will be spread across the entire product line.

The eMac will be Apple's only product without a widescreen display. It will be the odd one out. Apple will use it to make a full frontal assault on the educational market to take it back.

The G6 will be released at Macworld Expo San Francisco in the year 2005.

Wait, you forgot the video iPod, and the new G5 cube, and the tablet/notebook thingie, and the Apple-branded phone, and the return of the Newton, and...

 

[Phil Of Mac]

Originally posted by Macco
Wait, you forgot the video iPod, and the new G5 cube, and the tablet/notebook thingie, and the Apple-branded phone, and the return of the Newton, and...

I was trying to be realistic.

I also predict Apple will have at least one new product or service that none of us can see coming.

 

[macphoria]

Wait, you forgot the video iPod, and the new G5 cube, and the tablet/notebook thingie, and the Apple-branded phone, and the return of the Newton, and...

Video iPod: Maybe
G5 Cube: Not gonna happen
Tablet: Not gonna happen
Apple Phone: Not gonna happen
PDA: Not gonna happen

Something else: Definitely

 

[JSRockit]

Just remember that 10" laptops are generally more expensive than 12" laptops...so the dream of a 10" laptop cheaper than $999 isn't going to happen. The Fujitsu P5000 starts at $1599 and the Sony TR1/2 starts at $1999.

 

[iPC]

Originally posted by JSRockit
Just remember that 10" laptops are generally more expensive than 12" laptops...so the dream of a 10" laptop cheaper than $999 isn't going to happen. The Fujitsu P5000 starts at $1599 and the Sony TR1/2 starts at $1999.

P2120 starts at $1299. Also there is not a lot of competition in the US for this niche, so prices have remained rather stable (and high).

 

[tom.96]

G4 500 ibooks... confirmed!

Has anyone else seen the report on macworld.co.uk that the new ibooks will have a G4 500 CPU and a 15" screen? Mworld UK is a pretty good site, but seems like a strange new ibook lineup. If I was buying one, I would be more attracted to a 14" 1.1ghz G3 than a G4 500...

 

[iPC]

Re: G4 500 ibooks... confirmed!

Originally posted by tom.96
Has anyone else seen the report on macworld.co.uk that the new ibooks will have a G4 500 CPU and a 15" screen? Mworld UK is a pretty good site, but seems like a strange new ibook lineup. If I was buying one, I would be more attracted to a 14" 1.1ghz G3 than a G4 500...

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/39/32945.html

http://macworld.co.uk/news/top_news_item.cfm?NewsID=6935

Must be a slow week for macworld.co.uk

This is the most ridiculous thing ever. The current 900MHz G3 iBook is faster in nearly everything than the 500MHz G4 is.....

 

[murak]

Re: G4 500 ibooks... confirmed!

Originally posted by tom.96
Has anyone else seen the report on macworld.co.uk that the new ibooks will have a G4 500 CPU and a 15" screen? Mworld UK is a pretty good site, but seems like a strange new ibook lineup. If I was buying one, I would be more attracted to a 14" 1.1ghz G3 than a G4 500...

I read all of it and it is proboably just a rumour, though it got me on my toes! It most be a rumor and not a "mistake" (I gues you all remember the G5 specs that leaked out..)

 

[macphoria]

Has anyone else seen the report on macworld.co.uk that the new ibooks will have a G4 500 CPU and a 15" screen? Mworld UK is a pretty good site, but seems like a strange new ibook lineup. If I was buying one, I would be more attracted to a 14" 1.1ghz G3 than a G4 500...

I don't think this will happen for two reasons. One, Apple knows most consumers are concerned about clockspeed, therefore it will not update iBook with slower clockspeed, even if it is G4. Second, big attraction for iBook is its small form factor. It does not make sense that they'll make it bigger.

 

[Adamki2000]

I don't think we'll be seeing a G5 iBook anytime soon seeing as how the G4 iBook isn't even out yet. Plus, with Apple having cooling issues with the G5 processor in laptops, it's likely that we'll probably see them in Powerbooks sometime mid to late next year and probably will make their way to iBooks in 2005. This is, I think, being realistic, given Apple's history of how and when they update their hardware lines. As for the iBooks' design, I actually love it. It's nice, clean, simple, soft-looking, and actually very pretty I think. I'd be happy if they didn't change the design at all. As for bigger screens, I'd have to agree and say that a 15" screen would probably be the biggest screen size Apple would go with for what is meant to be an education-targeted user group that have less income than people who can afford the Powerbooks. I would definitely like to see VRAM upgrades, but I think what would truly be an innovation for Apple would be for the new video cards in their laptops to be swappable when newer/faster ones come out. Of course you could always possibly do a complete motherboard upgrade to gain more CPU speed and possibly RAM as well but I think having the VRAM embedded onto the motherboard itself is a serious drawback to people who are always looking to upgrade their systems to make them faster and better. I could see how embedding the VRAM forces users to have to buy whole new laptops when theirs become outdated but come on, the main reason I HAVEN'T bought a laptop yet is because of the fact that you can't swap out the processors or VRAM. Other than that nitpick, I think Apple is doing right with their consumer notebook line.

 

[Phil Of Mac]

Originally posted by Adamki2000
I don't think we'll be seeing a G5 iBook anytime soon seeing as how the G4 iBook isn't even out yet. Plus, with Apple having cooling issues with the G5 processor in laptops, it's likely that we'll probably see them in Powerbooks sometime mid to late next year and probably will make their way to iBooks in 2005.

PowerBook G5 in summer, iBook G5 in time for the holiday season.

 

[JSRockit]

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
PowerBook G5 in summer, iBook G5 in time for the holiday season.

No.

 

[sparky76]

Why the excitement about the ibook? The Powerbook is gorgeous, but the ibook is a slab of plastic. For far less than the price of an ibook I can get a Wintel laptop, to do all the same things and more.
Why not lower the entry price for the PB and kill the ibook line?

 

[JSRockit]

Originally posted by sparky76
Why the excitement about the ibook? The Powerbook is gorgeous, but the ibook is a slab of plastic. For far less than the price of an ibook I can get a Wintel laptop, to do all the same things and more.
Why not lower the entry price for the PB and kill the ibook line?

There is not one decent 12" PC laptop on the market.

 

[sparky76]

If anyone wants a 12" surely they can get a Powerbook - if they want a cheap laptop, get a PC.

 

[JSRockit]

Originally posted by sparky76
If anyone wants a 12" surely they can get a Powerbook - if they want a cheap laptop, get a PC.

Name a PC laptop at $999 with a real GPU?

 

[deadpoet]

Re: G4 500 ibooks... confirmed!

Originally posted by tom.96
Has anyone else seen the report on macworld.co.uk that the new ibooks will have a G4 500 CPU and a 15" screen?

most ridiculous thing I've ever heard -- but then again I've only been a switcher for 5 months

The next iBook revision will most likely be a G3 speed bump to 1.0 Ghz and no more -- Apple don't want the iBook to eat into PB sales, obviously.

Oh and when I bought my 800Mhz iBook 5 months ago, it was by far the best value budget notebook on the market, especially if we're talking 12" LCD form factor. Even now, the iBook remains competitive, but I'd rather get a new 12" PB if I was to switch now since the prices have dropped dramatically.

I see the new cheap Wintel lappies out now, but I have absolutely no envy even when comparing my 5-month old iBook to them.

 

[appleguy]

NEW iBOOKS

Just had my weekly meeting with a mate from Apple (i work in the wonderful reseller land) and have a good relationship with the guys there. I was informed that in about 2 weeks there will be a major vamp across the line for iBooks something that we have never seen before. yeah I know that there are alot of posts on here saying that they have a mate of Steve or know people at Apple, so believe me or not.. its up to you. But my guess is that it won't be two weeks it will most likely be a little more around the 24th Oct so keep your eyes peeled.
They should have the new IBM G3 processor with speeds that will give your desk skid marks.