Where is the profit for the manufacturer then? That would require that the manufacturer, and potentially the carrier cut profit.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
AT&T has 48 hours to answer iPhone pricing complaints
- Thread starter jjk454ss
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Where is the profit for the manufacturer then? That would require that the manufacturer, and potentially the carrier cut profit.
I've thought hard and long about doing this. But, then this is just going to set up the same problem next year. And I guarantee you, we are going to see just the same amount of bitching next year (from the buyers of the 3G S) as we are seeing this year.
The manufacturer would only lose profit if "high" retail price x units sold > "low" retail price x units sold.
But anyways, I'm sure the vast majority of these manufacturers profits come from carrier's purchases, rather than individuals purchasing the phones at retail pricing. And also remember, cellphone carriers do not pay the retail price either. Since they buy in-bulk (millions of units), they get substantial discounts. AT&T is certainly not buying their iPhones from Apple for $499/$599.
I have a theory.
I think that Apple accidentally used lead based plastics in the iphone 3g.
Lead poisoning can cause cognitive deficiencies.
Thus, the current iphone 3g owners who are so incredibly angry that they are being held to their AT&T contract must be absorbing the lead from their iphones somehow, causing their IQ to drop significantly.
I think that Apple accidentally used lead based plastics in the iphone 3g.
Lead poisoning can cause cognitive deficiencies.
Thus, the current iphone 3g owners who are so incredibly angry that they are being held to their AT&T contract must be absorbing the lead from their iphones somehow, causing their IQ to drop significantly.
Yep, TNSTAAFL.
Perhaps, in the future Apple will lower the early upgrade price. Prices on the hardware do tend to fall over time so maybe next time they'll take the opportunity to lower the upgrade price instead of lowering the subsidy price. Perhaps at $299/$399 they could eliminate most of the bitching. Although I'm sure it would not please everyone. That's not ever going to happen.
So did the 3G owners like myself who think these people should **** and stop whining luck out and get iPhone 3Gs without lead?
Anyone see cnet's recap of the Palm Pre/iPhone 3GS?
cnet mentions Nokia's new flagship phone:
cnet mentions Nokia's new flagship phone:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1001_3-10263325-92.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-5
You just haven't licked yours enough.So did the 3G owners like myself who think these people should **** and stop whining luck out and get iPhone 3Gs without lead?
It would be nice! And Apple would probably still profit because they would be able to recycle most of the parts. Or, at least sell them as refurbs for $100 cheaper than the retail price.
Not soon enough.
So did the 3G owners like myself who think these people should **** and stop whining luck out and get iPhone 3Gs without lead?
That's the big mystery. Maybe the complainers are just more anxious in general and their anxiety over the unfairness of the world causes their hands to sweat, leaching the lead from the plastic and into their system. Or maybe they have an oral fixation from not being breast feed and are ingesting the lead through their iphone/inipple.
The refurbs Apple sells look brand new. The restoration process they would need to go through for the quantity of trade-ins would be astronomical. We have eBay and Craigslist, so we can do the trade-in stuff ourselves.
Steps:
- Sell your old 3G
- Put that money towards a new 3G S
Perhaps with your carrier. AT&T applies the same prices and practices to the iPhone that it does to every other brand of PDA/Smartphone that it sells. And the subsidy practices are virtually the same for every US carrier.
From the sounds of the rioting peasants in the village, any solution that doesn't result in the iPhone being $199 regardless of their contract solution isn't going to be considered fair.
Fair - ATT buys the phone from Apple for $700. You buy phone from ATT for $300. ATT make money over the course of 18ish months to make up the $400 dollar discount they gave you on the phone hardware. You pay for service around $75 a month ($40 voice, $30 data, $5 txt). They break even on phone discount after 5.5 months. They have 12.5 to pay for saleries, benifits, ect.
Transparent - THey left you know the website when you are eligible for upgrade and it is in the contract YOU SIGNED.
I hope ATT sticks to you all and doesn't change price at all. However if they don something stupid they know they will have to do it next year, and I will benefit. But if they don't I will say I will just wait because I signed a contract and agreed to everything including not upgrading until 18 months in....They should put a NO WHINE clause in the contract.
That's the general assumption. To his point of transparency, neither AT&T nor Apple have disclosed the actual price paid per iPhone.
I have a solution to all this nonsense that may help for the next iPhone and dumbproof it.
Apple and AT&T should have a disclaimer when you purchase an iPhone at a discount:
"Warning. The $199/$299 purchase price is a discount with new activation or upgrade eligibility. If a new phone is released before your contract allows another discount, and it will upset you that you must pay full price to get another phone, please do us a favor and pay full price now. Thanks!"
Apple and AT&T should have a disclaimer when you purchase an iPhone at a discount:
"Warning. The $199/$299 purchase price is a discount with new activation or upgrade eligibility. If a new phone is released before your contract allows another discount, and it will upset you that you must pay full price to get another phone, please do us a favor and pay full price now. Thanks!"
I don't want them to give people a break on the 3GS. I would rather them lower there data plans then help all the suckers that bought a 3G
Washington Post: Apple and AT&T
here is an article that appeared in the Washington Post.
The author, MG Siegler, acknowledges that AT&T has a legal right to their terms... but that, long range, big picture, it is counter-productive to not be more flexible with iPhone upgrades. He also is a source for the figure $100 per month for AT&T service charges. (in his case and that of many others.)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/08/AR2009060803490.html
Why The iPhone 3G S May Be A Sucker's Bet Right Now
MG Siegler
TechCrunch.com
Monday, June 8, 2009 2:24 PM
The new iPhone 3G S sounds great. It's not a huge update to the iPhone, but it packs a few very important things: More speed, more storage, more battery and a better camera that can do video. It's a no-brainer to upgrade to it, just as many did from the original iPhone to the iPhone 3G last year, right? Wrong.
While current iPhone owners last year got to upgrade to the iPhone 3G for the fully subsidized $199 and $299 prices, the same will not be true this year. Instead, current iPhone 3G owners only 1 year into their 2 year contracts, will have to pay $399 and $499 to upgrade. The reason for this is simple: AT&T subsidizes the phone down to $199 based on a 2-year payment agreement with the customer. If you only paid one year of that contract, AT&T would have to eat those costs. So instead it's putting that cost back into this new phone. It didn't do that last year, because the original iPhone wasn't subsidized. It makes sense, but here's why that's a bad idea.
There are no shortage of AT&T iPhone customers who are pissed off at the company. Not only is their service sketchy at best in many places (I have spotty service in San Francisco, but it was much worse when I was in NYC this past week), but they do things like delay the roll out of features that the rest of the world is getting because they have other providers. And they do things like block the Sling player app from streaming over 3G on just the iPhone, while it works fine on other phones. And they rip us off with text messages (as do other carriers, though AT&T was particularly bad when moving from the original iPhone to the iPhone 3G). The list goes on.
Why this matters is that the dislike of AT&T, mixed with a not huge update to the iPhone and a higher subsidized price could be a perfect storm for users that normally would upgrade, not to. I probably will because the iPhone is integral to my work and I could use more speed and power, but the fact that I'm questioning it should say something. I didn't question it for a second last year.
But here's why it's really a very questionable upgrade: Because Apple is at some point going to move the iPhone beyond the AT&T network. That move could happen as soon as next year. If you buy this iPhone 3G S now, you'll be locked in for two more years (or have to pay the large cancellation fee). Now, AT&T is trying to negotiate with Apple to extend its exclusive deal through 2011, in which case the move to the iPhone 3G S would make some sense. But that has not happened yet, and AT&T is playing in risky waters. If I learned tomorrow that AT&T and Apple were ending their exclusive deal in 2010, there is no way I would upgrade. I'd suck it up and wait for a year.
That's why it may have been smart for AT&T to extend an olive branch to current iPhone users and give them the same subsidized price as new users. Sure, they would have taken a hit, probably a fairly big one, but big picture, I don't think it would be all that bad. First of all, not all current owners would upgrade even at the lower price. Second, if you think about it, it's not really that big of a hit for them. It's really only $200 per customer ? AT&T makes that off of me in two months with my bill. And if they do lose the Apple exclusivity, they will effectively be losing $1,200 (one year's worth of bills) that I otherwise would have been paying them.
Instead, basically what it will sounds like to most current iPhone owners is AT&T saying that, "we love you as a customer so much that we're going to make you pay an extra $200 for this new device since you stuck around with us." That $399 to $499 for the iPhone 3G S could end up costing you a lot more if Apple moves the iPhone beyond AT&T. And that sucks, because I want it. But I'm very worried it won't be worth it.
© 2009 TechCrunch
here is an article that appeared in the Washington Post.
The author, MG Siegler, acknowledges that AT&T has a legal right to their terms... but that, long range, big picture, it is counter-productive to not be more flexible with iPhone upgrades. He also is a source for the figure $100 per month for AT&T service charges. (in his case and that of many others.)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/08/AR2009060803490.html
Why The iPhone 3G S May Be A Sucker's Bet Right Now
MG Siegler
TechCrunch.com
Monday, June 8, 2009 2:24 PM
The new iPhone 3G S sounds great. It's not a huge update to the iPhone, but it packs a few very important things: More speed, more storage, more battery and a better camera that can do video. It's a no-brainer to upgrade to it, just as many did from the original iPhone to the iPhone 3G last year, right? Wrong.
While current iPhone owners last year got to upgrade to the iPhone 3G for the fully subsidized $199 and $299 prices, the same will not be true this year. Instead, current iPhone 3G owners only 1 year into their 2 year contracts, will have to pay $399 and $499 to upgrade. The reason for this is simple: AT&T subsidizes the phone down to $199 based on a 2-year payment agreement with the customer. If you only paid one year of that contract, AT&T would have to eat those costs. So instead it's putting that cost back into this new phone. It didn't do that last year, because the original iPhone wasn't subsidized. It makes sense, but here's why that's a bad idea.
There are no shortage of AT&T iPhone customers who are pissed off at the company. Not only is their service sketchy at best in many places (I have spotty service in San Francisco, but it was much worse when I was in NYC this past week), but they do things like delay the roll out of features that the rest of the world is getting because they have other providers. And they do things like block the Sling player app from streaming over 3G on just the iPhone, while it works fine on other phones. And they rip us off with text messages (as do other carriers, though AT&T was particularly bad when moving from the original iPhone to the iPhone 3G). The list goes on.
Why this matters is that the dislike of AT&T, mixed with a not huge update to the iPhone and a higher subsidized price could be a perfect storm for users that normally would upgrade, not to. I probably will because the iPhone is integral to my work and I could use more speed and power, but the fact that I'm questioning it should say something. I didn't question it for a second last year.
But here's why it's really a very questionable upgrade: Because Apple is at some point going to move the iPhone beyond the AT&T network. That move could happen as soon as next year. If you buy this iPhone 3G S now, you'll be locked in for two more years (or have to pay the large cancellation fee). Now, AT&T is trying to negotiate with Apple to extend its exclusive deal through 2011, in which case the move to the iPhone 3G S would make some sense. But that has not happened yet, and AT&T is playing in risky waters. If I learned tomorrow that AT&T and Apple were ending their exclusive deal in 2010, there is no way I would upgrade. I'd suck it up and wait for a year.
That's why it may have been smart for AT&T to extend an olive branch to current iPhone users and give them the same subsidized price as new users. Sure, they would have taken a hit, probably a fairly big one, but big picture, I don't think it would be all that bad. First of all, not all current owners would upgrade even at the lower price. Second, if you think about it, it's not really that big of a hit for them. It's really only $200 per customer ? AT&T makes that off of me in two months with my bill. And if they do lose the Apple exclusivity, they will effectively be losing $1,200 (one year's worth of bills) that I otherwise would have been paying them.
Instead, basically what it will sounds like to most current iPhone owners is AT&T saying that, "we love you as a customer so much that we're going to make you pay an extra $200 for this new device since you stuck around with us." That $399 to $499 for the iPhone 3G S could end up costing you a lot more if Apple moves the iPhone beyond AT&T. And that sucks, because I want it. But I'm very worried it won't be worth it.
© 2009 TechCrunch
Can i just throw this into the mix for those US customers who bought the original iPhone your two year contracts are up now yes? well what would make you sign a two year contract again? a new iPhone yes? so why no front facing camera etc etc? because they want you to commit to at&t for two years again so is the 3GS such a new iPhone? no the 3G is capable of all the new features the 3GS can do it is just a clever way to get your $$$$$
same goes over here in the UK but yes we have more of a problem see we have seven months left on most of our contracts so it is up to us pay or no pay i don't care either way because i know that when next years iPhone comes out i will have the same problem i will be mid contract!
so lets just see how many O2 sell over these next few weeks my guess not as many as last year! and with all the bad press they are getting who knows they might make it cheaper in the next coming months look how cheap you can get a 8GB 3G for now, so yes i understand we are not happy with the buy out policy and feel let down but look on the bright side......
you could own a Nokia N95
(I did before i got my original iPhone) and guess what? i am still in contract with TMobile and i am paying £25 per month for it
an expensive door stop?
same goes over here in the UK but yes we have more of a problem see we have seven months left on most of our contracts so it is up to us pay or no pay i don't care either way because i know that when next years iPhone comes out i will have the same problem i will be mid contract!
so lets just see how many O2 sell over these next few weeks my guess not as many as last year! and with all the bad press they are getting who knows they might make it cheaper in the next coming months look how cheap you can get a 8GB 3G for now, so yes i understand we are not happy with the buy out policy and feel let down but look on the bright side......
you could own a Nokia N95
(I did before i got my original iPhone) and guess what? i am still in contract with TMobile and i am paying £25 per month for it
an expensive door stop?
This must be the best answer this week bravo and what i think is on everyones mind who has been trying to get this point over
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Is there any independent basis for believing that AT&T pays Apple $700 per iPhone? (The basic 3G is now selling for $99.) An argument is only as valid as its premise.
Perhaps statements like "I hope ATT sticks to you all" indicates a certain lack of objectivity in considering these issues.
I, by the way, never signed a contract. I placed my order over the phone
and it was shipped to me. Then it was activated...and I was asked (over the phone) what degree of service did I want? did i want text messages, etc? that was all there was to it.
In a perfect World AT&T would reduce the cost and take care of their current customers and also think "Long Term" wanting to keep them for life. The bad news is this is not a perfect World and I just don't see AT&T doing that.
Those were the old days
Those were the old days