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Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
akboarder24 said:
Moxie, those pics are great, and it sure looks like you know how to utilize that camera! As far as noise issues, they look amazing @ 1600 iso! now, it doesn't matter what electronics you're using, adding your own touch in the digi darkroom (ahem...PS) is not that hard nor time consuming. shooting raw is a little more work, but it's like working with a roll of undeveloped film. Having a dslr also helped me understand film a lot more, to look at it in a different light, and frankly, film is more cost-effecient and practical to use for certain photographic applications. With the extreme price drops in the film market, I'm currently searching for a fast (fps) film body with a great sync that I would never have been able to come upon!
Keep it up Moxie, you're motivating me to shoot again!

I like how you're thinking. Jump in on this conversation. Please. Post some shots too. So you like the ISO 1600 shots? Lemme ask you this, being a film guy, can you ever get shots like that at ISO 1600 with film? I know the answer. I'm sure Gary and you do too. So what's interesting is all the "no noise" people are probably all tech guys. Photographers know what ISO 1600 and 3200 film looks like. Hell, even 400 and 800 are grainy. So we're already way ahead of the curve. People like Gary get excited by low noise/high ISO ratios because he understands what a revolution coming from film (were you once a film guy gary? i'm assuming). Other people in this thread think that just because Canon haslower ISO noise at 1600 and now 8mp, that means that Nikon, Fuji, Kodak, et. al should pack it in and nail their coffins shut. ;)

What's funny about that is that those people don't understand how tickled I am at the ISO abilities of my D100, my D2h, and DSLR's in general. I look forward to them all getting better to. It's pretty amazing to think about the handholding possibilities with VR/IS, fast lenses and high ISO's. Regardless of platforms.

But you do have a point. Certain things film can win on. If you're looking for a FAST fps camera at a low price, you could always get an 8fps F5 for around a grand. ;)

That said, rebates on the F100 (5fps) can get you in the door for around $600.

Share some shots. Which DSLR are you using?

m
 

iGary

Guest
May 26, 2004
19,580
7
Randy's House
The EF 100-400 would be the lens I would love to see Nikon make. Yours is an f4 right? Constant aperture? That's a killer piece.

Yeah, and I love it. Just got it and haven't had time to even tak a shot with it - been too busy with freelance writing and a deadline at work - blah.

The Nikkor 50 1.8 is a great lens too-- and cheap. I paid $59 for mine, and it's arguably the sharpest lens in my kit.

The EF 1.8 II is what they make to get you hooked on L glass - it's like a gateway drug. $60.00 and tack sharp.

Here's a sample from the sigma 70-200. Have you heard about this lens? Great bargain, for sure!

I see it talked about quite a bit ove on Fred Miranda. I almost bought the Sigma 24-70, but opted for the Canon L to see if the legend is true.

Sigma makes some really good stuff, if you pick and choose corrrectly.
 

Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
Jon'sLightBulbs said:
Shutter release cable? Shutter release remote? Threaded shutters?

How about just using the timer? Sure, you'll have to wait 5 seconds, but if your exposure length is long enough to be that worried about camera shake, sponteneity is clearly not at issue.

I think you've completely missed the point. ;)

The use of a cable release would allow bulb exposures at much longer than 30 seconds. ;)

As a matter of fact, even with the cable release on my D100, i'd still have a 2 second timer, and mirror lock up. I think that helps get the DOF on night shots, especially the pittsburgh skyline one. ;)
 

Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
iGary said:
Yeah, and I love it. Just got it and haven't had time to even tak a shot with it - been too busy with freelance writing and a deadline at work - blah.



The EF 1.8 II is what they make to get you hooked on L glass - it's like a gateway drug. $60.00 and tack sharp.



I see it talked about quite a bit ove on Fred Miranda. I almost bought the Sigma 24-70, but opted for the Canon L to see if the legend is true.

Sigma makes some really good stuff, if you pick and choose corrrectly.

I agree with Sigma making some good stuff. I feel like 50mm nikkor is the gateway drug to buy nikon lenses too. It made me sell my old 19-35 Tamron and get a Nikkor 18-35, made me sell my Nikon 28-80 and get the 24-85 and then the 12-24, and i still wanna ditch the 24-70 and 70-200 (though they've been good to me) for the 17-55 AF-S DX and the 70-200 AF-S VR
 

iGary

Guest
May 26, 2004
19,580
7
Randy's House
This is some of the aerial work I do, shot with the Rebel and the 28-135 IS USM, which is great for aerial work.

Image-FE4919487BD011D9.jpg


100% crop.

Again, the Rebel isn't a BAD camera, but if you want to take over the top pictures, the one's you get out of the Rebel will be because of luck.

And we all have those shots.

"How the EFF did I do that?" :D
 

jared_kipe

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Dec 8, 2003
2,967
1
Seattle
Hey buddy, what is the point of discussing image quality of a camera and then posting "enhanced" images. Not to mention what is the point of iso 1600 on a well lit subject?? There isn't any noise because there isn't any where for there to be noise. My images were WORST case scenarios, no they weren't under exposed, they were taken in the SHADE. That would be like saying your bridge shot was underexposed because you can't see the blurry person's face. They were accurate to what I saw, and I didn't do any "touch up" work on them

You calling me a canon troll, on a mac forum, on a canon thread, is pretty ridiculous. In fact I'll have a brain aneurism if I think about any of this anymore.

So if we are going to step back and go take some pictures, I just went to the University of Washington's campus ON MY DAY OFF, to take these. I did get to walk by a wedding, but they were watching me so I quickly snapped one while I walked by. :p

washington.jpg

tree.jpg

wedding.jpg

hydrant.jpg

duck.jpg

gull2.jpg


Now even though these may not be published or in a gallery, please don't steal them.

And you know, I don't hear anybody complaining about the imac being a plastic computer.
 

akboarder24

macrumors member
Jan 26, 2004
35
0
Fort Collins, Colorado
Moxiemike said:
I like how you're thinking. Jump in on this conversation. Please. Post some shots too. So you like the ISO 1600 shots? Lemme ask you this, being a film guy, can you ever get shots like that at ISO 1600 with film? I know the answer. I'm sure Gary and you do too. So what's interesting is all the "no noise" people are probably all tech guys. Photographers know what ISO 1600 and 3200 film looks like. Hell, even 400 and 800 are grainy. So we're already way ahead of the curve. People like Gary get excited by low noise/high ISO ratios because he understands what a revolution coming from film (were you once a film guy gary? i'm assuming). Other people in this thread think that just because Canon haslower ISO noise at 1600 and now 8mp, that means that Nikon, Fuji, Kodak, et. al should pack it in and nail their coffins shut. ;)

What's funny about that is that those people don't understand how tickled I am at the ISO abilities of my D100, my D2h, and DSLR's in general. I look forward to them all getting better to. It's pretty amazing to think about the handholding possibilities with VR/IS, fast lenses and high ISO's. Regardless of platforms.

But you do have a point. Certain things film can win on. If you're looking for a FAST fps camera at a low price, you could always get an 8fps F5 for around a grand. ;)

That said, rebates on the F100 (5fps) can get you in the door for around $600.

Share some shots. Which DSLR are you using?

m


Wow, yeah, the only time when you want to use a >800 ISO is if you're doing en exhibit aptly named "Grain"! j/k, but it's a test to sucessfully use more sensitive film...to me that's what makes it an art or skill or what have you.

And I am always looking for a great deal on a film body/booster, they get cheaper and cheaper. The F5 is a great machine, using it a little and seeing how well it does it job is great!

One of the only things I don't like about the ISO revolution is how it can be detrimental to a photographers skill/knowlegde over time. What good is it going to be when all ISO's pack the same clarity? Will ISO in general be eliminated? I don't know! Those who jump into the dslr market who don't really have much past film usage, digi ISO fools them greatly and they don't even know it! I'm a firm believe in film, and I don't think it's going away at all. When people know what you can do with film, & coming from a dslr, it will absolutely drag them down. GRANTED, most entry level con/prosumers will never want to or need to use film, unless they turn photography into their profession, but the problem will still be present.

I currently use a 300D (own) 20D & 1dsmkII (borrow), I bought the 300D to get used to the dslr way of shooting, but may end up sticking with film. I'm at a huge crossroads and I don't know what direction to take!

I'd post photos, but my laptop just died and I need to recover all of my stuff off of the HD. What luck?! Have a great weekend and I'll try to join this discussion again soon!
 

Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
I doubt i'll be stealing any of these images. Secondly, none of mine are really enhanced. You're obviously not really that "in the know" about digital photography. Or photography in general. The whole point of taking a photo, digitlal or film, is the CONTROL you have over the final image in the darkroom. Ask Ansel. He was famed for LOTS of manipulation in the darkroom post photo. Would you argue with that guy? And yes, it is a huge factor in image quality. It's called "real world usage." I'd be a wholly irresponsible photographer if I took an image directly from my DSLR, be it Canon, Nikon or anyone else, and gave it to a client as a final file.

The point of ISO 1600 on a well lit subject? The fact is, it wasn't well lit! Neither were. BUT I used ISO to achieve a proper exposure. THAT'S the point of ISO.

Your images were underexposed, and they were soft. Not in focus properly. What's the point of shooting flora if you can't make out the details? Your flora was underexposed (hiding detail!) and also soft focused (hiding detail also!) Secondly, your compositions were boring and not very exciting. Putting a flower in the middle of the frame is boring composition. Try offsetting them a bit. ;) Or get a macro lens and THEN go and try and do flora photography. I've done it. Whole magazine worth of garden photos next month as the feature. Hehehe.

Also, did you get permission to take that couples photo? That's kind-of dirty pool, or at least bad etiquette to take photos of a couple on their wedding day when you're not even involved in the wedding. Makes you a paparazzi of course. Just watch some groom doesn't sock you one. ;)

As far as your iMac comment goes, i don't complain about my iMac's plastic case because i'm not going to be using it in places where a plastic casing would be a potential detriment to the machine. That said, my D2h's rock solid build and water sealing is nice, even at events, where last week, I had a woman turn around and get startled by my closeness to her (i was photographing a mayoral candidate) and she spilled her soda all over my camera and lens. I took a few moments, wiped it down, and continued shooting. I also manage to do a lot of shoots in industrial sites. I like knowing that my camera has a chance of surviving should something heavy get dropped on it. Or during sports, say a bunch of athletes at a lacrosse game come crashing into me. I want rock solid gear that will hold up. I just don't think a 70-200 lens attached to ANY consumer based DSLR (300d, 350xt, D70, Nikon N75, or Rebel film series) is gonna hold up to that kind of abuse. In a professional setting, the Rebel is severaly underbuilt. In a regular setting, i've seen soccer moms drop their rebels with 75-300 lens on it down a set of bleachers and no more rebel. The lens mount popped right off. Nasty! So yea, I prefer a more robust build quality, since a camera does get subjected to elements that are far and above what we subject our iMacs to.

I'll go over your photos for critique in order. Don't get mad at my critique. Just the facts:

1. Washington.jpg : Bland composition. Do you know about the rule of thirds? If not, i'll give you a lesson if you like. No 300d, d70, D100 or 350xt can help a bad composition. Also, you could have tried to throw some fill light on the statue. There's really not a lot of detail that tells me that's washington. And that is your main subject, right?

2. Tree.jpg : Again, poor composition. The tree is barely visible against the left building, and the picture isn't sharp. Also your WB is off, as the blocks on the building have a big blue cast to them.

3. Wedding.jpg : First off, it's not good etiquette to shoot people's wedding if you're not a) the official photographer or b) a guest of the wedding. Secondly, the people in front, out of focus, take your eye immediately away from the couple, who look to be having a private moment. You shouldn't have taken this shot. Lastly, you didn't even get the bride's whole face. But probably because you had to be sneaky to get the shot.

4. hydrant.jpg : Again, would have been helped immensely by using the rule of thirds. Also, you seem to be shooting in unfavourable light. You should avoid midday sun. You've lost alot of detail, and again, your WB is way off.

5. Duck.jpg : Probably your best job compositionally, but the focus is way soft on this one. Either that or you used a slightly too slow shutter speed.

6. Gull2.jpg : Just a flat composition. You have two birds in the photo, neither of who's faces we can see. I would have zipped to the other side of the statue and tried to get one of the birds from the front.

Nikon or Canon (Fuji or Kodak or Minolta or Pentax) you have a ways to go. Let me know if you'd like a primer on composition and WB. I'm sure either myself or iGary would be willing to show you some tricks.

jared_kipe said:
Hey buddy, what is the point of discussing image quality of a camera and then posting "enhanced" images. Not to mention what is the point of iso 1600 on a well lit subject?? There isn't any noise because there isn't any where for there to be noise. My images were WORST case scenarios, no they weren't under exposed, they were taken in the SHADE. That would be like saying your bridge shot was underexposed because you can't see the blurry person's face. They were accurate to what I saw, and I didn't do any "touch up" work on them

You calling me a canon troll, on a mac forum, on a canon thread, is pretty ridiculous. In fact I'll have a brain aneurism if I think about any of this anymore.

So if we are going to step back and go take some pictures, I just went to the University of Washington's campus ON MY DAY OFF, to take these. I did get to walk by a wedding, but they were watching me so I quickly snapped one while I walked by. :p

Now even though these may not be published or in a gallery, please don't steal them.

And you know, I don't hear anybody complaining about the imac being a plastic computer.
 

BakedBeans

macrumors 68040
May 6, 2004
3,054
0
What's Your Favorite Posish
im sure this started about the new cannon coming out ;)

anyway - some nice images moxie (not perfect, but perfection is overrated anyway :p)

however - there is no point arguing about who is the better photographer, its pretty obvious, or it is to me - you could have multi award winning shots with a 1 megapixel beauty, it really just depends on how well you use your tool.

as for me - i would settle for a d2x or a 1ds mark II, but i personally would take the cannon.

hell i would take a 350d :)
 

Mord

macrumors G4
Aug 24, 2003
10,091
23
UK
i dont think jared submitted his photo's for you to critique is composition :rolleyes: it's to show the abilities of the camera by taking some quick shots with it not to impress you with work of art, you are avoiding the topic at hand
 

jared_kipe

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Dec 8, 2003
2,967
1
Seattle
So I assume you got written consent from the bum and all those pigeons? Why are you still arguing composition, don't you understand this is about cameras?? Gee let me thing the "professional" photographer says some of the most high-school hitting comments like "post some pictures hot shot , and we'll see who's the big man on campus". :rolleyes: Then you proceed to go, "well let me think, we were talking about camera image quality... so let me post some "enhanced" pictures of mine." Thats like me going, hey post something about quantum mechanics, then going oh gee, you're so stupid here is my doctoral thesis on quantum field effects. And by enhanced, you all but said you shot in raw, meaning you can expose it anyway you like, you really got hung up on exposure but nobody said a damn thing about your cameras underexposing. If you had the real images you would notice things that wouldn't show up if you exposed them more, like water droplets.

Further more, my images weren't supposed to be great works of art, they were keeping with the theme of what a camera can do, so buzz off. There was no white ballance problem, I walk around those buildings every day they are perfect. And if you think that you would just "zip" around that pond, then I think you'd be huffing and puffing when you got around the giant pool, and I don't have a lens anywhere near long enough to shoot from that far away. I think the blurry people isolate and frame the couple, and it gives wonderful depth of field, if only they weren't blinking.

But if we are going to comment, anybody cares,
First image, WTF is this, you take your camera into the supermarket one day and see some girls "dancing". I just don't like this image, the light is way overblown, not that it matters. The dairy is overblown, and the "dancers" are in awkward blurry positions. I don't know why anybody would like this image.

second, I think this looks bland, the sky is all one color, the ground is all one color, it kinda looks like watercolor or something.
third, now this is a truely bland stock image, all we are given to look at is some light streaks and a sign, woopty do.

the "birdman", this is nice, I like this image. Again, I don't suppose you happen to have the written consent form anywhere?

The statue, I'm not really sure about this image, something about the color composition just kinda makes me not like it, but this is probably me.

The woman in red, WOW, not sure what to say about this, the image is fine, almost like you understand the theme of posing images instead of works of art. Not sure who would like this though, or where it would be published, Overly Extravagant Elderly?

Product shots, nothing wrong with those, but as far as things that I would actually want hanging on a wall or something, not really catching subject material. Not to mention obviously shot in a studio under studio lighting.

The girl holding sign. Wow you have the gaul to tell me that my image has white balance problems?? The look at the white balloons at various distances. But again, why is this here? and you're telling me mine are bland compositions. Oh the ironies.

Nothing wrong with the nephew except that you are harping on me being unimaginative and then you do it yourself.

Model, another good shot, but OMG is she centered in your frame?!?! why wouldn't you leave her some room in front of her to give her the apearance of movement :rolleyes:

I'm tired of this.
I'm tired of people saying "powerbook G5 next tuesday"
And I'm tired of you coming into every thread about something even remotely related to photography and acting the a conceited jerk.

EDIT: You know what, the minute the wedding couple stepped into a PUBLIC venue made it so I could take the image. If they didn't want anyone to see them they should have done it in a back yard somewhere. Also you niggle about not having much detail on the statue, what about your statue picture? What am I looking at, a wall?
 

iGary

Guest
May 26, 2004
19,580
7
Randy's House
This is getting kind of silly...

The only reason that a model release would need to be obtained from the homeless man is if Moxie's image was used for advertising or commercial (non editorial) purposes.

If you took your picture of the wedding from a public sidewalk technically you're OK, but you are in a fuzzy area there, especially if you were on church grounds. That woul dbe invasion of privacy.

In any event, let's stop with the foolishness. Fred Miranda is a great place to share images and ask questions as is DPREVIEW - I think those would be much better places to discuss this, yeah?
 

jared_kipe

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Dec 8, 2003
2,967
1
Seattle
iGary said:
This is getting kind of silly...

The only reason that a model release would need to be obtained from the homeless man is if Moxie's image was used for advertising or commercial (non editorial) purposes.

If you took your picture of the wedding from a public sidewalk technically you're OK, but you are in a fuzzy area there, especially if you were on church grounds. That woul dbe invasion of privacy.

In any event, let's stop with the foolishness. Fred Miranda is a great place to share images and ask questions as is DPREVIEW - I think those would be much better places to discuss this, yeah?

Yes thankyou, maybe I'm not the only one who sees the sillyness in all this. Oh and I was at the University of Washington campus, as far as I know that was an Agricultural Sciences building, not a church. Oh and it wasn't technically a wedding, it was a picture shoot, I assume they are already married and just taking wedding photos.
 

Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
jared_kipe said:
So I assume you got written consent from the bum and all those pigeons? Why are you still arguing composition, don't you understand this is about cameras?? Gee let me thing the "professional" photographer says some of the most high-school hitting comments like "post some pictures hot shot , and we'll see who's the big man on campus". :rolleyes: Then you proceed to go, "well let me think, we were talking about camera image quality... so let me post some "enhanced" pictures of mine." Thats like me going, hey post something about quantum mechanics, then going oh gee, you're so stupid here is my doctoral thesis on quantum field effects. And by enhanced, you all but said you shot in raw, meaning you can expose it anyway you like, you really got hung up on exposure but nobody said a damn thing about your cameras underexposing. If you had the real images you would notice things that wouldn't show up if you exposed them more, like water droplets.

You're obviously foolish. If I were to ask, i'm sure iGary did some post-processing to his photos. 99.9% of the photos out there are post-processed. It's about real world results. I wouldn't get hired if I gave my clients images out of the camera, be them Canon Images or Nikon Images. You're foolish. I just don't know how to respond to you to get it through your head. Ah well.

jared_kipe said:
Further more, my images weren't supposed to be great works of art, they were keeping with the theme of what a camera can do, so buzz off. There was no white ballance problem, I walk around those buildings every day they are perfect. And if you think that you would just "zip" around that pond, then I think you'd be huffing and puffing when you got around the giant pool, and I don't have a lens anywhere near long enough to shoot from that far away. I think the blurry people isolate and frame the couple, and it gives wonderful depth of field, if only they weren't blinking.

So if you want to show off what your camera can do, take some technically solid images like iGary's. Your images don't show off the camera because a) they're technically bad and b) they're compositionally/artistically bad. I'm sure more people are gonna jump into the pool of Canon or Nikon if the images ROCK.

jared_kipe said:
But if we are going to comment, anybody cares,
First image, WTF is this, you take your camera into the supermarket one day and see some girls "dancing". I just don't like this image, the light is way overblown, not that it matters. The dairy is overblown, and the "dancers" are in awkward blurry positions. I don't know why anybody would like this image.

second, I think this looks bland, the sky is all one color, the ground is all one color, it kinda looks like watercolor or something.
third, now this is a truely bland stock image, all we are given to look at is some light streaks and a sign, woopty do.

the "birdman", this is nice, I like this image. Again, I don't suppose you happen to have the written consent form anywhere?

The statue, I'm not really sure about this image, something about the color composition just kinda makes me not like it, but this is probably me.

The woman in red, WOW, not sure what to say about this, the image is fine, almost like you understand the theme of posing images instead of works of art. Not sure who would like this though, or where it would be published, Overly Extravagant Elderly?

Product shots, nothing wrong with those, but as far as things that I would actually want hanging on a wall or something, not really catching subject material. Not to mention obviously shot in a studio under studio lighting.

The girl holding sign. Wow you have the gaul to tell me that my image has white balance problems?? The look at the white balloons at various distances. But again, why is this here? and you're telling me mine are bland compositions. Oh the ironies.

Nothing wrong with the nephew except that you are harping on me being unimaginative and then you do it yourself.

Model, another good shot, but OMG is she centered in your frame?!?! why wouldn't you leave her some room in front of her to give her the apearance of movement :rolleyes:

I'm tired of this.
I'm tired of people saying "powerbook G5 next tuesday"
And I'm tired of you coming into every thread about something even remotely related to photography and acting the a conceited jerk.

Man. You're just either jealous or interested in a pissing contest, which is lame either way. Your comments are pretty baseless, everyone who either has a print or has published my images is more than happy. You obviously don't know photography or how to critque. You can say your rebel rocks, which it very well might, but you're not qualified to comment much past there, as your lack of knowledge has illustrated.

You should really jump over to the D100/D1/D2 threads on dpreview.com.

I'm sure they'd love having another troll to deal with.
 

Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
jared_kipe said:
Yes thankyou, maybe I'm not the only one who sees the sillyness in all this. Oh and I was at the University of Washington campus, as far as I know that was an Agricultural Sciences building, not a church. Oh and it wasn't technically a wedding, it was a picture shoot, I assume they are already married and just taking wedding photos.

Eh. You really shouldn't take pics of stuff like that, regardless of whether it was a church or not. I mean, you can, but it's leaning you into the category of papparazzi! And if you don't have a long enough lens..... haha.

BTW, The pigeon man said it was cool to take some shots. I always try to get "approval" from people even if it's me looking at them and my camera and them nodding ok, which pigeon man definitely did. He even liked seeing the photos. It made his day. ;)
 

Mord

macrumors G4
Aug 24, 2003
10,091
23
UK
this is about comparing the quality of the cameras not about comparing ow good you are at patching your pictures to look great, the whole point of a good camera is to take some of the photoshop workload off your back and onto the camera, i'm not a photographer an i can see that, your obiously in need of common sense

if anyone is the flamer here it's moxie not jared, you came into his thread and acted like a nikon troll, jared is not a professional and for you to strut into the thread post some pictures and expect us to treat your word as gospel it's not going to happen, this is not a thread about who's the better photographer it's about the 350D.

Moxiemike said:
Are you serious? The D70 trounced both the Drebel and the 10d, and in a lot of ways the 20d. Faster flash sync, killer buffer, fast like a bunny AF, better metering. Etc.

That said, there's supposedly an 8-10mp D200 on the way with f6 build that will demolish the 20d, even if it's priced at $2000. That and there's a D70s on the way, with 6mp but doing 5fps.

And the D2x can fend off both the 1dmkII and the 1dsmkII.

lastly, the D70 IS NOT built from the D100. Quit spreading misinformation! haha. The d70 is a completely new design that has more in common with the D2h than the D100!

Sounds to me like you're probably more interested in MP than taking pics.... sorry to say.

Let's also not forget that a lot of reports are going around about bad back focusing in the 20d, as well as a REAL fps shooting time of 4.23 FPS. That's not the 5 that's advertised. So Canon's not really 100% at this point. ;)

m

your first post of the thread insulting jared as someone that is just interested in MP, then you go on to talk about how the D70 is so great compared to everything this is obnoxious trolling :rolleyes:.

Sounds to me like you're probably more interested in MP than taking pics.... sorry to say.

When you get in the real world

You sound like a true canon troll

You're obviously not really that "in the know" about digital photography. Or photography in general

You're foolish

I just don't know how to respond to you to get it through your head. Ah well.

You obviously don't know photography

please don't resort to personal insult, it makes you look like an idiot.
 

iGary

Guest
May 26, 2004
19,580
7
Randy's House
Of course I post process. Almost every DSLR out there (especially Canons) can use a little USM in PS.

Guess what happens inside your Rebel when you don't shoot in RAW?

It post-processes for you. Check you parameters menus.

Guess what happens when people take their film in to have it developed?

The machine post processes their film.

Whether a photographer post processes or not has nothing to do with talent, although a bad image is a bad image.

If every shot was a winner, we wouldn't need 2GB CF cards.

It is a well-known fact that Canons are not the sharpest lot of the bunch right out of the camera. Even a pro with an 8,000.00 1DS will tell you that.

Canons have their quirks, Nikons have theirs, too. But the 350D is by no means going to put a nail in Nikon's coffin. Glad they are offering it in black, though. the silver is hideous and screams amateur.
 

Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
Hector said:
this is about comparing the quality of the cameras not about comparing ow good you are at patching your pictures to look great, the whole point of a good camera is to take some of the photoshop workload off your back and onto the camera, i'm not a photographer an i can see that, your obiously in need of common sense

Hah. You're obviously SO familiar with my workflow, right? I take photos, in raw, bring them to PS, correct for less than a 1/3± stop of exposure compensation, add in some contrast, and a lil' saturation and it's off to the races. You people hear "photoshop" and assume that i took photos of the trees, and the signs, and the bricks and the statues and put them all together. Haha. Sorry. You're WAY off. The idea of a camera is a capturing device. You capture to the best of the boxes ability (i.e. it's dynamic range) and spend a lil' time in the darkroom to adjust some of the things in the photo. You're obviously the one who lacks common sense if you think a camera can magically capture perfect images eveytime. It can't. No cam on the market in the DSLR range is perfect. All require some retouch work. Your holy dpreview.com threads can tell you that. TONS of posts on post-processing and workflow methods. Christ, Thom Hogan makes a mint selling books on this and Ron Reznick does as well, teaching classes to Nikon AND Canon shooters.
 

Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
iGary said:
Canons have their quirks, Nikons have theirs, too. But the 350D is by no means going to put a nail in Nikon's coffin. Glad they are offering it in black, though. the silver is hideous and screams amateur.

Yea. I had a friend who bought a D70 solely because the body was black. He came up to me and said "Dude, I got a pro camera like yours. I almost bought the amateur rebel thing"

I almost cried with laughter. But he loves his under-exposing D70 alot so all is good. Just like jared loving his do everything for him rebel. A matter of taste. ;)
 

Mord

macrumors G4
Aug 24, 2003
10,091
23
UK
Moxiemike said:
You people hear "photoshop" and assume that i took photos of the trees, and the signs, and the bricks and the statues and put them all together. Haha. Sorry. You're WAY off.

I may not be a photographer but I'm not retarded, i never implied you paste your work together i just think we should see the raw images the cameras output to compare how well they come out with no work if you payed any attention in 9th grade science you would know what a fair test is :rolleyes:.
 

Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
Hector said:
I may not be a photographer but I'm not retarded, i never implied you paste your work together i just think we should see the raw images the cameras output to compare how well they come out with no work if you payed any attention in 9th grade science you would know what a fair test is :rolleyes:.

People generally resort to insults when they're wrong. Even the dpreview.com folks run their images through PS and post-process them. If we're talking fair comparison, maybe kipey could take some shots in raw and post-process 'em.

That said, imagine a ±1/3 stop, which is not very much at all, and you have what my images looked like before PS. A tiny bit darker or brighter. ;)
 

Mord

macrumors G4
Aug 24, 2003
10,091
23
UK
Moxiemike said:
People generally resort to insults when they're wrong. Even the dpreview.com folks run their images through PS and post-process them. If we're talking fair comparison, maybe kipey could take some shots in raw and post-process 'em.

That said, imagine a ±1/3 stop, which is not very much at all, and you have what my images looked like before PS. A tiny bit darker or brighter. ;)

three words: you can talk :rolleyes:

ps: look at my post before last i added to it while you were posting ;)
 

absolut_mac

macrumors 6502a
Oct 30, 2003
934
0
Dallas, Texas
Moxiemike said:
Gary. How's this D2h evening exposure from a few nights ago? Gimme your thoughts.

I know that you didn't ask me, but that shot is really fantastic, just about as perfect as a night shot can be.

The other one of yours that I like is young hockey player. Bright, vivid colors, sharp and an interesting shot to boot too.

While I didn't care for all of your shots, it was mostly just personal taste, not anything particularly wrong with the pics themselves.

Not everyone is brave enough to post their pics on an open forum for public criticism, me included, but I'm only too happy to comment if anyone asks for it ;)
 

Moxiemike

macrumors 68020
Jan 1, 2002
2,437
0
Pittsburgh, PA
Hector said:
three words: you can talk :rolleyes:

ps: look at my post before last i added to it while you were posting ;)

Heh. More fact that insult. Jared kinda showed us all how little he knows about photography and how much he knows about measurebating. :)

For him to come in and make stupidly grandious declarations like "the rebel is the nail in Nikon's coffin" shows who the troll really is.

And then he backed up this GREAT knowledge by.... oh. he didnt back it up!

;)
 

jared_kipe

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Dec 8, 2003
2,967
1
Seattle
Yeah we got it, you're like the energizer bunny, you just don't know when to quit. So then you are thinking that say... dpreview.com's reviews are post processed? I'd doubt it, because then whats the point of having samples from the camera.
 
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