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Class Action Lawsuit Accuses Apple of Crippling iPhone 4s With iOS 9 Update

I7guy said:
A youtube video probably isn't admissible as evidence in court or is not going to be any basis for the merit of the lawsuit. If it was apple would have lost the last go-around.

It seems to me you WANT Apple to lose because you want to use the courts to control corporate policy, when in fact as a consumer the proper thing is to vote with your wallet. Being an aggrieved consumer is also not the basis for a successful lawsuit.
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There is no need for a Youtube video.Its VERY easy to install iOS 6 on a iPhone 4S using Odysseus OTA and factually measure the numbers and compare it with iOS 9 and we all know how that will turn out.A night and day difference to be precise

Yeah I want Apple to lose because they have screwed the A5 chipset owners completely.The world's richest company does not need my sympathy
 
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I7guy said:
Not the 4s, but ios 9 definitely improved things on my ipad 2 over ios 8. Benchmarks actually showed IOS 9 is faster than IOS 8, this has all been hashed over and over again. As of now apples policy is no downgrade. Maybe they will lose the lawsuit and that will change.
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In the links you keep posting of iOS 9 being faster,iOS 8 won 5 out of 7 times
 
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Radon87000 said:
There is no need for a Youtube video.Its VERY easy to install iOS 6 on a iPhone 4S using Odysseus OTA and factually measure the numbers and compare it with iOS 9 and we all know how that will turn out.A night and day difference to be precise

Yeah I want Apple to lose because they have screwed the A5 chipset owners completely.The world's richest company does not need my sympathy
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This is out of your hands and out of my hands. The courts will decide this. (But I'll be surprised if the suit is thrown out of court)
 
I keep hearing how America is sue happy. I totally disagree in this instance because as a customer what other recourse does a customer have against a billion dollar company? Apple should not be allowed to destroy someones property. While they might own the OS, the devices we buy belong to the consumers who purchased them. It should not be legal for any company to destroy anyones property.

Imagine taking your car into the manufacturer after its bought and paid for, and having their mechanic do his magic fixes on your car. Now instead of running as fast as it used to it sputters down the road, fails to start, and now it only gets half the gas milage. That would be unacceptable however the tech industry gets away with offenses that are every bit as offensive. They don't want to be held accountable for their mistakes, just read the TOS.
 
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Radon87000 said:
Factual benchmark numbers before and after prove the significant slowdown.Its done on purpose.My gran cant tell the difference between 60fps and 30 fps.Those are not the people I am talking about.

It seems to me you WANT the lawsuit to be tossed and are sympathetic more towards a multi billion dollar corporation for whom profit is the sole criteria than the aggrieved consumers
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This does not prove that it is on purpose..
 
peterdevries said:
This does not prove that it is on purpose..
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Correct. In fact this would be very hard to prove. But Apple have not helped themselves by continuously doing this. Its only natural people are beginning to think it is deliberate. I've suspected it for a long time now.
 
roadbloc said:
Correct. In fact this would be very hard to prove. But Apple have not helped themselves by continuously doing this. Its only natural people are beginning to think it is deliberate. I've suspected it for a long time now.
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Yep. In my opinion Apple should tone down the marketing rhetoric on upgrades making phones faster and inform users better of the consequences of installing heavier new OS-es on older devices. Than all of this can be avoided.

Alternatively they can just provide OS upgrades only to phones that are one or two generations older, but then the same people whose phones are now slow, will be companining about being left out (and likely start a class action law suit).
 
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I don't see how they have a case. A crappy operating system doesn't equal false advertising or deceptive business practices.
 
Ladybug said:
I keep hearing how America is sue happy. I totally disagree in this instance because as a customer what other recourse does a customer have against a billion dollar company? Apple should not be allowed to destroy someones property. While they might own the OS, the devices we buy belong to the consumers who purchased them. It should not be legal for any company to destroy anyones property.

Imagine taking your car into the manufacturer after its bought and paid for, and having their mechanic do his magic fixes on your car. Now instead of running as fast as it used to it sputters down the road, fails to start, and now it only gets half the gas milage. That would be unacceptable however the tech industry gets away with offenses that are every bit as offensive. They don't want to be held accountable for their mistakes, just read the TOS.
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The recourse is to buy from somebody else. The only reason they get away with it is because nobody cares about the TOS, if they even read it.
 
peterdevries said:
Yep. In my opinion Apple should tone down the marketing rhetoric on upgrades making phones faster and inform users better of the consequences of installing heavier new OS-es on older devices. Than all of this can be avoided.

Alternatively they can just provide OS upgrades only to phones that are one or two generations older, but then the same people whose phones are now slow, will be companining about being left out (and likely start a class action law suit).
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Updating phones is a no win scenario.
 
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peterdevries said:
Yep. In my opinion Apple should tone down the marketing rhetoric on upgrades making phones faster and inform users better of the consequences of installing heavier new OS-es on older devices. Than all of this can be avoided.

Alternatively they can just provide OS upgrades only to phones that are one or two generations older, but then the same people whose phones are now slow, will be companining about being left out (and likely start a class action law suit).
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Michael Goff said:
Updating phones is a no win scenario.
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Very simple to solve this problem.Include a notification before installing the upgrade that there will be a performance decrease on upgrading to the latest iOS and that there is no way to downgrade OR give users the option to downgrade any time.

Windows also does a similar thing.Windows 7 included a notification which automatically disabled Aero on less capable hardware
 
I7guy said:
No. Maybe we should go back and repost some of the performance benchmarks as it seems to be at the very essence of the matter of performance.
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Yup.Post your benchmark of iOS 9 being faster than iOS 8.I'll wait
 
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peterdevries said:
Yep. In my opinion Apple should tone down the marketing rhetoric on upgrades making phones faster and inform users better of the consequences of installing heavier new OS-es on older devices. Than all of this can be avoided.

Alternatively they can just provide OS upgrades only to phones that are one or two generations older, but then the same people whose phones are now slow, will be companining about being left out (and likely start a class action law suit).
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The solution is simple. But it requires Apple and the Apple community to stop viewing fragmentation as a bad thing. It can be, but controlled correctly, fragmentation empowers the user with flexibility.

Two things. Allow downgrading all the way back down to the model's original firmware. Support iOS versions for longer instead of ditching them immediately.
 
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Radon87000 said:
Very simple to solve this problem.Include a notification before installing the upgrade that there will be a performance decrease on upgrading to the latest iOS and that there is no way to downgrade OR give users the option to downgrade any time.

Windows also does a similar thing.Windows 7 included a notification which automatically disabled Aero on less capable hardware
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Except the performance difference is often barely noticeable and not on every device. So you're scaring people out of updating for either something that might not happen or .2 seconds slower while being up to date with security and built in apps.
 
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Michael Goff said:
Except the performance difference is often barely noticeable and not on every device. So you're scaring people out of updating for either something that might not happen or .2 seconds slower while being up to date with security and built in apps.
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Exactly, many people seem to think that there is some kind of golden solution where older hardware runs faster with a new OS and all the features of current flagship phones. It is not possible. Indeed a no-win situation.

What Apple could do though is improve the information around this, but that will not do anything to stop people from complaining anyway and filing class action lawsuits.
 
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peterdevries said:
Exactly, many people seem to think that there is some kind of golden solution where older hardware runs faster with a new OS and all the features of current flagship phones. It is not possible. Indeed a no-win situation.

What Apple could do though is improve the information around this, but that will not do anything to stop people from complaining anyway and filing class action lawsuits.
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To be honest, I would rather they de-couple security and apps updates from giant system updates, or even go to a longer cycle. But this is the reality we live in. They should maybe say that it might negatively impact performance. That would give people an idea, but most would still go through with it.
 
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I'm all AGAINST frivolous legal actions (one of American society's darkest sides in my opinion), and I do NOT believe Apple is intentionally crippling older devices.

That being said... I totally see the plaintiff's point.

My girlfriend has an iPhone 4 which, while old, was still rock'n'rolling like a champ. One merry day, she got the screen notification of a new iOS version being available, so she installed it. As a result, the phone became, overnight, pretty much useless due to the unbearable lag.

Let's review the facts:

- Did anyone force her to install the update? No.
- Was she warned that performance would significantly drop? No.
- Could have she known, before installing, that her iPhone 4 was to become almost useless? No.
- Can she go back to the previous iOS version? No.
- Therefore? therefore she needs to spend dear dollars in a new iPhone she wasn't intending to buy for the time being.

Listen, Apple: if you want to stop law suits like this, either you allow users to go back to a previous version (recommended!), or you display a fat red-font disclaimer warning that older models might suffer a significant performance drop.
 
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Michael Goff said:
Except the performance difference is often barely noticeable and not on every device. So you're scaring people out of updating for either something that might not happen or .2 seconds slower while being up to date with security and built in apps.
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As you see above there is a performance drop of 0.2 to 3 seconds from just one iOS update so if we compare it with when the device released there will be huge lag on the Devices.if it was 1 second and it became 1.4 than unnoticeable but after 2 updates that same launch time is 4 seconds which has what's become of the iPhone 4S.

This is what the law suit claims and I agree.Apple must have noticed this in internal testing yet they went ahead without warning users what to expect which is wrong.iOS 5 to 6 and 7 doesn't need a notification but past that where it's approaching unstable territory a notification is needed so the user knows in advance what to expect instead of being stranded
 
Radon87000 said:
As you see above there is a performance drop of 0.2 to 3 seconds from just one iOS update so if we compare it with when the device released there will be huge lag on the Devices.if it was 1 second and it became 1.4 than unnoticeable but after 2 updates that same launch time is 4 seconds which has what's become of the iPhone 4S
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I'm going to throw this out there:
Apple screwed up by even updating the 4S this much. They should have stopped at iOS 7.
 
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From what I've seen, iOS updates on old phones have been hit-and-miss. I've never had a problem personally, but people I know have. Seems like the fair policy would be to allow iOS downgrades for those who do update and really want to downgrade (and provide plenty of warnings telling them why downgrading is so bad for security). It's ridiculous that there is a software action, updating iOS, that you can perform on your phone and can't undo! My guess is they do it so people won't downgrade immediately just because of some new thing they're not used to.

Michael Goff said:
Except the performance difference is often barely noticeable and not on every device. So you're scaring people out of updating for either something that might not happen or .2 seconds slower while being up to date with security and built in apps.
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Yeah, exactly. Apple should never recommend in any way against updating. Maybe allow people to downgrade, or fix the updates so they don't cause problems. The latter won't happen as long as Apple is making updates on a yearly schedule.
 
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