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Apple could have got in front of ALL OF this both domestically and abroad. But their selfishness tripped them up.

This is the heart of it. Apple essentially won the case with Epic, but you wouldn't know it because they're going to argue this single point to their own detriment until they give away the entire farm, just as they did with the Look-And-Feel lawsuits way back when, just as they did with the eBook lawsuit. Out of control hubris and money-blinders with zero conception of practical solutions. Apple could still have had it all, now they will end up with none.
 
No. Apple made the rules of their own platform and one complained.
They are beholden to market forces, the consequences of their decisions and the laws of the countries they operate in. Their rules need to align across two critical vectors of those 3 "first principles" and they need to choose a path that doesn't run afoul of either of those two, as it impacts the third. Apple isn't some sovereign state it's a company
 
I mean, if that's not what you meant then your comments make even less sense.
Seems pretty clear to me. Apple is forced by law to do a thing because a developer felt like they didn't have a choice and had to develop for iOS. That shouldn't happen. Developer should just leave iOS and the court wouldn't even bother with Apple. Makes perfect sense to me.

If you can't understand that, then well, have a nice day.
 
Imagine still advocating for typing in your credit card numbers into unknown vendors just so that greedy Epic games can get the extra 30%
Epic games is an unknown vendor? If people are so worried about transacting directly with an app developer why are these apps even on the store? They’re not shady if Apple gets it’s 30% cut but suddenly become shady if Apple is not in the picture?
 
Epic can choose not to develop for iOS. Choice is a wonderful thing.
So don't develop for iOS if handling payments yourself matters to you that much.
The best solution is to make iOS like macOS. Developers can create apps for iOS and macOS if they want to or not.

If developers choose to make iOS or macOS apps, they can then decide to either use Apple's infrastructure and other services to distribute them or they can do it all on their own.

That's real choice.
 
Seems pretty clear to me. Apple is forced by law to do a thing because a developer felt like they didn't have a choice and had to develop for iOS. That shouldn't happen. Developer should just leave iOS and the court wouldn't even bother with Apple. Makes perfect sense to me.

If you can't understand that, then well, have a nice day.
So you're saying the judge was wrong? That either they don't know the law or they're corrupt in some way? Because if not, Epic is fully within their rights to do what they're doing. You might not be happy about it, but thankfully the law doesn't live and die by the vibes of a random dude on the internet.

Either you believe you understand the law better than a federal judge or you believe Apple should be above the laws of the countries they operate in. So which is it?
 
Also, let's take Uber as example.

Apple provides them access to the App Store access and (afaik) their push notification service. And they're perfectly ok with charging only the yearly developer membership. And with allowing Uber to ask for credit card details in-app, conducting in-app transactions without Apple's involvement or commission.
Yes, so somehow when it’s a physical good we’re discussing (and I have my quibbles about considering Uber to be a physical good; you’re buying a ride in a car, not the car itself) there are no security or privacy issues and you’re not using Apple’s IP but if it’s a digital good then there are and you are and Apple needs to be the one handling payment? Except if you’re a big enough brand or direct Apple competitor - then you get carved out and don’t have to use Apple and thus don’t have to pay them a commission. All of this seems incredibly arbitrary or Apple making it up as they go along.
 
Amazon, Starbucks, Walmart, McDonald's, Uber, Netflix, et al all put their apps on Apple's App Store and use Apple's infrastructure for $99/yr. No complaints from Apple.
If Apple took 30% from their physical goods and services (which can't easily be duplicated), none of those companies would develop a native app.

If Apple took 30% from digital goods (which can be infinitely duplicated), there would still be companies developing native apps.
 
All of this seems incredibly arbitrary or Apple making it up as they go along.
I suppose it’s not entirely arbitrary.
  • They knew that they’d have to have the most popular media content providers, the most popular ebook and streaming services (Kindle, Spotify, Netflix on their platform).
  • They knew that consumers expected to be unable to use their books/subscriptions bought elsewhere with their iOS apps; they wouldn’t accept paying another, dedicated subscription or purchase for their iOS device.
  • They knew that a few companies do have at least some leverage against Apple (by being “present” on the platform with an app of their own or not)
That’s why they made that exception for “reader” apps.
Cause they’d sell much fewer iPhones otherwise.
 
This was under the old hush-hush rule where you could offer your services elsewhere but you couldn’t speak of it within your app.

The thing that has Apple worried is that developers will choose to offer their services only thru third party stores and forget about IAP all together.
Netflix, Spotify and Amazon (Kindle) don’t offer IAP now. It was Apple’s decision to create the ‘reader’ app category which allowed some apps to be on the store without offering IAP. I remember the Hey email app tried to do this and Apple wouldn’t let the app in the store unless it had some basic functionality that didn’t require a subscription. Of course Apple doesn’t need Hey; it needs Netflix, Spotify and Kindle.
 
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