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Court Rules Police Can Force Users to Unlock iPhones With Fingerprints, But Not Passcodes

Chatter said:
WTH? So my personal fingerprint is under state control (and can be used against me) but my personal memory of a passcode isn't. :rolleyes:

Wonder what category retina scans fall under. :D
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Basically anything that can be forcibly taken from you is fair game. So retina is fair game like fingers. Your knowledge not yet, only lie detector.
 
marine0816 said:
America is the best place for murderes and pedophiles. We hold to our absolute bogus liberties to aide criminals. Everyone should come to America and start conmitting terrible crimes because the ACLU will protect a murderes rights for free
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The ACLU will certainly protect a murderers rights, and I support this. Theyll still be in jail, but they'll have their rights.
 
How the hell would this not be self-incriminating?

You are under no obligation to talk to the police. None. Zero. Nada.

You want to know my opinion? Ask my lawyer. You'll break all my fingers, but I still aint putting in any print.
 
Do they want your fingerprint or for you to put your finger on the home button? I'm inferring the home button from all the comments here but didnt gather that from just reading the first article.
 
jrswizzle said:
Ha, no no that makes way too much sense. Let's figure out a way to break the law and get away with it.
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do you self-professed goody-goodies have any idea how many people are arrested for no reason? when cops and feds stop being criminals, then they can start accessing my phone merely because i was in the wrong place at the wrong time. i've been arrested outside a club for smoking a cigarette after some shady activity had been going on. i was put in protective custody for the night another time and i wasn't even told what it was i had been in danger of. i estimated it was because i was friends with a few 'wrong people' and they just wanted me in the state's system. not all police logs describe criminals. they have a habit of containing a lot of police boredom/righteousness and meeting quotas as well.
 
This is a big concern. Primarily because with apps such as 1password which can also be unlocked by fingerprint. That would give aot of info.
 
Why is everybody here so paranoid and hate the police? Laws are setup to let criminals go before an innocent person is convicted. When your daughter is kidnapped and the only information on where she might be is locked in someones phone, youll be glad these exceptions exist...
 
unplugme71 said:
How is repeating digits more helpful other than to the person attempting to access your device?
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Looking at the smudges on the screen can help determine the password; however, if there are repeated numbers, you can't be sure how many repetitions there are (if any), and where the repetition is. It makes the task of unlocking a phone substantially harder.

http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2011/01/27/game-theory-and-probability-of-iphone-passwords/

Also, since you're not using a 4-digit passcode, there isn't even a way to know how many digits total there are.

For example, if you're passcode is 123456, you'd see all 6 of those digits smudged on the screen. But, if your code is 123345 you'd only see five smudged digits. You might see the overlap on the 3, but there's no way to know where the 3 is duplicated, if at all..

Anyways, the link above explains, but, in general, duplicated numbers are a good thing.
 
Technarchy said:
How the hell would this not be self-incriminating?

You are under no obligation to talk to the police. None. Zero. Nada.

You want to know my opinion? Ask my lawyer. You'll break all my fingers, but I still aint putting in any print.
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This just demonstrates the total ignorance people have about the law and criminal procedure. YOU DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO OBSRUCT THE GATHERING OF EVIDENCE. You have a right to not testify against yourself. A fingerprint is not testimony. You do not have the right to refuse to hand over the key to your lockbox at the bank.

What we're talking about here is what the police can do AFTER they have obtained a search warrant supported by probable cause. I fully support the power of the police to conduct a criminal investigation after obtaining approval from an objective magistrate. I'm shocked at how many people apparently don't.
 
So we need a print combo app that requires a certain combination of fingers to unlock. The combination would result in a specific sequence that results in the same function as a passcode.
 
teslo said:
do you self-professed goody-goodies have any idea how many people are arrested for no reason? when cops and feds stop being criminals, then they can start accessing my phone merely because i was in the wrong place at the wrong time. i've been arrested outside a club for smoking a cigarette after some shady activity had been going on. i was put in protective custody for the night another time and i wasn't even told what it was i had been in danger of. i estimated it was because i was friends with a few 'wrong people' and they just wanted me in the state's system. not all police logs describe criminals. they have a habit of containing a lot of police boredom/righteousness and meeting quotas as well.
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This decision doesn't change what the police have a right to access, it only opens up a technical possibility to access information the police have a legal right to. Before the police can use your fingerprint to access the phone, they have to get approval from an unbiased magistrate and show that not only is there probable cause that you have committed a crime, but that there is likely evidence of that crime on your phone. Let's check our collective outrage, people.
 
DipDog3 said:
I can see a cop taking your iPhone after arresting you & forcefully unlocking your iPhone with TouchID as you are handcuffed on the hood of the patrol car. They will just claim they found it unlocked (if forcing you to unlock it was illegal).
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Law & Order episode in 5.4.3.2.1...
 
WolfSnap said:
Looking at the smudges on the screen can help determine the password; however, if there are repeated numbers, you can't be sure how many repetitions there are (if any), and where the repetition is. It makes the task of unlocking a phone substantially harder.

http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2011/01/27/game-theory-and-probability-of-iphone-passwords/

Also, since you're not using a 4-digit passcode, there isn't even a way to know how many digits total there are.

For example, if you're passcode is 123456, you'd see all 6 of those digits smudged on the screen. But, if your code is 123345 you'd only see five smudged digits. You might see the overlap on the 3, but there's no way to know where the 3 is duplicated, if at all..
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Yes the is,,, because users don't type the same exact place on their finger, nor may they press it in the same way.. (aka their smudge may be slightly off from the former)

Regardless. if a receipie of tracking someone..... If users only used logic and wiped their phone afterwards, they wouldn't leave smudges in the first place, and that would be impossible to get in.


This is why before i let the police or anyone have my phone, i would always wipe it clean first.

If the police want my phone i'm happy to give it to them, but they need to access it themselves. :) There is no "quick fix"
 
flatfoot99 said:
Why is everybody here so paranoid and hate the police? Laws are setup to let criminals go before an innocent person is convicted.
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The problem is that technically you might actually be guilty of something, even if you don't know it:

Even the most intelligent and informed citizen (including lawyers and judges, for that matter) cannot predict with any reasonable assurance whether a wide range of seemingly ordinary activities might be regarded by federal prosecutors as felonies.
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So the advice is better to be paranoid than sorry.

flatfoot99 said:
When your daughter is kidnapped and the only information on where she might be is locked in someones phone, youll be glad these exceptions exist...
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Exceptions to fundamental rights are very dangerous since they tend to pile up and never get repealed, eroding the rights further and further. It start a slippery slope towards more and more intrusive exceptions.

The trouble with fighting for human freedom is that one spends most of one's time defending scoundrels. For it is against scoundrels that oppressive laws are first aimed, and oppression must be stopped at the beginning if it is to be stopped at all. (H. L. Mencken)
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farewelwilliams said:
*attempts 10 times with an unregistered finger*
*device auto-wipes*
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The question is whether the police will let you use other fingers than the right thumb or index finger (or their left equivalents for lefties). I'd say the probability that either one of those fingers is registers is above 95%.
 
Use an uncommon finger

I'm probably going to just use my pinky finger as the real unlock finger from now on.

I like the idea of being able to register a "distress finger". Use it 3 times and *poof*, wiped, geotagged, and locked.
 
flash84x said:
So if you get arrested, turn off your phone. It requires a passcode after a reboot.
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And what if you're protesting something, breaking no laws, and get arrested because protesting is now often classified as terrorism, and you have been trying to record the events of illegal arrests and police brutality, and your phone is swiped from you by an enraged cop with control issues? Getting arrested doesn't usually happen in some polite and calm way that allows you any agency at all. You get grabbed and cuffed.

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deannnnn said:
Easy: don't break the law.
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Obviously you've never been harassed by cops with behavioral issues.
 
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