CVS Launches Barcode-Based 'CVS Pay' in Lieu of Apple Pay

[rjohnstone]

Yes. This is why they offer loyalty programs. It doesn't mean that they can simply buy your personally identifying information from the banks, as you insinuated.
Speak for yourself. I avoid most loyalty programs like the plague, and I certainly don't feel a need to be "noticed" by a merchant (or flooded with their stupid ads).
You're contradicting yourself. Above you wrote this:

"No, not directly, but if you think about it a second, you'd realize that the lack of identification during a purchase means that the stores now have to pay the banks to get access to that information.

Well, for one I always opt out, and I live in a state that has strict limitations when it comes to sharing information with non-affiliates. And second, I really doubt that simply tunneling the personally identifiable information through some other company absolves them of the privacy regulations.
Yes, but that's not what you were talking about above.
If that is the case the banks obviously made a bad deal. Am I supposed to feel sorry for them?

Banks, Credit Card companies and card processors never sell PII data to anyone. They sell usage metrics.
Merchants never get PII info unless they collect it directly themselves.
Banks and card issuers will provide non-identifying usage stats to merchants. Purchases broken down by age bracket, income level, etc.
They will never sell or provide PII data back to a merchant or vendor... ever. That is their bread and butter and also happens to be highly regulated information.

 

[jwatk71]

I used Apple Pay at CVS today. Worked fine.

 

[tmiw]

I used Apple Pay at CVS today. Worked fine.

AmEx or another card?

 

[CrystalQuest76]

I'm amazed that we use signatures for verification. I'm amazed we hand our credit cards to strangers with the number right on the card when paying for dinner at a restaurant. I'm amazed we give strangers credit card numbers over the phone.
The way we pay with credit cards needs to change.

You are absolutely correct. Besides the technology needing to change, all of the managers and employees will need to be trained to the new process that you develop.

 

[tasset]

AmEx or another card?

I just gave it a whirl with Amex. After having disabled for over a year looks like its back on in a VERY wimperingly quiet way. Probably so they can enjoy liability shift protections without letting too many customers know they offer the secure, private option.
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Stores want to cater to their customers. The easier they make it for you to find what you want in the store, means more money for them, and greater convenience for you.

Part of that effort is building a profile (age, address, etc) on customers, so they can guess what kind of products you'd like most in the future, and where to place them. It also allows them to send you customized ads that induce you to buy.

Note that in the old days when people shopped nearby, this same profiling was done by the store proprietor, who knew you and your family very well. Today's mobile buyers and temp employees makes this much harder to happen.

(This whole recent purchase privacy fad is silly. Most of us belong to store and card award programs precisely because we want custom deals. More importantly, we appreciate being noticed and catered to. That's why we go to the same stores and the same restaurants. When I go into my car dealer, I expect to get a better deal because they know me. When I go into my favorite eatery, it's nice to hear "Hi Mr. Darling! We'll give you your favorite seat and food!" When I go to the pharmacy, I like that the pharmacist makes special exceptions for our family and speeds things up. Only kids and crooks want to be anonymous, IMO.)

That is a perspective you are cenrtainly entitled to and suppose you may indulge in reminiscing the old days of growing up in Mayberry and Pete the mailman knows you. But others are certainly entitled to not be profiled by retailers who have no interest in personally "knowing you" or giving you special treatment but instead encourage zombie consumerism. As an employee for a large enterprise I see every day the efforts to dehumanize consumers and squeeze an extra few nickels towards that quarterly report.
My doctor knows me. My mechanic and accountant know me. I have no focks to give if Joe Willy the night supervisor at Walmart or Janelle the cashier at my local drug store know my name though.

 

[revurb]

I just gave it a whirl with Amex. After having disabled for over a year looks like its back on in a VERY wimperingly quiet way. Probably so they can enjoy liability shift protections without letting too many customers know they offer the secure, private option.

Yes/no. I work at CVS and at one of the pilot stores for all of this stuff. ApplePay has been working for a while now actually (2 months or so), but chip cards still require a pin. I think it's a limitation of the terminals because all of the stores that are non-CVS in my area that have the same exact terminal require PIN input when I try to use a PIN card.

I think, personally, that this app is being used partially because Health Care cards aren't really compatible with ApplePay (you know, the ones insurance companies issue). They can be added to the app though. Plus this makes picking up for multiple people really simple. I like it as an associate. Plus, more private information protection since all the information we have of what's there etc. is right there on the app. That and it scans the loyalty card so you don't have to enter the phone number or try to find it among the hundreds of them on your keychain. It's not a terrible system. It's a barcode, sure, but it does a bit more than ApplePay does by itself.

No it's not single scan. I still do have to scan out each individual prescription. But that's for patient safety (giving you the right medications is a plus). Now if we could just have the insurance industry figure out a way to simplify the way insurance information is entered (it only takes a minute sure, but a scan would be so nice, or even integration into ApplePay).

 

[PalidinoDH]

Yeah, but I don't really see it being adopted. We already have a universal standard on the web - PayPal.

Unfortunately for people like me who once used PayPal to accept payments online to run our own little store, without a big company backing me it was all too easy to be BANNED from having a PayPal account after so many chargebacks from costumers who knew the favor of winning is on their side when it comes to credit card companies and even PayPal them selves. I suppose I'm probably a minority, but I can't even have a PayPal account that just sends money and can't receive it. Guest checkout is my only use.

 

[iGeek2014]

Tesco in the UK have contactless terminals in some of their stores (the larger ones are slowly but surely getting them now).

They have an app called PayQwik which lets users add credit/debit cards and then the customer can scan the QR code at checkout.

That's fair enough for users who don't have NFC capability (or a bank that supports Android/Apple Pay) but I would rather use contactless any day.

 

[ipedro]

Shoppers Drug Mart offers ApplePay in Canada and I started using them exclusively because of it. When I go on my run, I don't carry a wallet or even an iPhone. I usually swing into Shoppers to grab some groceries at the end of my run on my way home and pay with my AppleWatch.

CVS is only making it more complicated for people to shop in their stores. Lost customers may be small now but as ApplePay adoption grows, resentment will build up amongst tech savvy customers because they're being deliberately denied the ability to pay how they want to.

 

[iSneeze67]

Simply because with their system they can track what you buy, when you buy and how often you buy. They are mining you for information that they will sell to other people to harrass you with endless email and text offers. That is why they are doing it.

This is actually completely untrue. Please provide proof that CVS has sold your information to an outside company. Please don't lie or spread misinformation based on your lack of understanding.
I agree that individual payment methods are generally a bad idea. But the idea of this in a pharmacy environment makes sense to me. It is much more than a payment method. It pulls up your prescriptions without having to go through hoops. In a pharmacy, you must have a way to identify yourself unlike other retailers as you are picking up a prescription! Since this method make it much simpler, it does make it easier to add payment to the same process that already exists. There is no extra step as others claim. This same process already happens in order to claim your prescription and is much quicker than the manual method using name and dob. Also more secure than someone walking up to the counter and simply giving someone else's name and dob in order to steal someone's script. This is much more secure and something that would not work with Apple Pay do to it not identifying who is using the card. This is essential for a pharmacy. Not a method of mining your shopping habits to sell to others. Do they use the data in house. Of course. But they do not sell it to others. And saying so is a lie.

 

[revurb]

CVS is only making it more complicated for people to shop in their stores. Lost customers may be small now but as ApplePay adoption grows, resentment will build up amongst tech savvy customers because they're being deliberately denied the ability to pay how they want to.

Except it's active in the pilot stores (as of 72 hours ago when I bought tissues using it). So there's really no denial of any method.

 

[Johns12]

This is actually completely untrue. Please provide proof that CVS has sold your information to an outside company. Please don't lie or spread misinformation based on your lack of understanding.
I agree that individual payment methods are generally a bad idea. But the idea of this in a pharmacy environment makes sense to me. It is much more than a payment method. It pulls up your prescriptions without having to go through hoops. In a pharmacy, you must have a way to identify yourself unlike other retailers as you are picking up a prescription! Since this method make it much simpler, it does make it easier to add payment to the same process that already exists. There is no extra step as others claim. This same process already happens in order to claim your prescription and is much quicker than the manual method using name and dob. Also more secure than someone walking up to the counter and simply giving someone else's name and dob in order to steal someone's script. This is much more secure and something that would not work with Apple Pay do to it not identifying who is using the card. This is essential for a pharmacy. Not a method of mining your shopping habits to sell to others. Do they use the data in house. Of course. But they do not sell it to others. And saying so is a lie.

This is a point that will probably be ignored but is the basis of the CVS pay system.

 

[andybow]

This is just data tracking of customers, but it demonstrates how badly they will treat their customers to get it.

 

[kdarling]

You're contradicting yourself. Above you wrote this:

"No, not directly, but if you think about it a second, you'd realize that the lack of identification during a purchase means that the stores now have to pay the banks to get access to that information."

As I explained in detail in the followup post, what I meant was getting access to the customer. But yours is a valid criticism that I should not have taken any shortcuts with the initial explanation. Mea culpa.

The point still stands though, which is that yes AP costs merchants because they have to pay others to do what they used to be able to do themselves.

If that is the case the banks obviously made a bad deal. Am I supposed to feel sorry for them?

Nope. Just explaining why so many banks are holding back, especially where EMV has been around for years. Many already have tiny contactless fraud rates, so extra security at the cost of paying Apple for doing absolutely nothing during a transaction, is not cost effective.

As an employee for a large enterprise I see every day the efforts to dehumanize consumers and squeeze an extra few nickels towards that quarterly report.

Hey, I have no delusions that the awards programs I belong to are an actual substitute for the seller personally knowing me.

However, I do think it's silly to leave money on the table because you hate getting targeted ads in the mail.

My doctor knows me. My mechanic and accountant know me. I have no focks to give if Joe Willy the night supervisor at Walmart or Janelle the cashier at my local drug store know my name though.

The difference between you and me, is that Joe Willy will keep a register open an extra few minutes for me, and Janelle will understand if I left my wallet at home.

Heck, the first people I make friends with at a new office, are the secretaries and guards. It's made my life infinitely easier when rules needed to be bent

 

[Mac2me]

Because they don't want just the customer, they want all the information on them too so they can resell it.

I asked my spouse about whether he has used ApplePay at CVS recently and he said yes he has. Did so last weekend in fact. Asked him if he had any charge statements refelecting it and he pulled out his last Amex bill to show me. Saw the charge listed for CVS back on July 17. Perhaps with their own system coming out, of which I wouldn't bother to use, no need for more store apps, they don't want to advertise it.

**MacRumors should do a Update to this article because from it it sounds like ApplePay doesn't work at CVS when apparently it does. So unless you have a need to use their app, you can buy from there using ApplePay. **

Personally I'd rather rely on Apple than on a third party company supporting an app and having my credit card info stored in it.

 

[tasset]

Hey, I have no delusions that the awards programs I belong to are an actual substitute for the seller personally knowing me.

However, I do think it's silly to leave money on the table because you hate getting targeted ads in the mail.

Nope. I never leave money on the table. I visit deal sites regularly to know when retailers are taking losses, and when I visit stores (especially grocers) using loyalty cards I have the cashier give me a new one each visit and toss in the bin on the way out.

 

[lionsy]

Never quite can understand the opposition to contactless pay terminals in the US - I don't understand why companies like this one can't just upgrade their terminals to offer contactless and just let their customers decide, be it their bank card with a contactless chip in or Apple Pay or whatever, it's a worldwide standard bit of NFC technology, it doesn't matter if it's Apple Pay, Samsung Pay or Wiggidydiddly Pay, it's all the same flipping technology under a different brand name - why is it so hard to follow most other western countries.

It isn't the case that they're saying no to Apple Pay, they're saying no to NFC, if their terminal supports contactless it supports everyone's contactless pay offerings, be it your highstreet bank card, Apple Pay or whatever, it's ludicrous at this point that there is such huge opposition to it in the US.

 

[tmiw]

I just gave it a whirl with Amex. After having disabled for over a year looks like its back on in a VERY wimperingly quiet way. Probably so they can enjoy liability shift protections without letting too many customers know they offer the secure, private option.

I heard of it working with AmEx a while back but it sounded like that other cards would still fail. If it did start working with Visa and MasterCard too that wold be pretty big news.

Yes/no. I work at CVS and at one of the pilot stores for all of this stuff. ApplePay has been working for a while now actually (2 months or so), but chip cards still require a pin. I think it's a limitation of the terminals because all of the stores that are non-CVS in my area that have the same exact terminal require PIN input when I try to use a PIN card.

If you have a chip and PIN card, it's supposed to require a PIN when you insert it. CVS and the others are doing the right thing here.

Never quite can understand the opposition to contactless pay terminals in the US - I don't understand why companies like this one can't just upgrade their terminals to offer contactless and just let their customers decide, be it their bank card with a contactless chip in or Apple Pay or whatever, it's a worldwide standard bit of NFC technology, it doesn't matter if it's Apple Pay, Samsung Pay or Wiggidydiddly Pay, it's all the same flipping technology under a different brand name - why is it so hard to follow most other western countries.

It isn't the case that they're saying no to Apple Pay, they're saying no to NFC, if their terminal supports contactless it supports everyone's contactless pay offerings, be it your highstreet bank card, Apple Pay or whatever, it's ludicrous at this point that there is such huge opposition to it in the US.

We tried contactless cards years ago but the rollout was extremely botched--to the point where they're now seen by a lot of Americans as even less secure than magstripe. Almost no bank is going to dare to bring those back again; they'll end up having to replace 75% of the cards they issue with non-contactless versions anyway while dealing with the customer service hassle. Thus, disabling NFC is basically the same as disabling Apple Pay here, since AP and the two Android options are basically the only way to pay wirelessly.

 

[Rigby]

As I explained in detail in the followup post, what I meant was getting access to the customer. But yours is a valid criticism that I should not have taken any shortcuts with the initial explanation. Mea culpa.

The point still stands though, which is that yes AP costs merchants because they have to pay others to do what they used to be able to do themselves.

You're still not making sense. Apple Pay doesn't cost merchants any more than when a physical credit card is used. Customers who are using the latter cannot be uniquely identified either. The only additional information the merchants get from card swipes/dips is a name, which doesn't help them a whole lot (especially if the name is "John Smith" or similar). And if they want to track customers by card number, they can still do that with Apple Pay.

Nope. Just explaining why so many banks are holding back, especially where EMV has been around for years. Many already have tiny contactless fraud rates, so extra security at the cost of paying Apple for doing absolutely nothing during a transaction, is not cost effective.

Apple Pay provides more fraud protection than just EMV due to the biometric authentication.

However, I do think it's silly to leave money on the table because you hate getting targeted ads in the mail.

Yeah well, I think it's silly to sell your privacy for pocket change.

The difference between you and me, is that Joe Willy will keep a register open an extra few minutes for me, and Janelle will understand if I left my wallet at home. Heck, the first people I make friends with at a new office, are the secretaries and guards. It's made my life infinitely easier when rules needed to be bent

And they are all your good friends because you signed up for their super saver double rewards program ...
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Never quite can understand the opposition to contactless pay terminals in the US - I don't understand why companies like this one can't just upgrade their terminals to offer contactless and just let their customers decide

The banks in the US actually tried to establish contactless cards years ago (Paywave and Paypass). Must have been around 2008 or so. It just didn't catch on, and they stopped issuing the cards. I guess most people just didn't see the point, since it isn't really more convenient than swiping. Perhaps now with the chip cards it would be a different story (because they are a bit less convenient).

 

[upnorth85]

for 10 years all our household prescription medicine was through our local CVS stores. 4 months back I switched to Walgreens. I think CVS computer systems are far better off than Walgreens, but Walgreens has longer pharmacy hours, so I switched to Walgreens. I am never going back to CVS. They are forcing their customers to use only their preferred type of payment system. Blackberry tried that too refusing to move from a physical keyboard. Target and CVS both lost my business for their intransigence.

 

[Steve.P.JobsFan]

CVS is a nightmare, at least locally. I have been a Rite Aid customer for years and will continue to be a Rite Aid customer, especially now that got on board with Apple Pay a few months back.

If Walmart (or at least Kroger), Shell and Tim Hortons took it, I'd be set. After having your identity and CC info stolen three times in two years, I absolutely *hate* not using it.

Hell, my local BMW dealership takes Apple Pay and I use it when I buy parts for my M3. Went to AutoZone the other day and noticed their credit card readers now show the NFC symbol and say "Swipe, insert, or tap" now. Didn't try it though, figured I would baffle the grandpa running the register.

Tim Hortons is interesting though. They use the same CC machines here as in Canada, but you can use NFC in Canada. The last three times I've driven to Toronto, I've used Apple Pay when getting coffee on the 401. Doesn't seem to work here, though.

I've considered buying my gas from Mobil instead of Shell (who was on board with CurrentC), as Apple Pay thru the Speedpass app (while annoying) is better than nothing. It'd be quicker than going inside, and I don't have to talk to anybody!

However, my local Mobil is really shady. They got robbed a few months ago, and somebody was stabbed there a month before that.

 

[Michael Scrip]

How much did it cost for CVS to develop a complete payment system like this?

And also... how much money are they losing when customers stop shopping in their stores because they don't offer Apple Pay and other NFC payment systems?

Will this ever be considered a "good idea" for CVS ?

I can't wait to see how history judges their recent decisions.

 

[SeaFox]

All these proprietary systems are short term gains, long term losses, bad for business my friends.

Business is all about short term gains -- even they will eventually lead to long term losses. The reason is Wall Street and its demand that companies have endless profit growth. There are countless examples of short-term being favored even when it's stupid, one of the most glaring being selling off production facilities and layoffs to reduce payroll expenses -- only for a company to find it no longer has control over production of its widgets, and nobody with any talent is still employed there to come up with the "next big idea" when the current trend is fizzling out.

But that doesn't matter, because a bunch of short-term investors made their money, and the CEO that orchestrated it all has gotten his bonus for the improvements in the few calendar quarters that count -- and he's taking his golden parachute to the next gig to start all over again.

 

[0388631]

How about no? CVS is a hell-hole. Everything has a higher price than competitors, even for name brands. The employees, save for the medical staff, are fools. I give CVS Pay a year before it's hacked.

 

[gnurf]

If every chain of stores is going to have its own payment app, it'll be quicker to use your debit/credit card than sifting through all of those.