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Dell DJ Price and Specs?

i'm not sure if "worry" is the right word. dell certainly has good brand recognition and people will take a look. if this particular device is anywhere near as functional as iPod, people will take a look.

what i'm really wondering is this:

how does it get 16 hours of battery life?

the battery technology is pretty much out in the open. there's no "secret" vendor that can produce a battery that's twice as good for the same size/price/technology.

given that ipod is very simple in its function, i really doubt that the hardware and software of this dell is twice as efficient. there's only so much energy you can save by optimizing the software or hardware. is there a new kind of mini-HD that's super efficient? is there a new kind of embedded processors that is twice as efficient?

so i conclude that dell's device is either:
-has "two" batteries (and making it probably clunky) (not necessarily two separate batteries - but you get the point.)

or

-16 hours was obtained under an extremely non-normal use condition, more extreme than, say, apple's - no backlight, music playing at a low volume and no skipping around songs. (frankly, i can't think of doing anything more to save battery, so i take the former conclusion...)

i'd like to see the image of it...
 
Originally posted by Nutzoids

The Pic looks like the one we've seen from Chaosmint:

http://www.chaosmint.com/macintosh/articles/dell-dj-digital-jukebox-h.shtml
Click to expand...

i'm just glad apple basically trademarked the touch wheel design. i'm no expert but i think it's fairly easy to see that the touch wheel design is the most usable interface for navigating thousands of menus. as long as it's not blatantly copied, apple will always have an edge in usability. this becomes more of an advantage as the HD capacity increases. what's the use of having 10,000 song access if it's so hard to get to them?

this is one reason i don't want ipod to become more of PDA. the interface as is is perfect for a music player - expanding the capability further will dilute this advantage... (all in my opinion.)
 
There have been rumors that Sony will also release a HD based music player. If true, Apple should worry. Sony has experience and recognition for quality in the field of portable players. Remember that Sony pioneered the technology for portable music devices. Oh, they also patented a thumbwheel design for navigation that they used in some palmtop PCs and MiniDisc players.
 
Originally posted by yamabushi
There have been rumors that Sony will also release a HD based music player. If true, Apple should worry. Sony has experience and recognition for quality in the field of portable players. Remember that Sony pioneered the technology for portable music devices. Oh, they also patented a thumbwheel design for navigation that they used in some palmtop PCs and MiniDisc players.
Click to expand...

finally... sony should have done an ipod long ago... they were just caught in the middle because they also own a record label.

we shall see...
 
Re: jxyama... I couldn't agree with you more!

Originally posted by jxyama
what i'm really wondering is this:

how does it get 16 hours of battery life?

the battery technology is pretty much out in the open. there's no "secret" vendor that can produce a battery that's twice as good for the same size/price/technology.

given that ipod is very simple in its function, i really doubt that the hardware and software of this dell is twice as efficient. there's only so much energy you can save by optimizing the software or hardware. is there a new kind of mini-HD that's super efficient? is there a new kind of embedded processors that is twice as efficient?

so i conclude that dell's device is either:
-has "two" batteries (and making it probably clunky) (not necessarily two separate batteries - but you get the point.)

or

-16 hours was obtained under an extremely non-normal use condition, more extreme than, say, apple's - no backlight, music playing at a low volume and no skipping around songs. (frankly, i can't think of doing anything more to save battery, so i take the former conclusion...)

i'd like to see the image of it...
Click to expand...

I'm betting they got this 16hrs by way of keeping it in STBY mode which just gives a ready to use indicator (LED), and not in use at all, but people will be suckered into flocking to it for untrue reasons.

I hope that when they give it a "First Looks" review they uncover these things.
 

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DellDJ

I don't believe you can compare the two for price, it's more a case of will people pay more for what we assume to be a better product.

Who wants a joystick, I've got one on my phone, it's a complete pain.

15 Gb, surely whats important is how much music it holds, how do the different formats relate to quantity and quality.

My son has got a 20Gb ipod and its almost full, he's only had it since April. I've got about 30 Gb of music on my mac although I don't have an Ipod. My other son has got about 20 Gb of music and is getting an ipod (40 Gb) for Xmas.

The point is, 15 Ghb is not a lot, especially if the format makes larger file sizes
 
Originally posted by mymemory
I think the iPod is way over priced and Apple needs competition.
Click to expand...

The 40 gig iPod is $500. The priced of a 40 gig laptop harddrive is about $125. How much is the cost of the iPod molding, logic board, battery, and touch controls. How much do you think the cost of R&D is to have the #1 rated product for several years in a row in a market getting more and more competitive?

Overpriced? I dunno, Apple definatly has some room to play with for R&D with the iPod's profits, but if they were to cut that out right now it might eat into the quality of future iPods.
 
Originally posted by ryanw
The 40 gig iPod is $500. The priced of a 40 gig laptop harddrive is about $125. How much is the cost of the iPod molding, logic board, battery, and touch controls.
Click to expand...
Uh, the iPod uses a 1.8" HD.

Most laptops use a 2.5" HD.

The smaller sized HDs cost more.

Sushi
 
Re: Re: not a fan of rebates

I don't know about 6 mos., but certianly 6-8 weeks minimum. The thing to remember though, is that only about 35% of Dell's customers ever send in for the rebate. And, you have to know to go online to d/l the rebate form, they don't send it with the item. And you had better not lose the packing slip on the outside of the box, you need to send a copy of that too. And if you threw away the box with the packing slip still on it...tough. You're S.O.L.
Give me a good old-fashioned "Sale" price any day.




Originally posted by MM2270
3 weeks? You'd be LUCKY to get it in 3 weeks. Try more like 6 months in most cases for rebates. Yes, rebates SUCK. I wish companies would stop them, because the fact is, you still lose the money for that period of time before you get that check in the mail.

Anyway concerning the Dell DJ, I'm skeptical about the 16 hrs of playback. Either this thing is HUGE, or somehow Dell's engineers came upon some brilliance. Honestly, Dell never creates anything innovative, so how did their engineers come upon a way to include 16 hours of battery life in a small unit and Apple couldn't? Like I said, this thing is probably really bulky to contain that battery. It's no iPod, but it will compete with it at least on some level.

Should be interesting to see what happens.
Click to expand...
 
Ther smaller a device is, such as the iPod, the harder it is to manufacture. I'm not sure who makes the iPod for Apple, but I'm sure Apple is looking at other companies to possibly make a cheaper version for them for the future. The cost of a device is not just in the price of the parts it contains. There's the previously mentioned R&D, the cost of the molds, securing the various parts from different vendors, assembly, salaries of the workers, overhead, advertising, warehousing, shipping, etc., etc., etc.
 
Re: iTunes does not work with Dell's DJ

Originally posted by duce
When ever you ask PC user why they bought a DELL they have no real justifiable reason. Only that they have those at work and my IT guy recommend it. Dammed lemmings every where.
Sorry for the rant, but it is maddening to know people will make poor choices because of misinformation.
Click to expand...

Do note that 3-4 years ago Dell was far and above the highest quality PC you could buy. That is where they got their foothold (especially since the price for that quality was reasonable instead of outrageous).

Of course, the quality has gone significantly down in the last couple of years, as has the service, but Dell won its standing quite fairly.
 
iPod's Hard drive costs as much as iPod itself

The PC-Card size hard drives inside the iPod cost as much as the iPod itself, if bought separately. This limits how far Apple can lower the price.

What Apple can do to allow for lower cost iPods is to create an iPod with a PC-Card slot. Then Apple can add removable generic PC-Card hard drives at whatever size the customer wants. Apple can then add even Compact Flash Cards. Apple can even sell iPods without the drive, for picky users that think they can get a better deal on storage outside of Apple.

Customers will realize that with the cost of scale Apple has, it can purchase the 40 gig removable drive with iPod at a lower cost that buying the iPod itself without hard drive and buying a 40 gig drive themselves.

Note that Laptop hard drives are much larger than the PC-Card drives inside the iPod. The smaller PC-Card drives are very expensive compared to Laptop hard drives.
 
Re: Re: Re: not a fan of rebates

Originally posted by scat999999
The thing to remember though, is that only about 35% of Dell's customers ever send in for the rebate.
Click to expand...

If the extra battery life were compelling than Apple wouldn't have made the battery smaller for the 3rd generation.

More importantly is that Dell shortcuts the retail channel by selling direct (or through CostCo). This means that while Apple leaves room in their price for retail sales, Dell doesn't. The Dell "retail" price doesn't look good at all. I guess Apple did learn a lot from Dell when they designed the iPod because these prices make it look that Dell can't leverage their supply chain advantages here.

I'm sure Dell will sell a few when people buy them with their computer. But outside the Mac world, MP3 players are not a purchase done at the same time as the computer so Dell is the weak player, not Apple.

Add to this the bundling of MusicMatch and Dell looks like a fish out of water: insignificant cost savings, retail world, poor software offering. Normally they're the WalMart of the PC world: they can cause a change that ripples all the way down the supply chain.

Maybe if this was introduced a couple of years ago when the iPod only worked on Macintosh and things would be different. The 3rd generation iPod, iTunes for Windows, the new ads advertising "Mac or PC", and the new ad campaigns with Pepsi and AOL show that Apple is serious about the iPod on Windows. While people may have a stigma about Apple and the Macintosh, I don't believe they do with Apple and the iPod.

There will always be those exceptions. But those people are buying Creative Zen's or flash-based players right now. This leads me to believe that if Dell takes marketshare from anyone it will be from companies like Creative.

Add to this the fact that all the kids will probably razz their friends for getting an iPod knock-off (as the ChaosMint pictures show). In most of the world, people like/trust Dell--putting their logo on such a shoddy product will do more harm than good--this isn't the PC world, its the consumer one; this isn't going against the Mac, this is going against the iPod.

Sad, I was hoping the prices of the iPod might drop or Apple might be forced to introduce a new line soon.
 
Originally posted by mymemory
Just think about this. An iPod has 5% of the technology of an iBook but it cost almost half ¿?
Click to expand...

Which is the exact reason i bought my iBook. The pricing on the iPod is mad insane. I want one but i dont think i would ever pony up that kind of cash for something that only plays music. For the moment ill just stick with my $20 D-Link shizz azz mp3 playa.
 
Cost of PC-Card Hard drives

The lowest price for a 5-Gig Toshiba PC-Card hard drive I've found so far is $192.

This is just for 5-gigs.

Not including iPod hardware.

The 10-40 gig hard drives should cost even more.

Thus, the current iPods are selling for reasonable price.

Even if Apple came up with removable PC-Card iPods, you will be hard pricessed to get a better deal than you would be able to from Apple.
 
You should then use the same logic to compare the cost of Dell's iPod-copy to the cost of their PCs, if you are so stingy on purchasing an iPod. You can get a Dell PC for $399. And their iPod-copy only plays music. Why buy Dell?!!! Stick with your $50 mp3 player.



quote:
Originally posted by mymemory
Just think about this. An iPod has 5% of the technology of an iBook but it cost almost half ¿?


Which is the exact reason i bought my iBook. The pricing on the iPod is mad insane. I want one but i dont think i would ever pony up that kind of cash for something that only plays music. For the moment ill just stick with my $20 D-Link shizz azz mp3 playa.
 
All about choice

Sure the iPod is more expensive. It also uses rigid specs on harware. Plus design features are always very carefully thought out.

You pay more for luxury and in my opinion Apple is all about computing luxury, reliabilty and ease of use.

Its just like a car ...Buy a chev cheap or drive a lexus ...Which would you prefer both will provide you with a mode of transportation . It comes down to what do you want and what can you afford. Apple will always be the computer supplier most of us will want but only some of us can afford. (And sometimes we buy even if we really cannot afford)

Then those that cannot afford it will bash the very item they really want because of the affordibility isuue. Caveat ... this does not apply to everone but it does to a lot of people.
 
Originally posted by jxyama
finally... sony should have done an ipod long ago... they were just caught in the middle because they also own a record label.

we shall see...
Click to expand...

True... and my understanding is that Sony will NOT enter the HD-based music player market, because Sony needs to control the market by establishing a proprietary standard, and Apple already denied that to happen.

Someone said something about Toshiba, but they are suffering badly, as their computer division is dragging the company down - their computers are considered "uncool" by its own market. So, I consider the chance of Toshiba entering the market as slim or none.
 
Originally posted by jon snow
Even with more battery life, there is no way that this Dell produce will be close to the style and functionality of the ipod.
Click to expand...

Not that style and functionality keep people from buying Dell computers.... I'm paranoid, suddenly. :(

Dan
 
Re: LOL

Originally posted by Stike
Music Match! I love that! Most PC people are switching from Musicmatch to iTunes now, because they hate it...
So, the iPod will beat the crap outta thhe Dell DJ :D
Click to expand...

Have you guys used the new version of MM? 8.1 is nothing like the previous versions. I have both iTunes and MM on my system and occasionally switch off between the two. There are more then a few features MM has that iTunes should have. Unless you've used the software don't trash something you don't know. MM is way faster then 7, it hasn't crashed on my once, I like the light blue skin it has, and is relatively simple to use. In a crunch people could use MM and most likely not bat an eye at converting from iTunes with the obvious problems of incompatibility with DRMed ACC files.
 
Originally posted by jon snow
Even with more battery life, there is no way that this Dell produce will be close to the style and functionality of the ipod.
Click to expand...

Ya and how many people aren't elitist snobs who are more interested in how pretty their device is vs. how long it lives and how much space you get on it.

Even if the batt life specs are 1/2 of what they are rating, FYI their batt life rating for their Axim PDA is spot on so I seriously consider that these specs are accurate as well, it still would still be on par with the iPod.

One way Dell may have acomplished a longer batt life is with a solid state cache that has maybe 3-4 songs cached prior to playback. I'll be interested in seeing what Dell actually did with their hardware, or more accurately what they manufacturer they hired did.
 
Originally posted by rhpenguin
Which is the exact reason i bought my iBook. The pricing on the iPod is mad insane. I want one but i dont think i would ever pony up that kind of cash for something that only plays music. For the moment ill just stick with my $20 D-Link shizz azz mp3 playa.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it's not like you can backup your files on it or view your contacts or calendar on it.
 
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