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Infinite Vortex

macrumors 6502a
Mar 6, 2015
541
1,107
I was talking about those that don't buy Apple at all, as you phrased it. If they are not buying Apple at all, they cannot be buying anything large from Apple either. The question is thus what are these people buying if they are not buying anything from Apple because anything from Apple is too large for them?

'Not buying from Apple' implies that they buy elsewhere. So where do they get anything the size of an SE from parties other than Apple? There is a clear difference between the two statements of:
1) don't buy from Apple at all
2) stopped getting new phones (beyond the SE)

I'm not sure what it is you want said. The best I can do is share my thought process in September 2018 through to today when I decided things regarding my SE.

I "need" a phone with around 160GB storage to be comfortable as I'm on flights enough such that I want my entire music library on my phone… I'm not going to f&$# around making playlists that fit - it just all needs to fit. 128GB is ok but is a bit of a squeeze. With Apple, that forces me into a model 256GB. So the choice was to go with an iPhone 8 with a 2 generation performance jump and a Touch ID button that always seems to fail for me in summer (and I live in a place where its summer 6 months of the year) else a XS that was priced at 1,350€. No way I'm buying an even bigger XR nor was I prepared to buy an even older iPhone 7… the SE has mostly 6S internals so what's the point there?!

So realistically I'm looking at spending 1,350€ on a device I don't want. Like hell no… I'm not spending that money on something I don't want! It's no more difficult than that. Don't get me wrong, in the Android space there's no SE size phone that I want to buy either. Basically any phone I buy at this point is one I don't want as it'll be too big. Given that it'll all be about saving money. If I can't have one I'll get the other.

Thing is, when I compared the Samsung A8 that was on sale at the time for 160€ it's a pretty easy choice. Granted I needed to buy a 128GB SD card but that was 25€ and that will get moved to the next phones as well. Sure the two phones aren't even close in either spec or longevity but I can buy a new phone every year at a 200-250€ price and spend waaaaay less than the XS. Break it… who cares… lose it… who cares… no updates… it'll be replaced in a year or so so who cares… new shiny model… maybe, why not. That sounded really good to me. And what's the worst that could happen… the Android experiment fails and I end up spending 1,350€ on the XS.

Over 4 years I was thinking around a 500€ difference with a significantly lesser chance of inconvenience and costs due to breakage or other as it's no longer presuming a single device for 4 years. iOS might be worth that 500€ to someone else but it isn't to me. Especially when I can fit a lot of things into that 500€ difference.

Granted 6 months later I replaced the A8 with an S10 because the rear finger print sensor annoyed me greatly and the camera was far from spectacular. Again, the S10, being the same size as the A8, is too big a phone however its came to me for 735€ (including the sale of the A8 plus the SD card) which is still a long way from the cost of a XS at 1,350€. The nice thing about Samsung S-series phones is that by the time the Note pops its head out it'll be highly discounted… so I'll time it a bit better next time if I care. Getting a decent discount on a current Apple phone is a crap-shoot at best with the discounts not being that large.

At that time Apple wasn't offering me an ultrawide camera nor an in-display FPS… and still aren't with the FPS. In the meantime a lot happened in 2019 where the prevalence of in-display FPSs and improved cameras have appeared in mid-range phones. No reason for me to replace the S10 with a flagship in 2-3 years time. I'm not waiting for Apple decide, or not, to give me something that I can get elsewhere, today.

Don't get me wrong here as I do fully get that I'm not buying the same level product in the Android space, actually I have with the S10, but I'm also not compelled to. Remember, I'm an SE buyer… top spec is not one of my requirements. Look at the choice for someone wanting a smaller phone has today in 2020, the 2 generation old iPhone 8 else bleeding on the price of the 11 Pro. That's not exactly a choice of anything.

It's not only size but price. Both do matter and in differing proportions based what size and how much. I am prepared to pay a premium for something that suits my needs. I spent 586€ on the SE in 2016 which I feel is a premium price for what the SE is/was. So if I'm not getting either thing I want it's massively unlikely I care to get remotely near the 1,000€ and higher price point. At the price point of Android I'm far more accepting that the phone is too big for what I consider to be "physically ideal".

I'm sure you will pick what I've written to pieces which is fine. What is important here is that my message is that the right thing to do will always be fluid if one can't get close enough to the things they're wanting. There are no hard and fast rules to choice. It's realising there is a choice and making one's own mind up as to what is more important rather than letting other do it for them. I have decided that an SE sized phone is no longer in my future where as someone else may wait in hope for an SE2. Waiting may bear fruit like those that waited for the Mac Pro or iPad mini 5… or maybe not. I have merely decided that I no longer care to find out. I got rewarded in a lot of different ways to what I was expecting by moving.

People prioritise differently based on the prevailing circumstances.

PS I did in fact buy an iPhone XS 64GB as an iOS device is a necessity for work. I wasn't going to do so until 2021 as I have my parents gave me their unused iPhone 6. Bought it on a big discount for 679€ this Christmas. Never seen a discount this large for the prior generation before so just did it. Please note that 1,350€ less 735€ basically fits this purchase.

PPS No, the XS has not become my primary phone as 1) 64GB isn't enough and 2) in setting up the XS I realised how much slower I am at getting things done with iOS. The latter was quite a surprise for me and I feel its because there is a grown a disconnect with me and iOS and how I think things should be done… so personal preference.

PPPS Really glad I can continue with a headphone jack without flapping about with an adapter as I have a number of Apple's in-ear headphones I still like to use. In reality the adapter isn't a big thing as I've never once wanted to listen both use headphone and charge at the same time, plus there's wireless charging, it more the convenience of it. Others don't care about it and try to get others to let it go. Yes, I know wireless is the future but I don't need/want that future today. Maybe in a year or two the market will have matured enough for me to want to go to that future.
 
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manu chao

macrumors 604
Jul 30, 2003
7,219
3,031
I'm not sure what it is you want said. The best I can do is share my thought process in September 2018 through to today when I decided things regarding my SE.
You made an unsubstantiated claim and I called you out on it. Simple as that. Your claim was that some people have stopped buying from Apple, ie, switched to another brand, because Apple only offers ‘large’ phones these days.

And I simply asked you to substantiate your claim by pointing out to me what kind of phones these people were getting that are in the size class of the iPhone SE.
 

cubbie5150

macrumors 6502a
Mar 4, 2007
705
216
Despite the battery barely lasting a day, I'm still completely satisfied with my nearly 3-year-old SE. You know why? Because it comfortably fits in my hands and my pockets. Sure, the screen is small, but I'm not staring at it throughout the day. For me, it's the perfect device for checking messages and maps, reading ebooks or websites while on the train, taking photos, and making phone calls.

You use your phone to make phone calls?!? What a weirdo.

;)
 

Icaras

macrumors 603
Mar 18, 2008
6,344
3,393
I never said it was a fact, what I said was no one ever complains their phone is too big.

why else do you think manufacturers make larger smart phones?

You will never see small phones again, case closed/

I base my statement on the fact that smart phone manufacturers DO NOT make small phones any longer. That’s a fact.

Case not closed. Get ready for the 5.4" iPhone 12 this fall, which I fully intend to move to from my XR when it's released. I prefer, and STILL prefer the size of the iPhone 6/7/8 over any X, XR, 11, or Xs/11/12 Pro/Pro Max any day.
 

iapplelove

Suspended
Nov 22, 2011
5,324
7,638
East Coast USA
Case not closed. Get ready for the 5.4" iPhone 12 this fall, which I fully intend to move to from my XR when it's released. I prefer, and STILL prefer the size of the iPhone 6/7/8 over any X, XR, 11, or Xs/11/12 Pro/Pro Max any day.

Ok great, good for you. You and the other 1% of the smart phone market.
 

Icaras

macrumors 603
Mar 18, 2008
6,344
3,393
Ok great, good for you. You and the other 1% of the smart phone market.

So Apple has decided to release a smaller iPhone 12 this fall to sell to just 1% of the smart phone market? That’s not very smart business if that’s the case.
 

iapplelove

Suspended
Nov 22, 2011
5,324
7,638
East Coast USA
So Apple has decided to release a smaller iPhone 12 this fall to sell to just 1% of the smart phone market? That’s not very smart business if that’s the case.

You can see the future? So you already know what Apple is going to sell this fall? You sir are amazing
 

Icaras

macrumors 603
Mar 18, 2008
6,344
3,393
You can see the future? So you already know what Apple is going to sell this fall? You sir are amazing

Kuo’s iPhone predictions were correct for the last two years at least, so between a new SE/9 and a 5.4” 12, there’s a pretty good chance that at least one of these smaller iPhones should be released this year, based simply on track record. Kuo is the amazing one. No fortune telling involved.
 
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iapplelove

Suspended
Nov 22, 2011
5,324
7,638
East Coast USA
Kuo’s iPhone predictions were correct for the last two years at least, so between a new SE/9 and a 5.4” 12, there’s a pretty good chance that at least one of these smaller iPhones should be released this year, based simply on track record. Kuo is the amazing one. No fortune telling involved.

ok
 

halluxsinister

macrumors regular
Oct 17, 2017
185
196
If they don’t make an iPhone5-sized SE phone they are missing a huge opportunity!
If they want me to buy it, it must fit into my iPhone 5S/SE case, have a headphone jack, and be reasonably priced.

If it does not meet all these criteria, then no sale.

If my last iPhone SE dies before they issue an adequate (from my perspective,) replacement for the SE, as outlined above, then I will end up buying a dumbphone, and after that, when time comes to replace, in turn, all my other Apple stuff, (i.e., my iPad and Mac,) their replacements will NOT be made by Apple.

For me to continue as an Apple customer into the future, they must still offer as a minimum, those kind of devices and when they upgrade them, not also downgrade them at the same time by yanking out functionality like the headphone jack.

That is an absolute dealbreaker for me.
 
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