Display of Flash Content in iPad Promo Materials Likely Not Indicative of Actual Flash Compatibility

mdriftmeyer

macrumors 68030
Feb 2, 2004
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Apple worked with Google to build a YouTube app that streams videos via h.264 MPEG-4, which is compatible.

Also, Google now offers a version of YouTube that’s completely without Flash. There’s an HTML 5 beta that works with Firefox, Chrome and Safari. They want to ditch Flash as soon as they can too.

http://www.youtube.com/html5
Yet Google restricts the WebKit browsers of choice it claims to support.

I'm running Epiphany Trunk which being WebKit Trunk runs HTML5 just fine.

Google isn't looking at generic headers to support, only Firefox, Safari and Google Chrome.

They even offer me a chance to install Google Chrome for Linux.

I only need a WebKit HTML5 ready browser to view their site, yet they are already pulling a Microsoft artificial blocker on the header.

Sad.
 

coolfactor

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Flash CANNOT work well on any tablet, and Apple cannot change that. Many/most Flash games, menus, and even video players would not even WORK.

Why? Because they are coded to use button down/up events and rollovers—such as video controls that pop up when you mouse over--that simply have no equivalent in touch....(snip)

The vocal minority of Flash defenders will continue to complain—but they’ll still have no good, intuitive solution to offer for the mouseover problem. They themselves would HATE Flash on the iPad if they actually tried it. Many sites couldn’t work anyway (they NEED a mouse) and what did run would be slow and crashy and burn battery.

(And yes, these videos are a big embarrassment! Dumb. Unless they know those specific sites are moving to a non-Flash solution! Sooner or later they’ll have to.)
Good points! Apple is not just being dumb about this. They are looking after the user experience through controlled means, like it or not. Proprietary Flash doesn't (always) play by the touch interface rules.
 

inlovewithi

macrumors 6502a
Sep 23, 2009
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I think it needs to be said -- of course iPhone and iPad can display Flash content. They're just not loading the plug-in for it.

The real issue is: at what cost? To the consumer and to Apple? That's what needs to be discussed.

Just because Flash has delivered a rich user experience in several ways through the web doesn't mean that it needs to be supported for that experience to be delivered. HTML5 and efficient codecs like .h246 are now capable of delivering that same (or even a better) experience.

I wish people would be very specific about why they want Flash. List some websites they can't use because of the lack of support on the iPhone and then we can begin to evaluate whether that website could replace its Flash with something that doesn't require a browser plugin.
Flash is basically a video player, I believe youtube videos are mp4 which I believe might virtually be the same as .h64.
 

Apollo21

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Feb 6, 2009
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And I'm sorry, but any claim of injury as a result of these "ads" is ludicrous.
Um, the loss of $829 for a device that doesn't do what it clearly shows it can do is not considered "injury" to you??

I guess you also think it would be fair if a car was advertised as being able to drive itself and you paid $300k for it, only to find that it was just a simulation for advertising purposes.
 

KT Walrus

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Jul 10, 2008
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Why not bundle Click2Flash in iPhone OS X Safari?

It takes care of all the negatives about Flash but lets the user decide whether they really want to load and run an individual Flash object in a page.
 

netnothing

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Mar 13, 2007
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Apple worked with Google to build a YouTube app that streams videos via h.264 MPEG-4, which is compatible.

Also, Google now offers a version of YouTube that’s completely without Flash. There’s an HTML 5 beta that works with Firefox, Chrome and Safari. They want to ditch Flash as soon as they can too.

http://www.youtube.com/html5
Just to be clear, Firefox is not supported due to it not supporting the h.264 codec (it only supports OGG for html5 video).

-Kevin
 

nagromme

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May 2, 2002
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False advertising.

The iPad is NOT capable of displaying the said web pages in full, as shown.
The only way I see that Apple can avoid paying out of pocket for this mistake is—MAYBE—the fact that you can’t actually buy the thing. They won’t take your money, and the device’s software is subject to change. They have 60 days to make the real state of affairs clear and start actually selling something.

I don’t think that’s enough. I think Apple will have to make a payment for this. And I think they’ll survive that just fine. It won’t be much money, since nobody has actually bought an iPad yet anyway :eek:

Here's something else that Apple got wrong on their website. They state that the iPad is Widescreen.
Good eyes! :)
 

starnyc

macrumors newbie
Nov 13, 2007
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Flash is proprietary

The problem with Flash is that it is a proprietary format owned by ADOBE, so it is utterly moronic to have the world's content locked up in a non-searchable proprietary format.

Besides being very processor intensive and battery wasting, flash can also introduce security risks and puts up a $600 barrier to content creators who must purchase the program and its expensive upgrades every year.

Apple is very into open standards, so it is not in their interest to push Flash, which could have a limited future.
 

coolfactor

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Um, the loss of $829 for a device that doesn't do what it clearly shows it can do is not considered "injury" to you??

I guess you also think it would be fair if a car was advertised as being able to drive itself and you paid $300k for it, only to find that it was just a simulation for advertising purposes.
By "clearly shows", what exactly do you mean?

Do you mean that you looked at that static image of an iPad with a static image of a web page loaded and say "hey look, it's loading Flash!".

No, only a live demonstration by Apple sales staff with interactive Flash could result in Apple being held responsible. That's not what they did. Steve's demo even showed the iPad _not_ loading Flash.
 

inlovewithi

macrumors 6502a
Sep 23, 2009
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Well I plan on buying two iPads and I already love it. So does that make me a fanboy ? ;)
Depends. Buying 2 ipads doesn't make you a fanboy, ignoring every other product made by every other company, and suggesting they are inferior for not having an Apple logo would make you a fanboy. For example, I could find a lot of uses for a tablet, but I would be a lot more interested in a Tegra 2 based tablet that has an SD card reader, and USB ports.
 

HiRez

macrumors 603
Jan 6, 2004
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I was just thinking about this last night...that it's ripe for a lawsuit.

I think it's immoral to blatantly show content that isn't supported.

Boo.
I agree with you, it is dishonest. However, let's remember that it won't even be available for months. They're taking a lot of heat from all sides right now for missing features like Flash support and multitasking (including their stock price which is being brutally beaten down), but many of its shortcomings can be fixed with software and OS updates. Hopefully the pressure will force Apple to implement some of them, and who knows, maybe they already are but just weren't ready to show those things yet.
 

dernhelm

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May 20, 2002
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Flash CANNOT work well on any tablet, and Apple cannot change that. Many/most Flash games, menus, and even video players would not even WORK.

[- intelligent reasoning redacted -]

(And yes, these videos are a big embarrassment! Dumb. Unless they know those specific sites are moving to a non-Flash solution! Sooner or later they’ll have to.)
There you go - bring logic and facts into it. Arguing from an emotional standpoint is so much more fun. WE WANT FLASH! IF WE COULD PUT A MAN ON THE MOON, WE COULD PUT FLASH ON AN iPAD!
 

Peace

macrumors Core
Apr 1, 2005
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Space--The ONLY Frontier
People making a living by being Flash builders won't lose their house and be out of work at least if they are good at it. You should already know Java.

Simply change jobs .
 

RazHyena

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Jul 30, 2009
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Update: MacRumors has heard from a source that The New York Times itself generated high-resolution images of several of its pages, including Flash and ad content, in order to improve the look of the pages for Apple's use in iPad marketing materials..

*Heroic Facepalm*

well................any updates on a mbp refresh?
 

0dev

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Dec 22, 2009
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Oh no, I can't play FARMVILLE?!?! That's it then, I'm not getting it now... :rolleyes:

The only thing I care about from the Adobe quote in the article is that Apple's ePubs will be DRM'd.
 

jmggs

macrumors regular
Jul 6, 2007
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www.joaomiguelsantos.com
All people talk about flash being a proprietary format. But what about apple and the closed system itunes store. Don't read a number of video and audio formats without transcoding and so on. The lack of USB and flash is all about that a closed and anti democratic system controlled by Apple.:mad:
 

inlovewithi

macrumors 6502a
Sep 23, 2009
615
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Care to back that up with some hard numbers?

I played the sample video and CPU usage for WebKit (the latest nightly) hovered around 40%. Not enough to get my fans going like Flash does, even simple rotating banners on websites.
That around how much I got for HTML5 around 40 percent. I just tried a youtube video, it started at 40 to 50% and then stayed in the 30s. I'm very disappointed because I was hoping that it would be in the 10% because I do hate flash, but so far flash was slightly better, and that's like with 20 tabs open. I had less tabs open for the HTML5. I should point out that I'm using a Mac with Windows 7, and flash is worst on OSX. My GPU doesn't support flash acceleration, but my future computers will certainly do, and if that's the case then HTML5 won't be a solution if it is currently using as much power as flash. It certainly wont help to kill it. My dream for html5 is for it to be able to play many different file formats, that way when a person uploads a video to you tube, it won't re encode it making it of less quality from the original.
 
There you go - bring logic and facts into it. Arguing from an emotional standpoint is so much more fun. WE WANT FLASH! IF WE COULD PUT A MAN ON THE MOON, WE COULD PUT FLASH ON AN iPAD!
I thought the moon landing was filmed in Arizona, and the iPad video was created at an ad agency in New York City?

:D

The device not being released yet makes any claims of malfeasance and lawsuit moot, and moronic. The advantage Apple has by pre-announcing the product is they can watch all the mindless rants, thoughtful posts, and wild claims, and parse what to do with the PRODUCT before it is actually RELEASED.

Where's the thread for the top 10 hardware features not demoed but that will be included in the shipping product? The sheer number of software applications that will spawn are mind boggling.

Remember this is a device to runn applications. Nobody who matters really cares what the hardware specs are. THEY CARE WHAT THEY CAN DO.

If Apple wants to reserve all multi-tasking for themselves for now, sit down, shut, up, hold on, and smile. Or simply do not buy one. Can the ant-fanbois comprehend that simple concept? I thought not. Whining is better than a job!

Rocketman