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Do I sense a major price drop on the Cinema 20"?
- Thread starter madoka
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Aside from the 'lack of controls' on the Dell, I didn't get enough of a feel from that rough comparison. Especially if you're looking at comparing an older model off eBay, with a ADC connector and no monitor controls at all, not to mention USB1. not 2.0... 
Since I >do< have a 20" ADC, but don't have a 2005FPW sitting here, I can't compare the screens. But the shots of the two looked near identical in a photograph. From the specs, the Dell should have some better range.
From what I've read, some of the Dell controls auto-set and disable when connected via DVI. You can just as easily go into your video card control panel to adjust from the presets. Yeah, sometimes you'd like different presets -- we'll have to wait and see if Dell states why they decided to go that route. Note that certain DVI televisions also disable some control settings when connected over DVI. And frankly, that's exactly what I have to do right now with my ADC-connector 20" via DrBotts ADC2DVI adapter on a PC.
Then, add in that for that price, the Dell also offers composite & svideo inputs, VGA in addition to DVI, height, tilt, and swivel adjustments, and Pivot -- plus warranty. It just wins in the end on features for the price. Especially when you compare to a new ADC @ 1299 (or maybe 1199 if you shop) versus a new Dell at around $600 (the avg price you can get it for), and not a unit off eBay!
As soon as I can get Dell to cough up a review unit, I'll put it to a visual test. But on specs and features, combined with price, any average user would be wise to think carefully before spending 2X on the Apple model.
Does Apple really get better panels? Probably. Maybe they get fewer dead pixels. Who really knows...
Is the Apple picture quality better? Likely arguable, given that no two people see color perfectly alike, not to mention few will agree on brightness settings!
If you are buying a Mac to start with, and get the monitor with the system where you get the warranty coverage, that at least improves things a bit. And your monitor then matches your platinum G5, which is (sadly) important to many consumers.
Gnite all,
-d
Since I >do< have a 20" ADC, but don't have a 2005FPW sitting here, I can't compare the screens. But the shots of the two looked near identical in a photograph. From the specs, the Dell should have some better range.
From what I've read, some of the Dell controls auto-set and disable when connected via DVI. You can just as easily go into your video card control panel to adjust from the presets. Yeah, sometimes you'd like different presets -- we'll have to wait and see if Dell states why they decided to go that route. Note that certain DVI televisions also disable some control settings when connected over DVI. And frankly, that's exactly what I have to do right now with my ADC-connector 20" via DrBotts ADC2DVI adapter on a PC.
Then, add in that for that price, the Dell also offers composite & svideo inputs, VGA in addition to DVI, height, tilt, and swivel adjustments, and Pivot -- plus warranty. It just wins in the end on features for the price. Especially when you compare to a new ADC @ 1299 (or maybe 1199 if you shop) versus a new Dell at around $600 (the avg price you can get it for), and not a unit off eBay!
As soon as I can get Dell to cough up a review unit, I'll put it to a visual test. But on specs and features, combined with price, any average user would be wise to think carefully before spending 2X on the Apple model.
Does Apple really get better panels? Probably. Maybe they get fewer dead pixels. Who really knows...
Is the Apple picture quality better? Likely arguable, given that no two people see color perfectly alike, not to mention few will agree on brightness settings!
If you are buying a Mac to start with, and get the monitor with the system where you get the warranty coverage, that at least improves things a bit. And your monitor then matches your platinum G5, which is (sadly) important to many consumers.
Gnite all,
-d
I thought I was never going to buy another Dell product again....
...but I just couldn't pass up the price!!
I've been looking around everywhere for a monitor to rival Apple's Cinema. I was too afraid to pay $1169 (student discount), which would be nearly the same price as a computer I decide to buy. But after finding the Dell (only a few hours ago on this site), and discounts (http://www.slickdeals.net/forums/t54792.html?&page=191&pp=15), nearly halving the price to $645 shipped for similar specs sold me.
If I had thousands of dollars to spend, I'd probably get the Apple display. But seeing as how I'm a college student, you can't beat the Dell. Even my Mac-addicted friend (who is dying to get a mac, and completely hates windows/pcs) convinced me to buy the Dell Display IMMEDIATELY! If I don't like it, I can return it. But the chances are I'm not going to find anything close to this for a while.
Well, off to dream about my insane savings
...but I just couldn't pass up the price!!
I've been looking around everywhere for a monitor to rival Apple's Cinema. I was too afraid to pay $1169 (student discount), which would be nearly the same price as a computer I decide to buy. But after finding the Dell (only a few hours ago on this site), and discounts (http://www.slickdeals.net/forums/t54792.html?&page=191&pp=15), nearly halving the price to $645 shipped for similar specs sold me.
If I had thousands of dollars to spend, I'd probably get the Apple display. But seeing as how I'm a college student, you can't beat the Dell. Even my Mac-addicted friend (who is dying to get a mac, and completely hates windows/pcs) convinced me to buy the Dell Display IMMEDIATELY! If I don't like it, I can return it. But the chances are I'm not going to find anything close to this for a while.
Well, off to dream about my insane savings
Well, I decided to jump on this Dell monitor with all the coupons out there. $600 complete and with 12 months interest free financing. Bummer is that tell me it won't ship till the 17th. Well maybe something for me to play with on Xmas Eve then.
Nice, congratulations. Please post an update once you get it. Maybe by then 10.3.7 will be out and who knows, maybe it (10.3.7) will enable contrast controls for that monitor.
It took about a month and a half for Dell to ship my 1TB LaCie drive. By the way, I had to sell the Lexus to afford it.
It took about a month and a half for Dell to ship my 1TB LaCie drive. By the way, I had to sell the Lexus to afford it.
The Dells image quality was nice, the same as the Cinema.
But the contrast setting was unusable so its true specs were worthless!
Also the Brightness control was useless!
Imagine staring into a TOO bright light constantly.
A bright bulb glaring into your eyes, that isnt good!
It was painful for me. Badly and irritating.
There are many times when I turn down the cinema's brightness for comfortable use! At differnet times of the day.
That is what brightness controls are for.
If anyone thinks that hurting your eyes to save a few dollars is ok, then they arent thinking right.
Insane saving cant help poor vision.
>>davebytes~
Again, the image quality was comparible to the Cinema, except for the pinkish hue at times and some colors seemed washed out due to excessive brightness. Dell may even be using the same LCD's as the new AluLcd's that have a pinkish problem also.
The Cinema has monitor controls through the Color management system.
The point is that you can never set the contrast ratio on the dell all the way up as you must to use the management system.
Again the image qualitys were comparible so obviously the Cinema was the better choice to compare it to, because that is the unit that can be had for the same price on eBay or various other stores!
There are TOO many problems with the newer Cinemas to even bother trying to make a comparison.
As for the other inputs, i never found them an issue because I have a 36" plasma television and use that for all my viewing needs that are not computer related. So, the dell's additional inputs are of no value to me.
I buy computer monitor for computers.
And reviewed as that.
Maybe the problems with the Dells are not apparent across the room,
but when you use it as a computer monitor then that is a problem!
Plenty of usb ports on the G5, again good enough, not enough of a issue to warrent use with the galring problems it had.
"Hey Dad, I'm blind but got to use USB off the back of my monitor instead of the computer, cool huh!"
I would really say that the really bad things about the Dell wiped out the additional usb etc and the pivot.
You have to get the basics to enjoy the rest.
Also dealing with Dell has been ridiculous!
I like talking to people in India they are very polite but nothing gets done and they are all very confused there!
But the contrast setting was unusable so its true specs were worthless!
Also the Brightness control was useless!
Imagine staring into a TOO bright light constantly.
A bright bulb glaring into your eyes, that isnt good!
It was painful for me. Badly and irritating.
There are many times when I turn down the cinema's brightness for comfortable use! At differnet times of the day.
That is what brightness controls are for.
If anyone thinks that hurting your eyes to save a few dollars is ok, then they arent thinking right.
Insane saving cant help poor vision.
>>davebytes~
Again, the image quality was comparible to the Cinema, except for the pinkish hue at times and some colors seemed washed out due to excessive brightness. Dell may even be using the same LCD's as the new AluLcd's that have a pinkish problem also.
The Cinema has monitor controls through the Color management system.
The point is that you can never set the contrast ratio on the dell all the way up as you must to use the management system.
Again the image qualitys were comparible so obviously the Cinema was the better choice to compare it to, because that is the unit that can be had for the same price on eBay or various other stores!
There are TOO many problems with the newer Cinemas to even bother trying to make a comparison.
As for the other inputs, i never found them an issue because I have a 36" plasma television and use that for all my viewing needs that are not computer related. So, the dell's additional inputs are of no value to me.
I buy computer monitor for computers.
And reviewed as that.
Maybe the problems with the Dells are not apparent across the room,
but when you use it as a computer monitor then that is a problem!
Plenty of usb ports on the G5, again good enough, not enough of a issue to warrent use with the galring problems it had.
"Hey Dad, I'm blind but got to use USB off the back of my monitor instead of the computer, cool huh!"
I would really say that the really bad things about the Dell wiped out the additional usb etc and the pivot.
You have to get the basics to enjoy the rest.
Also dealing with Dell has been ridiculous!
I like talking to people in India they are very polite but nothing gets done and they are all very confused there!
Grokgod said:
Can you explain the Contrast and Brightness issues that seem to bother you? I will have to wait for a couple weeks till my 205FPW comes in, so I can only judge by the online manual at this point (http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/monitors/2005FPW/English/index.htm) - not firsthand usage. And the Contrast and Brightness can be set from the front buttons on the panel. Are you saying that the range is not nearly enough for adjustments?
It is that with all the monitors that I have used on both PC's and Mac's; I just see where your comments are coming from.
I gathered that the brightness and contrast controls on the Dell monitor were not even functional - you couldn't adjust the brightness or the contrast.Chip NoVaMac said:
Chip NoVaMac~ let me explain further.
As I said in my review and again in my last post.
The Contrast ratio is Grayed OUT!
No use, USELESS, will not work, cannot be adjusted.
Dimmed, Greyed, not an option.
Also the Brightness is Useless.
It can be adjusted BUT it doesnt actually adjust anything.
Except maybe frustration which is further finetuned to maddness by the Dell tech support in India, who are brillantly polite, kind and equally USELESS!
The brightness will allow perhaps 1 percent change. Maybe 2.
But that isnt enough, IMHO.
I mean you have to stretch the imagination to see the change its NOT obvious or extreme.
I only use Mac's , dont know about Pc's and don't care about pc's!
Plus let me add that all these things are working beautifully with the Cinema! The LCD has two buttons one power , one brightness.
Both work great, I love not having to go to the computer in the closet to turn it on. And the brightness control is a sleight of hand breeze.
Compare that to the bizarre labrynth on the Dell, sheesh.
India is great, I heard a cow mooo next to her.
As I said in my review and again in my last post.
The Contrast ratio is Grayed OUT!
No use, USELESS, will not work, cannot be adjusted.
Dimmed, Greyed, not an option.
Also the Brightness is Useless.
It can be adjusted BUT it doesnt actually adjust anything.
Except maybe frustration which is further finetuned to maddness by the Dell tech support in India, who are brillantly polite, kind and equally USELESS!
The brightness will allow perhaps 1 percent change. Maybe 2.
But that isnt enough, IMHO.
I mean you have to stretch the imagination to see the change its NOT obvious or extreme.
I only use Mac's , dont know about Pc's and don't care about pc's!
Plus let me add that all these things are working beautifully with the Cinema! The LCD has two buttons one power , one brightness.
Both work great, I love not having to go to the computer in the closet to turn it on. And the brightness control is a sleight of hand breeze.
Compare that to the bizarre labrynth on the Dell, sheesh.
India is great, I heard a cow mooo next to her.
On the Dell LCDs I've used, the contrast control is disabled when connected via DVI but available for VGA connections. Not sure why, but that's what I've seen.
Rower_CPU said:
If that is the case, on a PB 12" rev B, what would using DVI verses the VGA output do (other than maybe make the Contrast available, and maybe a greater variance in the Brightness) for me?
Uuuh that's by design. DVI sends the data through the digital interface. You don't set geometry, contrast, pixel clock, or phase adjustment; you use your video card.Grokgod said:
In the case of a Mac, I recommend SuperCal, a shareware calibration utility. I just calibrated by 2005FPW and it looks amazing. The brightness controls are there just to tweak your settings, not change the picture from snow to dark. The Mac automatically set the correct color profile out of the box without much fiddling; there is a very slight difference between my calibrated profile and the default. (Mine is a tad darker contrast.)
Interesting that your post is what passes for "review" around here. You use "worthless" and "ridiculous" to describe the Dell. I favor "amazing value" and "fantastic picture" but maybe that's because I figured out how to calibrate mine.
Bought $550 new.
DVI gives you a pure digital picture; your video card passes along geometry settings, contrast, and other details. VGA does not, requiring you to adjust those settings. You also get better signal strength not prone to interference with DVI. Essentially DVI is "hands free" mode -- plug it in and it works.Chip NoVaMac said:
Has nothing to do with the OS version; you can set the contrast and brightness via your color calibration scheme right now. This is by design (when using DVI).Rod Rod said:
Don M. said:
Thank you, I gathered as much from your previous two posts in a row. If you must respond to multiple people, please do so in a single post. Using tabs and copy/paste makes the process very simple.
Actually they were different questions with different answers.Rod Rod said:
I'm sorry that the format of my answers didn't meet with your approval. So much for being helpful. <shrug>
I gave in, just ordered up a 2005FP, little christmas present to myself
hmmmm....3360x1050 desktop space (iMac 20+2005FP)...sweetness...
hmmmm....3360x1050 desktop space (iMac 20+2005FP)...sweetness...
Don M. said:
The only thing different about the questions was the askers. Your explanation of the nature of DVI answered my post sufficiently. Anyhow, I appreciate your helpfulness, but three posts in a row is excessive.
edesignuk said:I gave in, just ordered up a 2005FP, little christmas present to myself
hmmmm....3360x1050 desktop space (iMac 20+2005FP)...sweetness...
Congratulations ... does Dell have crazy coupons for UK customers as well?
edesignuk said:I gave in, just ordered up a 2005FP, little christmas present to myself
hmmmm....3360x1050 desktop space (iMac 20+2005FP)...sweetness...
Congrats! I am trying to patiently wait for mine.
Mine's due to arrive WednesdayChip NoVaMac said:Congrats! I am trying to patiently wait for mine.
edesignuk said:Mine's due to arrive Wednesday
You are trying to taunt me, aren't you?
Ordered mine on the evening of Dec 3, and it sys it won't ship till Dec 17.
What can I say, except...Chip NoVaMac said:You are trying to taunt me, aren't you?
Ordered mine on the evening of Dec 3, and it sys it won't ship till Dec 17.
I'll post pics for you