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Dual 1.8GHz PowerMac Released

Now just get rid of the 1.6 and put the single 1.8 at the low end.

Why continue to sell a crippled Power Mac? Sometimes I just can't figure Apple out at all. It seems like its always all or nothing from them. Why drop the single 1.8ghz Power Mac? It wasn't crippled like the 1.6 is. It would make a nice entry level Power Mac.
 
Re: Now just get rid of the 1.6 and put the single 1.8 at the low end.

Originally posted by jocknerd
Why continue to sell a crippled Power Mac? Sometimes I just can't figure Apple out at all. It seems like its always all or nothing from them. Why drop the single 1.8ghz Power Mac? It wasn't crippled like the 1.6 is. It would make a nice entry level Power Mac.
Click to expand...
Oh well, now the dual PowerMac G4 and the entry level PowerMac G5 are basically priced the same.

Going to be real hard to tell people they should save the money and buy the PowerMac G4 now. :D

Unless they have a real need for the 5v PCI cards and/or OS 9.
 
Re: Re: Now just get rid of the 1.6 and put the single 1.8 at the low end.

In most of the bench testing, the Dual G4 runs faster than the single processor G5.
Originally posted by Sun Baked
Oh well, now the dual PowerMac G4 and the entry level PowerMac G5 are basically priced the same.

Going to be real hard to tell people they should save the money and buy the PowerMac G4 now. :D
Click to expand...
 
This is really a very cool move by Apple....although I have to say I'm going to still wait until the next revision (MWSF?) to buy one, its a good sign of things to come.

D :D
 
hate to get slightly off topic but am fed up of people saying the 1.6 G5 was a waste of space or a downgrade. If you replace the pointless nvidia GPU and add more RAM it more than happily takes on a 1.42D G4 in all but multi processor aware apps. Even the single 1.8 G5 couldn't compete with a dual G4 in such apps. Yes on paper its the weaker sibling but it's much quieter, is more future proofed, has better technology and is more user friendly than any G4 yet comes in at an attractive price point.
 
I don't think any computer is 'future' proof, that's why we see updated machines every few months or so. Once programmers start making more applications that take advantage of the 64 bit architecture, then people will see the advantage of a G5 machine, but until then, it's just for show.
 
Why the 1.6 is still around

You are always going to have some less performing chips that will run at only 80% of the top speed. (Yes kids, 1.6 IS 80% as fast as 2.0).

They keep it crippled with regard to RAM and architechture because they are trying to justify the $700 price difference between the low and middle models and push anyone interested in real performance up to a dual. For the folks who don't really need the power, there is a new lower price point - but Apple doesn't want folks who would pay more settling for this deal. Pros check specs MUCH more carefully than consumers and the crippling is just enough of a turn-off to get them to contemplate jumping to a higher price level.
 
I find this release instructive in other ways.

The "need" for it was learned when almost all G5 buyers selected the dual processor model over the other cheaper single processor choices. The time from that event to this release is instructive to Apple's practical response time to releasing a version of a product.

The Apple buy site for the product is instructive as it includes what seems like a lot more add-on options. Several pre-installed software options, several accesssory items (iPod, iSight, Speakers, etc).

And as a side note, thenews line on the home page has almost exclusively large media accolades instead of the typical "space filler" news items of little national note. Apple has mindshare and recognition in the real world now (as opposed to predictable zealots). This change of events matters. It is a sea change for Apple Computer, Inc.

Wouldn't it be a shock if the next wildly successful Pixar project was actually made on macs from the other company the CEO runs? Instead of PC's and workstations?

Rocketman
 
My order for PowerMac single 1.8GHz was updated to DUAL 1.8GHz. The price remained the same.
Click to expand...

hm i just phoned with the apple store( germany)
and they said that it is not possible, so they have to give me my money back and i have to make a now order
*damn i am angry*
 
Oh well at least a 50% increase in real world speed with no significant change in price, is a big event.

And a new sweet spot.

A 5-10% boost for an extra $450 should slow the sales of dual 2.0 machines quite a bit.

Should be interesting to see how many people change their current BTO orders for the dual 2.0 G5.
 
Originally posted by quasan
hm i just phoned with the apple store( germany)
and they said that it is not possible, so they have to give me my money back and i have to make a now order
*damn i am angry*
Click to expand...

Well, at least my Apple Store (Finland) order status says:
POWER MAC G5 1.8GHZ CTO Z07J 2.336,00 1 - Canceled
...
PMG5 1.8DP CTO Z09Y 2.336,00 1 2.336,00
...

I really hope it remains this way :confused:
I've had enough problems with Apple Store and have been waiting for the G5 almost 5 weeks. They have just confirmed my order, but the status has not moved from "Being Reviewed" :(
 
So...does anyone know if these are a minor revision or just a processor-swap?

AppleMatt
 
Is there really any difference between the Dual 1.8Ghz and the Dual 2.0Ghz??

All you need to do is increase the FSB by 100Mhz and you have a Dual 2.0Ghz. I would think it would be possible!
 
A step in the right direction, though as others have said it leaves a huge gap between the low and middle end.

This corrects the previous anomaly where the fastest machine was the best value. Normally, you *expect* to pay a premium for that last increment of performance (which some will always be willing to pay). I'd expect the dual 1.8 to become the volume leader immediately.

I really don't like that gap in the line, though. They should add back the single 1.8 (and put the 1.6 in a reduced form factor tower, but that's another matter.)

It almost seems to be part of Apple's strategy (baffling though it be) to leave holes in their product line. When they fill one, they open another. I wish I could understand it sometimes...
 
looks like it's time to figure out how to overclock these G5s :D

I wonder it the 1.8DP is just 2.0DP with a different CPU card put into it, or is it a revision?
 
I'm the guy

It looks like this time I'm the guy that you always hear about that JUST bought a machine, and it was upgraded underneath him. I got my SP 1.8G5 2 or 3 weeks ago, and now this. For the same price.

Ah well. I'm sure at some point, I'll be able to buy a second processor. Is there any technical reason why I wouldn't be able to just socket it in? Are the 1.8 motherboards DP with an empty slot?
 
Only certain professions need raw power those being mostly video, maths and science. A number of grapic artists I know who work in London use graphite G4s or even B&W G3s.
From memory clocking any PPC to date has been something of a tricky process in the case of the G4 one which required extensive and careful work with the chip first. I assume like most processors now the G5 is locked so will require unlocking.
 
Re: I'm the guy

Originally posted by RealityMonster
Ah well. I'm sure at some point, I'll be able to buy a second processor. Is there any technical reason why I wouldn't be able to just socket it in? Are the 1.8 motherboards DP with an empty slot?
Click to expand...
Yes, there is no socket.

Nope, no empty socket.

And the machine requires a thermal calibration, using the Apple Service Tech's "Apple Service
Diagnostic for Power Mac G5," every time a processor is moved to a new socket.
 
Originally posted by wizard
Can one say 2.5GHz by January for the top end?

While some seem to think that this is to take pressure off the top end I don't believe it. First there isn't a great deal of differrence in performance for single threaded applications with the old configurations. Second I can't really believe that the 2GHz 970 is that hard to come buy that they need to take presure off the top of the line model.
Click to expand...

When setting pricing and features the theory is the low end will sell alot of units and the middle unit will sell fewer and the top line will sell fewer still at a high enough price to make the vendor vewwy, vewwy happy. This release caused most sales to happen in the vewwy, vewwy happy range. Wacky. An upside down pyramid formed with the G5 release.

That orphaned LOTS of chips only good enough for 1.6 and 1.8 Ghz ratings. In fact the IBM server uses the big pile of spare 1.6 Ghz 970's that Apple did not buy.

So a dual 1.8 is a way to dent the huge oversupply of those chips and when 2.6 Ghz chips are released to the public in January for march delivery, those will be in the high end.

I suspect the Powerbook G5 is entirely dependent on die shrink AND cooling tricks for release. Wind tunnel Powerbooks? :)
 
Apple has to move out it's supply of chips the best way it can. I'm guessing they had a surplus of 1.8 Ghz and decided to double them up to move them out. Obviously they couldn't drop the 1.6 cause they still need to sell those and making the single 1.8 the new low end would cannibalize the same supply bin for the new dual. We should be lucky Apple is having this type of supply issue with IBM rather than the supply situation they had with Motorola in winter 99/00.
 
I think the 1.8 single should replace the 1.6, and offer it for $1,699 ($100 less than the current 1.6 machine).

I was under the impression that the move to the G5 was due to the fact that the G4 could not compete as a single proc machine. Dual proc adds more heat, noise, and money to every machine. Apple is not very intent on expanding their market share with this type of marketing. Unless there really is some truth to the cube rumors of late.

--

OT

The 20" iMac should be a 1.33 not a 1.25 G4....

--

*sigh*

:confused: What is Apple doing :confused:
 
Originally posted by Sun Baked
Oh well at least a 50% increase in real world speed with no change in price, is a big event.

And a new sweet spot.

A 5-10% boost for an extra $450 should slow the sales of dual 2.0 machines quite a bit.

Should be interesting to see how many people change their current BTO orders for the dual 2.0 G5.
Click to expand...

Well, isn't it $100 more? And despite what Apple wants you to think, you're not going to see a bit of a difference unless you do some sort of processor intensive encoding... you won't even see a difference in 99% of games.

I'm surprised they axed the SP 1.8 GHz model though...

Don't forget the DP models are slighly noisier, and have a 600 Watt powersupply vs a 450 watt powersupply :)
 
Pros and Cons

Good to see another dual processor pro machine...

It would be great if all the "Pro" machines had dual processors.

It would be even better if they hadn't put that crappy video card in the machine. Typical Apple, to almost give you everything you want, but then come just short so they could rape ya with a few add on components. All these machines should come equiped with the top of the line video card, 1GB RAM, and two hdd. After all it is a "Pro" machine... So why not put all the pro features in it to start. So I'll call these the semi-pro Macs.
 
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