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Dual Core Yonah PC Notebook Specs
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legacyb4 said:
It's pretty hard to find a modern camera without USB2.0 today and more and more have wifi also.
Total Speculation
Price speculation is always dangerous with Apple, but here are my estimates:
(like it matters if i'm wrong)
iBooks
12" - $899. Screen size has no reason to change.
14" - $999. May change to 13"
Pentium M processors only because low-voltage price points would push up iBook selling prices. Possibly dual core Yohans @ 1.66 and 1.83
Mac Mini
Prices pretty much stay he same only keyboards and mice (heh) are now included.
Single core Yohan @ 1.66, dual core Yohan @ 1.66 and dual core @ 1.83 respectively. Maybe low voltae 1.5, 1.5 and .1.66 giving the illusion of "placement" below Powerbooks and still above iBooks?
Powerbooks:
13" - $1299. Screen size will change from 12" to up it's status as a "power tool"
15" - $1599.
17" - $1899.
Dual core @ 1.83, 2.0 and 2.16 respectively.
I feel that Powerbooks have the most room for major price change.
I dunno jack about the processors and such, not my area. Only guesses. I do feel products will be released at MWSF, but probably not entire refreshed product lines. Always a guess with Apple as to specifics but thankfully I don't need specifics
WindowsSUCKSX5 said:
Price speculation is always dangerous with Apple, but here are my estimates:
(like it matters if i'm wrong)
iBooks
12" - $899. Screen size has no reason to change.
14" - $999. May change to 13"
Pentium M processors only because low-voltage price points would push up iBook selling prices. Possibly dual core Yohans @ 1.66 and 1.83
Mac Mini
Prices pretty much stay he same only keyboards and mice (heh) are now included.
Single core Yohan @ 1.66, dual core Yohan @ 1.66 and dual core @ 1.83 respectively. Maybe low voltae 1.5, 1.5 and .1.66 giving the illusion of "placement" below Powerbooks and still above iBooks?
Powerbooks:
13" - $1299. Screen size will change from 12" to up it's status as a "power tool"
15" - $1599.
17" - $1899.
Dual core @ 1.83, 2.0 and 2.16 respectively.
I feel that Powerbooks have the most room for major price change.
I dunno jack about the processors and such, not my area. Only guesses. I do feel products will be released at MWSF, but probably not entire refreshed product lines. Always a guess with Apple as to specifics but thankfully I don't need specifics
840quadra said:
Indeed!
Single Core Yonah = Centrino/Core -"Solo" T1300 -1.66Ghz
both ibooks and mac mini will use them. single speed
or even worse ibooks might endup using pentium M sonoma platform for the first iteration essentially getting chips at the bargain basement level from intel.
Now we know who knows what!!
Powerbooks at a later date will use the Dual core versions.
Ja,budugu said:Single Core Yonah = Centrino/Core -"Solo" T1300 -1.66Ghz
both ibooks and mac mini will use them. single speed
or even worse ibooks might endup using pentium M sonoma platform for the first iteration essentially getting chips at the bargain basement level from intel.
Now we know who knows what!!
Powerbooks at a later date will use the Dual core versions.
I have been around the block a few times, and have a fair understanding of what may be coming for the Apple systems.
I am also well aware what a Yonah is, but a Yohan ?
840quadra said:
Indeed!
I said processors are not my area. I inverted a few letters.....so what? You Apple ****s get on my nerves!
INDEED is right. In ****ing deed.
windowuser82 said:
Gotta agree. Jeez, it was only a minor spelling error of a meaningless codename.....
Peace said:
At first I thought you were joking but I have gotten a few private messages bashing my posts. The "you Apple ****s" thing was born of that, so excuse me.
Are some "fans" really THAT rabid?
This is off topic (like it ever remains totally on topic anyway) so...
windowuser82 said:
(FYI it is iPod not IPOD, it is "Mac OS X" not OSX)
You may not realize that Apple's stock price is currently trading with a P/E ratio in the mid 40s (currently on a slight run up for MWSF). For a lot of last year (2004 & 2005) it was trading with a P/E ratio in 60s and even up into the 80s if IIRC. So the current pricing for Apple stock is off from its high exuberance that we saw in recent year and generally falling in line with its earnings (forward looking P/E is in the low 30s).
To be clear a lot of recent stock valuation for Apple is from Apple being profitable (thanks to iPod, Mac, and Mac OS X sales) not just the iPod train.
I expect to see this trend continue this year with Apple stock generally rising in price some while having its P/E ratio decline as it realizes earnings increases (as an investor I would love to see its P/E come down to the 20s). iPod is a driver of this but I believe Mac sales will take back that crown in the coming year (a lot of that thanks to the mind share that the iPod generated).
shawnce said:
P/E ratio of 48.06.
My area is in small caps and I have been, recently anyway, treating Apple as more of a Kodak kind of company and haven't been probing as far as I really should and giving it more credibility than I am comfortable with. That being said and understood, I -still- , deep in my gut, feel it's mostly hype and will come crashing down if this Intel transition doesn't really provide equal footing for Apple, which it should.
Indirectly in that statement I am relating iPod sales to increased Mac sales, which we have seen is the case, but as I stated in another post I don't feel it's a large enough mindset yet. Intel is adding a much needed "line of credit" as far as Apple branding goes, but ask Joe on the sidewalk and Apple, to him, is "Oh...iPods. Music." and computer hardware is taking a "slow sister in the attic" twist. This really worries me related to long term stability. Apple never really had a HUGE hold, atleast not for my generation and currently the largest market. Apple = computing is becoming less and less and less "duh" and moree "huh?"
P.S.: FYI I'm fully aware it's iPod and not IPOD.....emphasis should be placed with something is in CAPS! To me it's OSX, not OS X (and yes I'm FULLY aware of the needed space.)
Trust me when I say you are NOT speaking to someone of lowered intelligence
Ow, my head hurts from reading these posts!
Wouldn't you know it; I go out for a beer last night and miss this thread - and now have to wade through a bajillion comments... I tried to read them all before posting, but just couldn't get past a hundred before I had to pipe in.
Now, I'm not picking on Kris Kelvin, but he reiterated what drove me nuts about other posts before his...
The big changes for Apple, besides the Intel CPU, is:
"marrying" their Airport networking software to Intel's Centrino chipsets.
transitioning from AGP to PCI-Exp. x16 graphics.
moving from DDR to DDR2 memory (I haven't read anywhere on Napa that it supports DDR3).
SATA 150 hard drives, etc.
Now, much of that "workload" is incorporated into the Napa platform, of which Yonah is the CPU. And Intel has been pursuing Apple for a decade, and would be giving Apple all the help they wanted/needed to develop the motherboards for the Intel Macs - putting it in a beautiful & functional case is what Apple excels at.
That's why I think Apple will showcase the new Intel-powered PowerBooks next week (available by this time in February). It won't have a 512MB GPU - neither does the Acer (it "borrows" the last 256MB from main memory under heavy load). It will have Centrino 802.11g (maybe 802.11n), but WiMax and/or UWB are still a few months out. It will have an ATI X1xx-series GPU (maybe nVidia G-Force Go 7800?) with at least 128MB on the GPU, and a BTO for 256MB. It will have one each of FrWr 400 & 800, as well as two USB 2 ports, plus gigabit ethernet (10G is months away, and overkill except for heavy 3D/DV work). It will ship standard 512MB DDR2, but we'll still pay a BTO premium for the full 2GB (when Merom arrives in September we may see the two slots support 4GB). And the widescreens will pack as many pixels as Apple (and our optometrist) will allow, possibly HD resolution...
But with the single-core Yonah not due until Spring (and at $209 for 1.66GHz in quantities of 1,000), it makes no economic sense for Apple to put a dual-core Yonah in either the iBook or Mac mini... I mean, did anyone bother looking at the other link? The one that showed how much the various iterations of Yonah would cost per 1,000... (http://vowe.net/archives/006694.html) And Viiv, which contains Yonah, will cost upwards of $1,500-1,800 per system, so don't expect it in a mini at its current sticker price...
Please, people, Christmas was over 2 weeks ago. Get those visions of sugar plums out of your heads.
Wouldn't you know it; I go out for a beer last night and miss this thread - and now have to wade through a bajillion comments... I tried to read them all before posting, but just couldn't get past a hundred before I had to pipe in.
Now, I'm not picking on Kris Kelvin, but he reiterated what drove me nuts about other posts before his...
Intel (as well as AMD, IBM, Freescale, ATI, nVidia, et al) provide "engineering samples" to the manufacturers months before the official release dat of a new CPU or GPU. So Apple has had a chance to work with Yonah, as well as Napa, since before the Intel announcement at WWDC this past June. They are not starting from scratch. Many of the basic components Apple will use in an Intel Mac are similar, if not identical, to those used previously in PPC Macs.Kris Kelvin said:
The big changes for Apple, besides the Intel CPU, is:
"marrying" their Airport networking software to Intel's Centrino chipsets.
transitioning from AGP to PCI-Exp. x16 graphics.
moving from DDR to DDR2 memory (I haven't read anywhere on Napa that it supports DDR3).
SATA 150 hard drives, etc.
Now, much of that "workload" is incorporated into the Napa platform, of which Yonah is the CPU. And Intel has been pursuing Apple for a decade, and would be giving Apple all the help they wanted/needed to develop the motherboards for the Intel Macs - putting it in a beautiful & functional case is what Apple excels at.
That's why I think Apple will showcase the new Intel-powered PowerBooks next week (available by this time in February). It won't have a 512MB GPU - neither does the Acer (it "borrows" the last 256MB from main memory under heavy load). It will have Centrino 802.11g (maybe 802.11n), but WiMax and/or UWB are still a few months out. It will have an ATI X1xx-series GPU (maybe nVidia G-Force Go 7800?) with at least 128MB on the GPU, and a BTO for 256MB. It will have one each of FrWr 400 & 800, as well as two USB 2 ports, plus gigabit ethernet (10G is months away, and overkill except for heavy 3D/DV work). It will ship standard 512MB DDR2, but we'll still pay a BTO premium for the full 2GB (when Merom arrives in September we may see the two slots support 4GB). And the widescreens will pack as many pixels as Apple (and our optometrist) will allow, possibly HD resolution...
But with the single-core Yonah not due until Spring (and at $209 for 1.66GHz in quantities of 1,000), it makes no economic sense for Apple to put a dual-core Yonah in either the iBook or Mac mini... I mean, did anyone bother looking at the other link? The one that showed how much the various iterations of Yonah would cost per 1,000... (http://vowe.net/archives/006694.html) And Viiv, which contains Yonah, will cost upwards of $1,500-1,800 per system, so don't expect it in a mini at its current sticker price...
Please, people, Christmas was over 2 weeks ago. Get those visions of sugar plums out of your heads.
I am a soon to be switcher who didnt want to get an outdated PPC Mac. After seeing this kind of PC I am so excited I hope that the new powerbook I will be getting has these kinds of features. I am however fine with having less RAM and V-RAM. It seems excessive and would have my PB too expensie. All i want is a PB that is beautiful like the current one, has a backlit keyboard, iSight, dual core intel, 512 to 1 gig of ram, and a graphics card with at least 128 MB or VRAM. I am so excited to get rid of this celeron piece of crap !
!jbouklas said:
"untill quite a while after" ~ as in exactly 1 week!
+ Speed top Powermac before update DUAL 2.0/2.3/2.7 -> after update DUAL CORE 2.0/2.3/DUALx2.5; imac 1.8/2.0(=least powermac) after update SINGLE CORE 1.9/2.1!! (updated G5s?). NOT TO MENTION THE CRIPPLED BUS!![check the buyer's guide for more info!!!] it is not about building your dream machine... it is about making their dream profit! Initially (even in the windows world) ... dual core laptop models are all highend machines as they can get the maximum profit margin milking the early adopters! Slowly they will come down to base models with time. Some body should wake you all guys out of your wet dreams!
red diamond said:
well, you're not exactly posting in the right thread...
- Mac OS X will still not run PC apps
- you should be able to emulate PC apps through Virtual PC at a high fraction of full speed
- you should be able to boot an Intel Mac to Windows, which should run PC apps, if not at full speed, very close to
- Maya is available for Mac too
aegisdesign said:You're a developer and you don't know the answer to this?
word.
windowuser82 said:
i am disgusted at the idea that some users took the time to hideously attack you in private because their self-esteem depends on a post at this board.
I'd like to express my admiration for WINDOWUSER; he's brave enough to come in a Mac forum and post ( like it should need courage anyway; but considering the way this story is unfolding it looks like some pathetic members should scare themselves in the mirror ).
You will never grow more than when you face critics and peek beyond the limits of your liking; i welcome all windows users here and thank them for their contribution to the community.
Now flame or whatever, i don't think i'm going to add more fuel to this ridicoulous discussion; we're all joking and having some good time, not wrestling for real. Let's talk about upcoming Macs, OS comparisons ( you need alternatives for comparisons, right ? ), and rumors instead of our personal problems...
jbouklas said:
Do you think any news on powerbooks will be given at MacWorld? I really want to get one but am unsure if I should just go for the 15inch 1.67GHZ G4 now or wait for the intel.
I guess I'll comment before going to bed - it's late and I work tomorrow...
Next, the linked-info to the Acer laptop stated that the GPU had 256MB of attached VRAM and "access" to another 256MB from main memory - I guess it's apples & oranges as far as battery life,... "tomato" & "tomato" (which doesn't work if you don't hear them pronounced differently). But I'm still not convinced that Apple could deliver a dual-core Yonah iBook for less than what they charge now. Would they ignore the advanced features that Napa will offer "on board", such as SATA, GSM & WiMax options, PCI-Exp x16, etc.? Will they use Intel integrated video? And all while maintaining (as much as possible) their industry-high profit margins...
I guess it depends on just what kind of discounts they get for buying those 1,000-quantity lots of Yonah by the barge-full... Still, I don't see the mini - at its present size and pricepoint - getting a dual-core Yonah AND all these fancy DVR functions people are hoping for...
And, yes, I was referring to engineering it in a laptop: the iMac G5 received DDR2 & PCI-Exp x16 in Sept.(?), when the iTMS announced the Disney deal, while the PowerMac G5 was updated the following month (including the dual-core 970s). However, I think that it's different in the laptops. The form factors are too similar as compared to the iMac G5 & PowerMac G5 variance. There's limited expansion options either way in the laptops, so it boils down to what's on board.
And even if the PowerBook stayed G4 for another 3 months (so-called "performance" version of Yonah) or as long as 8 months (dual-core, 64bit Merom), things like FrWr 800, Gig-eth., screen res and GPU will not mask the fact that the consumer laptop has a dual-core CPU on a 667MHz bus that makes the pathetic G4 on its 167MHz bus (or is it still 66MHz!?!) look like its frozen in time.
I just don't see Apple doing that. Especially as the iBook has been steadily nibbling away at the "vast gulf" between it and the PowerBook. Nor do I buy the argument that Apple will wait until pro-apps are available in Intel versions before switching the PowerBook to Intel... Looking at the specs on this Acer (their new "top-line" model) you just know Apple's PC competitors would be laughing all the way to the bank to deposit the receipts from all those dual-core Yonahs they sold to eager-walleted customers.
You said it yourself, jbouklas, Rosetta is surprising people with its apparent performance, and that a 1.6GHz Yonah blows past the developer kits... It just opens too wide a gulf between the iBook and the then-geriatric PowerBook.
Okay, you're braver than me. I wasn't going to piss off the entire forum by saying they didn't know what they were talking about...jbouklas said:
Next, the linked-info to the Acer laptop stated that the GPU had 256MB of attached VRAM and "access" to another 256MB from main memory - I guess it's apples & oranges as far as battery life,... "tomato" & "tomato" (which doesn't work if you don't hear them pronounced differently). But I'm still not convinced that Apple could deliver a dual-core Yonah iBook for less than what they charge now. Would they ignore the advanced features that Napa will offer "on board", such as SATA, GSM & WiMax options, PCI-Exp x16, etc.? Will they use Intel integrated video? And all while maintaining (as much as possible) their industry-high profit margins...
I guess it depends on just what kind of discounts they get for buying those 1,000-quantity lots of Yonah by the barge-full... Still, I don't see the mini - at its present size and pricepoint - getting a dual-core Yonah AND all these fancy DVR functions people are hoping for...
And, yes, I was referring to engineering it in a laptop: the iMac G5 received DDR2 & PCI-Exp x16 in Sept.(?), when the iTMS announced the Disney deal, while the PowerMac G5 was updated the following month (including the dual-core 970s). However, I think that it's different in the laptops. The form factors are too similar as compared to the iMac G5 & PowerMac G5 variance. There's limited expansion options either way in the laptops, so it boils down to what's on board.
And even if the PowerBook stayed G4 for another 3 months (so-called "performance" version of Yonah) or as long as 8 months (dual-core, 64bit Merom), things like FrWr 800, Gig-eth., screen res and GPU will not mask the fact that the consumer laptop has a dual-core CPU on a 667MHz bus that makes the pathetic G4 on its 167MHz bus (or is it still 66MHz!?!) look like its frozen in time.
I just don't see Apple doing that. Especially as the iBook has been steadily nibbling away at the "vast gulf" between it and the PowerBook. Nor do I buy the argument that Apple will wait until pro-apps are available in Intel versions before switching the PowerBook to Intel... Looking at the specs on this Acer (their new "top-line" model) you just know Apple's PC competitors would be laughing all the way to the bank to deposit the receipts from all those dual-core Yonahs they sold to eager-walleted customers.
You said it yourself, jbouklas, Rosetta is surprising people with its apparent performance, and that a 1.6GHz Yonah blows past the developer kits... It just opens too wide a gulf between the iBook and the then-geriatric PowerBook.