Engadget really dislikes the Glossy displays.

[MowingDevil]

I think Lenovo may be still have matte screens... it would be worth checking out. Generally, for the wintel world they are the most serious laptops as long as they maintain the old IBM philosophy of modularity and durability for the corporate IT world. Of course, Lenovo could just go all consumer on us... since all they did was buy IBM's PC division.

Good, I hope more "switchers" switch back. The hordes of facebooking youtubing myspace-ing gaming coffeeshop-surfing casual users is where this whole dumbing down of the Pro line is coming from anyways. When Apple was more of a niche market they catered to the musicians/film makers/photographers/graphic artists. Now they seemed more worried about what the majority of regular consumers want.

I've ordered the new MBP and I'm not here to complain but I would definitely have selected the matte option if offered and even paid more for a 2nd distinct FireWire bus/port.

 

[macrem]

Just my $0.02, but it'll only happen with a design change. I can't see them incorporating a matte option with the current template. The whole laptop was redesigned from the ground up with the intent of having a glass display.

Unless they redesign the upper panel at the next revision in may/june/whenever, it's not gonna happen.

Couldn't glass be texturized or coated without a redesign?

Aside from matte, in a redesign I'd hope for: silver keys and bezel, 2nd usb adapter on right, blu-ray, bigger/cheaper ssd's, quad-core, higher res screens & ability to switch graphics cards on-the-fly.

 

[technogeek]

Texturizing or coating

Couldn't glass be texturized or coated without a redesign?

Aside from matte, in a redesign I'd hope for: silver keys and bezel, 2nd usb adapter on right, blu-ray, bigger/cheaper ssd's, quad-core, higher res screens & ability to switch graphics cards on-the-fly.

Yes, they could put a multi-coating on the glass, just as is done with cameral lenses and anti-glare coatings on eyeglass lenses. The old anti-glare filters for CRTs had this, as I recall. That would reduce the glare to some degree; I don't know quantitatively how much. But if you recall, the slightest bit of oil from a finger will appear on these screens because they disrupt the destructive interference that reduces the glare.

You can't texturize the glass surface, because it is so far from the LCD pixels that they would be blurred by the texture (the texture on matte screens is so close to the pixels on the other side of the plastic that they aren't blurred).

 

[CaptainCaveMann]

The MB's have lower quality LED screens than the MBPs. The viewing angle is much lower as is the depth.

See, this doesn't even bother me because I plan on connecting the new laptop to the LED Cinema Display while at home. When I'm on the road, I'm sure the screen will be just fine.

 

[hashilli]

No luck needed - no other manufacturer went glossy-only on their pro models.

Links please? I'd love to see which make/models.

 

[skye12]

The glossy is not a problem at all. Give it a chance and you'll actually
prefer it.

 

[MrJingles]

I'm sorry but unless you're a roaming bedouin and can't find decent lighting conditions , I don't see what the big deal is?
People are ranting about the screen like its the end of the world..Just sit under a tree or something :/
Or better yet, if you can afford a macbook I'm pretty sure you can afford an umbrella and a stand and ALL IS SOLVED.
An extra .5 kg's won't hinder your portability.

or you can buy my new "MacBook Pro Anti-Reflective Kit" it includes:
1. Zipper-less black hoodie
2. Black ski mask
3. Black gloves
4. Portable black anti-glare tarp to throw over you and your new MBP.*
*Air conditioning unit sold seperately.

=)

 

[MrJingles]

Don't be facetious; he merely stated (correctly) that it's a laptop, so it can be moved around. In the vast majority of cases, people buy laptops for exactly that purpose; I'd wager very few buy them specifically to plug something on a stand. Plus, he fairly specifically stated he was talking about glare in the office, not a trade show.

On another note, the employee at the local Apple store today mentioned that he hadn't seen one 17in MBP sold since the new products came out, believing anybody needing it was probably waiting for the unibody successor. So at least here, glossy doesn't seem to be a problem. Obviously that's pretty much pure conjecture, as I've no figures to go on, but hey, it's macrumors after all

Maybe so or they are like me and many others who are waiting to see if they shine up the 17in like it's smaller sibling and if so it's 'see ya later'.

 

[Teej guy]

The glossy is not a problem at all. Give it a chance and you'll actually
prefer it.

Did, don't. It's a preference, not a cut and dry "one is better than the other."

For me, matte is better. Period.

 

[kis]

Links please? I'd love to see which make/models.

http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/e...owerful&psn=notebooks_tablet_pcs/notebook_pcs

Not one of HPs performance-line business notebooks has a glossy display.

Same goes for the Dell Latitude line - here you can choose what you want. Go look them up yourself.

peter

 

[sinser]

http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/e...owerful&psn=notebooks_tablet_pcs/notebook_pcs

Not one of HPs performance-line business notebooks has a glossy display.

Same goes for the Dell Latitude line - here you can choose what you want. Go look them up yourself.

peter

Don't forget about Lenovo!

 

[nicksellshondas]

And with regards to the Engadget review, the idea that a glossy screen is an automatic deal breaker for more than a small percentage of people is ridiculous.

The only time a glossy screen will give you any problem is if you position it directly in front of fluorescent lighting or have it tilted directly up at the sun.

And having owned multiple powerbooks and macbooks with matte screens, this bizarre reverence that people hold over the matte screen as if the sun or fluorescent lighting had no effect on it is asinine.

I remember having to shift the screen or where I was sitting many times when sitting in auditoriums with the old ones. They are not immune to ambient light.

Since my thread was closed, let me just point this post out again. People need to stop jumping on the "me too" train and use their heads to think for themselves. I bet that this is not a deal breaker for nearly as many people as people seem to think. It just makes no sense at all that something this trivial could get so many people so upset!

All I am saying is that I think people are following a group mentality with this one and they need to try it out for themselves first. Look at all the posts that say "I thought it would be bad, but I actually love it!"

Listening to other people on a forum should not be the only thing you consider when making a decision. Don't you think you should actually experience the thing yourself?

I really am not trying to rile people up here, despite what the moderators thought of my last thread. The fact of the matter is that there isn't even a choice, so what is the point of debating it? Despite my post, I agree with the moderator's opinion that we don't need any more glossy vs. matte threads. Those threads were relevant when there were two choices when buying a MBP. Now that there isn't a choice, there is no need to debate the two.

 

[Teej guy]

Those threads were relevant when there were two choices when buying a MBP. Now that there isn't a choice, there is no need to debate the two.

I disagree entirely.

 

[digitalpencil]

The glossy is not a problem at all. Give it a chance and you'll actually
prefer it.

Gloss is a huge problem for many and full glass is very distracting.. it is significantly more reflective than the older matte variety.

 

[bushbaby]

Many of us are reporting here that the sudden lack of a matte option IS a deal breaker for us. Now there are plenty more who are not reading this board, and not posting.

If you work in a visual field, this is hardly trivial. If you sell cars, then maybe it is trivial to you.

Many people are buying the new mbps sight unseen because they don't live near an Apple store. So for them, they have to rely on the early reviews like engadget and reports by us on forums like this one. Of course it is a personal decision and the best way is for the potential buyer to see it in person and judge for themselves.

But it is very narrow-minded to demand that people stop talking about their dislike of the glassy screen just because the choice was taken away from us.

We are hoping Apple will bring it back.

For those of you who are just tickled pink over this hi-gloss, glassy screen, then don't bother to read our threads. I can't imagine why you would bother.

Since my thread was closed,
let me just point this post out again. People need to stop jumping on the "me too" train and use their heads to think for themselves. I bet that this is not a deal breaker for nearly as many people as people seem to think. It just makes no sense at all that something this trivial could get so many people so upset!

All I am saying is that I think people are following a group mentality with this one and they need to try it out for themselves first. Look at all the posts that say "I thought it would be bad, but I actually love it!"

Listening to other people on a forum should not be the only thing you consider when making a decision. Don't you think you should actually experience the thing yourself?

I really am not trying to rile people up here, despite what the moderators thought of my last thread. The fact of the matter is that there isn't even a choice, so what is the point of debating it? Despite my post, I agree with the moderator's opinion that we don't need any more glossy vs. matte threads. Those threads were relevant when there were two choices when buying a MBP. Now that there isn't a choice, there is no need to debate the two.

 

[magallanes]

. Those threads were relevant when there were two choices when buying a MBP. Now that there isn't a choice, there is no need to debate the two.

In fact its the opposite, now is the moment to cry aloud about the lack of options, so Apple will retract to use glassy-only-screen.

 

[Kan-O-Z]

I read that, too - and immediately canceled my order. I had already looked at the MBPs in the store nearby and found the screens to be appalling. After having read some of the more positive comments here, however, I decided to order one anyway because I recently sold my old MBP (very bad decision) and really need a notebook right now.

I absolutely don't want to switch to Windows or Linux but right now I don't see an alternative :-(

Wow you're willing to switch to a Windows just because of the glossy screen!?! That's taking it a little too far. It's like saying that you were going to buy a BMW but it didn't come with the tinted windows you were hoping for so now you are just going to buy a Chrysler

Folks - remember that these reviews are just that...reviews. Aside from facts and specs, they are opinions of just one person. There are many reviews out of the new MBP. This one just happens to be one of the negative ones on the screen. There are many positive ones. Have you discounted those?

I am into cars and read reviews from different sources. I can't tell you how much they vary on the opinions on the same vehicle. It's almost like politics...everyone has an opinion. Remember that there are just as many people who view matte screens negatively(which causes more distortion and diffusion of images) as there are those who view glossy screens negatively(which causes more reflections)

The best thing to do is to make your own opinion. I highly doubt that you would be so unhappy with the new MBP screen that you would regret it. I own a MBP matte and was just using my parents MB and quite honestly I forgot about how the screen was glossy. Worse case scenario, go buy a film for your MBP screen if you can't get used to it.

Kan-O-Z

 

[Starfall]

Flawed pro-glossy arguments

There are several common but flawed arguments that I've consistently seen offered in defense of Apple's apparently glossy-only policy:


1. "I thought I preferred matte, but it turns out I really like the glossy screen on the MacBook Air (or previous MacBook or MacBook Pro) - it's been great!"

That may be true, but the new MacBook and MacBook Pro screens are really glossy - much more so than the MacBook Air or previous MacBooks.

See here - that's the old glossy MBP on the left (not even matte!), and the new one on the right:

(from this page: http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=3435&p=5)



2. "With a glassy display, the colors and contrast really pop off the screen!"

Again, that may be true, but if I go into the control settings of my TV and move the sliders all the way to the right, the colors also "pop" off of the screen and the picture looks really high contrast. Do I watch it that way? No, a supersaturated, ultra-high contrast image is not the final measure of a good image or screen for many people even though it may look great in the showroom.



3. "Neither matte screens nor glossy screens offer truly accurate color, so matte is no better than glossy. What's the big deal?"

That may be true with respect to color accuracy, but for many of us, the real issue with glossy screens is the problem of reflections. Would you read a book if it were printed on high gloss acetate? Even glossy magazines won't show an actual reflection. Again, see the linked image above.

Think of it this way: When are reflections on a computer screen ever a good thing? They're almost always a bad thing, which is why many people are willing to sacrifice a little color accuracy or "pop" to make them go away.



4. "But with the new LED screens, you can crank up the brightness to overpower any reflections!"

That may work if the software you use has a lighter colored user interface, which is probably common with web-browsing and email. But with darker interfaces (common in certain 3D programs, digital photographs of darker scenes, and even maybe websites) cranking up the brightness won't help much. From the Engadget review itself:

5. "I just like glossy better, and I don't really get why anyone would prefer matte!"

That's fine, and hardly anyone wants to take away your option for a glossy screen. However, many of us just want to have a matte screen option so that we can love our displays as much as you love your glossy one.

 

[garyoke]

OMG look at the glare in the side by sides.

Just so much to dislike about these laptops.btw speaking of glossy screens. I just finished watching Mirrors ---- scary
Looking closer at the image it seems it may just be the reflection. The Macbook pro logo looks to be at the same angle as the older one.

Do you own a new MBP? Or are you just responding to a post? I positively LOVE this machine - I work in a classroom with lots of overhead florescents - and I do some serious photography as well. I have NO problem with reflections - I don't know how that guy angled the screen, but it does not "reflect" my own experience.

 

[workerbee]

Yea, good luck finding a new windows laptop that doesn't have a glossy screen.

No, it should be "good luck in finding a new Mac laptop that doesn't have a glossy screen.

 

[kis]

Wow you're willing to switch to a Windows just because of the glossy screen!?! That's taking it a little too far. It's like saying that you were going to buy a BMW but it didn't come with the tinted windows you were hoping for so now you are just going to buy a Chrysler

Bad example. If I don't like the BMW, I'll go for a Merc or an Audi instead. That's where the problem's here - there are no alternatives. And if you actually read my post, you would have seen that I don't want to switch (and I haven't - I'll just be working on the old MBP I got from my employer instead and won't be buying any notebook in the foreseeable future at all).

As for the reviews: I've read three full reviews so far - all of them hated the screens. I've also read tons of "reviews" (that were just re-arrangements of Apple press-release) that didn't mention the screens. Apart from that: I've been to apple stores and vendors three times over the last 10 days and looked at the MBPs. I still hate the screen. What do you want me to do? Buy one anyway? Do you work for Apple?

 

[petvas]

The more I think about it the more I believe that the problem of the display isn't the glossy finishing. It is the glass! If it was only glossy I would buy it despite the fact that I prefer matte. Glossy displays look much better but have reflections. Now if you take a glossy display and put a glass in front of it you have a very impressive looking laptop mirror...You can really enjoy looking at the laptop because it is really beautiful but you can't use it...
We should see it coming before with the iMac...It uses the same design...I think in 3-5 years we will eventually get rid of this stupid design...

 

[volcom883]

anybody else out there not buying the new MBP just because of the reflection issue?

 

[petvas]

That's the second mail I sent to Steve Jobs:

"https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/586680/"

I don't think he will ever answer...

 

[Montag]

My MBP is incoming from China in the next few days. I was a bit concerned about the glossy screen before I ordered, but I realized two things:

1) When I checked out the machines in the Apple Store, I was doing so in the same kind of lighting conditions my home office uses: bright fluorescent lights, white walls, blond wood. It didn't bother me at all. Likewise, my fiancee has an old MacBook with a glossy screen, and she operates without any issues. Now, granted, it's not a glass screen, but...

2) I use my iPhone everywhere I go, and it has a glass screen. I don't really run into many reflection issues. Now, it's a much smaller screen, and it's far more mobile than a laptop, but it's an example of a glass, glossy screen working in wide open spaces.

I also heard more than one person -- one of the guys on TWiT specifically -- say he wasn't bothered by the reflections at all. That clinched it for me. I do videography, and while I'm not concerned with color accuracy (since I'm not using an $80,000 machine here), I do want color consistency, and the glossy screen doesn't sound like it fails in that regard. So, while it may be a deal breaker for you, for me the evidence is inconclusive, and I'm willing to give glossy a chance.