Epic Games Accuses Apple of Charging 'Unjustified Fees' for Required Non-App Store Purchase Link

[iOS Geek]

Oh my God, Sweeney...I have a toddler who whines and cries less than you...

 

[DocMultimedia]

Yeesh. Apple should just buy them and fire every single employee. Epic = junk

 

[BuffyzDead]

Your second sentence (in bold) is all conjecture and hypothesizing

You're also completely ignoring how much 3rd party Apps DRIVE iPhone sales
No 3rd party Apps? .... I got news for ya ... iPhone becomes a nothing burger

Now you are completely making up 100% BS.
Never ever has a consumer purchased a Smartphone because it runs a certain App.
EVER !!

I see you are on the side of developers, and that is fine. Perhaps you are a developer.
BUT IN NO WAY is any of this, about benefitting the End-User.

You have decided that developers are right and Apple is wrong. Again, your choice.
But if you think Epic is looking out for End-Users, then you are either trolling, or completely naive.

 

[Starflyer]

I don't know if they do or not. However, if game developers don't like Epic's game store terms, they can leave Epic and start their own store and sell directly to gamers, or partner up with someone else. There are other ways for them to reach gamers besides the Epic Game Store.

Now compare that to how Apple's App Store operates where Apple controls everything. Even when they're not hosting the content (e.g. games, movies, music) or paying for the infrastructure or payment processing (infrastructure costs for EU alternative app stores are handled by the developer), Apple still thinks it's entitled to a Core Tech Fee.

Epic should make their own phone and really make Apple pay.

 

[10anta]

Epic are a bunch of whiny crybabies.

Nothing short of Apple giving them everything for free will satisfy them.

I prefer not to reward tantrums.

 

[Amazing Iceman]

Now you are completely making up 100% BS.
Never ever has a consumer purchased a Smartphone because it runs a certain App.
EVER !!

I see you are on the side of developers, and that is fine. Perhaps you are a developer.
BUT IN NO WAY is any of this, about the End-User.

You have decided that developers are right and Apple is wrong. Again, your choice.
But if you think Epic is looking out for End-Users, then you are either trolling, or completely naive.

I’m a developer, and I prefer things continue the same, I don’t like this 3rd Party App Store bs.

 

[threeseed]

I se you are on the side of developers, and that is fine. Perhaps you are a developer.

They are not a developer and you can tell.

Because developers like me understand the huge benefits that the iOS brings compared to something like Steam or the Mac. App Store as a channel to market is far easier, cheaper and more effective than running Google or Meta Ads.

It's why there isn't some huge parade of developers aren't asking for the whole system to be scrapped.

 

[WiiDSmoker]

Apple has never prevented any company from using non-proprietary technologies to develop and distribute apps on Apple devices.

HTML 5 is an open standard. Java script is available widely. Any company can develop a web app, and distribute it on any 3rd party App Store developed with a similar technology, without paying Apple a dime, or getting Apple’s approval.

What Apple asked for, is if they use Apple technologies, like XCode, iOS SDKs, etc, to pay a commission on digital goods sold. Which almost every big company running subscriptions has bypassed now. Netflix, YouTube or Spotify, do not pay Apple a commission because they are signing up outside the App. And all the banking & finance apps, car apps, bakery apps, shopping apps, etc. They don’t pay Apple anything as well (other than the extremely low $100 a year membership). As they are not selling digital goods.

All this nonsense about 3rd party App Stores and external payment mechanisms are not about giving any real choice to the end-user or companies.

They are just about using Apple’s technologies for free. They want to use Xcode, Apple SDKs and all the polish for their apps that comes with using it, Apple training, Apple engineers’ time, the recognition and reachability that comes from the Apple App Store, all the vetting & advertising that Apple does to achieve it, etc. But they want it for free.

And The EU just making up special rules to do it, is nothing but forced extortion of Apple’s proprietary technologies.

In the process, they don’t care if they break down the trust and no-nonsense experience users buy Apple products for. Or maybe they do want to break it down.

There is little the Apple user in EU (or outside) stands to gain from these, other than a loss in quality of the ecosystem they’ve paid all these years for, just as much as Apple has worked hard building it.

That's what the $99 developer fee is for. Don't believe me? Go back and watch when SJ revealed it all.

 

[Starflyer]

They won't be hosting anything in a direct sales situation

How did the customer find the link to outside sale?

 

[sw1tcher]

If Epic doesn't like Apple's game store teams, they can leave Apple and start their own cell phone and sell directly to gamers, or partner up with someone else. There are other ways for them to reach gamers besides iOS and the App Store.

Tell me why your assertion about a theoretical developer leaving epic is any different than epic leaving apple?

How is it different? Seriously?

In my case, game developers wouldn't have to create a whole new device to reach their audience if they leave the Epic Game Store. And the audience doesn't have to go out and spend money on a new device when they already have one that's perfectly capable of playing the games. Imagine having to buy a new device with each and every new game you purchase? That would be a big road block to a games success.

That alone is a huge difference. The fact that you don't see that is just sad.

 

[Think|Different]

The entitlement is simply unreal.

 

[m4mario]

That's what the $99 developer fee is for. Don't believe me? Go back and watch when SJ revealed it all.

How did you forget the part where he mention the 30% commission?

 

[Timpetus]

I don’t think so, he is an idealist.

It feels like he's still just acting like one to get what he wants for his company. He's trying to sell it to the public as some idealistic mission, but when you think about what he's saying that's all just marketing fluff. He sees how much companies with successful digital stores are making and he wants a piece of that for himself, but without doing the work of building it from the ground up. Apple's just the high profile target, but I imagine Steam will be next if he gets his way.

 

[AppliedMicro]

The entitlement is simply unreal.

👉 Which one?

Apple's StoreKit External Purchase Link Entitlement?

I agree. Sounds simply unreal.

 

[2540497]

If epic spent the same amount on developers and producers than they do lawyers they might not have a dying catalogue of games

 

[Jensend]

Does Epic allow developers for games on Epic's game store to advertise payment outside of their store?

Yes.

https://store.epicgames.com/en-US/news/epic-games-store-launches-self-publishing-tools-for-game-developers-and-publishers

Publishers receive 88% of the revenue for the games sold through Epic Games Store with an option to use your own or a 3rd-party payment solution to receive 100% of the revenue from in-app purchases.

 

[spazzcat]

Your second sentence (in bold) is all conjecture and hypothesizing

You're also completely ignoring how much 3rd party Apps DRIVE iPhone sales
No 3rd party Apps? .... I got news for ya ... iPhone becomes a nothing burger

It's a two-way relationship most of these developers exist because of the iPhone and the iPhone benefits from having the apps. At the end of the day someone has to pay for the platform and that's what the devs do with their commission.

 

[Starflyer]

Epic is mad that they lost a TON of money and those with a casual interest (most players?) when Apple banned them from the App Store. Epic NEEDS Apple. Epic NEEDS the iPhone. Epic needs iPhone users. I think everyone is getting Epic fatigue and won't be relevant much longer IMO.

 

[AppliedMicro]

epic spent the same amount on developers and producers than they do lawyers

They're spending it on providing affordable commissions for sales through their store - to the benefit of developers and consumers alike.

12% - that's less than half of Apple's 30%.

 

[tridley68]

Probably just cheaper for Apple to buy Epic and close the company in the long run.

I agree

 

[victorvictoria]

What variety of cheese would you serve with this whine?

 

[tridley68]

Epic is like the little kid at the park with a ball if the other kids don't let me win the game all the time they take their ball and go home
Epic just go away forever

 

[mdriftmeyer]

a) Because Apple has a right to charge a fee for its SDKs. Same as Epic does with Unreal Engine.

b) Many companies over the years have brought up these arguments in court. They all fail because it's completely legal to charge a fee for people to use your products and services.

c) At no point is anyone forcing Epic to develop for iOS and at no point did anyone force them to sign the agreement between themselves and Apple.

And to this end Epic has check-mated themselves with all three points.

The entire history of software development on OS platforms has required large fees for Libraries, Frameworks, compiler tools, etc.

Millennials and Gen Z have no clue the investments accrued in the past to develop applications. iOS made the cost of entry extremely cheap yet they want it all FOR FREE.

My answer: Go develop the Hardware, Operating System, Developer Toolkits and Tools to create your own platform and then go give it away. See how many investors you get to cover your costs accrued in development.

 

[Student of Life]

How is it different? Seriously?

In my case, game developers wouldn't have to create a whole new device to reach their audience if they leave the Epic Game Store. And the audience doesn't have to go out and spend money on a new device when they already have one that's perfectly capable of playing the games. Imagine having to buy a new device with each and every new game you purchase? That would be a big road block to a games success.

That alone is a huge difference. The fact that you don't see that is just sad.

Nintendo does exactly what you are arguing and is one of the best and most profitable gaming companies....

 

[Jensend]

Does Epic allow developers for games on Epic's game store to advertise payment outside of their store?

Funny how this comment has 20 26 32 thumbs up so far, with people probably thinking it's a rhetorical question pointing out Epic's hypocrisy.

But the answer is yes. Does that at all change your attitude about Epic?