EU Approves Landmark Legislation to Regulate Apple and Other Big Tech Firms

[Unregistered 4U]

If Apple were to do that, they would have to shut down all services too on existing phones. Apple likely will not do that to their brand or bank account.

Apple’s bank account is already going to be hit when the region with the current lowest margin of profitability makes itself LESS profitable. It could become a situation where they cut their losses and focus on those areas with higher margins.

The services can still be available to the minority in the EU that have iPhones, they’d just have to set up accounts with addresses in other countries.

 

[pastrychef]

Even China doesn't do this.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

And it's going to be extremely difficult to achieve. I don't think the politician in EU even know all the difficulties every operator of a messaging service have to go through to make this successful.

The biggest problem as I see it, is where do you store the public keys for all devices for all messaging services?

This have been tried with email with very little success.

I’m pretty sure they had feedback, but everyone they spoke to told them “this is silly, it doesn’t work like that and you’re not going to get any company to agree to this.”. Annnd, they promptly ignored them.

 

[hans1972]

Why? The standard is already there, RCS. If every app must comply to RCS, you have interoperability. Of course iMessage would have exclusive and richer features, but at least some of them like read receipt, groups, file sharing... are supported

No, RCS requires a mobile network. These requirements are for providers of messaging services independent of the technologies used.

So if I create a messaging service running on a Raspberry Pie, I can demand that Apple provides some method for my application to send messages to users of iMessage on iPhones, iPads, Macs and other devices if supported by Apple. Even if I am a single developer with one user on my messaging platform.

 

[hans1972]

More options leads to no more options how?

You now won't have a device which is locked down and controlled by Apple. So one less choice than before.

 

[q64ceo]

This law would not exist had Apple not been so zealous in maintaining control so they could wring out every single cent that they could. These devices were crippled under the guise of security. I just wish Apple would have done the right thing earlier. We wouldn't be here if that were the case.

 

[t76turbo]

Why would an American company listen to a craphole organizatin like the EU???? They can pound sand. I own probably 6500 shares of aapl. I am ok if they stop selling in the EU countries.

 

[HMFIC03]

I sure hope that the people in Netherlands are demanding that their politicians are being transparent with where this money is or has gone.

Apple finds $5.5 million fine every week for months in the Netherlands instead of obey orders from the Authority for Consumers and Markets (ACM) to allow third-party payment systems in Dutch dating apps.

 

[hans1972]

I assume it will be like e-mail. Companies will have to make their protocols available to everyone, such the yes, you can DM someone from Instagram to Apple Messages.

This is probably the biggest benefit I see here to the actual users. Everything else mainly benefits other companies.

The reason why it works for email is that everyone uses the same "standards" like SMTP, MIME/HTML, DNS, SPF, DKIM, DMARC etc. And even here there are interoperability problems.

And email encryption across systems is almost non-existent.

The problem is there are very few standards in the encryption space. Everyone is using their own technology.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

No, RCS requires a mobile network. These requirements are for providers of messaging services independent of the technologies used.

So if I create a messaging service running on a Raspberry Pie, I can demand that Apple provides some method for my application to send messages to users of iMessage on iPhones, iPads, Macs and other devices if supported by Apple. Even if I am a single developer with one user on my messaging platform.

I would guess we’re going to see some adjustment to the regulation that’s been published. What they’re pushing for can’t be provided without reducing the security of all the partners.

Now, if the EU wanted to fund upgrading all of the cellular infrastructure in the EU such that it’s proper RCS at the carriers THEN you’d have something approaching a replacement for SMS. However, it’s clear the EU really doesn’t have any ‘big thinkers’ when it comes to regulations.

 

[Shirasaki]

Just first page and it’s already extremely polarising, even coming up with “charges per app use”. Like what? You REALLY that badly want apple to become the worlds first $10T company?

And no one realise, being too successful is also a problem, depending on how you get there. I’m all heart with EU spearheading the war against tech giants because they have all become way too powerful in manipulating people nowadays, even more so than government would’ve dreamed of. Methods may be up to debate, but intention is good.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Why would an American company listen to a craphole organizatin like the EU???? They can pound sand. I own probably 6500 shares of aapl. I am ok if they stop selling in the EU countries.

The EU is hoping that, at the next shareholders meeting, shareholders don’t vote to re-allocate investments redirecting them to countries where the return on investment has historically been higher.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

I sure hope that the people in Netherlands are demanding that their politicians are being transparent with where this money is or has gone.

Apple finds $5.5 million fine every week for months in the Netherlands instead of obey orders from the Authority for Consumers and Markets (ACM) to allow third-party payment systems in Dutch dating apps.

Over 50 million dollars could do a LOT for the Dutch economy. I’m sure it’s being used for good causes.

 

[genovelle]

not really the new law just gives more options for devs and users

Not really. It creates a disincentive for apple to invest heavily in their platform.

 

[pastrychef]

If all the smartphone makers followed this, every smartphone sold in the EU would basically be the same with no differentiation between any of them other than hardware specs.

 

[R3k]

Though I don't have a problem personally with having iOS is locked down and I understand the benefits it actually brings us as users, I do feel that big corp needs more regulation in general and this is a step in the right direction.

Sure, to a degree Apple and Google have their users's interests in mind, and I think its fair to have your information sold in order to use a free service like Gmail. But ultimately a corporation is beholden to its shareholders and continual profit and its not necessarily good for them to have free range when we have no other practical options.

 

[MecPro]

So, for the record, you are fine with Apple (and all other companies) opening up encryption, right?

Because that's the only way you are going to get "interoperability" as the EU are wanting it.

Most Encryption ciphers/algorithms are open.

There is a misconception that hiding encryption algorithms makes things more secure. But that’s not true.

With encryption the thing that should be secret isn’t the algorithm; but the private keys

 

[ApplesAreSweet&Sour]

But why would any private businesses spend hundreds of millions on r&d to create any kind of new product if the product and all its associated software and services are essentially nationalised to the point of being financial liabilities?

If these regulations are actually implemented 1/1 as they are written here then the EU smartphone industry is dead in less than a year including all the app-based businesses in the EU.

 

[genovelle]

The law legislation said it must ensure end-to-end encryption between all parties, so no.

What is the use of encryption when criminal enterprises can just release their unvetted malware on app stores out of Apple’s reach and gain access to the device keys.



I hope Apple is brave enough to protect us from these idiots by exiting the EU or closing the App Store altogether and supporting only 1st party apps. Allow consumers to choose the OS they want. They should Offer an open sourced version that supports this foolishness and stops at this version and an Apple supported OS with new features and apps provided as unlimited subscriptions like Arcade.

 

[Shirasaki]

View attachment 2026461

And reagen ends up working in the government and for the government anyways, just fyi.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

The reason why it works for email is that everyone uses the same "standards" like SMTP, MIME/HTML, DNS, SPF, DKIM, DMARC etc. And even here there are interoperability problems.

And email encryption across systems is almost non-existent.

The problem is there are very few standards in the encryption space. Everyone is using their own technology.

“I assume driving to Europe from Kansas would work a lot like driving from Kansas to Ohio. It’s all still just driving.”

There are standards in encryption, it’s just that, as part of implementing an encryption standard, you choose a secret “key” to “lock” the messages, the network, etc. To be most secure, that “key” must reside within your own organization. Sharing it to even one other entity makes it less secure. Sharing it with “every other messaging operator” makes it REALLY less secure.

I think that, as long as “encryption” is taken off the table, interoperability is possible, just have the apps plug in to the existing SMS system.

 

[Stromos]

Already see how this is going to play out.

Want to be an Apple Developer?
1. 10K entry free first year.
2. Year 2+ provide financial records of last years profits from app regardless of how you do transactions bypassing Apple etc. Provide Apple 20% of previous year profits to continue being a developer. That includes ad revenue from "free" apps. That includes anything related to the app.

Don't want to pay? Then your app won't run in that years iOS update because Apps are locked to the version they are complied on. No access to xcode unless you are a paying developer.

 

[sorgo †]

And reagen ends up working in the government and for the government anyways, just fyi.

And he was a conservative, something of which we don’t have nearly enough in modern government.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

But why would any private businesses spend hundreds of millions on r&d to create any kind of new product if the product and all its associated software and services are essentially nationalised to the point of being financial liabilities?

If these regulations are actually implemented 1/1 as they are written here then the EU smartphone industry is dead in less than a year including all the app-based businesses in the EU.

You’ve answered my question of “Why doesn’t the EU produce any cellular phones or cellular phone OS’s or cellular phone app stores?” Seems like to me, working within the EU to produce a competitor would provide more advantages to the EU. But, again, that would require forethought and vision. Just fining others only requires a few bytes in a document.

 

[jclardy]

This is both good, and bad. And 100% Apple's own fault for being so staunch in their resistance to giving any ground to third party payment providers.

The App Store open-ness is good and will ultimately result in a better, more secure platform for those that stay within the App Store bounds.

The messaging inter-op is very bad and going to be a nightmare if actually attempted. But again, Apple shot themselves in the foot by not just slightly loosening App Store rules when world governments started looking into this.