EU Consumer Group Summarizes How Apple Fails to Comply With DMA

[janl]

EU antitrust chief Margrethe Vestager is out after 10 years. I hope the DMA soon follows.
As a indie developer I’m a ’trader’ for the DMA and have to publish my private address in any App Store I use.
For me that is an absolute ‘no go’. So that means I’m no longer a developer… thank you, EU!
That‘s a big fail of the DMA.

 

[IllegitimateValor]

“Oh no! Won’t somebody please defend/think of the trillion dollar corporations!”

This forum, every single EU article

Many in the US absolutely cannot comprehend government action being a good thing. We’ve long surpassed the era of governments. We’re in the era of corporations. Consumers must do all we can to wrest power back from them and the many politicians they’ve bought to maintain their edge.

 

[fivetoedbear]

I’m not sure it’s a DMA issue, but I assume it has something to do with not giving third party AIs access to the same data as Apple Intelligence.

After looking at the Windows Recall debacle, I sure as hell want the AI companies far away from my phone. (I'm pro AI, but let's just say that I give the sideeye to using AI from Google or Meta...).

I am an Apple customer for reasons, and one of those reasons is that I chose to trust Apple with my privacy, and to defend my privacy and security from companies and governments that would like to crack things open and let unscrupulous companies in.

You'll say that I can always only use the App Store, and that sounds great until Facebook (which thanks to its dominance and network effect, is a necessary evil) decides it's only going to work on mobile if you get it from the Meta Store, and just bypass the protections that Apple enforces (and refuses web browsers). It's pretty bad that the modern equivalent of the old wired phone network is an information-gathering company that tries to spy on you wherever you go, but here we are.

The worst of this is that while I would be all for some reforms at Apple (better app store fees, play nice with Netflix and Spotify, more app substitution choices), a pile of bureaucrats from far away is hellbent on just breaking everything.

I think the consumer ends up little more than a bargaining chip in this battle. The EU will win, consumers' privacy will be exploited.

I'm older, and I'm glad I got to live through several golden eras of computing, before consumerism, corporatism, bureaucrats and capitalist cult leaders ruin it all.

 

[rizzo41999]

Apple Intelligence will come to the EU, just later than to the rest of the world. Considering it is still in its diapers, not a big deal.

American firms want to do business in Europe as much as elsewhere where they can make profit. And guess what? 400+ million people generate a lot of profit. Meantime China’s growth figures are down, Russia is sanctioned out and 90% of people in other potentially big markets (like India) simply cannot afford Apple’s products. This has nothing to do with the EU, just an economic reality. So no, Apple is not leaving the EU any time soon.

And the most ironic bit is that Apple could have easily made it all go away by aligning its iOS/iPadOS policies to those of macOS.

I think that's the problem...The EU seems to think that American firms would not be what they are without European consumers but by simply looking at the data, it's clear that there are other markets - even outside of China and Europe that contribute to Apple's overall success. To some, that's typical European arrogance - "If it weren't for us..." Truth is, the older generations failed Europe because there's not enough working folks to service the debt so there's really not much to look forward to, from a market/consumption standpoint, I'm afraid.

Writing is on the wall and US firms will pivot accordingly if there is any risk to margin.

 

[God of Biscuits]

Complaining that the browser choice screen is confusing AND should provide more information is *chef's kiss*

Because Apple isn't famous for making things easy to use. Or something like that. Rip. Mix. Burn.

 

[szabogabor10]

What a pathetic entity the EU has become. Shame.

 

[Biro]

Just the fact that if you want to do a cloud backup, you MUST use iCloud (with only 5GB of free storage, not per device but per Apple ID) is something that should end in 2024.

For 99 cents a month - virtually free - you can get 50GB of backup space in iCloud.

 

[breenmask]

It's OK to admit Apple has had some anti-competitive and anti-consumer practices. You do not have to defend a trillion dollar corporation all the time.

Please click accept cookies to continue talking in this thread (thanks to the EU). 🤣

 

[MilaM]

Bravo 👏. One step closer to a usable iPhone and iPad. I think very soon Apple will recognize how user hostile some of their policies have been and roll out all those features worldwide. You can thank us Europeans and the EU later 🎉.

 

[blazerunner]

I'm convinced the EU has no understanding of Apple's main customer.

They know very well of how technologically inept Apple consumers are, easiest consumers to deceive.

 

[blazerunner]

You do not have to defend the dma all of the time.

You do not have to defend Apple all the time.

 

[webkit]

Referees generally don't force teams to share their playbooks with the other teams because it would be "unfair" for one team to have a better strategy that gives them an advantage.

If a football analogy is going to be used here, I don’t think this is really about "sharing playbooks" but rather allowing "visiting teams" to have similar access to and use of the field and sidelines as the "home team."

Apple (the "home team") is allegedly making it more difficult for "visiting teams" to call plays, make substitutions, call timeouts, allow cheerleaders on the sidelines, etc.

 

[webkit]

Imagine going into a car dealer. Pick one - Toyota/Nissan/Subaru/VW/Chevrolet/Ford/Maserati. You tell the sales person "I want your Toyota/Nissan/Subaru/VW/Chevrolet/Ford/Maserati but I want a Toyota/Nissan/Subaru/VW/Chevrolet/Ford/Maserati engine that's not what you make. I demand that the installation be easy and I demand that you warranty the car to work exactly as I wish it to with this different engine."

That’s not really what is happening here. It would be more like, but still not exactly like, going to a major car dealership and them telling you that you must use their bank to finance the car, their insurance company to insure the car, their gas or electric stations to fuel the car, aftermarket accessories must be purchased and paid for through their dealership, etc.

 

[jlc1978]

they do not complain that iOS is missing features that Android has

What about messaging interoperability?

Nowhere did it say to mess with US phones when they enter the EU. That’s their own choice.

Not sure that is happening. A family members phone works just fine in the EU, with no weird things. The only issue we had is the Vodaphone rep insisting it has a sim slot and wanting to pry it open, despite being told it's a US phone with no SIM slot; and another clueless one that when she went to add another month screwed up the refill and created a whole new sim.

As a indie developer I’m a ’trader’ for the DMA and have to publish my private address in any App Store I use.

That was my biggest fear - the small developers will be collateral damage while the big players continue to fight over how they divide the ∏.

 

[Luap]

I personally love that there are organisations out there dedicated to protecting consumers. That there are regulators out there that are actually willing to act on those concerns is even better.

The complaints about that on this forum are asinine.

Likewise, your views could be seen as naive.

 

[vantelimus]

Because Apple isn't famous for making things easy to use. Or something like that. Rip. Mix. Burn.

Apple isn’t famous for that since the passing of Jobs. Apple’s UIs have gotten steadily less easy to use and more Microsoft-like now that there isn’t a person at the top who knows what the products are supposed to do and cares enough to be an a$$hole about making sure everything “just works”. It doesn’t bode well for Apple in the long run. But for the short term, they are still coasting on inertia from Jobs. Once Cook is gone, Wall Street will run the corporation. The golden days are gone and the afterglow won’t last forever.

 

[Powerbooky]

I hope most people realize these rules are to protect consumers by giving them the freedom of choice. If big tech companies try to lock you in or misuse their power, it’s great to have those rules as a consumer.

If you don’t agree with it, you can just use the AppStore and all the default apps Apple is giving you. Nothing changes for you!

But now you’ve the possibility to use other stores, apps that weren’t possible before.

Be glad the EU uses their power by giving you freedom.

Otherwise we would still have the lightning cable and the new iMessage couldn’t communicate other than with other iPhones.

These rules aren’t only for Apple but apply to all big tech companies.

Protect what? Users always had the freedom of choice. It actual problem are the high store fees. The EU could have regulated those fees instead. They did the same with the credit card and payment services business.

 

[ProbablyDylan]

What about messaging interoperability?

I genuinely don't see a downside for that. Did anyone have an issue with being able to send an SMS to other brand's phones?

As a plus, we would ideally get to keep just using iMessage instead of having to switch to some Meta garbage. Like the EU, I'm not worried about how it works, just that it does.

 

[waltman]

The EU should make a "consumer-friendly" phone by themselves.

 

[DocMultimedia]

Luckily anyone under 30 believes they deserve a good life and should never pay a dime for anything. Illegally stream everything, get free apps, free OS, free food, free music, yada yada. I'm glad I'm old and won't be around to see the outcome of the recent generations.

Apple should provide every single thing for free. So should REI. And Netflix. And Amazon. No one should ever charge for anything.

Bye world. It's happening.

 

[jlc1978]

I genuinely don't see a downside for that. Did anyone have an issue with being able to send an SMS to other brand's phones?

As a plus, we would ideally get to keep just using iMessage instead of having to switch to some Meta garbage. Like the EU, I'm not worried about how it works, just that it does.

True, but I suspect the EU wants more than SMS or why bother mentioning interoperability unless you want to force What’s App to open up??

 

[ProbablyDylan]

True, but I suspect the EU wants more than SMS or why bother mentioning interoperability unless you want to force What’s App to open up??

Meta is also a gatekeeper. Google too. EU is basically telling them to play nice or else. Not that I mind.

 

[QuarterSwede]

Wow. Every single one of these complaints is 100% bought and paid for by Spotify and other E.U. member lobby. There is no reasonable version of reality where a governing body actually gets this specific with what a software company can do with their own platform, when its not being manipulated by parties that stand to gain. What a disgrace.

When you’re considered abusing monopolistic behaviors governments can get this specific if they so choose. Doesn’t matter if you agree with them on that or not.

 

[CyclingHermit]

Bravo 👏. One step closer to a usable iPhone and iPad. I think very soon Apple will recognize how user hostile some of their policies have been and roll out all those features worldwide. You can thank us Europeans and the EU later 🎉.

No thank you. I love my iPhone and iPad just as they are, without third party crap, and without iOS changes to support third party crap. The EU can go F itself here. And I’m writing this from Europe, to be clear.

 

[Timo_Existencia]

Many in the US absolutely cannot comprehend government action being a good thing. We’ve long surpassed the era of governments. We’re in the era of corporations. Consumers must do all we can to wrest power back from them and the many politicians they’ve bought to maintain their edge.

Yeah, like simply not buying products from companies you don't like and don't support. Not that hard, really.