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European Commission Joins Investigation of Apple's Flash Exclusion Policies
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Well I couldn't ask the cat to hold the camera.ZOMG - Anuba's the invisible man!
Isn't there a difference between not including support for Flash in part of your product lineup and "banning" it? They are doing nothing to stop you from installing it on an iOS device. They are just not helping you.
Technically, that's true with regard to the Flash Player plugin, although they did explicitly ban apps created in Flash and compiled with the Flash-to-iPhone software. That's the part that the FTC and the EC are looking into anyway... the Flash Player is semi-OT.
Why do you feel the need to lie in order to cover Apple ?
I don't. I may be misinformed, but I'm not lying. What are they doing to prevent you from installing the Flash Player other than not supporting it?
They... run a curated app store that blocks out any software they don't approve of? If you want to define that as "not helping", that's your call I would refer to it as "actively preventing".
Where on the App Store can I download Flash without any instructions or help ? Or if the App store is too much help, please point me to an IPA I can install on my Apple stock phone (not jailbroken). Apple is actively banning Flash. On to the next point to prove it even more :
And seriously, you're not misinformed. You were there in the threads when Adobe shipped the Flash-to-iPhone compiler and just the day before when Apple changed the wording to their developer agreement to prevent using it.
So either you have a terribly selective memory, or you're lying to cover Steve's ass.
First, the app store doesn't even do plugins, so I'm not sure what you are proposing is what most Flash supporters are expecting. Second, it is now legal for you to jailbreak in order to install third party apps, so you aren't prevented from doing anything.
But Apple will not honor the warranty on a jailbroken phone and they do not permit installing anything outside of the App store unless you're jailbroken. Sounds kinda more like "putting up barriers" than just "not helping".
And again, Flash-to-iPhone compiler. Active. Ban.
Stop wasting our time and insulting our intelligence by trying to rewrite history.
"Legal" has nothing to do with it, Apple doesn't make laws. The recent DCMA exemption may formally have made jailbreaking legal, but Apple still maintains that jailbreaking can violate the warranty.
And again, this isn't about the Flash plugin. The FTC and the EC are investigating the issue of Apple refusing to accept applications made with anything other than their own tools.
Did you purposely ignore the distinction that I made?
Adding a Flash Player to the App Store would require active support on Apple's part. It would not provide the experience that most people would expect from the Flash Player unless Apple added third party plugin support to Safari and the ability to install plugins from the App Store.
And why add the "not jailbroken" requirement? If you are not expecting Apple to support the plugin, then what is the problem with jailbreaking to install it?
And seriously, you're not misinformed. You were there in the threads when Adobe shipped the Flash-to-iPhone compiler and just the day before when Apple changed the wording to their developer agreement to prevent using it.
Yes, they banned the Flash-to-iPhone compiler. I'm not arguing that. Obviously, the Flash Player and the Flash compiler are two different topics. I thought it was pretty clear which one I was addressing.
And you continue with the fanboy card. How about sticking to the discussion?
I like to have a warranty on my equipment and be able to take it in if something happens. I like being able to upgrade to the newest software so that security bugs that can own my phone (like the current PDF vulnerability in Apple's font loading code) are fixed in a timely manner.
Jailbreaking is a big hassle. However, it is required in order to install IPAs without going through the App Store. Apple is making darn sure that you don't do that... like if they were ACTIVELY putting EFFORTS toward that goal.
Your argument makes no sense, either way. Including :
No, it was clear you were trying to purposefully avoid the Flash-to-iPhone compiler issue, because it just destroyed your argument that Apple is not putting efforts towards banning Flash.
Now even you admit you were wrong. It's ok. It seems I was right in saying you felt the need to lie too, since you've "recalled" the issue, just were just "not arguing about that".
And then you wonder why people think you might be a bit biased ? (I didn't say fanboy, you said that).
Again, warranty is only related to Apple support.
Again, sorry for being unclear. Only speaking to Flash Player.
It's a forum. I'm trying to have a discussion. I make no requirements on your time. And you are the only one making insults. I haven't said a single thing that is a lie or a history rewrite in this thread. We just are looking at things from different points of view.
My point was that it is now legal because of the DMCA exemption. That takes away a major barrier to alternative app stores. Nothing is preventing you from installing Flash Player except for your technical knowledge and your desire for Apple support.
Again, I apologize for being unclear. I was only addressing the plugin.
*sigh*. Where did you even get this plugin ? Adobe never announced nor intended to ship one officially outside of "were working on it". The only Flash for iOS support that was announced is the Flash-to-iPhone compiler.
And that is what everybody is discussing, including what the FTC and EC are looking into. Why would they look into rumors and vaporware and not a shipping product ?
I never insulted you either. You're making stuff up, again. That's a fact, not an insult.
No, it's not. A warranty is there to assure that I have a fully working unit without any manufacturing issues. If Apple doesn't honor their warranty, I might get stuck paying for a fix that should not be on my to pay for. I don't care about Apple support, but I want them to assume the financial burden of their manufacturing defects if one ever creeps up.
And you completely ignored the updates to the software that fix security holes that can leave your phone open to malicious attacks. Jailbroken phones that update will lose everything, even if it was "legally" obtained through Cydia. How is that not "putting up barriers" ? I don't give a hoot about the Genius bar or Applecare, but I want my phone to be both secure and warrantied.
Again, insulting our intelligence by making stuff up and passing it off as fact. And again, this is a fact, not an insult. It is what you are doing.
And that is what everybody is discussing, including what the FTC and EC are looking into. Why would they look into rumors and vaporware and not a shipping product ?
I never insulted you either. You're making stuff up, again. That's a fact, not an insult.
No, it's not. A warranty is there to assure that I have a fully working unit without any manufacturing issues. If Apple doesn't honor their warranty, I might get stuck paying for a fix that should not be on my to pay for. I don't care about Apple support, but I want them to assume the financial burden of their manufacturing defects if one ever creeps up.
And you completely ignored the updates to the software that fix security holes that can leave your phone open to malicious attacks. Jailbroken phones that update will lose everything, even if it was "legally" obtained through Cydia. How is that not "putting up barriers" ? I don't give a hoot about the Genius bar or Applecare, but I want my phone to be both secure and warrantied.
Again, insulting our intelligence by making stuff up and passing it off as fact. And again, this is a fact, not an insult. It is what you are doing.
You are arguing something that I never claimed. I did not say that Apple makes it easy to install Flash Player. I did not say that Apple sells Flash Player. I did not say that Apple does not ban it from the App Store.
All I said is that they do not ban it from the iPhone. You can install it if you want to. That's my only point.
You mean fixing security vulnerabilities.
I'm pretty sure that I know what I meant better than you. I did not consider the Flash compiler issue at all when I made the original post.
Now even you admit you were wrong. It's ok. It seems I was right in saying you felt the need to lie too, since you've "recalled" the issue, just were just "not arguing about that".
No, you were wrong.
Are you claiming to not be a bit biased?
Because there is a difference between calling someone a fanboy and accusing them of trying "to cover Steve's ass"?
Biased for ? I own both a Mac and iPhone, don't have Flash Professional installed, nor any knowledge of how to write Actionscript.
What is my bias in this ? Biased towards the truth ?
The rest of your post, is again, rewriting reality in regards to jailbreaking and the efforts Apple puts toward it and not letting you run unblessed code.
Let's take your original statement again :
It is false. To claim it is true in the context of some imaginary "flash plugin" is ludicrous and an insult to our collective intelligence. Flash support for iOS right now is limited to the Flash-to-iPhone compiler. Apple is doing something to stop us from installing it. In fact they are doing many things :
- Rewriting their dev agreement in order to prevent code written in Actionscript from getting onto the App Store.
- Preventing you from installing IPAs that aren't blessed by Apple and don't come from the App Store.
- If you do get around their barriers and install unblessed code, they will refuse to honor the warranty on your device, leaving you with a financial burden in case of a manufacturing defect. They will also prevent you from installing security fixes for vulnerabilities.
So "They are just not help you" is quite the insult. Again. You. Were. Wrong. To claim otherwise or that "you just weren't arguing about that" is just showing that you don't want to admit it.
Are you trying to say that they are banning a plugin that doesn't exist?
Whatever.
Calling me a liar and accusing me of lying to cover Steve's ass are insults.No, it's not. A warranty is there to assure that I have a fully working unit without any manufacturing issues. If Apple doesn't honor their warranty, I might get stuck paying for a fix that should not be on my to pay for. I don't care about Apple support, but I want them to assume the financial burden of their manufacturing defects if one ever creeps up.
And you completely ignored the updates to the software that fix security holes that can leave your phone open to malicious attacks. Jailbroken phones that update will lose everything, even if it was "legally" obtained through Cydia. How is that not "putting up barriers" ? I don't give a hoot about the Genius bar or Applecare, but I want my phone to be both secure and warrantied.
Again, insulting our intelligence by making stuff up and passing it off as fact. And again, this is a fact, not an insult. It is what you are doing.
How are those things not considered Apple support?
What's my bias? I own one Mac, one iPod touch, two Windows 7 machines and run Windows XP and Ubuntu in virtual machines. What does that prove?
My bias is anti-flash on iOS. Your bias is pro-flash on iOS.
And, again, by that you mean that they fix security vulnerabilities.
I think I made it clear that they are banning the Flash-to-iPhone compiler, since this discussion never was about a plugin that doesn't exist, except where you tried to make it so to prevent being wrong.
Whatever.
No, they are statements of facts. You were lying since you now have admitted to have full knowledge of the Flash-to-iPhone compiler and its surrounding issues. So your first comments were lies. You just spun it as "not arguing about that" to not admit it.
Fact.
If they are, they you are grossly misrepresenting the importance of "Apple support" in order to support you warped world view.
No, they also make darn sure that whatever you legally acquired after a jailbreak gets wiped. They don't just fix the vulnerabilities, they make sure that in order to get the fix and secure your device, you lose anything you've gained by "legally" jailbreaking it.
Who are you to decide what the discussion was about? I've repeatedly said that my claim (which is what we are discussing) has nothing to do with the Flash compiler.
Statement of fact: "Your statement is incorrect."
Insult: "You are a liar."
Where did I ever say that I didn't know about the Flash compiler? I said that I was only talking about the Flash Player. And I apologized for not being more specific in my original statement. No spin, despite your uncanny confidence in knowing what I meant better than me.
If they are, they you are grossly misrepresenting the importance of "Apple support" in order to support you warped world view.
I'm not misrepresenting anything. You are assuming that I am implying things that I am not.
No, they also make darn sure that whatever you legally acquired after a jailbreak gets wiped. They don't just fix the vulnerabilities, they make sure that in order to get the fix and secure your device, you lose anything you've gained by "legally" jailbreaking it.
Do you really think that that has anything to do with Apple rooting out jailbreaking? I'm pretty sure that's just how the installer works. I doubt they considered jailbroken apps and data when they designed the installer.