Flash Player Performance on Droid 2 Found to Be Hit-or-Miss at Best

[faroZ06]

Silverlight 2.0b2 was actually PowerPC compatible.

However, the final Microsoft release of Silverlight 2.0 denies PowerPC installation even though it will work if you remove a file from the package.

But the bigger dilemma is where in the world can you find a copy of Silverlight 2.0 now that it's up to 4.0?

I can only find 1.0 and 4.0

The real question is: WHY do you want Silverlight? I installed that piece of @#$% and it did nothing but waste space and processor power.

Anyway, that happened with Spore. I'm running 10.5.0. It said I need 10.5.6 or later, but I tricked it into thinking I was running 10.7 so it installed and it works.

 

[faroZ06]

This outta slap down some confidence...

The things that Droid users/fanboys always say: The Droid has a user replaceable battery, keyboard, unlimited apps, and Flash.

Finally, I can laugh in the face of those people because Flash sucks on mobile devices. Finally people will see why Apple denied Adobe. It was purely to keep the superior quality of their products.

Anyway, why do you need a user-replaceable battery? That just means it doesn't hold as much charge, but when it dies (won't charge anymore) you can change it yourself...is that because you can't go to Google to change it? Hmmm. It's like a Windows PC. You can't get support because it's Microsoft OS on (example) Dell hardware. You call about it not booting up for instance. You somehow manage to get a real person to talk to (which is near impossible at MS) "Is this a hardware or software issue? Contact Dell." Ah great.
With the iPhone, if it dies, just take it to Apple and they'll replace the battery.

Keyboard...unneccessary. The touch screen works just fine. It's just more breakable parts.

Unlimited apps...remember that news about crazy apps that are messing Droids up...yeah... And none of the apps are actually good. The App store has a way better selection even if it is limited, and there's always jailbreaking

 

[Compile 'em all]

Pretty funny that a dedicated Mac site has Android news. Android must be doing something right.

Android isn't doing anything right.

The news is relevant because it is related to the nerd rage the Steve Jobs's "thoughts about flash" letter generated.

 

[bkspero]

Put that into perspective..

Well, just for mobile, but mobile is where the web is still exploding in functionality. Let's say Android and the iPhone pass 300 million soon. Half a billion in a couple of years, etc. -- that's a lot of people who really use the wireless web.

The world will buy almost 400 million PCs this year alone.

Functionality is, I agree, growing more quickly in the mobile space. Mainly because mobile was so much more limited previously. But one of the major functionality improvements is the development of Flash on mobile. And that development has happened in far and away the fastest growing platform in the mobile space...Android OS. It has already blown past iOS and is breathing down hard on Blackberry. Despite Android still only being in the early stages of developing its international distribution compared to either of those other two systems.

So, we have Flash flourishing on 90% of the PCs that comprise the vast majority of web accessing, and even on the newest versions of the 10% or so running OS-X. Plus we have v1 of mobile Flash running tolerably on a very large and the fastest growing segment of the mobile market, with the expectation of continued improvement as both the hardware and software mature.

So, to paraphrase Mark Twain..."The Rumors of Flash's Death Have Been Greatly Exaggerated."

 

[KnightWRX]

Finally, I can laugh in the face of those people because Flash sucks on mobile devices. Finally people will see why Apple denied Adobe.

You can do that based on 1 article by 1 unknown magazine that contradicts what every user has been saying about it for the time since the first Beta has been available ?

I think you're the one who'll get laughed at when Apple finally says "We think Adobe have done some great work in these past months and we now feel confident Flash will be a great addition to iOS and it will co-exist with our HTML5 support until developers decide to move on. We believe in choice and today Apple gives it to you".

 

[Lesser Evets]

The things that Droid users/fanboys always say: The Droid has a user replaceable battery, keyboard, unlimited apps, and Flash.

• Flash sucks on mobile devices. Finally people see why Apple denied Adobe.

• Why do you need a user-replaceable battery? ... because you can't go to Google to change it? With the iPhone, if it dies, just take it to Apple and they'll replace the battery.

• Keyboard... just more breakable parts.

• Unlimited apps... And none of the apps are actually good.

That sums it up for me. Total agreement. Bloatech/Clunktech people rally around the past and cling on with fear in their eyes.

 

[DrFreeman]

This is getting ridiculous!

A few years ago everyone was praying for Flash to die! Now the same people are objecting to its demise because of freedom of choice for consumers etc.

Since when Flash is the good guy in town!

 

[Salacion]

Wow, 17 pages (and counting) of hot air - these macrumors editors know how to get the clicks in. Flash debates must be a cash cow for all the blogs out there at the moment .

I'll throw my oar in. I run Froyo 2.2 on an antiquated (7 months old!) Nexus One. Flash works absolutely perfectly when I want to view it (using on-demand browser setting). I browsed around miniclip.com and all of the silly games there seemed playable (not that I'd bother - native apps are much better currently on mobile devices). It's also great when trawling the tech sites (including here) to be able to click on any video content posted knowing it'll work. Fed up with being treated like a second class citizen on my iPad and previous iPhone. Obviously not everyone has got the Jobsian message that Flash is already dead and buried...

If Macrumors would like to run a piece on how well Flash runs on my device (though I'm sure I'm not unique in that score) then feel free to drop me a PM. It may even generate more clicks, and well know what clicks mean .

That's great for you, but you're not in the majority.

 

[KnightWRX]

That sums it up for me. Total agreement. Bloatech/Clunktech people rally around the past and cling on with fear in their eyes.

Care to elaborate how we can replicate Flash's functionality in the present ? Until we can, all this HTML5 talk is for the future, and in the future, I won't have my present phone, I'll have another one.

So why not give me a phone with a choice and then when HTML5 has finally caught up and does provide the same features as Flash, drop it ?

It's a fallacy to think both can't co-exist. The black and white choice is simply wrong. Google got it right. Ship Webkit with its HTML5 support (and they ship a more recent build than Apple, so the Android browser actually has better HTML5 support, like Chrome does over Safari) and let Adobe into the Android Market. Users get to access everything.

Devs that can move to HTML5 because what they need exists and is ready can, Devs that need features provided by Flash but not by HTML5 can still use it to deliever their stuff.

That is how open computing should be. It's not just about open specs (which Flash has) and open source. It's about choice in technologies.

That's great for you, but you're not in the majority.

You're saying his phone is special ? He got a magic Nexus One that performs better than other Nexus One owners ? He is the majority. All Nexus One owners and reporting great Flash performance and that most games and site "just work" even though they never had touch UIs in mind. It's not perfect, and that's why you can set it to on-demand.

It's actually the LAPTOP article discussed here which is not in the majority. It contradicts every report, some even made by members here, about Flash's capabilities and performance on Android handsets. The only people that are brandishing this as pure fact are people that have never owned an Android phone with Froyo and just wants Steve to not have been wrong all along so they won't look like fools when he is proven wrong.

This is getting ridiculous!

A few years ago everyone was praying for Flash to die! Now the same people are objecting to its demise because of freedom of choice for consumers etc.

Since when Flash is the good guy in town!

It's wrong to think everyone defending Flash doesn't want to see HTML5 succeed. I for one would rather have HTML5 with proper SVG, CSS and DOM in browsers so that Flash can go on its merry way.

Flash is a necessary evil unfortunately. The fact is, HTML5 isn't ready, it isn't complete and browser support is lacking. Until it catches up, choice for consumers is important, because in the end, it's more important that a consumer can see your site than your site being written entirely in some future technology that's not yet ready.

 

[MorphingDragon]

Who's to say it's not easy to find it ? Remember, people posting these comments don't even own Android phones.

And Flash is not stock on Android, you need to grab it from the Android Market, so that's strike 2 against people whining. You need to actively go out of your way to even install it, and then in the settings you can choose weather it's on all the time or at a click.

Seriously, stop commenting if you don't have a clue about it. Flash doesn't slow down your phone unless you really want it to.

I own a Nexus One Knight, everything is so hidden, I didn't know that you could click to flash on Froyo till now.

 

[bkspero]

Striking difference

Thanks.

I've never even looked at Sliverlight.

I did one search for a demo and the 1st thing I found was a on screen magnifying glass.

Perhaps it was a bad example. Judge for yourself.

Silverlight Magnifying demo:
http://demo.componentone.com/Silverlight/ControlExplorer/#ImageMagnifier/See it in action

Flash based Magnifying demo:
http://www.flabell.com/files/218_e1006_9d139e3a09e531d63440852b89b7dc0b/deploy/index.html


Note: I don't care WHAT we move on towards using, but PLEASE make it better than what we have been using in the past.

Which is the biggest part of the Problem Flash is SO GOOD.

There, I've said it.

The fact that for many reasons Adobe have not been able to hit the mac's hardware for years to get the best speed from it, is a totally separate issue.

Striking how much better, and even faster loading, the Flash site is. To be fair, though, I'm using a Win7 PC right now. If I tried it with one of my Macs the outcome might have been different.

 

[Compile 'em all]

Care to elaborate how we can replicate Flash's functionality in the present ? Until we can, all this HTML5 talk is for the future, and in the future, I won't have my present phone, I'll have another one.

So why not give me a phone with a choice and then when HTML5 has finally caught up and does provide the same features as Flash, drop it ?

All those features you rally about that Flash has over HTML5 are essentially USELESS on a mobile device if you can't use them. Loading flash brings the browser to a CRAWL.

If you want to continue using medicore technology, be my guest. But this poor user experience has no place on an Apple product.

“The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” - George Bernard Shaw

 

[Reed Rothchild]

The things that Droid users/fanboys always say: The Droid has a user replaceable battery, keyboard, unlimited apps, and Flash.

Finally, I can laugh in the face of those people because Flash sucks on mobile devices. Finally people will see why Apple denied Adobe. It was purely to keep the superior quality of their products.

I think this sentence condenses what a lot of the anti-Flash zealots feel. Apple denied you an experience (which by the way is entirely optional, non-instrusive, and non-battery draining on devices that can handle Flash media), and you're grateful to them . I love a lot about the Apple "less is more" design ethos, but denying you optional access to large portions of the web doesn't make the quality of the product superior. It actually makes the quality of the product inferior. Maybe when Lord Jobs provides a strict list of sites you can visit, plugins you can install, and thoughts you can think, then you will have reached a sort of Jobsian-induced Nirvana. For the rest of us living in the real world, we like to make these choices ourselves.

 

[KnightWRX]

All those features you rally about that Flash has over HTML5 are essentially USELESS on a mobile device if you can't use them. Loading flash brings the browser to a CRAWL.

If you want to continue using medicore technology, be my guest. But this poor user experience has no place on an Apple product.

You offered no insight. Flash doesn't crawl my browser down, it doesn't on Android either. Badly created Flash content does, just like a badly written Javascript piece does. That's just you again repeating the same overblown, washed out Steve rethoric. It's actually Steve and people like you that are trying to adapt the world to themselves. Choice in which technology to use is adapting to the world. Forcing HTML5 in its unready state on the World is what you're condemning even though you think it's not.

Flash vector animations, something that is not yet ready in HTML5 with Canvas+SVG, have been around for over 10 years and worked flawlessly on the then awful Linux plug-in on my old Pentium 2. They still work like a charm on my Macbook, no fans, no heat, no CPU at 100%.

That's very basic and yet HTML5 browser support for it is lacking on about 50% of the browser market out there. Flash is on 98% of Internet connected devices.

I think this sentence condenses what a lot of the anti-Flash zealots feel. Apple denied you an experience (which by the way is entirely optional, non-instrusive, and non-battery draining on devices that can handle Flash media), and you're grateful to them . I love a lot about the Apple "less is more" design ethos, but denying you optional access to large portions of the web doesn't make the quality of the product superior. It actually makes the quality of the product inferior. Maybe when Lord Jobs provides a strict list of sites you can visit, plugins you can install, and thoughts you can think, then you will have reached a sort of Jobsian-induced Nirvana. For the rest of us living in the real world, we like to make these choices ourselves.

The most fervent Apple users on this site are anti-choice. Choice is evil and bad, and it confuses the users. These people probably all shop at some store where there's only 1 style shirt, 1 style of jeans and 1 style of shoes. They get very confused and go for their pills when they get to the sock display, which has gasp, 2 colors of socks.

 

[Reed Rothchild]

I own a Nexus One Knight, everything is so hidden, I didn't know that you could click to flash on Froyo till now.

That's not really a problem with the Flash plugin. The Android browser has always had an "enable plugins" option in Settings. Flash is a browser plugin. You'd have had the same confusion regardless of which plugin you installed. Always worth checking out settings in apps you run - they sometimes have lots of interesting features .

 

[UniversalMind]

BTW, the source article has been updated and points to another post that demonstrates that the experience is a lot better than they made us believe. The things that don't work quite right are not the fault of Adobe, like Videos with bandwidth that is just too high or codec that can't be hardware decoded. Overall this clearly shows how well Flash Player 10.1 performs on mobile phones on a 1 GHz CPU that doesn't even support out-of-order-execution. And it will only become better over time when the creators start testing their stuff whether it's suitable for mobile devices and devices get even faster handling higher quality clips.

 

[KnightWRX]

I own a Nexus One Knight, everything is so hidden, I didn't know that you could click to flash on Froyo till now.

Yeah, and I didn't know you could disable Wi-fi on my iPhone until I looked in Settings.

Seriously, it's been mentionned everytime there's been an Android article and the Flash thing came up. In all those threads you've participated in, you're seriously going to tell me it's the first time you've heard it ?

Riiiiiiiiiiiiight....

 

[-=XX=-Nephilim]

BTW, the source article has been updated and points to another post that demonstrates that the experience is a lot better than they made us believe. The things that don't work quite right are not the fault of Adobe, like Videos with bandwidth that is just too high or codec that can't be hardware decoded. Overall this clearly shows how well Flash Player 10.1 performs on mobile phones on a 1 GHz CPU that doesn't even support out-of-order-execution. And it will only become better over time when the creators start testing their stuff whether it's suitable for mobile devices and devices get even faster handling higher quality clips.

Hahahaha

Wonder is MacRumors will also update their article...

In any case - initial review was full of crap anyway and I am positive they have been forced to correct it little bit since it missed the point entirely...

Point is, exactly as you stated, FLASH is HERE and NOW and it is here to stay and get better over time...

This is HUGE point in history of (portable) computing since this is the first time that entire internet is truly and (almost) fully available on mobile device(s).

All accolades to Google and Adobe and big fat middle finger to Steve Jobs...

He asked for it after all

 

[Piggie]

Above all else....................

I hope whatever alternative comes along (if this is what will happen over the next X years)

Will either be able to run flash code, or flash code will easily be able to be re-compiled for the new format as run even better than it did under flash.

That's all I ask.

 

[southernpaws]

Article is utter rubbish and perfect example of crap journalism...

Flash player for Android is in its first and initial release - fact...

Anyone who was expecting to have the same performance as he / she is having on their laptop or desktop computers is an idiot - fact...

Flash is NOT just a video and basing almost entire article on video arguments is sign of very disturbed brains or of someone being paid to write bullcrap - fact...

Player, as well as hardware that runs it, can only get better meaning that within couple of years or so we will have perfectly capable devices as well as software to run it without any hick-ups - fact...

iDevice owners will keep on missing on half of the web forever - fact...

For the end, I will ALWAYS rather take something that is "HIT OR MISS" than something that is just a MISS 100% - fact...

So screw you Apple

Thanks for reading!

First, not only do you sound completely arrogant with all your "fact" nonsense, you also sound like Dwight from The Office (us).

Second, why are you treating Flash like it's some kind of nascent technology? Capable mobile devices have been out for three years. As a fairly entrenched technology, they should have made it a priority to get on board quickly. Three years later, this is the best they have to offer? And you're making excuses for them?

From a business perspective, any technology that is three years behind the curve deserves not a handicap, but to be kicked to the curb. Flash is simply not that good.

 

[shadygrove]

Hahahaha

Wonder is MacRumors will also update their article...

In any case - initial review was full of crap anyway and I am positive they have been forced to correct it little bit since it missed the point entirely...

Point is, exactly as you stated, FLASH is HERE and NOW and it is here to stay and get better over time...

This is HUGE point in history of (portable) computing since this is the first time that entire internet is truly and (almost) fully available on mobile device(s).

All accolades to Google and Adobe and big fat middle finger to Steve Jobs...

He asked for it after all

Right... What technological utopia do you live in? (Since every developer wants to spend hundreds on adobe licensing, vs opening the most basic text editor that comes with any computer.)

As browser technology (IE) moves forward to allow full CSS3 and HTML5 compliance, Flash will start to become less used by developers, in exchange for much cheaper, non proprietary, lighter weight options that works on all devices. Going forward the only people that will continue to develop Flash applications will be the same people who have been doing it for a decade the refuse to adapt and learn new languages and techniques while the people innovating the industry will be have tossed Flash out the window. I know I have and in fact I don't know a single person that is setting the bar in the industry with Flash applications...in fact it's quite opposite.

Consumers who use computers and "like flash" will have very little to do with the final outcome. Because at the end of the day, the developers will implement the best method to reach the broadest audience and if that means they don't have spends hundreds in licensing while mandating the user download a plugin, you can bet developers will start dropping flash as fast as they started using it.

 

[southernpaws]

Point is, exactly as you stated, FLASH is HERE and NOW and it is here to stay and get better over time...

Flash may be around, but the market has made it clear that it's not integral to the web experience. (see: millions of iPhone users)

Additionally, there are other technologies out there that are competing with Flash and making it even less integral.

Finally, sure, Flash will get better. But when will it become good enough? They've had three years. Are you suggesting we just halt technology and the market and give Flash a chance to catch up?

You speak like a Flash apologist, or an Apple opponent, but nothing like a knowledgable developer or a rational businessperson.

 

[Compile 'em all]

BTW, the source article has been updated and points to another post that demonstrates that the experience is a lot better than they made us believe. The things that don't work quite right are not the fault of Adobe, like Videos with bandwidth that is just too high or codec that can't be hardware decoded. Overall this clearly shows how well Flash Player 10.1 performs on mobile phones on a 1 GHz CPU that doesn't even support out-of-order-execution. And it will only become better over time when the creators start testing their stuff whether it's suitable for mobile devices and devices get even faster handling higher quality clips.

the creators start testing their stuff?

Are you listening to yourself?

The whole point of mobile flash is that all existing videos will run just fine on a mobile device. If they need to optimize or change crap, then they might as well serve HTML5.

Once you start thinking of "throwing a faster CPU" at the problem, it means your software is garbage.

Flash on a mobile device doesn't work. how many times do you have to repeat that? It wasn't built with multitouch in mind. As simple as that. Any attempt to make it work, will just create an uglyass mutant that barely runs.

 

[southernpaws]

BTW, the source article has been updated and points to another post that demonstrates that the experience is a lot better than they made us believe. The things that don't work quite right are not the fault of Adobe, like Videos with bandwidth that is just too high or codec that can't be hardware decoded. Overall this clearly shows how well Flash Player 10.1 performs on mobile phones on a 1 GHz CPU that doesn't even support out-of-order-execution. And it will only become better over time when the creators start testing their stuff whether it's suitable for mobile devices and devices get even faster handling higher quality clips.

The intent of the updated article was to give more detail and references for the original article. They in no way backed off from their original conclusion. How did you come away with thinking that it was showing it was better than they had us believe? It was pretty much exactly what they said in the first place.

 

[-=XX=-Nephilim]

First, not only do you sound completely arrogant with all your "fact" nonsense, you also sound like Dwight from The Office (us).

Second, why are you treating Flash like it's some kind of nascent technology? Capable mobile devices have been out for three years. As a fairly entrenched technology, they should have made it a priority to get on board quickly. Three years later, this is the best they have to offer? And you're making excuses for them?

From a business perspective, any technology that is three years behind the curve deserves not a handicap, but to be kicked to the curb. Flash is simply not that good.

I'll avoid letting you know how you sound since I might break forum rules that way...

What exactly did you expect my reaction to this excrement of propaganda journalism is going to be!?!?

Did you expect me to read that pile of nonsensical garbage and nod my head in approval of Job's draconian politics, internet censorship, lies and overall bullcrap!?!?

Get serious - please! Hahahaha

My dear friend FACT - let me spell it to you F.A.C.T. - is that Android users can access almost 100% of available content on the net - now and in the future...

There is also another F.A.C.T. which is that YOU and rest of iDevice users will NEVER EVER have full net in your hands...

This is where story starts and ends as far as I am concern...

Now that might sound arrogant to you - but quite frankly I don't care...

I am just pointing out the FACTS - that's all...

Just like Steve does, I also hope you will enjoy your blue lego boxes for quite some time