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The only reply is to point out that there are other technologies out there that don't have that disparity between desktop and mobile functionality.
[...]
Since there is technology out there that displaces Flash and performs just as well on mobile as well as desktop devices, the market will continue to move towards those other technologies.
But that is just not true. HTML5 doesn't magically make things possible that the underlying hardware can't do. And judging from the videos the Flash Player does use the hardware extremely well.

The average consumer isn't going to make excuses for flash performing well on some sites and not others. They will work off the crazy assumption that the phone should be able to do what their computer does.
Like, say, an iOS device that should display freaking content and not a blue lego brick?
 
Basically, Apple would like to reinvent the world wide web. They want to turn it into an "app". It'll provide a really rich experience for those who have the right hardware to access it. Those using it will never know what else is out there and be supremely happy.

You sure about that? Why would they be one of the primary users and contributors to Webkit? Why would they be pushing HTML5? Safari continues to be pretty prominently featured on Mac OS X and iOS.
 
I'd posit that the way "miniature PC's" have developed IS primarily as a "communication, media, and information appliance". I'm pretty sure most PC users are Facebook users, Google browsers, website readers. I've no doubt that Apple (and Google) know this.
Fair enough. Netbooks are certainly the future of 'conventional computing', but running a desktop OS on them is probably not. Most people don't need a general-purpose personal computer, and keep buying them out of habit instead of need. I'm arguing, though, that consumers have shown quite clearly that they prefer the unified repository-style of media/software purchase and operation (Steam, XBL, ITMS, App Store, Android Market. All successes), and that seems to be the demarcation point between PCs and 'appliances' these days.

I don't see the link between that and access to Flash though. Surely an Apple or Google/Android smartphone user can still do those tasks regardless of the existence of Flash?
They can, assuming it doesn't cause ancillary problems, but it presents four possibilities. Either it works well or it doesn't. Beta quality software, quite usually, does not work well. Some don't like this release, some do. But it will eventually be mature, and by then we can reasonably and logically assess whether it provides a good quality of service over the wide variety of devices it runs on. Now, independent of the operation is whether or not it achieves its goals. Adobe would like Flash on smartphones to be what Flash for desktops is (or used to be): the method to deploy video and rich applications. It either will, or it won't. If it does, then it reduces the usefulness of the Android Market and provides an incentive for media providers not to write native applications for Android. This is not good for Android, Google, or in the long term its users. Flash on Android isn't going to be as fast or flexible as native Android programming. So content providers and developers may not utilize user hardware to its best capabilities, and users will have no incentive to have platform loyalty. This, if I recall correctly, was one of Apple's objections to Adobe's development interface for iOS.

(and advertising, but both Google and Apple have their own ad distribution model for that).
Adobe doesn't get paid every time someone buys a flash ad, so it's kind of different. But you're right in that a good portion of flash utilization is for advertising, and this is another reason Apple doesn't have an interest in pushing Flash onto their platform. With iAds, they claim that their goal is to create a smoother integration of advertising into applications (for now, media later perhaps?), so that the application experience is not damaged and the advertisers can have richer content. Flash goes against that in their eyes: web advertisement is going to be different, they think, in a few years, because the way we use the web will be different.

I fully agree that Apple have their own infrastructure which they want to use for distribution of apps, and it's obviously in their own interests to not promote a rival technology! I think you've reduced the argument to the essence right there - but on here as well as other iOS fansites the reason will be because Flash "sucks"....;).
Don't expect sense from a rabble under any flag :p.

Basically, Apple would like to reinvent the world wide web. They want to turn it into an "app". It'll provide a really rich experience for those who have the right hardware to access it. Those using it will never know what else is out there and be supremely happy. I hope it happens. It'll be the best of both worlds.
Ding! What a lot of people fail to realize is that every platform benefits from a situation where rich content is by and large served on platform-specific implementations, but the web at large is standardized and looks the same everywhere, on every device. It prevents one platform's limitations from damaging superior platforms, whichever those may be at the time. It also promotes marketplaces which have the potential to be more secure from IP theft, which could result in more content and applications being delivered to more platforms and devices with less hassle and expense.
 
I am very happy with my jailbreak. Frash on iPhone 4 seems to be pretty decent. The only sites that give it a problem are the ones that run my desktop processor really high as well. Make sure you are using the 2nd release of Frash.
 
But that is just not true. HTML5 doesn't magically make things possible that the underlying hardware can't do. And judging from the videos the Flash Player does use the hardware extremely well.

But is it true that HTML5 is less demanding of the hardware than many iterations of Flash (any that aren't optimized for mobile?) If that's the case, HTML5 performs more consistently than Flash. Meaning that consumers will demand it, developers will prefer it, and Adobe needs to catch up.

Like, say, an iOS device that should display freaking content and not a blue lego brick?

Not entirely unfair, but don't ignore the fact that the market shows that a compelling number of people would rather have an iOS device at the expense of giving up Flash. Advertising firms, content providers, and developers are responding not by giving up on that market, but by acceding to it by moving away from Flash.

Again, the author made an accurate assessment when he said Flash needs to perform better or get left behind.
 
Don't like it?
Don't buy it.

is that the best you got? you know their are people who have itunes on their pc but are unable to tranfer they purchase music to other devices. thats like buying a cd and not being able to play in your car with out ripping all that drm crap out.
 
why is it that every time their is a discusion on flash everyone bring on html5 im i missing somthing here? html5 is just a new version of html it has nothing to do with the cantainer that will allow you to stream music or video to your pc or moble device.
 
H.264

It’s inter*est*ing that, in the para*graph about open*ness, Steve Jobs men*tions HTML5, CSS, and JavaScript but leaves the issue of video codec for later in his note. That comes in the dis*cus*sion of “the full web” where he men*tions sup*port for H.264.

That name rep*re*sents a stan*dard that is not an open one. In fact, it’s one that needs to be licensed in order to be used and, while many peo*ple use it (as Apple’s note demon*strate), it’s one that could gen*er*ate roy*al*ties for many com*pa*nies when the agree*ment to make this stan*dard royalties-free for inter*net video ends in 2015. And one of the com*pa*nies that would get some of those roy*al*ties is.…

(if you haven’t guessed, you must have skimmed throught the rest of the article)

sur*prise, it’s Apple Inc., a com*pany that hap*pens to own some pro*pri*etary intel*lec*tual prop*erty that is included in this standard.

And, sur*pris*ingly, the best tool for author*ing con*tent for the H.264 stan*dard is Quick*time, a piece of soft*ware that is dis*trib*uted by… Apple.

I’m not going to deny that the rest of the argu*ments (around secu*rity, per*for*mance, and bat*tery life) may hold value. I’m also not going to claim that Jobs is wrong in say*ing that the “Touch” expe*ri*ence is not fun*da*men*tally dif*fer*ent from the expe*ri*ence that Flash was ini*tially cre*ated for.

But I am going to go out on a limb and say that this whole fight between Apple and Adobe comes down to a sin*gle thread: Who will con*trol video on the web. Jobs is prob*a*bly not thrilled that Flash has usurped Quick*time as the main con*tender on the web and is work*ing on chang*ing that.
 
VP8 can't currently support Apple's needs as a mobile-optimized codec for its iPods, iPads and iPhones, nor is it suitable for high definition video encoding. VP8 is targeted directly at the web, where Google, Mozilla and other partners hope to use it to deliver video without the royalties required by H.264. Apple has no issue paying royalties to license MPEG's H.264 technologies because the royalties are not very expensive. The H.264 licensing fees are really only a relevant cost issue for groups like Mozilla wanting to give their software away for free.
 
This is the future? Isnt it supposed to be an improvement?

My CPU running Apples HTML5 Trailer.
HTML5.png



My CPU running the Flash Trailer in 1080p
Flash1080p.png
 
H.264
It’s interesting that, in the paragraph about openness, Steve Jobs mentions HTML5, CSS, and JavaScript but leaves the issue of video codec for later in his note. That comes in the discussion of “the full web” where he mentions support for H.264.

That name represents a standard that is not an open one. In fact, it’s one that needs to be licensed in order to be used and, while many people use it (as Apple’s note demonstrate), it’s one that could generate royalties for many companies when the agreement to make this standard royalties-free for internet video ends in 2015. And one of the companies that would get some of those royalties is.…

(if you haven’t guessed, you must have skimmed throught the rest of the article)

surprise, it’s Apple Inc., a company that happens to own some proprietary intellectual property that is included in this standard.

And, surprisingly, the best tool for authoring content for the H.264 standard is Quicktime, a piece of software that is distributed by… Apple.

I’m not going to deny that the rest of the arguments (around security, performance, and battery life) may hold value. I’m also not going to claim that Jobs is wrong in saying that the “Touch” experience is not fundamentally different from the experience that Flash was initially created for.

But I am going to go out on a limb and say that this whole fight between Apple and Adobe comes down to a single thread: Who will control video on the web. Jobs is probably not thrilled that Flash has usurped Quicktime as the main contender on the web and is working on changing that.

You do realize that most video delivered through Flash is encoded in H264, right?
 
Seems a lot of people are just butt-hurt because once again, "arrogant" Apple is proven right.

Honestly I thought apple was paying you for your beyond ultra fanboy posts until i realized that even they would be embarrassed by your posting.
 
Point is that Android user can type in almost ANY web address into his portable / mobile device and get the contents he is after while YOU and rest of iDevice owners can enjoy BLUE LEGO BOXES today, tomorrow and for the rest of the time until Steve goes belly up or eats his own excrement.

Fact!

You are 100% right, and it is pathetic that apple zealots would rather suffer and see less of the web. You have to remember though, questioning or even daring to disagree with Steve Jobs is the equivalent of the most devoted catholic questioning the Pope.
 
This is the future? Isnt it supposed to be an improvement?

Just out of interest did you know that Flash is only a container i.e. the Flash trailer that you are watching is actually the H.264 movie, to be supported in HTML 5 video tag, but wrapped in a Flash player?

Video tag in HTML5 just allows the trailer to be played without 3rd party software wraps! The browser itself will take care of the movie rather than a plug in. This is not a bad thing!

assuming that your pictures are to the same scale, the average CPU usage in the HTML5 will be lower than Flash! (just by looking at your graphs)

To make your comparison more scientific, I suggest you use Chrome as the OS you are using is Windows!
 
You are 100% right, and it is pathetic that apple zealots would rather suffer and see less of the web. You have to remember though, questioning or even daring to disagree with Steve Jobs is the equivalent of the most devoted catholic questioning the Pope.

Why do you care. If they (me including since 2004) want less it's their right to have what you think is less. Or are you scared that their word has some real weight that can change things? Flash was dead long before Apple said so.

3 years of baby crying from Adobe that Apple is not allowing Flash on iPhone while not having a viable mobile Flash version. 3 years later they put some half backed poor performance mobile Flash version which is a nigtmare and they are surprised that things went south.

Sorry, a day late a dollar short doesn't count in tech world.
 
I can show some images too.

screenshot20100822at225.png


screenshot20100822at230.png

Flash, works beautifully on Windows, which is (not trying to sound fanboyish) the dominant platform. And everytime I've tried to use and test HTML5, it has performed very poorly, the (probably) more professionally refined HTML5 test Apple are showcasing, requires more resources than the flash equivalent running at higher quality, and the HTML5 YouTube Beta, was forever crashing Safari, being unresponsive.

Speaking globally, wouldn't it be best to use the tech that works best with the majority,instead of going over to the Tech that Apple has a lot invested in, and only works smoothly on the minority platform.

Apple AND Adobe need to work together, and meet halfway, Apple need to give Adobe decent API's like Windows gave Adobe, so Adobe can work magic, and get flash working as smootly on Mac as it does Windows.

And Adobe need to work hard on their end to get the finished result as smooth as it is in Windows.
 
and what other devices are those? just apple devices or what

My brother purchased a W series Walkman that he couldn't get to sync on a friends PC. He didn't realize that it needed a transfer app that was included in a folder in the devices memory.

I tried it on my mac using iTunes; drag and drop. It will work with iTunes on a PC without having to install a separate transfer app.
 
yes but not all, what would be the standard when they settle on a video standard for html5

Please read this page:
http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flash/quickstart/video_encoder/

Flash is not the encoder! It is just a wrapper! Flash supports three main encoders. With HTML5 the wrapper layer is removed and the browser takes care of the encoded movie.

If you are against H.264 you may want to support other formats. Apart from a Mozilla backed format, and to an extent the newly Google backed format, no other main royalty free video formats exist!
 
Flash, works beautifully on Windows, which is (not trying to sound fanboyish) the dominant platform. And everytime I've tried to use and test HTML5, it has performed very poorly, the (probably) more professionally refined HTML5 test Apple are showcasing, requires more resources than the flash equivalent running at higher quality, and the HTML5 YouTube Beta, was forever crashing Safari, being unresponsive.

Speaking globally, wouldn't it be best to use the tech that works best with the majority,instead of going over to the Tech that Apple has a lot invested in, and only works smoothly on the minority platform.

Apple AND Adobe need to work together, and meet halfway, Apple need to give Adobe decent API's like Windows gave Adobe, so Adobe can work magic, and get flash working as smootly on Mac as it does Windows.

And Adobe need to work hard on their end to get the finished result as smooth as it is in Windows.

Silverlight is way better even without those mysterious APIs (performance wise), so either Microsoft has some Unicorns hidden somewhere or Flash player just sucks. Pretty simple to me.

And HTML 5 is a web standard just like HTML 4 before it. I really don't feel the desire to install bunch of plugins for things that are doable with open standards and without need for apps that cost hundreds, not to mention security and additional instability plugins bring.
 
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