Full Laptop Refresh By Holidays?

[AppliedVisual]

Given that Yahoo MBP's are thought to be unacceptably hot, a chip swap with Merom might make for a truly unacceptably hot notebook computer.

Does this not suggest the high probability of a case redesign? At the very least it suggests a reworking of internal compotents to address cooling issues.

Is a chip swap simply out of the question in this upgrade?

What's a Yahoo MBP?

I think we're all assuming that the extra long delay is indicative of some form of redesign. But to what end remains to be seen. I just hope the wait will be worth it and part of the hold up could be waiting for the proper Crestline chipset from Intel, hopefully Apple will upgrade the GPU along the way.

 

[mautal]

no computers for anyones

The only saving face would be systems that have (or could have) AMD's inside.

then someone else sues AMD and we are back in the middle ages

 

[clintob]

Intel is a wonderful company, and the SPEED of their processors is pretty much unrivaled in the industry. However, while Apple's systems have gained speed with Intel chips, the chipsets still run very hot - just as bad if not worse than the G5.

This is not a problem in desktops, as there's always a way to cool them off. But in notebooks, this is a huge issue. MacBooks are shutting down for no reason, MBPros have noise and fan issues, and this is all directly related in some way to the heat that Core Duo creates.

Pentium 4 had the same problem... the chips ran very hot, and any slim notebook with extra RAM in it was a ticking timebomb. Sure, some lasted without issue, but many had tremendous problems (including one of mine in which the motherboard actually CRACKED from heat stress).

So, the moral of the story is, sure Apple could plop C2D into their notebooks right now. But if you want a notebook done right, pump your brakes for a few months and let them rework things a little, change the inner architecture a little bit, and in the end you'll have a much more stable and efficient machine that will last a lot longer...

Oh, and it won't "moo".

 

[Buhbuhb]

Ram & MBP related question

I recently bought 1GB DDR2 200-PIN SO-DIMM RAM (Value Select, Samsung Ram).

Link:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145012

My Question:
I know that this is 100% compatible with the current MBP CD system, however I'm holding off until an update occurs as I do not NEED it now. In the event of a case redesign would that somehow effect in any way the compatibility of this Ram to an updated version? So is 200-PIN size an industry/apple standard for notebooks? They wouldn't screw around with the Ram slots would they? Any insight would help as I'd like to know if I should hold on to this (I have 30 days to return if needed).

Did the Ram slots in the Powerbooks require 200-PIN also?

 

[kumbaya]

A closer look at those Sonys...

The Vaio SZ line has this: both integrated and dedicated GPUs, switchable by rebooting the computer.

You can also have your laptop engraved:

But wait! What does this one say??

Jokes aside, the US site has a couple of the SZ Core 2 Duo models ready to ship the next day, while two others say they will ship on October 16/17. The European site lists the C2D SZ models shipping in mid-November!

 

[iBorg20181]

Maybe they, i.e. all manufacturers, could simply move out of the 'States with it's rather silly software patent rules and lawyers. Out of jurisdiction = out of reach of the money grabbers.

Can't see "the big W" and his mates allowing this - they (and his daddy) have probably all got shares in hi-tec organisations, so wouldn't want to see them devalued.

Oops, a tad too political for this forum

LOL - seeing as how Jobs is a devout bleeding-heart liberal Democrat, I doubt that the Bushies have anything to do with keeping Apple in the US! Your exhorbitant taxes in the UK probably keep many companies from moving there, tho!

[back on topic/]

iBorg

 

[kumbaya]

Worst case scenario

then someone else sues AMD and we are back in the middle ages

As we're all on UNIVERSAL binaries now (not x86 binaries) Apple can always go to IBM or Motorola or Freescale or some combination of them

 

[djkny]

As we're all on UNIVERSAL binaries now (not x86 binaries) Apple can always go to IBM or Motorola or Freescale or some combination of them

LOL. SO we can reignite "PowerBook G5 - Next Tuesday" threads on mac forums everywhere. Just what we need.

 

[AppliedVisual]

As we're all on UNIVERSAL binaries now (not x86 binaries) Apple can always go to IBM or Motorola or Freescale or some combination of them

Er... Too bad "universal binary" isn't truly universal. It works with the G4/G5 and x86 architectures and care must be taken to maintain G3 compatibility. Beyond that, the compilers would probably need some tweaks to shift to AMD, to better optimize for their architectural differences as well as other instruction sets that differ from Intel like their new 3DNow! implementation.

IBM has dropped their own PowerPC architecture in favor of Intel for all their new system lines

 

[ccroo]

What's a Yahoo MBP?

I do not have any idea where that came from. This frightens me. What else am I writing that I'm not aware of?

 

[ct-scan]

A glimmer of hope?

I was just thinking about Apple's main page, with (PRODUCT) RED being highlighted...

How long do you think they'll advertise this as the main product, before it's thrown down in a image below?

My guess (hope) is that it'll be until Tuesday...when it gets replaced by, oh I don't know...the MBP?

(Just starting some hype for next week!)

 

[generik]

Thanks.


To me, it would make sense to at least have some sort of plan as a back-up. I run a business, and I have back-up plans for all kinds of possibilities. If you read some of them, you'd probably ask me what I was on. Most of them are simply on paper, and not immediately actionable, but at least there is something on the drawing board just in case.

Then again, as my wige keeps bringing up from time to time, I also said 5 years ago, "Gas over $1.50 in the next couple of years? Yeah, OK. Not happening for any extended period of time!"

Oops!

Of course, it was about a buck or a little under at the time too. Who knew? The whole topic came up when I told her we were moving back to the country, about an hour away from where I was working then, and we were estimating for new costs and savings.


So that was kind of off topic, but not completely. Point being, you never know what's going to happen and if you can at least have some sort of plan you might need it one day.


Whether or not that would mean Apple has a super top-secret motherboard/design just in case Intel up and closed up shop overnight is a whole different ball of wax though.

Isn't it a bit naive to actually think that big businesses are such law abiding corporate citizens?

If the judge issues the injunction, Intel can simply... ignore it and fight it later while raking in cash first. That's the pure evil (aka Microsoft) way. What's the govt going to do about that? Physically send troops to Intel's plants in Malaysia and China to stop shipment of chips? Not bloody likely.

Fines? Intel will simply delay price cuts by a few months to OEMs, matter resolved.

 

[ct-scan]

If the judge issues the injunction, Intel can simply... ignore it and fight it later while raking in cash first. That's the pure evil (aka Microsoft) way.

I agree that they could ignore such an injunction...but how is that evil?

You can say that it's just putting cash in their pockets, but isn't also giving us (the consumer) what they want? I don't want some dying company to slow down development of technology, hinder my role as a consumer, or possibly raise the end cost to the consumer (to help offset any costs associated with this suit).

Just some thoughts.

 

[MacsAttack]

If the judge issues the injunction, Intel can simply...

...appeal against the injunction. Then the injuction will be suspended until the appeal takes place (which will take several months at least). Assuming the appeal is rejected, Intel will still have had months to attempt to resolve the whole situation.

If the issues goes to trial, and if both parties do not settle out of court (99% of these gigs end up setteing out of court - sometimes after years of litigation), then Transmetta (if they win) will receive what the judge considers fair recompence from the sales Intel has made for all the years that Intel has been using their patented technologies.

The same song and dance has playd out a number of times in the Tech industry.

This is not Transmetta trying to force Intel out of business. it is just them poking Intel with a stick to let them know they are serious and Intel is just going to have to be a bit more generous with the licence payments (assuming Intel's nija-assassin-lawyers are not confidnet that the claimes are groundless).

Is Transmetta get their pound of flesh out of Intel I suspect AMD will be next on the target list.

We are not going to see the supply of CPUs suddenly cut off. That would be dammaging to not only Intel but their customers (which is one of the grounds for suspending the injunction).

The most probable outcome of this will ultimatly be a slight rise (or more correctly a reduction in the rate of price drops) in CPU/chip set prices from Intel and anybody else (AMD - so relative price levels will remain uneffectd) that Transmetta go after.

A good example is the INtel vs Intergraph case back in about 2002 when Intergraph got an injunction against Intel over technology used in the Itanium...

http://news.com.com/Intel+settles+Intergraph+suit+for+225+million/2100-1006_3-5182064.html

Intel continued to produce Itanium chips (thay had several weeks to appeal the injuction), and ultimatly setteled. Production of Itanium chips was not impacted at any time.

No panic. Sky Not falling. Apple not under threat. Movie at 10.

 

[generik]

I agree that they could ignore such an injunction...but how is that evil?

You can say that it's just putting cash in their pockets, but isn't also giving us (the consumer) what they want? I don't want some dying company to slow down development of technology, hinder my role as a consumer, or possibly raise the end cost to the consumer (to help offset any costs associated with this suit).

Just some thoughts.

Perhaps evil was the wrong word, but they most definitely wouldn't just bow over and take it without a fight.

I mentioned Microsoft because they seem to be the ones with the most balls to stand up against anybody, including the whole EU which is... bigger than any one country!

 

[ThunderLounge]

Isn't it a bit naive to actually think that big businesses are such law abiding corporate citizens?

If the judge issues the injunction, Intel can simply... ignore it and fight it later while raking in cash first. That's the pure evil (aka Microsoft) way. What's the govt going to do about that? Physically send troops to Intel's plants in Malaysia and China to stop shipment of chips? Not bloody likely.

Fines? Intel will simply delay price cuts by a few months to OEMs, matter resolved.

No, not at all. But then again, if I hated everything and was never happy with anything, I might think like you.

Intel couldn't simply ignore it. Are you seriously suggesting that they are "above the law" and nothing applies to them? Talk about naieve. Look at Tyco and Enron, K? Thnx.

I don't see an injunction happening, as I said before. If anything it would get tied up in courts for so long, that it wouldn't be much more than a distant memory as Intel bleeds what remaining capital Transmeta has and forces them under. That's the big business way.

MacsAttacks makes a perfectly valid point as well. It would end up tied up in the courts, until Transmeta ends up accepting on Intel's terms because Intel backs them into a financial corner. Then again, who knows.

 

[shadowlander]

No panic. Sky Not falling. Apple not under threat. Movie at 10.

_Great_post. Well said. Thanks for the reality check.

 

[ct-scan]

I mentioned Microsoft because they seem to be the ones with the most balls to stand up against anybody, including the whole EU which is... bigger than any one country!

I figure 'evil' and 'Microsoft' go together just fine

 

[timmillwood]

I hate waiting... its like the run upto christmas... we are all waiting for our presents.

I have my Crumpler Base Toucher bag ready, i have my PIN for my new credit card, so the card won't be long, all i need now is my Macbook Pro...

I will be getting the 17" once it comes out not matter what spec it is

 

[macman2790]

well apple's front page changed with a red ipod nano. I just don't see a merom mbp happening this year. It probably wont happen next tuesday. I'm not gonna get my hopes up.

 

[shecky]

well apple's front page changed with a red ipod nano. I just don't see a merom mbp happening this year. It probably wont happen next tuesday. I'm not gonna get my hopes up.

one thing has nothing to do with another, much as everyone would like to think so.

 

[shadowlander]

well apple's front page changed with a red ipod nano. I just don't see a merom mbp happening this year. It probably wont happen next tuesday. I'm not gonna get my hopes up.

Somehow, a red iPod doesn't seem front-page news worthy for very long...certainly not as (INTERMINABLY) long as the iTunes/Johnny Depp front page existed. It can't be....

 

[absurdio]

Intel is a wonderful company, and the SPEED of their processors is pretty much unrivaled in the industry. However, while Apple's systems have gained speed with Intel chips, the chipsets still run very hot - just as bad if not worse than the G5.

This is not a problem in desktops, as there's always a way to cool them off. But in notebooks, this is a huge issue. MacBooks are shutting down for no reason, MBPros have noise and fan issues, and this is all directly related in some way to the heat that Core Duo creates.

Pentium 4 had the same problem... the chips ran very hot, and any slim notebook with extra RAM in it was a ticking timebomb. Sure, some lasted without issue, but many had tremendous problems (including one of mine in which the motherboard actually CRACKED from heat stress).

So, the moral of the story is, sure Apple could plop C2D into their notebooks right now. But if you want a notebook done right, pump your brakes for a few months and let them rework things a little, change the inner architecture a little bit, and in the end you'll have a much more stable and efficient machine that will last a lot longer...

Oh, and it won't "moo".

I don't know. I'd like to agree, but I fear we may be giving Apple too much credit. It seems like every generation has its set of problems and that every subsequent generation has different - but equally significant - problems. The TiBooks had problems. The AluBooks had problems. Now the MBPs have problems. I mean I'm not surprised - or even disappointed, really - but to suggest that this delay is going to rectify all this generations problems and not crop up any new ones is a bit too optimistic for my tastes. I hope Apple is working to fix the heat, whine, and moo issues. But every portable they've made (at least going back to TiBooks) had heat issues. I doubt this is going to be the revision where they suddenly figure it all out.

Here's hoping, though.

 

[akadmon]

Corporate discount

Just found out that as one of the perks of my employment I can get discounts on Apple hardware!!! This is something new and (frankly) unexpected --when I checked last week the only discounts I could get were from Dell, HP and Lenovo. The Apple discounts are not huge (e.g., 8% on MPB and MP, 6% iMacs, incl. BTOs and Apple Care), but this will help narrow the gap between a Dell Latitude 820 and a 15" MBP I'm considering to about $800 (assuming the C2D model will stay at the current price) making it a bit easier to justify paying my share towards Steve Jobs' 300' yacht.

Edit: here is the link to the Corporate Discount page

http://store.apple.com/Apple/WebObjects/BEPPStore?qprm=298940

 

[macman2790]

Somehow, a red iPod doesn't seem front-page news worthy for very long...certainly not as (INTERMINABLY) long as the iTunes/Johnny Depp front page existed. It can't be....

yeah i agree with that. But i still don't think mbps and mbs will be updated by the holidays. I believe their waiting til mwsf to release more new features. i think we will see something "santa rosa" like at mwsf. They wont bear the name intel centrino 2 duo or anything like that. I believe it's likely that we will see 800 mhz fsb. Full 64-bit capability (the ability to use more than 4gb of ram. Current chipsets only allow 3.2gb of ram, including the dell ones that hold 4gb of ram. They only use 3.2, dell should be brought to justice for selling 4gb of ram in their notebooks.) Well, all i'm hoping for is a completely revised and redesigned mbp at mwsf.