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Game Developers Discuss How Apple Could Improve Gaming on Apple TV
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Gaming is big business. It is what generates the most revenue on the App Store. Apple has all the pieces to have an integrated gaming approach where a game purchased on the App Store can be playable on any Apple device. Why leave money on the table by not providing that user experience?
I agree, but for some reason I don't really see gaming in Apple's short term plans.
Dude you keep pushing this narrative that isn’t true at all. The GPU in an Apple TV is not “gimped”, it benchmarks 1.8x that of a Switch/Shield TV. It costs $180, and isn’t a $400 gaming console. Nobody is asking it to compete with a PS4, but it easily outperforms a Switch which is doing fine even with 3rd party games. Stop.
I read the Ars Technica article last night, & the "curated" comment caught my attention.
Highly recommend ALL App Devs should read the entirety of the Ars Technica article ... there are some very good Nuggets in there !
Highly recommend ALL App Devs should read the entirety of the Ars Technica article ... there are some very good Nuggets in there !
Why is everyone saying that Apple isn't supporting gaming on Apple TV? It's developers who come out with game titles, not Apple. Blame developers, they are the ones who don't trust Apple TV, even though for the last three years we had the 4th gen and 5th gen hardware with CPU upgrades and 4K support. Apple also dropped the requirement for developers to support the TV remote as a controller. You don't need Apple to sell bundles, you can choose your MFi controller anywhere.
My opinion/what I'd do/wet dream: I think developers should treat the Apple TV with some retro-style gameplay to build a gamer base that differentiates from the consoles. With the twist (unlike in the 80s and 90s) that they have today excellent tools to develop great graphics/music/animations (Unity and Unreal, for example) for any platform. No 3D based graphics, and definitely no 2D-low-res pixel art (that's what we have emulators for.) Think about beginning with some classics, like Mario Bros. or Sonic The Hedgehog with some Orioto-style graphics and updated game mechanics with some physics simulations. Then your standard brawlers, fighters, out-runners, etc., again, with extremely detailed 2D-hi-res art and animations. Those were really fun games, and should be able to capture a good gaming audience and help get noticed. No in app purchases, of course. After that, you can sell more complex, 3D-based games without the fear to loose large amounts of time and money.
Imagine games that look like this on the Apple TV:
That would get it noticed among gamers because they would be fun, excellent art, gameplay and relatively low cost development when compared to larger 3D games.
One could only dream...
My opinion/what I'd do/wet dream: I think developers should treat the Apple TV with some retro-style gameplay to build a gamer base that differentiates from the consoles. With the twist (unlike in the 80s and 90s) that they have today excellent tools to develop great graphics/music/animations (Unity and Unreal, for example) for any platform. No 3D based graphics, and definitely no 2D-low-res pixel art (that's what we have emulators for.) Think about beginning with some classics, like Mario Bros. or Sonic The Hedgehog with some Orioto-style graphics and updated game mechanics with some physics simulations. Then your standard brawlers, fighters, out-runners, etc., again, with extremely detailed 2D-hi-res art and animations. Those were really fun games, and should be able to capture a good gaming audience and help get noticed. No in app purchases, of course. After that, you can sell more complex, 3D-based games without the fear to loose large amounts of time and money.
Imagine games that look like this on the Apple TV:
That would get it noticed among gamers because they would be fun, excellent art, gameplay and relatively low cost development when compared to larger 3D games.
One could only dream...
Need to blame the customers more than anything for not buying the few games that exist on the platform already. Devs are sharing their sales stats and most have decided that it isn’t worth developing for. Apple being hostile to things like Steam Link also isn’t helping.Why is everyone saying that Apple isn't supporting gaming on Apple TV? It's developers who come out with game titles, not Apple. Blame developers, they are the ones who don't trust Apple TV, even though for the last three years we had the 4th gen and 5th gen hardware with CPU upgrades and 4K support. Apple also dropped the requirement for developers to support the TV remote as a controller. You don't need Apple to sell bundles, you can choose your MFi controller anywhere.
My opinion/what I'd do/wet dream: I think developers should treat the Apple TV with some retro-style gameplay to build a gamer base that differentiates from the consoles. With the twist (unlike in the 80s and 90s) that they have today excellent tools to develop great graphics/music/animations (Unity and Unreal, for example) for any platform. No 3D based graphics, and definitely no 2D-low-res pixel art (that's what we have emulators for.) Think about beginning with some classics, like Mario Bros. or Sonic The Hedgehog with some Orioto-style graphics and updated game mechanics with some physics simulations. Then your standard brawlers, fighters, out-runners, etc., again, with extremely detailed 2D-hi-res art and animations. Those were really fun games, and should be able to capture a good gaming audience and help get noticed. No in app purchases, of course. After that, you can sell more complex, 3D-based games without the fear to loose large amounts of time and money.
Imagine games that look like this on the Apple TV:
That would get it noticed among gamers because they would be fun, excellent art, gameplay and relatively low cost development when compared to larger 3D games.
One could only dream...
When you think about where games are headed (3D, AR, incorporating ultraviolence & porn), and Apples approach to sanitized curated content, I don’t know why Apple would even want to pretend to have anything to do with gaming.
...unless they take a more artful approach, like above.
...unless they take a more artful approach, like above.
The future is CLOUD GAMING... and Apple knows this. This allows device switching and allows non-high-end gaming devices to do gaming.
You have to give customers something of quality to buy, or they will ignore you. And again, you don't see the same quality games available on iPhone than on Apple TV. To tell you the truth, and my special case... I bought Rayman's Adventures, Oceanhorn, Alto's Adventure, Horizon Chaser, Minecraft Apple TV Edition, and some others, no hesitation, for my daughter and myself. I'm interested in Manticore Rising and a couple others. Already have an MFi controller. I'd rather play on the big screen we have our Apple TV plugged in than on an iPad or iPhone. The reason I don't buy more games for the Apple TV is because 1) They don't seem to be good quality games (crappy low res 2d graphics, or really bad 3d models, clones from other games like Candy Crush, Plants V Zombies, Angry Birds, etc.,) and 2) In App Purchases. There are no attractive well-made games, and again, it's not Apple's fault. It's the developers.
BTW, Steam Link isn't my cup of tea, and not really anything more than a streaming app from your gaming computer to the Apple TV. A long HDMI cable could replace it, and that's probably the reason why Apple didn't accept it. I don't think it's a measure on Apple's attitude towards games.
Blame Apple.
Nothing stopping Apple from doing what Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo do:
Microsoft Studios
Microsoft Studios is the video game production wing for Microsoft, responsible for the development and publishing of games for the Xbox, Xbox 360, Xbox One, Games for Windows, Steam, Windows Store and Windows Phone platforms.
Sony Interactive Entertainment
...it is also a developer and publisher of video game titles...
Or maybe Apple doesn't trust AppleTV for gaming.
They've been in the AppleTV business a lot longer than their new found love for movie/TV content creation and purchasing.
Good point & if true, then maybe Apple should invest in building their own steam-equivalent service for their devices.
Apple didn't accept it because of competing app stores, and it streams controller inputs as well as video and audio - does a lot more than an HDMI cable.
I'm with you, though - I bought a bunch of games and have multiple MFi controllers, but we are outliers - when critically acclaimed indie games like Kingdom are only selling 600 copies most developers are not going to bother. And there are a handful of attractive, well-made console/PC ports like Inside, Transistor, Kingdom, Lara Croft/Hitman Go, Geometry Wars, Rayman, Octodad, etc. etc. and none of them are selling well. I would wager that Minecraft was easily the top selling Apple TV game and it still wasn't enough for them.
But they have also introduced Apple Watch, AirPods, etc. It might be more of a 'prioritizing resources' to industries more ripe for disruption. The gaming world is not what I would call 'ripe for disruption' at the moment.
My guess is they were interested until Nintendo's Switch was wildly successful. Now, it would cost too much money to build an audience. They have other major marketing efforts with Watch, Apple Music, etc. I can see them re-approaching the gaming market in a few years if the weather is right.
The dude I quoted JUST SAID it would compete with the PS4 and XBOX, LOL. Did you even read the full comment and the quoted text?
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Not really, too much lag even with a fast internet connection. Try playing a first person shooter and you'll see. Hell, even with GeForce Now the results are wonky; I tried playing NFS Hot Pursuit (2010) and while it looks great and all but the response wasn't accurate while i was hardwired to my router from both my PC and the Nvidia Shield.
How to make ATV a gaming console:
1. Bundle with a controller designed for gaming
That is it, do that and we are done. Make it nice - wireless charging, touchpad for normal ATV control, microphone for search, W2 style pairing (Meaning you can swap it to an iPad/iPhone/Mac easily).
1. Bundle with a controller designed for gaming
That is it, do that and we are done. Make it nice - wireless charging, touchpad for normal ATV control, microphone for search, W2 style pairing (Meaning you can swap it to an iPad/iPhone/Mac easily).
It's way too late. Any brief opportunity there might have been to gain some market share was squandered with the insane decision to insist developers support the remote control.
If you want to play AAA games, you already own a Playstation or XBox. If you want to game on the go, you already own a Switch. I can't see that changing anytime soon. Apple should continue to leave gaming to the professionals, as they've done since the 80s.
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Try it and see what you think. Microsoft, Nvidia, and Sony are all investing in it. I've tried it, and in its current "best" guise (GeForce Now), it's absolutely terrible. Massive amounts of lag and abysmal image quality.
If you want to play AAA games, you already own a Playstation or XBox. If you want to game on the go, you already own a Switch. I can't see that changing anytime soon. Apple should continue to leave gaming to the professionals, as they've done since the 80s.
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Try it and see what you think. Microsoft, Nvidia, and Sony are all investing in it. I've tried it, and in its current "best" guise (GeForce Now), it's absolutely terrible. Massive amounts of lag and abysmal image quality.
Step 1 is get as many iOS games on the Apple TV as possible. There can’t be that many changes needed.
There’s a reason iOS has a healthy gaming ecosystem. Duplicate that on the Apple TV somehow and build from there. Apple must be able to find an easy way for devs to port from iOS. Make it so that developing for iOS creates an atv version by default or with minimal further effort. Ride the coattails of your iOS gaming success Apple!
There’s a reason iOS has a healthy gaming ecosystem. Duplicate that on the Apple TV somehow and build from there. Apple must be able to find an easy way for devs to port from iOS. Make it so that developing for iOS creates an atv version by default or with minimal further effort. Ride the coattails of your iOS gaming success Apple!
Worst remote I had ever used. Menu button? Seriously? Should just make it the back button, there's never a menu when you hit the menu button. Touchpad is absolute crap, so hard to navigate accurately. Play/pause button redundant, you press the touchpad for the same function. Half the time, I ended up trying to navigate with the wrong end of the remote cause it looks the same.
As for gaming on it? WTF are you thinking apple? Touchpad for precise controls? Buttons in the middle of the remote instead of the sides? Get carpal tunnel just trying to maneuver hands in position for buttons. Jeez, no wonder gaming is not taking off.
For things like this, Apple really needs to embrace being a little more open, and understand multi-use peripherals. For example, certify the Xbox One controller for iOS. Now I can buy one controller and it’s useful on my Windows PC, Xbox One, Mac, AND iOS device. I don’t want to buy a separate controller to keep around JUST for iOS.
PS4 single controller 500gb at $270. Delta only $90. Bonus, blue-ray player. Some actually have physical media they own or rent. The PS4 streaming and multiplayer abilities are a significant feature.
I've wondered why none of the controller companies could make an MFI controller for iOS that *also* works on Android or PCs... Even if there had to be a little slider switch on the bottom to change modes. Since functionality-wise, the controllers would be identical (with the possible addition of L3 and R3 for non-iOS).
real controllers
Apple was really stupid to go the MFi route, rather than just including drivers for Playstation and Xbox controllers.
Lots of people who own Apple devices probably also have these controllers around, and if not, they are readily available. A lot of people don't even seem to to know you can get fairly nice controllers for iOS, but they cost as much or more (i.e.: Steelseries Nimbus, etc.).
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True, though I think if it weren't for the controller issue, more serious games would be available and do well. While it isn't a hardware match for a PS4 or Xbox One, it's adequate to do way more than it does (and would probably be fine for a lot of people/families).
Apple was really stupid to go the MFi route, rather than just including drivers for Playstation and Xbox controllers.
Lots of people who own Apple devices probably also have these controllers around, and if not, they are readily available. A lot of people don't even seem to to know you can get fairly nice controllers for iOS, but they cost as much or more (i.e.: Steelseries Nimbus, etc.).
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True, though I think if it weren't for the controller issue, more serious games would be available and do well. While it isn't a hardware match for a PS4 or Xbox One, it's adequate to do way more than it does (and would probably be fine for a lot of people/families).