GM is acting like scum

[MagnusVonMagnum]

You also not going to buy another Toyota? Because they did the same thing with the faulty gas pedal issue a few years back….

I won't buy a car from either one.

I've been buying Subarus (two WRX models since 2004), although even they have a defect with their clutch where it doesn't have a retaining clip for the release bearing to the fork which can lead to premature clutch failure if it gets stuck against the transmission case/cover. They refuse to acknowledge the defect and haven't fixed it yet since introducing it in 2005 when they switched back from pull clutches to push type clutches.

Frankly, you can't count on any large corporation to do the right thing because their FIRST PRIORITY is MAKING MONEY $$$, not doing the right thing. It's a real problem with a soulless "legal entity" as the courts seem to think corporations are people and shareholders don't invest based on anything but MONEY, the corporations do what they do best and that is do ANYTHING to make a buck. People should always come before cutting corners and sadly only threats of massive lawsuits and bad PR leading to lost slaes (where they could lose money if they don't do the right thing) is the ONLY thing that has ever phased these companies and even then they try to get away with it.

 

[ucfgrad93]

GM recalls another 218,000 cars today.

A day after recalling 2.6 million vehicles globally, most of them in the United States, GM is recalling 218,000 Chevrolet Aveo cars in the United States from model years 2004 to 2008. The problem with the cars stems from a faulty part in their daytime running lights that could overheat and cause a fire, according to documents filed with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA)

Wednesday's two recalls add to a string this year that covers almost 11.8 million vehicles in the United States, topping the previous full-year high of 10.7 million vehicles that the company recalled in the U.S. market in 2004. It pushes the number of vehicles that GM has recalled globally this year to about 15.6 million.

GM took a $1.3 billion charge in the first quarter for recall-repair costs and said Tuesday that it expects to take another $400 million charge in the second quarter for the same reason.

Since the recall began in February, GM has been hit with more than 70 lawsuits from customers who say their cars lost value because of the ignition defect, according to court documents.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/05/21/us-gm-recall-aveo-idUSBREA4K0G420140521

 

[yg17]

Another day, another GM recall.

At this point I'm not sure why anyone would buy a GM car.

 

[ucfgrad93]

Another day, another GM recall.

At this point I'm not sure why anyone would buy a GM car.

Agreed. Over 25 million cars recalled in a 2 year stretch is ridiculous.

 

[prostuff1]

Agreed. Over 25 million cars recalled in a 2 year stretch is ridiculous.

That is not quite true.

They have announced the recall of 25 million vehicles that span a larger time frame then just 2 years. The aveo they just announced was has 4 year time frame for the recall.

Since the recall began in February, GM has been hit with more than 70 lawsuits from customers who say their cars lost value because of the ignition defect, according to court documents.

This is funny... all vehicles lose value... as soon as you drive them off the lot. Good luck proving that the vehicle lost value specifically because of the ignition defect.

 

[ucfgrad93]

That is not quite true.

They have announced the recall of 25 million vehicles that span a larger time frame then just 2 years. The aveo they just announced was has 4 year time frame for the recall.

I didn't mean the models recalled only spanned a 2 year period. I meant that in 2013 & 2014 GM has announced recalls that cover 25 million cars.

 

[quagmire]

This is funny... all vehicles lose value... as soon as you drive them off the lot. Good luck proving that the vehicle lost value specifically because of the ignition defect.

Especially Cobalts. They were POS's without the defect.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

I just know I will never own/buy another GM car!

But that's what you get in a capitalistic society that has runaway from the basic idea of being of use to 'the people'.

It's all about profit, profit over everything else. There is a thread here in this forum about the EU banning US apples because of the chemical DPA. Some think the EU is being over protective (knee-jerk), and others may believe that it's being 'protective', which is a marked difference from the US lobbyist overrun capitalism where a whole list of chemicals that we come into contact on a daily basis will likely never be tested, even though many in the industry know they are highly toxic, because of a 'this was the best we could get' agreement decades ago.

Runaway Capitalism is a disease that is consuming this country and the world, and it's probably only going to get worse.

I remember as a kid, that when a corporation announced they were slashing employment, their stock price went down. When they announced they were moving jobs overseas, their stock price would take a hit. Now, within the past, what, 20 some years, those announcements make the stock price pop to higher levels.

Gone is any focus on 'the good of humanity', and the focus is more on providing 'investor return' and 'maximizing profit' then looking at anything so distant as what their product will do to the planet in a week, a month, a year, ten years, a human life... With the fracking, human life has become even more insignificant. Oklahoma has more earthquakes now than California, and people are finding toxic chemicals in their water across the country, but that scorched Earth method of raping the planet was approved by the previous administration and was excluded from environmental regulation, so rape on...

Want to know why GM did it?

They could. Their cadre of lawyers and 'risk assessment' people said it would be cheaper to do it that way...

And the investors aren't weeping about it. Their Lexus, BMW, and Bentley cars are running just fine!

And watch out, because a Chamber of Commerce dream called 'Tort Reform' is heading towards a corporation near you. Imagine, not even being able to sue GM in any meaningful way, and not getting any money from any suit.

THAT is going to be a REALLY BAD DAY IN AMERICA when that happens.

Accountability? Apparently it's only for the poor, run over by the corporations...

/soapbox

 

[JackieInCo]

Another day, another GM recall.

At this point I'm not sure why anyone would buy a GM car.

I'll still buy one. All I have ever owned were Chevys. I have a 2006 Chevy Cobalt SS Supercharged that has actually been the best Chevy I have ever owned and most reliable. I have not had it in the shop once except for brakes. Never had the problem with the ignition even though mine is included in the recall.

I tried listing it on craigslist last summer for $7500 which is lower then most 2006 SS/SC are selling for with more miles. I got lots of calls. Just couldn't bare to sell it. It's fun to drive. Can't tell you how many compliments I got on it when I would pull into gas stations or other places.

 

[AustinIllini]

Another day, another GM recall.

At this point I'm not sure why anyone would buy a GM car.

I dunno, the ATS is pretty incredible. And Buicks are fantastic. The shoddy pre bankruptcy GM cars are quickly becoming a thing of the past.

 

[JackieInCo]

I dunno, the ATS is pretty incredible. And Buicks are fantastic. The shoddy pre bankruptcy GM cars are quickly becoming a thing of the past.

The current GM cars are still featuring plastic interiors. Look at the Chevy Cruz the thing is plastic inside all over.

 

[AustinIllini]

The current GM cars are still featuring plastic interiors. Look at the Chevy Cruz the thing is plastic inside all over.

All the Chevy Cruz's competitors have plastic interiors. They're Chevys. Hondas, Toyotas, and Subarus have plastic interiors. Plastic keeps the prices competitive.

 

[JackieInCo]

Also my boss is leasing a volt and it too is nothing but plastic on the inside. Another example is the Chevy amimpala. I have a friend with one and it to is plastic on the inside.

 

[quagmire]

The current GM cars are still featuring plastic interiors. Look at the Chevy Cruz the thing is plastic inside all over.

Expecting nice BMW, Cadillac, etc grade leather wrapped dash in a $16K Cruze?

----------

Also my boss is leasing a volt and it too is nothing but plastic on the inside. Another example is the Chevy amimpala. I have a friend with one and it to is plastic on the inside.

And the Prius is plastic, the Avalon is plastic, the Altima is plastic, etc. You won't get into leather until luxury cars generally. Only the Corvette will have a leather wrapped interior if you want one in a Chevy.

 

[AustinIllini]

And the Prius is plastic, the Avalon is plastic, the Altima is plastic, etc. You won't get into leather until luxury cars. Only the Corvette will have a leather wrapped interior if you want one in a Chevy.

My Acura is a lot of leather and a lot of plastic. People hate GM as though it's just Chevy. Sad, really.

 

[quagmire]

My Acura is a lot of leather and a lot of plastic. People hate GM as though it's just Chevy. Sad, really.

Yep basically. A lot of people who say they will never buy GM again were already in that camp( yg, etc) before this mess. And they are using the latest recalls( outside of the ignition switch) as a way to say GM is a POS ignoring it's a PR move at this point. Toyota did the same thing when they had their pedal scandal. They went on a recall binge for a bit. Will yg, satcomer, etc say Toyota's are a POS? It's a double standard.

 

[AustinIllini]

Yep basically. A lot of people who say they will never buy GM again were already in that camp( yg, etc) before this mess. And they are using the latest recalls( outside of the ignition switch) as a way to say GM is a POS ignoring it's a PR move at this point. Toyota did the same thing when they had their pedal scandal. They went on a recall binge for a bit. Will yg, satcomer, etc say Toyota's are a POS? It's a double standard.

Toyotas are the same thing as Chevy...except with zero exciting models and they're getting worse. This FT-1 had better be the best car ever built because the Toyota logo is the ultimate snorefest at this point.

Consumers do themselves a disservice by not considering all the major Japanese, American, European, and Korean brands at this point.

 

[quagmire]

Toyotas are the same thing as Chevy...except with zero exciting models and they're getting worse. This FT-1 had better be the best car ever built because the Toyota logo is the ultimate snorefest at this point.

Consumers do themselves a disservice by not considering all the major Japanese, American, European, and Korean brands at this point.

I agree that Toyota's are snorefests.

Point was Toyota went through the exact same thing GM is going through right now with their defective gas pedal scandal. They covered the defect up, etc. Only difference is GM managed to hide it for longer. They recalled other cars for other issues to show they are being open about defects, save face, etc.

 

[yg17]

Yep basically. A lot of people who say they will never buy GM again were already in that camp( yg, etc) before this mess. And they are using the latest recalls( outside of the ignition switch) as a way to say GM is a POS ignoring it's a PR move at this point. Toyota did the same thing when they had their pedal scandal. They went on a recall binge for a bit. Will yg, satcomer, etc say Toyota's are a POS? It's a double standard.

You won't see me ever buying a Toyota. Not a chance in hell. Not with their current line up, they don't make anything that I'd want to drive.

At least GM has the new Corvette which is a good looking car and I assume a blast to drive. Toyota's entire lineup is dull and boring.

Let me put it this way: I can't see myself ever buying a GM or a Toyota. The difference is, if I won a new Corvette, I'd keep it and have a fun car for the weekend. If I won a new Toyota (any model), I'd sell it and use the money to pay off my current car.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

Also my boss is leasing a volt and it too is nothing but plastic on the inside. Another example is the Chevy amimpala. I have a friend with one and it to is plastic on the inside.

What material do you want used in a car? Leather? I'm sure vegans (and Indians) don't like that material much in their cars. What else is there? Artificial leather like BMW uses? Then people would cry it's cheap FAKE material. Vinyl? Synthetics. I mean I always read this garbage about how horrible the interiors are in various cars and it's always due to plastic, but put fake leather in there and it's suddenly not "cheap"? Synthetic is synthetic. Cheap is in the mind of the beholder. My WRX has plastic and I don't care a whit about it. What I do mind is the lack of cushioning material between it and other surfaces. That's what makes vibrational noise, etc. Put sound insulation and cushioned surfaces behind the panels and it's as quiet as a Lincoln (well until you put the sport exhaust on )

Plastic comes in many forms. My glasses are made of high-index plastic. It's the hard/hollow crap that feels cheap.

 

[JackieInCo]

What material do you want used in a car? Leather? I'm sure vegans (and Indians) don't like that material much in their cars. What else is there? Artificial leather like BMW uses? Then people would cry it's cheap FAKE material. Vinyl? Synthetics. I mean I always read this garbage about how horrible the interiors are in various cars and it's always due to plastic, but put fake leather in there and it's suddenly not "cheap"? Synthetic is synthetic. Cheap is in the mind of the beholder. My WRX has plastic and I don't care a whit about it. What I do mind is the lack of cushioning material between it and other surfaces. That's what makes vibrational noise, etc. Put sound insulation and cushioned surfaces behind the panels and it's as quiet as a Lincoln (well until you put the sport exhaust on )

Plastic comes in many forms. My glasses are made of high-index plastic. It's the hard/hollow crap that feels cheap.

Of course some cars interiors will always be made of plastic, but it's the way GM is using it and not hiding the fact that it is cheap plastic. It looks cheap in the cars.

Have you read any reviews done over the last ten years on Chevys? They always score low marks because of the cheap plastic interiors compared to other manufacturers such as Honda and Toyota. All Chevys that I have seen cut the plastic molding in the car to where the pieces don't even lung up properly.

Also, I owned three different cobalts, two were new from the factory and one used and all were different years: a 2009, 2006 and a 2005. All of them had this issue where the chrome playing on the drivers side door handle peeled off leaving dangerous jagged edges that cut my hand. I even looked at another Cobalt at a used car lot a few years ago and it too had the chrome plating peeling off the drivers side door handle.

Drive any Chevy over the last ten years or so? When you are in the drivers seat, look over to the passenger door and look at the inside panel and look at how much of the door frame you can see? Notice how it's the color that the car is painted? My family has two different Honda cars and the inside door panel is perfectly designed so that you don't see that. These Hondas also have nice cloth door panels that are not plastic and the face of the dashboard is also padded giving it a nice look. Sure there is plastic underneath but Honda obviously cares how the interiors look on their cars.

I still own a 2006 Chevy Cobalt SS Supercharged and don't regret buying it. As I said above, it's been the most reliable Chevy I have owned mechanical wise. Bought it new and other than breaks,maintenance and an alignment, it's not seen the inside of a shop for repairs. It still even has the original clutch.

 

[quagmire]

Of course some cars interiors will always be made of plastic, but it's the way GM is using it and not hiding the fact that it is cheap plastic. It looks cheap in the cars.

Have you read any reviews done over the last ten years on Chevys? They always score low marks because of the cheap plastic interiors compared to other manufacturers such as Honda and Toyota. All Chevys that I have seen cut the plastic molding in the car to where the pieces don't even lung up properly.

Also, I owned three different cobalts, two were new from the factory and one used and all were different years: a 2009, 2006 and a 2005. All of them had this issue where the chrome playing on the drivers side door handle peeled off leaving dangerous jagged edges that cut my hand. I even looked at another Cobalt at a used car lot a few years ago and it too had the chrome plating peeling off the drivers side door handle.

Drive any Chevy over the last ten years or so? When you are in the drivers seat, look over to the passenger door and look at the inside panel and look at how much of the door frame you can see? Notice how it's the color that the car is painted? My family has two different Honda cars and the inside door panel is perfectly designed so that you don't see that. These Hondas also have nice cloth door panels that are not plastic and the face of the dashboard is also padded giving it a nice look. Sure there is plastic underneath but Honda obviously cares how the interiors look on their cars.

I still own a 2006 Chevy Cobalt SS Supercharged and don't regret buying it. As I said above, it's been the most reliable Chevy I have owned mechanical wise. Bought it new and other than breaks,maintenance and an alignment, it's not seen the inside of a shop for repairs. It still even has the original clutch.

So you're basing your opinion on the Cobalt? The Cobalt is a POS. I have a 2007 Saturn Aura XR, yeah there are some cheap areas in the interior, but for the most part it is solid.

My mom has a 2013 Equinox and the interior is pretty good. My dad has a 2014 Cadillac ATS and the quality of material is top notch. As good as the 3 series if not better.

I'm not expecting super awesome interior in a Cruze. The interior is good and quality is expected of the class.

 

[AustinIllini]

Of course some cars interiors will always be made of plastic, but it's the way GM is using it and not hiding the fact that it is cheap plastic. It looks cheap in the cars.

You don't know how car marques work, do you? None of the manufacturers "hide" their plastic pieces in their entry level sedans.

Have you read any reviews done over the last ten years on Chevys? They always score low marks because of the cheap plastic interiors compared to other manufacturers such as Honda and Toyota. All Chevys that I have seen cut the plastic molding in the car to where the pieces don't even lung up properly.

Since the reemergence from bankruptcy, this is simply not true. Honda and Toyota have become stale and have allowed Chevy to equal or surpass them. Honda has been particularly bad. They have allowed Buick to pass up on Acura in many cases (Verano > ILX).

Also, I owned three different cobalts, two were new from the factory and one used and all were different years: a 2009, 2006 and a 2005.

OMG why? Why would you subject yourself to that horrible automobile?

All of them had this issue where the chrome playing on the drivers side door handle peeled off leaving dangerous jagged edges that cut my hand. I even looked at another Cobalt at a used car lot a few years ago and it too had the chrome plating peeling off the drivers side door handle.

Cobalts are horrible. My first car was a Cobalt. I had it for a year before I sold it.

Drive any Chevy over the last ten years or so? When you are in the drivers seat, look over to the passenger door and look at the inside panel and look at how much of the door frame you can see? Notice how it's the color that the car is painted? My family has two different Honda cars and the inside door panel is perfectly designed so that you don't see that. These Hondas also have nice cloth door panels that are not plastic and the face of the dashboard is also padded giving it a nice look. Sure there is plastic underneath but Honda obviously cares how the interiors look on their cars.

I have. My little brother drives a Cruze. My old man drives a 2014 Impala. Have you looked at either of the reviews from those cars? They are absolutely fantastic. My brother's Cruze has as much plastic in it as my TSX does, frankly.

I still own a 2006 Chevy Cobalt SS Supercharged and don't regret buying it. As I said above, it's been the most reliable Chevy I have owned mechanical wise. Bought it new and other than breaks,maintenance and an alignment, it's not seen the inside of a shop for repairs. It still even has the original clutch.

I've heard those things are quite fun.

 

[Southern Dad]

I bought a Toyota Prius because mpg is important to me. When I purchased my Prius (Jan 8, 2012 - The King's Birthday) there was no US made vehicle that got the 50 mpg in the price range. This is my third hybrid (2000 Honda Insight, 2008 Toyota Prius).

Although the Chevrolet Volt has the great mpg for the first 30 miles, after that it sucks. In addition, it requires premium gasoline. Further, I'm not a fan of a car company that tries to dump responsibility for everything made pre-bankruptcy. If I buy another US made car, it will be a Ford. They haven't filed bankruptcy, taken a bailout or been sold to a foreign country.

 

[D.T.]

What material do you want used in a car? Leather? I'm sure vegans (and Indians) don't like that material much in their cars. What else is there? Artificial leather like BMW uses? Then people would cry it's cheap FAKE material. Vinyl? Synthetics. I mean I always read this garbage about how horrible the interiors are in various cars and it's always due to plastic, but put fake leather in there and it's suddenly not "cheap"? Synthetic is synthetic. Cheap is in the mind of the beholder.

I’m totally with you on plastic != cheap.

There’s plenty of plastics, even in high[er] end models from [perceived] high-line brands like BMW - our $65K X5 had leather, vinyl, and an ample amount of plastics - same for the Lexus GS I owned. From my perspective, the plastics were very high quality, had nice feel, and the overall ergonomics, fit and finish were outstanding (i.e., it’s about how they’re used as much as using them in the first place).

The truth is (like the quoted above pointed out), there’s only so many durable materials you can source, and for some things like switch gear, electronics surfaces, bezels, handles, (high contact, rigid components) plastic is the best choice.

----------

If I buy another US made car, it will be a Ford. They haven't filed bankruptcy, taken a bailout or been sold to a foreign country.

I believe a Ford might be my next ride.