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Google and Apple's Search Engine Deal Violates Antitrust Law
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That deal shows the power of an opt-out option. Of course people could still switch the search engine on your own, but most will not do that and your grandma probably does not know how to do that. That's why it is worth billions to be the default search engine.
Instagram for example decided to hide some content by default and if you do not want that, you can disable that filter. However most people are too lazy, do not care or don't know how to do it. That why default options are so dangerous and can even lead to an antitrust case.
Instagram for example decided to hide some content by default and if you do not want that, you can disable that filter. However most people are too lazy, do not care or don't know how to do it. That why default options are so dangerous and can even lead to an antitrust case.
That's because the default was already set and you didn't have to do anything but if forced to make a choice on set-up or after an update, most people will choose Google Search anyway.
Now if this deal is illegal apple won't be able to make a similar deal with another company, so they will have to provide the option to choose the default search engine, like its required in the EU for any OS for example.
Also Google doesn't outright pay apple 20 billions, they pay a percentage of the money they make, the more money they make the bigger the pay. The idea is apple won't see this kind of money from any other company so they will lose more than Google which most likely will remain the most popular search engine on apple's platforms.
The idea that apple will make a search engine that will take over the online search market is fantasy.
Google and Apple was always going to lose this because Google did not become the default browser because they were better than their competition, they became the default browser because they could pay more than anyone else and can continually prevent their competitors from becoming the default browser by continuing to pay more money than them. Apple encouraged this by not picking the best browser but by picking the one who can pay them the most money.
This is why ant-trust laws exist. It is to stop those with financial clout being able to use their financial clout to drown out the competition and win the contracts, regardless of how good or bad their product is.
This forum is very good evidence in proving the DoJ's case against Apple and Google because their are thousands of posts over the years from Apple user's explaining how there are better browsers than Google that Apple should be using on it's platforms but yet Apple has continued to go with the one that pays them the most money.
This is why ant-trust laws exist. It is to stop those with financial clout being able to use their financial clout to drown out the competition and win the contracts, regardless of how good or bad their product is.
This forum is very good evidence in proving the DoJ's case against Apple and Google because their are thousands of posts over the years from Apple user's explaining how there are better browsers than Google that Apple should be using on it's platforms but yet Apple has continued to go with the one that pays them the most money.
Good, at last.
This deal was always utterly disgusting and dirty, Apple "we care about privacy" taking bucks to make sure you use google search who they then claim steal your info and you shouldn't trust them.
It's one of the most hypocritical things I've ever seen from Apple.
Tim OUT.
This deal was always utterly disgusting and dirty, Apple "we care about privacy" taking bucks to make sure you use google search who they then claim steal your info and you shouldn't trust them.
It's one of the most hypocritical things I've ever seen from Apple.
Tim OUT.
DuckDuckGo has its own web crawler (DuckDuckBot) and uses Bing, Yahoo as well as Yandex, so not just Bing (according to ChatGPT).
DuckAppleDuck (DAD) would be a good name...
Guys, even 5% is a monster percentage...
Especially if you compare it with the risks&resources behind that value!
Google Search is people's favorite Search engine most of the time anyway.
While I get what you're saying, I find it significantly less plausible that Google would pay $20 billion a year for essentially nothing. These corporations exist to make money; no one gives away billions for free (unless, of course, it happens to be tax payer money lol)
It hardly makes sense. In general Google Search is the most popular search engine and Windows and Android each have over 70% of their respective maket. Even if half of Android and Windows users wouldn't access the internet Google Search would still get more traffic from these platforms than from ios and MacOS.
I get what you're saying, and had Apple performed a bait-and-switch, I would agree with you.
But iPhone and iPad were always like this. Hundreds of millions of people bought them (with extremely high satisfaction scores) just the way they are.
The closed, controlled ecosystem was always the value proposition for these platforms.
And if you recall, the 30% cut Apple takes was considered an AWESOME deal for developers at the time.
So what has actually changed since 2008?
Not Apple, not iPhone, but rather some people's opinion of how Apple's platform should operate.
Well, that's not exactly true; the network effects of having such a large installed base gives Apple a lot of power to make even more money.
What is unclear to me is what is the best course of action here; do we force all companies to be "open" even though people bought into them because they were closed and controlled?
That doesn't seem like a clear-cut win, either.
Do we prevent Apple from offering new integrated services because that, in a sense, is taking advantage of their monopoly position within its own platforms? (This is what is happening with Microsoft and it including Teams in Office in the EU)
That seems like a terrible approach to prevent vertically integrated companies from offering more integrated services.
These are difficult questions to answer because laws should apply evenly to all companies; you can't just make exceptions for one company here and another one there.
In other words, this stuff is complicated and IMO going for quick fixes is more likely to result in even worse outcomes, which is why I remain cautious of any legislative solutions to these complex topics.
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Google pays a percentage of the money they make from apple's platform, they don't outright pay 20 billions.
Google will still remain the most popular search engine on apple's platforms anyway. If people will be forced to choose the default search engine, we know most will choose Google. This decision is not in apple's favor.
The fact that the user can change the default search engine proves that this isn’t happening. How exactly is Apple “making sure you use google search” if we can change the search engine?
$20 billion hurts any which way. That's likely more than the profit Apple makes with their entire Mac lineup. Just for keeping Google as their default search engine. Sure, they'll be fine. And shareholders will see it differently.
Because it’s free money, and as a user, I can (and have) switch to alternatives like DDG.
They want Apple’s customers due to them typically outspending Android users.
Whatever the case, the only loser in this is the consumer who will have to take additional steps to set Safari as the default search engine. It’s going to appeal so it’ll be years before anything is done anyway I’m sure and will figure out another way to make it financial or rewarding.
Why wouldn’t Apple be able to make a deal with another company? It’s Google that have been found guilty of being a monopolist, there'll be nothing stopping Apple from agreeing a deal with another company to set their search engine as the default. I’d fully expect Microsoft to quite happily step into the breach, I’m sure they’d be delighted to take a sizeable chunk of Google’s search engine share and profits.
Business relation.
A lucrative contract for both and most likely Google didn't want to go against apple, knowing how petty apple is as a company(this is very obvious by looking at apple's relation with Nvidia). But now, this works in their favor and apple can't do anything about it and has no excuse to sabotage Google.
Because these kind of deals will be classified as illegal. Apple will most likely be forced to provide upon setup(or after an update)the option to choose the default search engine, just like the do in the EU already.
Even if apple signs a deal with Microsoft( which will also be classified as illegal in the future)there's no way 36% of even more of what Microsoft will make, will amount to 20 billion. Google Seach is a money making machine like no other.
The type of deal would only be illegal for Google to enter into as they are the ones guilty of being a monopolist. Neither Apple or Microsoft have been found guilty of being monopolists in the search engine market, so there’d be nothing stopping them from entering into an agreement. It would be rather odd for Apple or Microsoft to be punished for Google’s wrongdoing!
I suspect Microsoft would jump at the chance.
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How are they going extinct? Are you using search exclusively to find trivia? The most important and profitable function of search is to facilitate transactions.
How many people would actually stick with Bing as the default vs switching to Google Search the first chance they got?
With Google, it's easy to see why they went ahead with the deal. Search is actually still pretty good, users don't really hate the service, and neither party is really losing anything here.