Google and TweetDeck Executives Respond to Jobs' Anti-Android Comments

[Redgiemental]

Interesting comment on TweetDeck's blog then.

Here is a a quote from a dev on the Tweetdeck blog when asked about the difference between developing apps for the iPhone and Android.

"@Crow74 It's not particularly harder to develop for Android over iPhone (from a programming standpoint). Except when it comes to final QA and testing. Then it can be a nightmare. (A manageable nightmare mind you)
I know of a major company having a multi million dollar project held up because of it. Project managers definitely prefer developing for iPhone over Android. Because there is less to worry about in final QA."

Unfortunately Tweetdeck did not answer the user directly as far I can tell to compare as it would certainly be interesting. Doesn't seem a million miles away from what Steve said to me.

Blog entry here http://blog.tweetdeck.com/android-ecosystem. The dev appears to work for this company http://www.simpletree.biz/blog/ and seems legit.

Edit: For clarification it does not appear that the dev works for tweetdeck, let me make that part clear.

 

[mcoyne]

No? Then why do they reply with "mkdir android ; cd android ; repo init -u git://android.git.kernel.org/platform/manifest.git ; repo sync ; make"

Because Google doesn't get it (or at least Rubin doesn't). Most of the smart phone public will understand the difference between "fragmented" and "integrated". The majority will have no idea what Rubin is talking about and this sort of thing would most likely scare them off if they were unfortunate enough to see it.

 

[BC2009]

lol wut?

So the developer found it cool that people have their choice of what android device they are using and that many of these people were using their client.

And you took a that as them not admitting its difficult? How is it a nightmare? What evidence can you support that this means its a nightmare?

Maybe for 3D gaming apps...but for basic apps like a twitter app you are not going to have issues really across the many devices.

I have to agree -- having support for many devices is not necessarily hard to do. When Java came about it was cool that you could write the code and test it on a couple of platforms and it would "just work" on a whole bunch of platforms. There is always going to be the fringe case where one thing does not work on one device, but you can provide support for a variety of devices with a good standardized API that is implemented and certified to standard on each device.

However, it doesn't mean I would call Android completely "open" either. Whenever somebody is trying to sell you "open" and that somebody is not the GNU or Apache community, then more often than not, "open" is really another word for "bait". Its always "open" to a degree in such cases, because the businesses always want to lock you into their platform (i.e.: close you in) so they can own your information for advertising and marketing and upgrade purchases. Its not bad -- its good business. Just don't believe the "Google is all about freedom" rhetoric. The only guy I buy that line from is Richard Stallman and the GNU community -- and Stallman is a bit on the "wacko" side if you ask me.

 

[nefan65]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPod; U; CPU iPhone OS 3_1_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/528.18 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0 Mobile/7E18 Safari/528.16)

Android is an interesting platform. I actually have enjoyed the Droid X with its seemless feel. Everyone is bashing on Android because it has multiple platforms. Android is working.

But this will no doubt become an issue in the future when Android becomes bigger with more app development. Having too many platforms will become a nightmare. It might not be yet and it might only take 2 people to do it but just wait. Wait until Andriod is big.

Based on what others are saying, it already is big...no? Personally, I think the Android OS is kinda cool. The problem I have are the devices. Different carriers, different handsets; some good, some suck. Even if I didn't have an iPhone, I'd stay on AT&T, because it provides good service in my area vs. the others. They have a couple of Android handsets, but they both suck. Same can be said for a few of the others; T-Mobile one of them [IMHO]. I tried a couple of their Android phones, and wasn't impressed.

Like someone else said here earlier; too many of the carriers are fragmenting the OS. Some are on 1.6, other 2.1, some just getting 2.2. Then they pollute the device with non-removable junk and tweaks....

 

[samcraig]

Um.....
Its not like TweetDeck is a hardware dependent application.

Something like TweetDeck could run on a watch calculator from 1980.

Now, when you get to GAMES and other REAL applications designed for Android, fragmentation can be a very big problem.

Just look at Windows. Sure Calculator.exe works on every platform but try and pop in a game like Crisis (or whatever is the top end game these days) and you run into a problem.

Steve Jobs didn't make the issue about games, calculators or other apps. He specifically used TweetDeck as an example. It was a poor choice based on Tweedeck's response.

 

[Žalgiris]

I think the choice is whether you'd like to get the ads from Apple or Google. Your info is used for the same purposes on the Apple platform.

That's the point i would not. And Apple vs Google data mining wise is like my local hill ( about 200 feet high) vs Everest.

 

[NebulaClash]

Actually, I'd contest this. I'll wager that even on a site like this, only the tiniest percentage has the inclination to modify open source software.
20 years in all aspects of this industry, and I can count the number of people who have any interest in this on one hand.

But if that sliver is Android's target audience, then more power to them. I'll be over here on the side where the money is.

Absolutely correct. It's hard for MacRumors posters to see this because on this site you have a geekier audience including many developers. Most smart phone users have never even heard of MacRumors, or could even imagine themselves developing code. They want a phone that works consistently.

 

[macsmurf]

Exactly. They are forced to develop for the least common denominator. This leaves exciting potential features unimplemented so that the software can work on the broadest set of hardware.

Innovation goes out the window.



GL

Not really. Games are good examples. There are numerous graphic cards out there. This is resolved by auto detecting, demos, and posting minimum requirements.

 

[Rodimus Prime]

Link please? How do "sales numbers" correlate with "switching over in droves" exactly? The majority of Android users I know only got an Android device because the iPhone is not available on their carrier of choice. I don't know anyone who chose an Android device over an iPhone when both were a viable option.

Let's get the iPhone on Verizon, Sprint and T-Mobile and see about all this "switching over in droves," hmm?

I'm willing to wager Android is more a reluctant second choice by necessity rather than a willful first choice for most Android users.

As it has been pointed out many times before. Look over seas iPhone on all carriers and Android on all carrier yet low and behold Android is out selling the iPhone......

Argument fail.

 

[Mattie Num Nums]

That's the point i would not. And Apple vs Google sata mining wise is like my local hill ( about 200 feet high) vs Everest.

Hilarious. You act like Apple isn't trying to do the same thing with your data google is! Hello!!! Apple is a corp. that is just as power and money hungry as the next one.

 

[czeluff]

Jobs constantly gets trashed by the Android "community": the hardware manufacturers, the Android devs, etc.

I don't think it's very wrong for him to assert the principles that he and his company believe in.

 

[diddl14]

Rubin's tweet amounted to defining "open" as the code required to get the Repo tool that serves as a basis for working with Android source code installed and ready for use.

Think someone is missing the point here. The tweeted statement downloads all Android 'open source' and builds (compiles etc) the OS. The repo and build tools must be installed for the statement to work.

 

[eliotw]

the majority won't 'see' it at all. THink about it. Average users don't care about upgrading their phones or tinkering with Sense, TouchWiz, etc. Average users go and buy a phone and keep it for two years, and buy another one.

They don't care.

Tinkering they won't care about but that's not the point.

When they can't get the newest cool game (or functionality) their buddy with the brand new phone has then they will suddenly care.

 

[crazy4apple]

u* yours Google, Sc**w All Androind Devices

for life

 

[Boston007]

Oh please! Calling all iPhone 2G owners! Hows iOS4? Oh yeah thats right... see above statement.

Never let -fanboyism get in the way of reality LOL

 

[NebulaClash]

Steve Jobs didn't make the issue about games, calculators or other apps. He specifically used TweetDeck as an example. It was a poor choice based on Tweedeck's response.

Maybe. This is corporate communication, and that means shading what you say based on the audience. So privately they whine to Steve about the headache that is Android, but when this becomes public knowledge their lawyers tell them to "fix this immediately." Thus they play nice to Android now. This could easily explain the discrepancy instead of Steve is a liar or made a mistake or whatever.

 

[LagunaSol]

Oh please! Calling all iPhone 2G owners! Hows iOS4? Oh yeah thats right... see above statement.

Way to bring up a 3-year-old device to make your point while failing to acknowledge there are brand new devices sitting on store shelves right now that are stuck on Android 1.6.

 

[azurebat]

This has to be the stupidest comment I've ever read, in any forum, anywhere.

Haven't read many threads on here then have you

 

[notjustjay]

The biggest tech snow job I can recall since Microsoft's "The Freedom To Innovate" astroturfing campaign. "A future we do not want???" Here's a future I don't want: a future where Google is the exclusive gatekeeper of the world's information.

Yeah. Let's hope Android and RIM and everyone else dies a quick and painful death, so that iPhone can capture 100% market share and our beloved Apple can be the exclusive gatekeeper of the world's information.

 

[macsmurf]

Absolutely correct. It's hard for MacRumors posters to see this because on this site you have a geekier audience including many developers. Most smart phone users have never even heard of MacRumors, or could even imagine themselves developing code. They want a phone that works consistently.

Open is not just about modifying source code. There are a lot of benefits to OSS that doesn't require you to be able to modify source code.

 

[BC2009]

usually it's Makefile, not MakeFile, unless you want to use -f

rofl -- hillarious

 

[nefan65]

Link please? How do "sales numbers" correlate with "switching over in droves" exactly? The majority of Android users I know only got an Android device because the iPhone is not available on their carrier of choice. I don't know anyone who chose an Android device over an iPhone when both were a viable option.

Let's get the iPhone on Verizon, Sprint and T-Mobile and see about all this "switching over in droves," hmm?

I'm willing to wager Android is more a reluctant second choice by necessity rather than a willful first choice for most Android users.

Definitely agree with that. I work with someone who's on Sprint, because of where they live [AT&T service is spotty]. He himself said "I wanted an iPhone, but since Sprint doesn't have it yet, I ended up getting an Android device". That isn't to say it's a bad phone, but he clearly bought it out of necessity; not because it was better than the iPhone...

 

[Westside guy]

What do you think Google would say in response? They will never admit their problems, so of course they are going to ignore Steve's point and misdirect the issue to an area they like.

It's amazing how this easily this can refer to an item in Apple's very recent past...

What do you think Apple would say in response (to the V4 antenna issues)? They will never admit their problems, so of course they are going to ignore the complainers' point and misdirect the issue to an area they like.

Eerie...

 

[ksgant]

I was seriously considering buying an Android phone recently. I didn't have ANY mobile phone at all, but wanted to drop my home-phone service and just keep my DSL. So I did some research on Android.

Wow....what a mess. So, if they just had the Android Froyo 2.2 OS on the phones, with it's UI and that's it, it would be fine. But no...get an HTC phone? It's got Sense UI on it. Want a Motorola Droid X? It's got it's Blur UI on it. Want the standard Froyo 2.2 UI on a phone? As far as I know, only the discontinued Nexus One offered that. Everything else has "value added" BS added to the phone and UI, including nice little demo programs that YOU CAN'T DELETE.

This is what Steve was talking about when he said fragmentation. You can't just pick up any Android phone and have the "Android experience". Depending on which phone or carrier you have, it could be totally different. I've even heard co-workers who both have Android phones getting confused over this because one had an Evo with Sense and the other guy had a Droid with Blur.

You pick up an iPhone, it's an iPhone. Which is what I walked out with, an iPhone 4. No bumper case either...and have zero problems with reception or coverage.

 

[LagunaSol]

Yeah. Let's hope Android and RIM and everyone else dies a quick and painful death, so that iPhone can capture 100% market share and our beloved Apple can be the exclusive gatekeeper of the world's information.

Apple is not an information gatekeeper. They are a device seller.

You can always walk away from an Apple device if you so choose. Good luck walking away from Google five years from now.