Google Announces Google Chrome Operating System

[Wikinerd]

You (apparently) missed the text: "Leopard Users" below the $29

Again, how will that matter? When they restart they pop the CD in it's the same, with EFI, hard drive.

OS X licensing isn't like Windows in that you can't get a "partial" license like the Windows "upgrade" ones...

PS. ofc, I'll wait for the EULA to come out before making final arguments on that lot..

 

[chaosconan]

No arguments with that-- but when it comes to typing symbols, hell breaks loose when you have to navigate an insert a symbol that's not within the usual 26 alphabets, 10 numbers and 10 symbols...

On windows its ALT+{using num_pad 4 digit number for the symbol}
I'm not sure on leopard. Does anyone know?

 

[DoFoT9]

On windows its ALT+{using num_pad 4 digit number for the symbol}
I'm not sure on leopard. Does anyone know?

what symbol are you after??

: option: + any key gives this:
¡™£¢∞§¶•ªº–≠œ∑´®†¥¨ˆøπ“åß∂ƒ©˙∆˚¬…æΩ≈ç√∫˜µ≤≥ etcetc

:shift:+: option: gives this:
€‹›fifl‡°·‚—±Œ„´‰ˇÁ¨ˆØ∏”’ÅÍÎÏ˝ÓÔÒÚƸ˛Ç◊ı˜Â¯˘

im sure there are more key combinations.

 

[chaosconan]

what symbol are you after??

: option: + any key gives this:
¡™£¢∞§¶•ªº–≠œ∑´®†¥¨ˆøπ“åß∂ƒ©˙∆˚¬…æΩ≈ç√∫˜µ≤≥ etcetc

:shift:+: option: gives this:
€‹›fifl‡°·‚—±Œ„´‰ˇÁ¨ˆØ∏”’ÅÍÎÏ˝ÓÔÒÚƸ˛Ç◊ı˜Â¯˘

im sure there are more key combinations.

Like the apple symbol

 

[Wikinerd]

On windows its ALT+{using num_pad 4 digit number for the symbol}
I'm not sure on leopard. Does anyone know?

Yep. You have to memorize the numbers...

On macs you press option/shift/option-and-shift + an alphabet/symbol/etc

That way you can have a better way for organizing them:

such as option-r for ®, option-f for ƒ, option-p for π (pi), option-o for ø, opt-t for †, opt-y for ¥, opt-c for c

then most of the shift-option keys are alternate punctuation keys....

Oh, and for accents on letters it's opt+accent - letter, for example the acute accent (accent "aigu" in french) with e it's opt+e, then release, then type e again. for the acute accent with a it's opt+e - a...

PS. if you're on a mac, you can choose in the international>languages menu to open the keyboard viewer...

PPS.  is option-shift-k

 

[DoFoT9]

Like the apple symbol



not sure but i dont think it appears on PCs haha, its good but!

 

[Wikinerd]



not sure but i dont think it appears on PCs haha, its good but!

U+F8FF. Interestingly it shows as the windows logo in WingDings...

im sure there are more key combinations.

Don't forget Shift+smth and plain. Those are symbols too—just that they're ones we recognize as alphabets and numbers.

 

[AidenShaw]

I personally am split between the different interfaces of the operating system. I can't say I like one over the other completely. For example the accelerators on windows is far better than Mac OS. You can practically navigate through everything without a mouse. But on Mac OS you cannot.

Interface Winner

Menus windows (each window has its own menu system that does not change and easier to access)
Toolbars macosx (toolbars on the max were always superior but the ribbons isn pretty interesting)
Docks macosx (better organized with more features then your start menu)
Windows macosx (window arrangement and visualization is better but i hate those circicles at the top. they are just too small to click, bring back the boxes)
Accelerators windows (you can practically do everything through the keys navigating through the menu system)
Icons macosx (icons are always superior on mac)
Finder macosx (more features and better organization)
Desktop macosx (desktop organization is better)
Kernel macosx (more stable)
File System macosx (none of that stupid drive C or D crap as well as those fake link files)
Storage windows (better disk management)
Games windows (more games and better support like directx)
Software windows (more software)

Which version of Windows are you comparing against? I hope Windows 7 against OSX 10.6. The Win7 taskbar and increased use of the ribbon metaphor are definite advancements.

And for "file systems", perhaps you should look up "reparse points", 32K character length file names, volume shadow services (this is *huge*), support for huge volumes (I have some 16 TiB filesystems). Windows servers with NTFS are doing some amazing things - don't knock them just because you don't like .lnk files!

Apple switched to intel (no similar move in Microsoft's history)

That's because Microsoft supports older systems far longer - basically until no one cares anymore. Vista x86 still supports DOS 16-bit applications. (x64 Windows systems don't support 16-bit apps from the early '90s, sorry)

Windows NT runs on (or has been sold on):

• 32-bit x86
• 64-bit x64
• 64-bit Itanium
• Alpha (in 32-bit mode - 64-bit Alpha was in Beta, but Alpha support was dropped before it shipped)
• PowerPC
• MIPS
• SPARC

I don't think that you know Microsoft history.

 

[CyberBob859]

You know, OS X is just an Apple-branded FreeBSD distro.

The question is whether Google redesigns the graphical interface (replacing X Window with their own system) like Apple did, or if they simply use X Window to display the Chrome browser. The latter solution would be easier in terms of 3rd party support for audio/video, since companies can reuse their linux code. Of course such a solution could be upgraded to a full Linux desktop with little extra work.

But as I understand Google's claim, they want to produce something more radical than that. If they build a new architecture on top of the linux kernel, a lot of web-based software needs to be written to rewritten before the Chrome-OS becomes usable. This might turn into the classical chicken-and-egg problem that companies don't want to develop for a non-existing market because the users don't find the apps they need. We will have to see how it turns out.

Google has been dabbling behind the scenes in this for a couple of years, and if the clues other companies have been leaving are any indication, this could be a radical OS.

First, there are companies playing around with "instant on" OS, by including Linux (or at least a portion of it) in the BIOS. You power on and in a couple of seconds, you're ready to go online. A remarkable screenshot is here:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-10110716-1.html?tag=mncol;title

Then, there's Google Gears, where you can have Google apps cached locally when online access is not available. And Google Gadgets for Linux for snippets from the web (gOS also features this):

http://www.thinkgos.com/gos/index.html

With everything done from the web, you can go with a smaller hard drive (or no hard drive at all). And, if Google makes money on search and advertising, they could give away the OS if they want.

Suddenly, the margins-strapped netbook market looks a lot more profitable for HP, Dell, etc.

The big question is whether consumers would go for it, but if you have a decent, very portable machine for $300-$400 with Google's name on it, designed primarily for web access, I think people will give it at least a look and take it seriously.

Also consider that Google already has their Chrome browser available for Windows, and is working on a browser for the Mac and Linux, they may be able to sneak some of the features in the upcoming Chrome OS to the machine you already use.

 

[chaosconan]



not sure but i dont think it appears on PCs haha, its good but!

I believe its Option-Shift-K for the logo

 

[luminosity]

Interesting article from the Washington Post on how the new Google OS may not affect Apple much:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/08/AR2009070803070.html

As for Chrome OS and OS X themselves, I wouldn't waste too much time thinking about it. While it will take several years for this all to play out, this is a direct attack by Google on Microsoft's core. It's perhaps the most bold move in a series of battles currently raging between the two (Android vs. Windows Mobile, Bing vs. Google Search, Google Docs vs. Office, etc). This is all about Microsoft, and not about Apple. And I don't think Apple is losing any sleep at night over Google attacking what is also its rival.

 

[DoFoT9]

U+F8FF. Interestingly it shows as the windows logo in WingDings...

how ironic! no doubt apple did that on purpose.

Don't forget Shift+smth and plain. Those are symbols too—just that they're ones we recognize as alphabets and numbers.

what is "smth"?? cant say i know what that key is lol!

I believe its Option-Shift-K for the logo

i know, thats how i got them to appear on the post you quoted

 

[Wikinerd]

That's because Microsoft supports older systems far longer - basically until no one cares anymore. Vista x86 still supports DOS 16-bit applications.

Windows NT runs on (or has been sold on):

• 32-bit x86
• 64-bit x64
• 64-bit Itanium
• Alpha (in 32-bit mode)
• PowerPC
• MIPS

I don't think that you know Microsoft history.

They've been on x86 since DOS... The one thing they did before that was the Altair 8080 but they needn't worry about backwards compatibility then.

What I was talking about was how they should have slowly phased out the driver model then introduce the new one. I used the PPC-Intel as an example of a good dev-friendly transition.

Menus windows (each window has its own menu system that does not change and easier to access)

That's because you're used to them, and that's fine. But according to Fitt's Law Apple's menu bar can be accessed up to five times faster.

 

[chaosconan]

Which version of Windows are you comparing against? I hope Windows 7 against OSX 10.6. The Win7 taskbar and increased use of the ribbon metaphor are definite advancements.

And for "file systems", perhaps you should look up "reparse points", 32K character length file names, volume shadow services (this is *huge*), support for huge volumes (I have some 16 TiB filesystems). Windows servers with NTFS are doing some amazing things - don't knock them just because you don't like .lnk files!

I was comparing with XP and Vista. I considered volume, disk, and shadow services part of disk management which I gave it to windows.

 

[str1f3]

Interesting article from the Washington Post on how the new Google OS may not affect Apple much:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/08/AR2009070803070.html

I don't think it affects Apple too much. I think it affects companies like Microsoft, third party browsers (ie Mozilla & Opera) , and all other Linux distros. Apple caters to the high end. It should be interesting what happens with their tablet and its pricing.

All in all I think apple is ok with this. The goal of Apple has always for the web to be open because they can thrive there. The relationship with Google right now is "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Once Microsoft is out of the picture than they can compete with each other.

Glad to see that there is an actual comment about Chrome and not another PC/Mac debate that this thread has degenerated into.

 

[AidenShaw]

What I was talking about was how they should have slowly phased out the driver model then introduce the new one.

Please explain what you mean by "driver model", since I have XP drivers that load in Vista.

I think that you're talking about major improvements in the display driver, changes that Nvidia was remarkedly slow to embrace.

I think Nvidia learned its lesson though - on the Nvidia website WHQL drivers for Windows 7 are already in the top level menu!

 

[Wikinerd]

how ironic! no doubt apple did that on purpose.

Apple probably did that first. They needed a way of typing the ... Microsoft followed, like how they did with the keyboard layout (notice how Apple's the one who merged control, alt and a command key, then called Apple-key. Microsoft followed and copied Apple's shortcuts over...)

what is "smth"?? cant say i know what that key is lol!

I mean shift + something. Shift usually gives you the capital letters and symbols, while plain gives you the plain ol' lowercase and numbers.

 

[DoFoT9]

Apple probably did that first. They needed a way of typing the ... Microsoft followed, like how they did with the keyboard layout (notice how Apple's the one who merged control, alt and a command key, then called Apple-key. Microsoft followed and copied Apple's shortcuts over...)

they have been pretty innovative, it wouldnt surprise me if they didnt invent it!

I mean shift + something. Shift usually gives you the capital letters and symbols, while plain gives you the plain ol' lowercase and numbers.

ahhhh well that makes more sense haha! im following now.

 

[chaosconan]

That's because you're used to them, and that's fine. But according to Fitt's Law Apple's menu bar can be accessed up to five times faster.

You're right about that.And this is a personal preference. I use both operating systems everyday. My personal computer is a Mac but at work were I do software development is Windows. But I do have to remind you that most operating systems out there employ a windows based menu navigation system versus desktop.

 

[Wikinerd]

Please explain what you mean by "driver model", since I have XP drivers that load in Vista.

Vista requires drivers to be signed and approved. The massive incompatibilities that were present early on was due to the number of drivers that needed rewriting because of poor code in the XP version of the driver.

You're right about that.And this is a personal preference. I use both operating systems everyday. My personal computer is a Mac but at work were I do software development is Windows. But I do have to remind you that most operating systems out there employ a windows based menu navigation system versus desktop.

Huge waste of space on the window's top bar. But they don't have that much of a choice; Apple patented & copyrighted the menubar at the top thing....

But I guess if you're used to the Windows menubar system, fine, but for a newcomer to pick up I'd say Mac OS X's menu bar system's easier because of it's proximity to the edge of the screen.

 

[Shake 'n' Bake]

Beat me to it. Google blog:http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2009...com/2009/07/introducing-google-chrome-os.html

This is huge. I'm not really a Google fan but all OSs are threatened by this just because it's Google. They are planning to open source the code so it could potentially kill off other Linux distros not to mention throwing down the gauntlet to Microsoft. If I were Apple I'd be a little scared.

You now have Google starting to create an ecosystem with Android, Chrome/OS, Search, Gmail, Gcal, etc. I wonder how long it is before they get hit with antitrust regulations by the gov't.

Sorry if this has been pointed out yet, but I didn't feel like reading the whole thread...

Apple runs its own ecosystem and, AFAIK, has never been slammed by antitrust laws.

 

[AidenShaw]

Vista requires drivers to be signed and approved.

Not all drivers...

http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/winlogo/drvsign/drvsign.mspx

The massive incompatibilities that was present was due to the number of drivers that needed rewriting because of poor code in the XP version of the driver.

LOL. People say "Windows sux because it blue screens" and then they say "Windows suxs because it refuses drivers that will blue screen".

Can't win....

Huge waste of space on the window's top bar.

vs. huge waste of motion to go up to the top of the screen (and maybe not the current screen) to get to the menu.

I'll take "menu on the window", not "menu on the screen".

Apple runs its own ecosystem and, AFAIK, has never been slammed by antitrust laws.

Wait a while, Apple will be in court over Itunes/Ipod and various monopolistic practices in that business.

Remember that Microsoft did nothing that would have been illegal for a small company. Microsoft got big, and the rules change. Apple is big in MP3 players and music downloads - their day will come.

 

[Wikinerd]

Sorry if this has been pointed out yet, but I didn't feel like reading the whole thread...

Apple runs its own ecosystem and, AFAIK, has never been slammed by antitrust laws.

Very true, Apple runs it's own ecosystem but depends on how you translate it—

Economically Apple's not a pure monopoly because of relative abundance of substitute products... As a hardware manufacturer Apple has to compete with the other 90% of the market. But the product differentiation (OS X) allows Apple to retain some control over the product (i.e. "Apple Tax"). Thus it's in monopolistic competition, which is, if I'm right, legal.

 

[chaosconan]

Huge waste of space on the window's top bar. But they don't have that much of a choice; Apple patented & copyrighted the menubar at the top thing....

But I guess if you're used to the Windows menubar system, fine, but for a newcomer to pick up I'd say Mac OS X's menu bar system's easier because of it's proximity to the edge of the screen.

Lets say you purchased 30-inch Apple Cinema HD Display and set the resolution to the highest. Is it not true that the higher resolution you go and the bigger screen you get the desktop menu system falls short? I thought this was beautifully rectified with NeXT floating menu system. But last they abandoned that model. At one time MacOS or and add-on allowed for tear-off menus basically pop-up menus to resolve the ever growing displays. But that was abandon as well.

 

[Wikinerd]

Not all drivers...

http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/winlogo/drvsign/drvsign.mspx

LOL. People say "Windows sux because it blue screens" and then they say "Windows suxs because it refuses drivers that will blue screen".

Can't win....

Nope. You can't. Either you let all drivers in, and some are bad, blue screen, or you get a lack of drivers, blue screen again.

vs. huge waste of motion to go up to the top of the screen (and maybe not the current screen) to get to the menu.

I'll take "menu on the window", not "menu on the screen".

Oh, god. Won't you read. Read my posts again. "Fitt's Law". The fact that the screen's edge limits where the cursor can go, that means that the corners are the places where it can arrives fastest, then followed by the edges of screens. Not being at the edge of the screen means the mouse might overshoot and have to recorrect the position to arrive at the button/menu.

Wait a while, Apple will be in court over Itunes/Ipod and various monopolistic practices in that business.

Remember that Microsoft did nothing that would have been illegal for a small company. Microsoft got big, and the rules change. Apple is big in MP3 players and music downloads - their day will come.

iPod? Maybe... If Apple demonstrates it can exercise a lot control who can use their products, then yes, it's a monopoly. If, say they change the prices significantly, like XP Pro to Windows Ultimate, without much repercussion, then yes, it's a monopoly. If not, it's just competition—best device wins.