Google Exec Pushing RCS Adoption Says He's 'Not Asking Apple to Make iMessage Available on Android'

[ignatius345]

Well, I don’t know anyone who uses WhatsApp or WeChat. It’s all iMessage or Messenger.

Same, but we're both in the US I suspect. Every time I've left here, people are using WhatsApp, and although I've never been to China I had to adopt WeChat when my friend lived there because it's ubiquitous.

In a perfect world, all these apps would use some interchangable standard but Facebook (sorry, "Meta") wants to keep their users silo'ed in WhatsApp for data brokering purposes and China wants users silo'ed in WeChat for surveillance purposes. Meanwhile Apple keeps user silo'ed in iMessage for hardware platform lock-in purposes. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Treq]

ONLY if you’re sending to other iMessage users. If iMessage has to fall back to SMS, then there’s a charge. For those using iMessage without unlimited SMS messaging there could be a charge for sending AND for receiving. (I think the US historically charged for both, but I think other countries handled it differently)

Yes, there MIGHT be a charge with SMS, but not for iMessage. They can shut off SMS messaging in the settings, so it will only go through iMessage if the other person has an iPhone, iPad, or Mac... and that can be determined before the message is even written. If their contact name is blue, they have an iMessage capable device. It's simple, secure, feature rich and free. Better yet, it doesn't mine your data.

 

[jonnysods]

My gosh I would never enter my Apple login credentials into an Android device, nor any other app except Apple devices for that matter.

 

[BuffaloTF]

Readers who want some facts, rather than listen to wordplay from this supercilious turnip, can read the RCS specification here directly from the publishers, the GSMA. It is completely irrelevant that standards can be extended. Just like HTML evolved over time.

Readers who want some facts, rather than denial and wordplay from this hamster head that doesn’t understand what a target feature set is, can go visit developers.google.com and try to search for any RCS or Google Messenger API for themselves. I can save you all time though - you’ll find nothing. Because the Google Messenger API is closed, allowing for zero access outside of their own app. Making this yet another closed network in a long list of closed RCS networks.

The GSMA isn't infallible... their 3G target was EDGE, after all. It wasn't until W-CDMA was created and an entirely different group of companies got together to codify UMTS from it, in a totally separate group called the 3GPP, that the GSMA backed down, adopted UMTS, sunsetted GSM and EDGE, and even tried to coin EDGE as "2.9G" to make nicey-nice with the 3GPP.

 

[techwhiz]

Clearly, SMS as a basic "default" messaging platform needs major improvement, and RCS is at least a viable option with more modern features. Apple can keep RCS messages green but it would be beneficial to everyone Apple and Android users alike if the RCS features were available as the fallback on iOS Messages instead of or in addition to SMS. Apple should not care if the green messages are SMS or RCS or both.

The problem is that Apple doesn't support RCS period.

 

[brofkand]

I don’t disagree that something better than SMS is needed, but RCS isn’t it. If it WAS, every carrier in the world would already be on board, just like with SMS, but they’re not. If they devise a solution where carriers are jumping to support it, they’ll have devised the logical successor to SMS.

The challenge there, is that carriers in non-US countries charge large amounts for SMS messaging. This would likely continue with nextgen-SMS messaging. Right now, that money is bonus on top of all other charges and fees with no outlay of cash or testing or support effort. As a result, any dollar spent on updating to nextgen-SMS messaging is a dollar that eats into that bonus… for a product that the majority of their customers actively avoid using anyway due to other solutions being readily and easily available. I’d imagine the calculations were clear years ago and they all passed on it.

The point is it doesn't matter if carriers are on board or not. Carriers aren't on board with Facebook Messenger are they? RCS is an open chat standard that any Android device can use. Apple could support it if they wanted to.

 

[Stromos]

And why would Apple do this ?

I'm NOT a fan of Tim Cook's Apple, but in this case, I think they are in the right.

Um because you only control your own phone and not what other people have? I don't get people against it. If I have to message someone with an android phone do I just want to message them or do I want to beg them to switch to Signal. Just set it up when you send a message to go through a chain (iMessage, RCS, SMS) Use the best one available. It's literally what messages does right now sans RCS. Haven't you ever messages someone with their iPhone turned off? It will actually fall back to SMS. Why wouldn't people want RCS in the mix?

 

[dba415]

This is honestly the most kindergarten thing I've ever heard. "Bullying" because the bubbles are green? I never even considered that. Blue just means that I didn't get charged SMS fees, green means that I did.

Google has some pretty big huevos to ASSUME that every green bubble MUST be android. If I turn off iMessage, then messages to other iPhones are green as well. Because... (drum roll) it's using SMS instead of iMessage. Doesn't matter what phone it is then; could be apple, could be a motorola razer. This is seriously just Google throwing a temper tantrum because they feel singled out.

Maybe they'll develop a new message standard called "Google Snowflake".

bullying because of green bubbles is a real thing amongst kids. Apple loves this bullying taking place because it makes teens need to buy an iPhone

 

[Stromos]

“Horrible”? Maybe I don’t expect much when I’m sending what’s essentially a low effort email. My criteria is, if I can read it, the communication was a success.

I would probably concede that it’s not as feature loaded of a connection, but I would have to not be able to read the text for it to be considered “horrible” to me. And, do we WANT to sunset SMS? It’s still a pretty robust way of communicating and I’d always like a fallback that’s as simple as possible. As others have said, this isn’t even a solution looking for a problem as the problem and solution is neatly encapsulated in Whatsapp, Signal, etc. Both of those run on Android and are great for folks that want to message securely across many devices, so what’s Google’s angle here?

So you're telling me that if you want to send an image or video to someone that's on Android you tell them to download Signal and set it up and they are just like oh yeah let me install this program so you can send that? The difference is if I want to send someone a picture or video it should just work. You know that used to be Apple's Motto right? Just work? The best part is it goes both ways. If an Android person needs to send me something it looks like crap because SMS is not a modern standard.

 

[thebeans]

Google for the last several years has been pushing a new communications protocol called Rich Communication Services, or RCS, which is designed to replace the current SMS standard. RCS offers support for higher resolution photos and videos, audio messages, bigger file size, improved encryption, and more.

For the last few months, Google's senior vice president of Android, Hiroshi Lockheimer, has been publicly trying to persuade Apple to adopt support for RCS, and over the weekend, he once again took to Twitter to speak out on Apple's lack of RCS support for iMessages.

On Saturday, The Wall Street Journal published an article about teens with iPhones ostracizing peers who have Android phones with "green bubble" chat messages. Lockheimer tweeted the story and accused Apple of using "peer pressure and bullying" to sell products, stating that Apple could implement RCS to solve some of the messaging issues that exist between iPhone and Android users.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1479865157753147395

Today, Lockheimer tweeted again to offer some clarification on the statement, which had sparked quite a bit of discussion on Twitter. According to Lockheimer, Google is "not asking Apple to make iMessage available on Android," the company simply wants Apple to "support the industry standard for modern messaging," aka RCS.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1480663650775883777

Lockheimer's Twitter thread offers a list of reasons why Apple should adopt RCS, such as cross-platform read receipts and typing indicators, secure 1:1 messages between Android and iPhone users, and improved group texting.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1480663656463437824

"Supporting RCS would improve the experience for both iOS and Android users alike," Lockheimer said. "That's right, RCS will also improve the experience and privacy for iOS users." By not adopting RCS, Apple is "holding back the industry" and preventing both iPhone and Android customers from having the best possible messaging interactions.

Lockheimer ended his Twitter thread by stating that Google is happy to "work with Apple" to make RCS interoperability a reality, which is something that he's said before.

Apple is the last major RCS holdout, as U.S. carriers that include Verizon, AT&T, and T-Mobile have already started adopting RCS support for Android devices. Apple has not commented either way on whether it plans to add RCS support in the future, so the company's position is still unknown.

Article Link: Google Exec Pushing RCS Adoption Says He's 'Not Asking Apple to Make iMessage Available on Android'

Im not familiar enough with this new standard to know if Apple should implement or not. But the whole peer pressure thing seems rather silly. From what I’ve seen, teens don’t really use text that much. They much prefer other forms of communication such as Instagram, Facebook messenger, etc. I have a teen. She texts with me, her mom, her aunt. Others maybe occasionally. Everything else is on another app.

 

[Stromos]

" They don’t need to solve pain points for Android."

Boom.

Thank you SJJohn. the best comment of the thread.

I can't send or receive images or videos with Android users without jumping though hoops/leaving iMessage. I am a loyal iPhone user.

BOOM!

 

[deckard666]

Google the “gold standard“ for messaging apps are asking apple to hand over a hardware selling feature to solve their own inept software ….some chance.

 

[Sphincty]

I seem to remember a similar attempt to force Apple to 'open' their iPod platform...RealPlayer anyone? That was an enjoyable smack down. The good thing about this current discussion is emails do not need to be leaked.

 

[Mikebobo]

I don't know anybody who voluntarily uses iMessage or SMS. Those are antiquated systems.

It's all WhatsApp or WeChat.

Everyone I know uses iMessage, except the few android users. WhatsApp sucks, so do other messaging services.

 

[GermanSuplex]

These arguments are getting out of hand. iMessage is a perk for iOS/Mac OS users and in no way interferes with other messaging platforms. If I was locked into using only iMessages and couldn't communicate with Android users, that would be on thing. But that is not the case.

 

[kwikdeth]

RCS sucks. I tried enabling it on my Android phone and it was a mess of randomly late and/or undelivered messages both sending and receiving. Not ready for prime time.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

The point is it doesn't matter if carriers are on board or not. Carriers aren't on board with Facebook Messenger are they? RCS is an open chat standard that any Android device can use. Apple could support it if they wanted to.

If Facebook Messenger is an ok solution for someone, then they don’t need Apple to support RCS, they can just download Facebook Messenger and be happy.

The point is, it matters ONLY if someone wants a replacement for SMS that’s as ubiquitous as SMS and NOT just another app to add to the myriad ones already in use. If THAT “use everywhere with every device” thing is what they want, carrier support is required. If not, there’s WhatsApp and Signole and Telebam and others.

 

[RONS67]

Citation needed to show that Google can and does track RCS users.

Per Michael Simon on macworld: "RCS may be superior to SMS, but many of the features overlap with iMessage and encryption isn’t as strong. Google Messages supports end-to-end encryption, but only for 1-on-1 conversations and if both users are using the Google Messages app with RCS turned on." So group chats can be snooped. You need to wake up to the fact that Google will use any loophole it can to track people, be it a technical loophole or a legal loophole.

 

[jahall05]

I find the comments here surprising. For me, Apple adopting a standard that is way secure than SMS is a win for everyone. Google is right on this. If Apple is serious about security, they should push for the adoption of this standard on iMessage. Granted Apple has no incentive to do so, but that doesn’t mean it’s not something i can root for.

Totally agree. No only is is more secure, but Apple is always bragging their user experience is better than everyone else’s and this improves the user experience. I have friends who have Android phones and really like them and the texting experience with them is not very good when compared to iMessage. I’m not asking for green bubbles to turn blue or Apple to move iMessage to Android, just adopt the new standard and make things better all around.

 

[jahall05]

Per Michael Simon on macworld: "RCS may be superior to SMS, but many of the features overlap with iMessage and encryption isn’t as strong. Google Messages supports end-to-end encryption, but only for 1-on-1 conversations and if both users are using the Google Messages app with RCS turned on." So group chats can be snooped. You need to wake up to the fact that Google will use any loophole it can to track people, be it a technical loophole or a legal loophole.

If you read the tweets from the article Google admits group chats are no encrypted but note they will be soon as they are working on it now.

 

[Warputin]

Meanwhile at Facebook HQ:
????

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Totally agree. No only is is more secure, but Apple is always bragging their user experience is better than everyone else’s and this improves the user experience. I have friends who have Android phones and really like them and the texting experience with them is not very good when compared to iMessage. I’m not asking for green bubbles to turn blue or Apple to move iMessage to Android, just adopt the new standard and make things better all around.

The only way this would happen currently would be as “just another app” (i.e. not natively in iMessage). If carriers were to step up to support it and implement it, then it would be just like SMS and MMS and be available in iMessage. However, carriers aren’t going to support it. And, if it’s gonna be “just another app”, might as well use one of the ones already in existence.

 

[carriebeary]

I find the comments here surprising. For me, Apple adopting a standard that is way secure than SMS is a win for everyone. Google is right on this. If Apple is serious about security, they should push for the adoption of this standard on iMessage. Granted Apple has no incentive to do so, but that doesn’t mean it’s not something i can root for.

I ? agree. And who the heck is out here bullying people over a green bubble? Seriously people.

 

[dba415]

My gosh I would never enter my Apple login credentials into an Android device, nor any other app except Apple devices for that matter.

If you care about privacy so much, then it's funny that Apple is forcing users to download and install WhatsApp because they don't support RCS

 

[Calaveras]

Flashes back to the 90's when people gushed about 'rich multimedia' or 'rich text support'.
I still gag a bit when I recall how people used the word 'Rich" like it was the sexiest boutique leather.