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Google's platform is so far superior to HomeKit and Siri it isn't funny. I just purchased two Google Home Minis, and the ability to give it multiple requests in a single command is fantastic. For example, I just said, "Hey, Google...turn the office lights off and tell me what the temperature is upstairs." The four Hue lights in my office turned off and it told me what the temperature is on the upstairs Nest thermostat. One request crossing multiple devices and the end result was exactly what I was expecting. Apple has a long, long way to go.
I agree that the voice capabilities of Google / Amazon are ahead of Siri, but isn't Google's platform missing automation and some of the Home-app features, like setting up rooms and rich scene creating features? HomeKit seems far ahead in these aspects, and behind in the voice capabilities. It seems as if you have to speak verbatim for Siri to recognize commands (ie: Siri sometimes doesn't understand that light and lamp can be the same thing, especially for a device that you frequently control).
 
No, it's not.

Amazon is leading the field, pretty much everything works including a $8 no-brand wifi plug, within minutes I could tell Alexa to 'turn side lamp on' and off.

We used to praise Apple Store for being the biggest back in the day, it's good to acknowledge that Apple comes a distant third in this one
Right, most everything works with Alexa. However, for nearly every practical connected item there is a HomeKit compatible version. Sure some are a bit more money, likely due to the hardware required that used to exist. Now that the hardware limitation has been removed there will likely be more and more HomeKit devices coming out.

HomeKit will never be as big as Google/Alexa. Homes that do not use iOS cannot use the system so it is obvious that Google/Alexa will have a bigger market share.
 
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Its not that similar.

the problem here is options and choices. If i want home automation, using Google / Alexa, I can take my pick from thousands of options. Even if I only end up using 2 or 3 of them in my home. I can choose which products, services and featuresets fit my home.

With HomeKit, those options are far far far more limited. So while both functionally will work once setup, I can outfit my home better overall using Google. EG: My Garage Door opener is not homekit compatible. It IS google home compatible. I can get the status of my garage door or even close it using google assistant.
I don’t see an advantage of having to sift through 1000s of choices vs having the best curated by Apple instead.
 
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Another area where Apple was one of the first to market, and let others surpass them by miles. Sad state of affairs.
 
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this is factually incorrect

Google does NOT sell your data. this has been bebunked numerous times by just about every media organization AND government agency that overseas privacy.

Yes. Google collects a LOT of data. They also do a lot of work with that data to create profiles for it's users. This part is all true. But google does NOT sell that data to anyone (as this would be a gross violation of many national laws around the world). What they sell is "ad space". They know they have X amount of users who would benefit from seeing a ad, and they sell to that ad company "we guarantee X amont of eyeballs on your ad".

stop spreading FUD on something you are woefully inadequate to talk about

We're talking past each other. Do they sell 'MallardDucks' Profile? You're right, they don't explicitly do that, but that's just a fig leaf - in practice that's exactly what happens. The threat is exactly as you point out - the ads. They sell ads based on user profiles, and track those ads. Those trackers are then correlated with other trackers, which de-anonmizes the profile. For example, if Verizon wants to market to left-handed, green necked ducks, google will kindly place an ad on those machines. If such a duck has ever visited Verizon's website, those two trackers are now connected, which de-anonmyizes the google profile data, and they now know that that particular duck flies south, and winters in palm springs, so they send targeted advertising for the local palm-springs Verizon store. When the tracking correlation expands to include two dozen trackers (which is common), building profiles on consumers is a trivial exercise.

Your bias is showing by the way. Users don't benefit from seeing an ad - the company selling the product or service benefits from having the consumer view the ad.
 
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We're talking past each other. Do they sell 'MallardDucks' Profile? You're right, they don't explicitly do that, but that's just a fig leaf - in practice that's exactly what happens. The threat is exactly as you point out - the ads. They sell ads based on user profiles, and track those ads. Those trackers are then correlated with other trackers, which de-anonmizes the profile. For example, if Verizon wants to market to left-handed, green necked ducks, google will kindly place an ad on those machines. If such a duck has ever visited Verizon's website, those two trackers are now connected, which de-anonmyizes the google profile data, and they now know that that particular duck flies south, and winters in palm springs, so they send targeted advertising for the local palm-springs Verizon store. When the tracking correlation expands to include two dozen trackers (which is common), building profiles on consumers is a trivial exercise.

Your bias is showing by the way. Users don't benefit from seeing an ad - the company selling the product or service benefits from having the consumer view the ad.

my bias? I never stated whether this is good or bad (I actively block ads and have opted out of google site tracking, which you can actually do), so your attempt to bring bias is more self reflective.


And what you said above is also untrue as the advertising that is provided by google's advertising platform aren't run by other ppeople. The ads themselves are provided TO google who serves them to you. There's no 3rd party tracking when google ads are presented.

you really don't know what you're talking about
 
Another area where Apple was one of the first to market, and let others surpass them by miles. Sad state of affairs.
Have you ever used HomeKit? It really isn't a sad state of affairs. Google can connect to 5,000 devices, why do I need that? I don't need a smart home version of a toaster or toilet seat. Just because it can connect doesn't mean that it adds anything positive to my life.

Google and Amazon have passed them because of their low cost devices and the fact that you don't need to be using an iOS device to use it. Apple is not going to dabble in the sub-$50 market like Amazon and Google is.
 
This is really disappointing. I read some months ago that Apple’s plan is to eliminate a specific hardware requirement that makes devices HomeKit compatible and make it a software based affair. The process required by manufacturers to become HomeKit compliant is both onerous and very expensive. The report cited these two issues as the reason Apple would be changing their requirements - to make HomeKit a more appealing environment and grow the range.

As much as I like our Nest thermostats (2), seven Nest Protects, and Nest Secure - I did go all in expecting HomeKit compatibility sometime this year. I started the process of updating older equipment to Nest in January. Now I’m feeling pretty let down.
 
I would not mind a bit if the 200 items are high quality. I use Hue and many times I cannot turn on / off the light using Home app or Siri because certain lights have issues. I need to go to Hue app to resolve that.
 
I agree that the voice capabilities of Google / Amazon are ahead of Siri, but isn't Google's platform missing automation and some of the Home-app features, like setting up rooms and rich scene creating features? HomeKit seems far ahead in these aspects, and behind in the voice capabilities. It seems as if you have to speak verbatim for Siri to recognize commands (ie: Siri sometimes doesn't understand that light and lamp can be the same thing, especially for a device that you frequently control).

In the case of Hue lights, rooms are configured in the Hue app, which is what both HomeKit and Google's assistant use to determine which lights are in which room. The Hue app passes the information to the "Home" app on-device, but Google is connected directly to my Hue account because I gave it my Hue credentials.
 
I don’t see an advantage of having to sift through 1000s of choices vs having the best curated by Apple instead.
Because not everything on Apple's curated list accomplishes everything that you want, with the vendors that you want.

Apple also doesn't curate this like you think (if you're comparing to the sApp Store for example). There are far less homekit options because of development costs and proprietary platform of homekit, vs open platform of the others.

so the argument here is moot for homekit.
 
I have a google home mini in my condo and while I believe it to be slightly better at command recognition; it's not better by much. I've asked for currency conversions in the 'wrong way' (that google didn't understand) and other things that get me to that 'I'm sorry I can't do that quite yet' response.

Honestly I'd trade it in for a home pod, because (and this another point that Apple has to keep on top of) the painless integration with other Apple/Apple approved products works really well.
 
Or don't actually benefit from being connected devices.

The 5,000 number sounds impressive but what does it mean? How many devices realistically can one household have and benefit from. Reminds me of Android in their land grab days, fragmentation city. Lets get as many irrelevant connected devices as possible never mind what they are!

Good point. Our new dishwasher will have a smart connectivity. I'll be notified when dishes are done washing. Right... because I don't get enough text messages, calls, emails and other notifications. Dishwasher being low on the rinse fluid is not a mission critical item... Just saying.

Also, I would take 200 well implemented solutions over 5,000 that may not be as secure, well-coded to avoid performance issues, etc. Apple has always been about quality and not quantity.
 
Apple is losing this assistant battle so bad.. they should be really concerned.

Mixed Google/Apple user and Google Assistant is just decades ahead of Siri.
 
I have a google home mini in my condo and while I believe it to be slightly better at command recognition; it's not better by much. I've asked for currency conversions in the 'wrong way' (that google didn't understand) and other things that get me to that 'I'm sorry I can't do that quite yet' response.

Honestly I'd trade it in for a home pod, because (and this another point that Apple has to keep on top of) the painless integration with other Apple/Apple approved products works really well.

Personally, I'd never trade my Google Home Minis for a HomePod. $49 is a lot easier to swallow than $349. If Siri had all of Google's smarts and then some, maybe I could talk myself into spending seven times more for the additional smarts and the vastly superior sound quality that HomePod provides over the tiny Google Home Mini. However, as both products sit today, there's not a chance in hell that HomePod is worth seven times more what a Google Home Mini costs -- at least as far as my household is concerned.
 
Most of the negativity is due to the relatively small amount of devices that it supports. HomeKit is IMO the cleanest and best platform to use, you just need to make sure the products you purchase support it.

https://www.macobserver.com/columns-opinions/editorial/alexa-beats-homekit/

It’s the best experience out there...
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my bias? I never stated whether this is good or bad (I actively block ads and have opted out of google site tracking, which you can actually do), so your attempt to bring bias is more self reflective.


And what you said above is also untrue as the advertising that is provided by google's advertising platform aren't run by other ppeople. The ads themselves are provided TO google who serves them to you. There's no 3rd party tracking when google ads are presented.

you really don't know what you're talking about

You can’t expect people on MacRumors to not blindly hate on Google these days. It’s the cool thing to do.
 
I agree that the voice capabilities of Google / Amazon are ahead of Siri, but isn't Google's platform missing automation and some of the Home-app features, like setting up rooms and rich scene creating features? HomeKit seems far ahead in these aspects, and behind in the voice capabilities. It seems as if you have to speak verbatim for Siri to recognize commands (ie: Siri sometimes doesn't understand that light and lamp can be the same thing, especially for a device that you frequently control).

Been using the Google Home/Insteon for 5 or so months now. It's fantastic. It understands scenes, lights, etc. It's awesome to be able to tell it to turn on/off lights and get statuses.

Couldn't comment on Amazon as their ASSistant is very lower in quality than Google and I have no love for their company.
 
I agree that the voice capabilities of Google / Amazon are ahead of Siri, but isn't Google's platform missing automation and some of the Home-app features, like setting up rooms and rich scene creating features? HomeKit seems far ahead in these aspects, and behind in the voice capabilities. It seems as if you have to speak verbatim for Siri to recognize commands (ie: Siri sometimes doesn't understand that light and lamp can be the same thing, especially for a device that you frequently control).

In the case of Hue lights, rooms are configured in the Hue app, which is what both HomeKit and Google's assistant use to determine which lights are in which room. The Hue app passes the information to the "Home" app on-device, but Google is connected directly to my Hue account because I gave it my Hue credentials.

There's also the very easy integration into IFTTT for both Google Assistant & Alexa, where you can choose whatever activation phrase you want, and set up as many actions as you want it to trigger. As an example, you can chose"IF Google Assistant hears you say 'I need my morning coffee', THEN switch on the bedside light, the stairs lights, and the kitchen lights to a certain level (they don't all need to be allocated to a specific room you can pick individual lights), AND turn on the kettle/coffeemaker plugged into the smart socket in the kitchen AND start streaming your favourite morning radio station on the speakers bluetooth-connected to the chromecast audio in the bedroom & kitchen". IFTTT sequences are a breeze to set up for Alexa or Google Assistant, and I've never known one to fail.
 
I wonder how many people actually use these devices, other than the first time they hooked it up. I can't picture wanting to control my dishwasher from my phone.
A thermostat makes sense, and a door lock, maybe turn a light on when you are not home.
I'm totally with you on the dishwasher, etc. But automation doesn't necessarily have to mean continual remote control.

I haven't gone further than lights (thus, the worst that black hats could do is make my house suddenly bright at night - limited potential for damage). But I use do Siri all the time to control my living room lights, setting them all in concert to various themes I've defined controlling brightness and hue (yes, I can set "rainbow" to get every light a wildly different color, but most of the themes are variations on daylight, from midday sun to very yellowish dimmer sunset, "relax"). I can control these via Siri or a Hue Dimmer Switch mounted next to the front door, or a touch panel on my homebuilt weather station/lighting console. Being able to tell Siri, "set TV time" to get a theater-like dull red glow from all the lights at once, is helpful, but being able to set the lights not just dimmer, but also way at the warmer end of the spectrum, in the later evening, turns out to be a substantial QoL improvement. I wouldn't want to go back to normal on/off/dimmable lights.

And I got tired of having my porch light controlled by either a timer that needed adjusting throughout the year, or a photocell that often made mistakes (not seeing the sky well from under the porch roof), so I took out the photocell socket and bulb, and instead put in a HomeKit-controlled iDevices Socket, and one of those socket-to-plug adaptors, and a string of weatherproof rope lights (the Socket and adaptor are inside a weatherproof box, the lights are strung around the inside edge of the porch's roof). And I told HomeKit to set up automation routines to turn the light on at sunset (at 80% brightness because that looked nice), and off at sunrise, and to drop the brightness by 10% at the top of each hour from 9pm to 3am. So, late at night, it's enough to find your keys, while early in the evening, it's a more welcoming glow. And because HomeKit is running it instead of some little timer, "sunset" actually means local sunset today and every day (same with sunrise), regardless of seasons or DST changes. It's a bit of overkill, but I've been extremely pleased with the result. This is an example of HomeKit automation that I never touch after initial setup - I'm not controlling it with my phone - and it Just Works. I could turn it on/off from anywhere in the world, but there's no need.

The trick with Home Automation is to ignore the marketing hype, look at the specs/reviews for what exactly it can do for you, and decide if that's useful. I have no use for Internet connected fridges or toasters, absolutely do not want Internet connected door locks, but... the iDevices Socket I'm happily using is one that everyone else says, "why would you use a smart socket instead of a smart bulb? Well, for this particular use, the smart socket is perfect - a smart bulb would give me a bulb outside, I wanted rope lights, and a smart plug... I had a light socket to work with, not an outdoor plug. So, it's a matter of figuring out what actually works for you.
 
Absolutely wrong. That is *exactly* their business model, and they are exceedingly good at doing it. Google maintains individual personal profiles, monitors everything that you do, tracks you across multiple devices, and while you're right that it's not the highest bidder, they will sell that information to anyone that meets the asking price. There's a fig leaf about 'anonymizing' some data, but it's trivial to reverse that and get back to a specific person due to the level of detail gathered about each individual.

If you're not paying for it, you're the product, not the customer.

When was the last time you wrote a check to Google, Facebook, Twitter, etc?
You know just because you think you know what the competition is up to and you don't like it doesn't mean Apple is doing any better (you just don't know about it).
 
Seems many here do not understand the difference between Home Automation and Home Control.
 
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