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Greenpeace Criticizes Apple's 'Daisy' Recycling Robot, Says Focus Should be on 'Repairable and Upgradeable Product Design'

69Mustang said:
While I agree with your premise, your examples need work. You could actually use items that were 1. at one time more repairable and 2. benefit greatly from the evolution of smaller, faster, higher density tech that negates some of the repairability. Our phones are a perfect example. Tablets are another. Flash/thumb drives were never in the repairability realm.
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Phones are still repairable though.. maybe not every single component, but then again almost nothing is repairable to every individual component. Additionally, in many cases, repairing is more expensive than replacing because of the labor involved. So now you have to argue that it would be beneficial to pay lower wages so that repairing made economical sense.

A few examples of things that don't need as much repairing on phones is below:

  1. Extendable Antennas (These used to break and need repairing, but we no longer have these)
  2. Flipping Mechanisms (These used to break after over use/extended use, but they no longer exist)
  3. Sliding Mechanisms (Same concept as the flipping)

Things that can still be repaired:
  1. Glass Front
  2. Glass Back
  3. Screen
  4. Battery
  5. Enclosure/Casing
  6. Lightning Port
  7. 3.5MM port (where applicable)

If your processor in the phone goes bad, the cost to repair now and even in the past always exceeded purchasing a new phone. Additionally, the screen on the new iPhone is different sizes and tech than the old phone. My iPhone X has an OLED screen, my iPhone 6 (previous phone) had an LCD screen of a differing size. So you are stuck with either forcing a manufacturer to manufacture old tech, or you are forcing standardization both of which are for the sake of repairability which could compromise innovation. I am sure there is some happy medium but I think the way they do it now is more than sufficient. These types of reports are just more attacks on an extremely successful company.

Ultimately, I agree with your premise, but your examples are poor as-well.
 
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Praesto said:
Phones are still repairable though.. maybe not every single component, but then again almost nothing is repairable to every individual component. Additionally, in many cases, repairing is more expensive than replacing because of the labor involved. So now you have to argue that it would be beneficial to pay lower wages so that repairing made economical sense.

A few examples of things that don't need as much repairing on phones is below:

  1. Extendable Antennas (These used to break and need repairing, but we no longer have these)
  2. Flipping Mechanisms (These used to break after over use/extended use, but they no longer exist)
  3. Sliding Mechanisms (Same concept as the flipping)

Things that can still be repaired:
  1. Glass Front
  2. Glass Back
  3. Screen
  4. Battery
  5. Enclosure/Casing
  6. Lightning Port
  7. 3.5MM port (where applicable)

If your processor in the phone goes bad, the cost to repair now and even in the past always exceeded purchasing a new phone. Additionally, the screen on the new iPhone is different sizes and tech than the old phone. My iPhone X has an OLED screen, my iPhone 6 (previous phone) had an LCD screen of a differing size. So you are stuck with either forcing a manufacturer to manufacture old tech, or you are forcing standardization both of which are for the sake of repairability which could compromise innovation. I am sure there is some happy medium but I think the way they do it now is more than sufficient. These types of reports are just more attacks on an extremely successful company.

Ultimately, I agree with your premise, but your examples are poor as-well.
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You could have saved a lot of keystrokes by reading and understanding my quote a little better. ;)
"Phones are still repairable though..." Nothing in my quote says they aren't repairable. I mention phones and tablets as items that were more repairable in the past, and that the improvements in technology negated some of that repairability. Everything you wrote only goes to support the meaning of my comment: Some things like phones and tablets are harder to repair now. Harder =/= not repairable. Flash/thumbdrives were never generally considered repair items. Making them poor examples of repairability.

The examples I used are fine. Your understanding of what you read? Could use some help.
 
Santabean2000 said:
The problem is rampant consumption. The never ending devouring of resources over the 'need' for the next shiny thing.

We (everyone in the top 1% especially) need to learn to live with less; be satisfied with what we have.

Stop trying to justify it.
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I have neither the desire nor the crayons to explain myself to you. :cool:

Here is an idea, you live your life and buy (or not buy) whatever you want and I will do the same. Thankfully, I don't need your permission to buy a new iPhone, iPad, Apple Watch or whatever I want, whenever I want.
 
69Mustang said:
You could have saved a lot of keystrokes by reading and understanding my quote a little better. ;)
"Phones are still repairable though..." Nothing in my quote says they aren't repairable. I mention phones and tablets as items that were more repairable in the past, and that the improvements in technology negated some of that repairability. Everything you wrote only goes to support the meaning of my comment: Some things like phones and tablets are harder to repair now. Harder =/= not repairable. Flash/thumbdrives were never generally considered repair items. Making them poor examples of repairability.

The examples I used are fine. Your understanding of what you read? Could use some help.
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Maybe your understand Could use some helping . I explicitly stated I agreed with you, yet your commend indicates you thought I didn’t. Of course my comment would build on your point, since I stated I agreed with you. I was pointing out flaws in your examples. Can you provide examples of how phones are less repairable now than 10 years ago? If not, just stating the idea/concept doesn’t hold water. My point was simple, we no longer have a need to repair many of the defective points on phones from old. They don’t have flip or sliding mechanism, they don’t have retractable antennae's. Your turn to provide some actual examples. Tablets didn’t even exist on a mass scale 10 years ago. Literally the first iPad came out 8 years ago this month. Comparing repairability in such a young product is pointless.
 
There was a time it was easy to repair (or upgrade) a Mac, something I have done many times.
iPhone 4 battery exchange was fairly easy too.

Now its more like a used tissue. :/
 
Praesto said:
Maybe your understand Could use some helping . I explicitly stated I agreed with you, yet your commend indicates you thought I didn’t. Of course my comment would build on your point, since I stated I agreed with you. I was pointing out flaws in your examples. Can you provide examples of how phones are less repairable now than 10 years ago? If not, just stating the idea/concept doesn’t hold water. My point was simple, we no longer have a need to repair many of the defective points on phones from old. They don’t have flip or sliding mechanism, they don’t have retractable antennae's. Your turn to provide some actual examples. Tablets didn’t even exist on a mass scale 10 years ago. Literally the first iPad came out 8 years ago this month. Comparing repairability in such a young product is pointless.
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This is a silly exercise. Your arbitrary 10 year limit is just that, arbitrary. A limit you imposed to bolster your point. How about we do this. You go your way, I'll go mine and we'll both benefit from it. The idea that I would support my own argument based on constraints you put on it... hard pass bud. But hey, enjoy the rest of your weekend.
 
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69Mustang said:
This is a silly exercise. Your arbitrary 10 year limit is just that, arbitrary. A limit you imposed to bolster your point. How about we do this. You go your way, I'll go mine and we'll both benefit from it. The idea that I would support my own argument based on constraints you put on it... hard pass bud. But hey, enjoy the rest of your weekend.
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No worries man, we can all make bland argumentative statements with no basis. Heck I will go as far as to say, repairability has improved on newer devices. Now similar to you, I will provide no evidence!


Edit: My 10 year was not arbitrary, cell phones have only become mass adopted in the last 30 years. And repairability was absolute **** when they first came out because no one had the knowledge or technology/tools to repair them at home. So it's completely fair to say that repairability has barely changed when accounting for the change in technology. As you said, we can both go our own ways, and if you feel the need to have the last word feel free to reply/quote my post knowing I won't respond :). Have a nice day.
 
DoctorTech said:
I have neither the desire nor the crayons to explain myself to you. :cool:

Here is an idea, you live your life and buy (or not buy) whatever you want and I will do the same. Thankfully, I don't need your permission to buy a new iPhone, iPad, Apple Watch or whatever I want, whenever I want.
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Arrogance personified.
 
Santabean2000 said:
Arrogance personified.
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I'm not the one trying to tell everyone else what they can and can't buy and what they can and can't say (i.e. "don't try to justify it"). Personally, I find people like you, who label other people as "problems" to be a lot more arrogant than people like me who mind our own business and simply look forward to buying a new phone each year.
 
DoctorTech said:
I'm not the one trying to tell everyone else what they can and can't buy and what they can and can't say (i.e. "don't try to justify it"). Personally, I find people like you, who label other people as "problems" to be a lot more arrogant than people like me who mind our own business and simply look forward to buying a new phone each year.
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It's not about me specifically. Or you.

It's individualistic thinking - "I'll do what I like!" - which is the issue here. Nevermind everyone else in this world, eh.

But wait, it's just one iPhone, right..?
 
dilbert99 said:
An I don't always agree with GreenPeace, but in this case they are right. It is obvious that repairable goods are much better for the environment that ones that are not.

Apple says they need to use copious amounts of glue every where which is just plain false. Take the battery in the MBP this is glued in unnecessarily. I recently had the similar form factor battery replaced in my Dell XPS, the engineer came to my house, whipped the cover off with a standard torx driver, unplugged the battery and swapped in a new one. Whole job was over in minutes.
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Doesn't quite work if you change your video editor for instance which might give you greater performance with an extra 16GB stick of memory. out of luck if you have a MBP
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Well you would be even if it was user accessible, it doesnt' support another 16gb of ram.
 
Cesar Battistini said:
Funny that I have an iPhone 6 and it's still VERY usable.
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What iOS are you using?

You bring up a good point though.

One thing that seems to be a common trend with Apple lately is how inconsistent the user experience has been from user to user, device to device, and also between the same user and same devices.

For example, an iOS update crippled one device of mine, while the other older device was fine with the update. My wife and I now have the same iPhone, and she had a lot of issues with iOS 10, while iOS 10 was great on mine.
 
RedKite said:
Why are so many people against repairing the devices you buy.
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Because repairable devices = worse devices. This is why the only people with an opinion such as yours are those who are complete ignorant to all relevant factors, and think they just can demand something as archaic as repairability from the most advanced technology in use today.

Clueless is the only fair and kind word to describe it.
 
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purplehaze0 said:
Then you live a very sad life flower.
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Why? Because hes not buying what Green-Sham is selling? Not many other people are either. They are totally NOT important and dont matter. Green-sham is just a fringe group thats always pissed off about something. They're professional whiners and protesters. Zero credibility. Nothing to see here.

DoctorTech said:
I'm not the one trying to tell everyone else what they can and can't buy and what they can and can't say (i.e. "don't try to justify it"). Personally, I find people like you, who label other people as "problems" to be a lot more arrogant than people like me who mind our own business and simply look forward to buying a new phone each year.
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Right? Whats up with everyne trying to control others lifestyles and choices? Buying a new tablet or phone every few years doesnt effect anyone so enough with that. Geesh.
 
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