Sidebar Sidebar
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

Gurman: Mac Studio Isn't One-Off Stopgap Product, New Models Planned

Serqetry said:
No, it really isn't. Doing this would just make Apple look bad and show that Apple Silicon can't scale.
Click to expand...

What? You apparently missed my point. It was questioned, with doubt, if there was something to put in the Mac Pro PCIe card slots.

Having a huge array of PCIe cards for a variety of engineering/scientific/research/data collection/music production/etc disciplines does not make Apple look bad.

Rather, it makes Apple look good that one can use a Mac Pro for a wide range of engineering/scientific/research/data collection/music production/etc applications

That's the reason why a powerful computer with expansion slots and a robust power supply is good.
 
Last edited:
citysnaps said:
What? You apparently missed my point. It was questioned, with doubt, if there was something to put in the Mac Pro PCIe card slots.

Having a huge array of PCIe cards for a variety of engineering/scientific/research/data collection/music production/etc disciplines does not make Apple look bad.

Rather, it makes Apple look good that one can use a Mac Pro for a wide range of engineering/scientific/research/data collection/music production/etc applications

That's the reason why a powerful computer with expansion slots and a robust power supply is good.
Click to expand...
See my post above concerning the Mac Studio expansion capabilities......
 
switz said:
See my post above concerning the Mac Studio expansion capabilities......
Click to expand...
And that's fine if your needs are modest.

Check out music producer Neil Parfitt's comments about PCIe expansion chassis driven by TB. Their performance is lacking for serious applications. Which is why he went from those to a Mac Pro with PCIe slots and found happiness.

Again, how does that "make Apple look bad" as you claimed above?
 
Right next to my my Mac Studio which is my daily driver, sits a windows machine with a RTX4090. For Almost everything, the M series Macs are great, but for graphics work they have a long way to go. I was hoping the Mac Studio could completely replace my Windows machine, but i guess we will have to wait.
 
  • Like
Reactions: gusmula and TheYayAreaLiving 🎗️
ThisBougieLife said:
It will be interesting to see how the Mac Pro is differentiated from the Mac Studio, if they will end up using the same processors.
Click to expand...
Only difference if they can pull it off is the Mac Pro will be expandable with bus slots and what I've read they are experimenting with expanding to secondary RAM. But things I've read this development is not going well Apple silicon wasn't designed with expandability in mind.
 
So one should buy an existing Intel MacPro if their needs are immediate and load it up with all they need. Probably will be a significant dent in the bank account. Most likely only a major player is willing to drop tens of thousands on one computer.

But what percentage of Mac sales are/were MacPro sales? As many have posted, Apple is loosing their position in the big machine market place. What is the potential market for these literally super computers to offset the R&D and building costs?

There has to be a starter machine and I would think the Mac Studio with the Sonnet expansion could be such a machine. Also it can be a portable setup as shown in the Sonnet literature. A MacPro tower is not very portable.

But there are currently Apple choices for the potential buyer which is wonderful.

Maybe the Apple "vaporware" becomes "hardware" and maybe not.
 
MacRumors said:


Apple plans to release at least two new Mac Studio models in the future, according to Bloomberg's Mark Gurman. This information suggests that the Mac Studio was not a one-off stopgap product amid the wait for the first Mac Pro with Apple silicon.

mac-studio-thumbnail.jpg

In his newsletter today, focused on new MacBooks and other announcements planned for WWDC, Gurman briefly mentioned that "there are also two Mac Studio follow-ups planned, but their timing is less clear." He did not share further details about the new models, so tech specs and release timing remain unknown for now.

Apple released the Mac Studio and its companion Studio Display in March 2022. The high-end desktop computer is available with Apple's M1 Max and M1 Ultra chips, with pricing for these configurations starting at $1,999 and $3,999, respectively. The higher-end Mac Studio with the M1 Ultra chip is currently the fastest Mac ever released.

In February, Gurman said the next Mac Pro would be equipped with an M2 Ultra chip and offer "very similar" functionality as the Mac Studio. As a result, he said it "wouldn't make sense" for Apple to release a Mac Studio with an M2 Ultra chip, suggesting that the computer might not be updated until M3 Max and M3 Ultra chips are ready at least. If so, the next Mac Studio would likely be released in 2024 at the earliest.

Article Link: Gurman: Mac Studio Isn't One-Off Stopgap Product, New Models Planned
Click to expand...
Just wish Apple would just kill off the Mac Pro and be done with it Apple Silicon wasn't designed for expandable computer. I wish Apple would just declare the Mac Studio the replacement for Mac Pro.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Serqetry
docbop said:
Only difference if they can pull it off is the Mac Pro will be expandable with bus slots and what I've read they are experimenting with expanding to secondary RAM. But things I've read this development is not going well Apple silicon wasn't designed with expandability in mind.
Click to expand...

It just seems weird--it's like they didn't see this coming and were blindsided by Apple Silicon not working well with expandability. How could they not know what was going to happen?
 
  • Like
Reactions: gusmula
switz said:
This Sonnet enclosure for a Mac Studio includes an expansion capability for up to three PCIe cards

xMac Studio - SONNETTECH

3U enclosure to install and secure one Mac Studio with optional PCIe card expansion in a standard 19-inch rack.
www.sonnettech.com www.sonnettech.com

So in the real world there is expansion for external cards for the existing 2022 Mac Studio. I am sure more will come along to join the show as all the talk about a "M" powered Mac Pro up to now is about "vaporware" and not real "hardware".

As I have no interest in this expansion as my fully loaded Mac Studio does what I need, I lack the knowledge about the range of these extra boards and their mechanical requirements. But a chassis that can support a road ready system is operational now.
Click to expand...
Someone will have to write the drivers for whatever cards you put in there since MacOS doesn't have them. It's not nearly as easy as you think! Apple discontinued support for eGPU's for some reason...
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheYayAreaLiving 🎗️
Serqetry said:
Doing this would just make Apple look bad and show that Apple Silicon can't scale.
Click to expand...

Each generation of the M-series SoC has added CPU and GPU cores so even if Ultra (2xMax) remains the "top chip", it will likely continue to add cores over the generations and each core will become more powerful so Apple Silicon will continue to scale at a rate sufficient for the markets Apple targets a Mac Pro at - and those markets do not include high-end workstation / server (just as they never did when Macs used PowerPC and Intel CPUs). Those markets will continue to be the domain of Intel and AMD running Windows and Linux/Unix.


switz said:
But what percentage of Mac sales are/were MacPro sales?
Click to expand...

It is a bit hard to parse, but at the 2017 Pro Event Phil Schiller said the following: "Notebooks are by far and away our most popular systems used by pros. Second on the list is iMacs...Third on the list is Mac Pro. Now, Mac Pro is actually a small percentage of our CPUs — just a single digit percent."

Now Schiller was also talking about users running "professional" software on macOS, so this may be single-digit of all Mac sales or single-digit of Macs running "professional" software. Either way, it is still going to be less than 10% of all Mac sales since at the time the MacBook Air and MacBook Pro made up over 80% of all Mac sales so the Mac Pro was the second most-popular desktop model after the iMac and I expect the iMac made up the significant majority of Apple desktop sales, followed likely by Mac Pro and then Mac mini with the sliver that was left.
 
Is the memory size limitation due to lack of "real estate" space on the all in one chip? Wonder if the magic web connecting two MAX chips into an Ultra could use another piece of the same magic web to expand memory going out the other side of one of the ships or stacked below the Ultra?
 
switz said:
Is the memory size limitation due to lack of "real estate" space on the all in one chip? Wonder if the magic web connecting two MAX chips into an Ultra could use another piece of the same magic web to expand memory going out the other side of one of the ships or stacked below the Ultra?
Click to expand...

I would think Apple could create an external memory controller chip and bus to connect to traditional DIMMs, but it would be significantly slower than the on-package RAM currently used with the M-series, though it would be a fair bit faster than page swapping to SSD, which M-series SoCs can currently do.
 
Serqetry said:
And I see no reason for Apple to make a Mac Pro with the same CPU as the Mac Studio... and I'm betting Apple feels the same way.
Click to expand...

General speculation was that Apple would offer the Ultra model SoC in addition to a 2xUltra "Extreme" model. MajinBu did post schematics of an enhanced UltraFusion connector that would support a 4xMax configuration.

Bloomberg has reported that Apple did sample production of an "M1 Extreme" that used four M1 Max, but that the manufacturing costs were so high (likely due to poor yields) that the BTO price would overwhelm any value such an SoC would offer and therefore not enough customers would select it to make it worth offering.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tagbert
docbop said:
Just wish Apple would just kill off the Mac Pro and be done with it Apple Silicon wasn't designed for expandable computer. I wish Apple would just declare the Mac Studio the replacement for Mac Pro.
Click to expand...
From what we know about Apple Silicon, I think you are 100% right.

However, I think Apple must have something else up their sleeve. If we get a new Mac Pro, it's not going to have an M2 Ultra. They will have to come up with something different. They need a new class of ARM CPUs for something like the Mac Pro.

If not, then yeah, they should just retire the Pro.
 
bobcomer said:
Someone will have to write the drivers for whatever cards you put in there since MacOS doesn't have them. It's not nearly as easy as you think! Apple discontinued support for eGPU's for some reason...
Click to expand...
It's a hardware issue with the M series, not a driver issue.
 
  • Wow
Reactions: gusmula
mdriftmeyer said:
Apple's unified memory model needs to expand allowing direct PCI-e access in order to leverage external GPU/DPU/dedicate AI cards, etc., that run over PCI-e.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately Apple doesn't agree that they need to expand it.
 
Last edited:
rpmurray said:
Yeah, same was said for the iMac Pro, and look what Apple did with that. Really, I don't see what niche the Mac Studio fills that couldn't be filled with a Mac Mini (or two).
Click to expand...
The Mac Studio has either a Max or Ultra SOC. No Mac Mini does. The Mini is a nice low cost device but doesn’t have the power that a lot of people need. That is why there is a Mac Studio.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Serqetry, haddy and TheYayAreaLiving 🎗️
Ethosik said:
Just please fix the annoying fan whine issue. I would take a louder fan over a very faint whine that is nails on a chalkboard. If this is done this will be a perfect product that fits my needs.
Click to expand...
Can't you go to Apple with that? None of the 20 Studio's in my company have that problem.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.
Top Bottom
Back