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bartelby said:
I've got to say I don't really care!
It was a fancy dress party!!!!
Would there be a fuss if a 'normal' person went dressed the same?
No!
If the press didn''t blow things totally out of proportion...well they wouldn't sell papers.

Blue Velvet said:
If you can't see this for what it is, then I despair...

It's a massive insult to millions of people and their descendants. The Nazi swastika is a symbol of rascism, fascism and state-sponsored genocide. Even the BNP draw the line at openly displaying Nazi regalia... there's nothing 'ironic' or amusing about the swastika. It's a gross act of insensitivity...

Also, the point is: he's not a 'normal' person, he's 3rd in line to the throne, lives an extremely comfortable life courtesy of the UK taxpayer, and is therefore at one level, a representative of the UK nation.

Sorry I'm late to the discussion, but I've been talking with people I know about this for a little while and to be honest I can see every angle:

1. It was a fancy dress party
2. He knew exactly what he was doing
3. It's hard being born into public scrutiny like he has been.
4. Even as 3rd in line to the throne, he's doubtful ever to take any position of massive responsibility
5. As a British male of a similar age to him I can understand his "rebellious" feelings
6. If anyone turned up to a "fancy dress" party at my house in a Nazi costume, they wouldn't be there for long.

Hob
 
Costume

virividox said:
i want to know where harry got that costume, i did a quick google search and didnt really find anything
Cotswold Costumes in Nailsworth(I have friends there,quite a nice place actually fairly alternative).About the royal family,given their history I'm surprised they didn't have them in stock(see princess michael of Kent and edward the VIII).My Personal opinion they should all be strung up on lamposts(Regent street would be good,outside the Apple store.Diana was the only vaugely human one and she(as they constantly harped on about) was a commoner.(hey I've been up and working for 18 hours) :mad:
 
One of the tabloids...

...this morning was reporting that he tried to order a SS uniform but that the costumers didn't have one in his size.

SS Uniform?

Slightly fetishistic and also a little troubling.
 
GonzoRob said:
jesus, what a clever comment! ... No, he cant abdicate from his postition.. he's a prince. That title is given to him as a birth right - he cant escape it. As he has been apointed *no* position, just a title, he therefore can not abdicate from any role....
Yes, he could run away from his family and home.. but who really does that ? AND thats not abdication anyway

go and read a book, not The Sun.

Rob


Whoopsie daisy... I knew when I originally typed abdicate something clicked in the back of my head, I just couldn't think what. I mean renounce from his royal responsibilities.

He won't do of course, my point though was in answer to a post, that if he's so fed up from having his strings pulled, he could walk away from it all as opposed to behaving like a total tit.

Anyway it's not the first mistake I've made and it won't be the last... ;)
 
Blue Velvet said:
...this morning was reporting that he tried to order a SS uniform but that the costumers didn't have one in his size.

SS Uniform?

Slightly fetishistic and also a little troubling.

while i would consider a wehrmacht uniform extremly stupid thing a SS uniform (while not being much different on the lower ranks) is "playing in a different league" ...

(and then i would consider it as rather sick and disturbing)
 
iGAV said:
Whoopsie daisy... I knew when I originally typed abdicate something clicked in the back of my head, I just couldn't think what. I mean renounce from his royal responsibilities.

He won't do of course, my point though was in answer to a post, that if he's so fed up from having his strings pulled, he could walk away from it all as opposed to behaving like a total tit.

Anyway it's not the first mistake I've made and it won't be the last... ;)

No worries, luckily we all (most of us) :rolleyes: knew what you meant and understood the implied dynamic of the situation. If everyone had picked up on that point we would be discussing eligibility for abdication rather than what makes third on the bench act like a nut job. :) :rolleyes:
 
bartelby said:
I've got to say I don't really care!
It was a fancy dress party!!!!
Would there be a fuss if a 'normal' person went dressed the same?
No!
If the press didn''t blow things totally out of proportion...well they wouldn't sell papers.
Actually in Germany you go straight to prison if they catch you in a "fancy dress" like this. Showing the swastika like this is breaking the law here...

groovebuster
 
groovebuster said:
Actually in Germany you go straight to prison if they catch you in a "fancy dress" like this. Showing the swastika like this is breaking the law here...

groovebuster

yeah it would be hard to claim educational purpose with having a beer in your hand ... ;)

(reminded me of the thing one guy did in austria 5 years ago at the "wiener opernball" where he got himself driving in front of the red carpet in a rented white rolls royce, wearing a hitler costume (with makeup, fake moustache and complete uniform) as a protest against the opernball which costs lots of taxpayer money every year)
 
Should it really be such a big deal if he dresses as a nazi to a fancy dress party? The royal family barely have any power these days anyway, but I don't think Harry's a Nazi. He just happens to be a little more open minded than most of the royal family and "the Sun" :p I say let him do what he wants.
 
bartelby said:
Would there be a fuss if a 'normal' person went dressed the same?

That's an interesting question. Funnily enough my answer is exactly opposite from yours. Not only would there be a "fuss", a "normal" person dressing up like a nazi to go to a fancy dress party would probably get a well-deserved kicking or at the very least be booed and jeered and shamed into seclusion for the next two weeks.

Unless he was going to a neonazi-only meeting, of course.

I'd understand if he was 14. At 20 you're supposed to be a bit less clueless and stupid. Obviously growing up so privileged means no one tells you when you're being a moron!

Anyway. At least he had the sense not to add moustaches... ! Here's one of the other highly sensitive fancy dress choices he was considering:

prince_harry_tidal_wave.jpg
 
Blue Velvet said:
...this morning was reporting that he tried to order a SS uniform but that the costumers didn't have one in his size.

SS Uniform?

Slightly fetishistic and also a little troubling.

Only if he wanted the matching hand-cuffs :rolleyes:
 
They really had it splattered all over CNN last night. One of the anchors was interviewing a Rabbi and asked why there was such a big deal about it since Broadway was currently running Mel Brooks' "The Producers", which featured a musical number called "Springtime for Hitler". The Rabbi answered to the effect that Mel Brooks wasn't an English Prince (there's a thought!), and it was in bad taste anyway. I thought the coverage was a little overdone, though.

Now I hear that Harry is planning to make a trip to Auschwitz to make amends.

BTW, those of you wishing to see Nazi humor in it's proper place, check out the Three Stooges film "I'll never Heil again". Moe plays Hitler, Curly Goering, and Larry Goebbels. It was filmed before America entered the war, and totally rips on Hitler and the axis. The best part was Hitler was known to have watched Stooges shorts, so it is slightly possible that he saw this parody.

blackfox said:
Rather off-topic( since most of my sentiments on the matter-at-hand have been mentioned), but I am again reminded of the brilliance of whomever designed the German/Nazi-era uniforms.

Without a doubt, they are the most attractive-looking uniforms ever worn by a country's military forces. Even the swastika was a stroke of design/marketing genius.

I once got in a discussion with a professor about this. We concluded:

German uniforms: Overall best looking, very martial and frightening especially in the case of the black SS uniforms. Paratrooper uniforms had best camo.

Italian uniforms: Excellent style, but too fancy, almost effeminate. Best as a dress uniform.

French Uniforms: They looked like firemen with those helmets, even if Churchill swore by them. Meh.

American: Plain, but well made and functional. fairly boring except for Patton's personal modifications.

British: cf. American for infantry, though their officer's uniforms were probably the best of the allies, until Italy switched sides (nice to have a good tailor about). Best Naval uniforms, though the Germans were close.

Soviets: Well, they certainly LOOKED proletarian. Higher officers had more fruit salad on their chest than anyone except Mussolini or Goering. Very utilitarian.

Japanese: most old-school, with the leggings. Officers carried swords, though.
 
Peterkro said:
Diana was the only vaugely human one and she(as they constantly harped on about) was a commoner.(hey I've been up and working for 18 hours) :mad:

Diana - a commoner? Errrm - no.

She was also a toff - Lady Diana Spencer - before she married Charles. If anything, her family is more establishment than the Windsors. She was also a cynical publicity hound.


Nobody seems to have mentioned that the party was themed on "Colonials and Natives" which begs two questions:
1. Isn't this worse (a bit like a "Masters and Slaves" pary in America)?
2. What in god's name was Harry doing dressing as a German soldier?
 
Benj said:
1. Isn't this worse (a bit like a "Masters and Slaves" pary in America)?
2. What in god's name was Harry doing dressing as a German soldier?

1. So he chose to go as "the master race" :rolleyes:
2. Maybe it was a bit of a Bridget Jones moment... He turned up in a Nazi uniform, expecting some kind of Military re-enactment only to be told "oh, didn't anyone call you to tell you we changed the theme?"

Sorry, I know this whole thing's been quite offensive to some people, but it's gettin really old really quick... He's apologised, I think he should be left well alone...

Hob
 
bartelby said:
I've got to say I don't really care!
It was a fancy dress party!!!!
Would there be a fuss if a 'normal' person went dressed the same?
No!
If the press didn''t blow things totally out of proportion...well they wouldn't sell papers.

I live in Chicago and while I can't speak for everyone here by a long shot... but..... look, if someone showed up wearing that shizzle at the kind of parties I go to he'd be lucky to make it out alive. A sound beating in the press is nothing.
 
Kettle said:
It's quite obvious you don't, thanks for your balanced opinion.

Yes, it is my opinion, and no, it wasn't supposed to be balanced. I dislike the Royal Family. I don't think they provide value for money and I think they are an anachronism. Lords of the realm are no longer allowed to sit in the House of Lords (the British second chamber of Parliament, similiar to the U.S. Senate) on the basis of hereditary - it's seen as old fashioned and hence has been abolished. If hereditary Lords are no longer appropriate for 21st century Great Britain, why is a hereditary monarchy? Both are equally steeped in tradition. People should get where they are based on merit, not on the basis of long-dead family members who were favourites of Henry VIII or Elizabeth I, or who their parents happen to be.

When Harry dresses up in Nazi regalia, fights with photographers outside nightclubs, smokes cannabis, I disapprove. When Prince Charles laments the state of the British education system and protests against it giving children what he perceives as ideas above their station, I disapprove. When Prince Phillip makes racist, insensitive comments, I disapprove. When Prince Edward runs a vanity TV production company (losing lots of (presumably taxpayer) money) and interviews his nephew Prince William in violation of a press agreement (which includes his media company) not to harass William, the heir to the throne and his wife makes ill-advised comments to press members who are dressed as Arab sheiks, I object. Ought not they, the Royals, be an example to the rest of us? The Queen never does anything distasteful or stupid. Princess Anne is very well behaved and does a lot for charity. Why can't the male members of the House of Windsor be more like the female ones?

My views are not supposed to be balanced. I did not intend to present them as such. They are tainted by my belief that we should not have a monarchy and should allow the Windsors to live out their existence in private, without the press harrassing them. In addition, my comments were supposed to be light-hearted. I think some readers got that impression. Evidently you did not.

Kettle said:
Are you deliberately trying to show how disgusting you can be? Presumably this is humour? It's not like he has attended a dinner in remembrance of the liberation of Auschwitz is it? He was at a private party, and personally in that context I find in very amusing that someone frequently referred to as a Nazi (among other derogatory names) because of his accident of birth, can see beyond the self importance of accidental position.

Errr, no. You really are hypersensitive aren't you (but then again, you find it "amusing" that he prances around wearing a Nazi armband and attends a party called "Colonials and Natives")? I was angry with Prince Harry. I found his action, to coin an expression, "disgusting". I thought he made an unforgivable error of judgement, especially crass when we're about to commemerate the liberation of Auschwitz. Acts committed by the Nazis are still fresh in the minds of many survivors of the death camps, including those of British citizens. The Third Reich was, to my mind, one of the worst eras in human history. I've read a 1600 page two-part biography of Hitler. I've read about the Nazis. I have a copy of "Mein Kampf", a truly hideous, despicable book that I dare not read. I don't believe you should make light of the atrocities committed by the Nazis, especially if you are an heir to the throne, supposedly a responsible, mature adult who provides leadership and inspiration for millions of Britains and other people across the world. Prince Harry showed an alarming naivity in his actions. I hope he learns something from them and becomes a better person. Whether he does remains to be seen. I hope he goes to Auschwitz with the British delegation and takes some time to learn what happened and reflect upon it.

Kettle said:
You're out for one thing and that's blood. What would you say to his family after you had personally lined him up, blindfolded, against the wall and shown no sympathy at all? Would you pull the trigger or would you order someone else to do it?

No. I'm out for responsible behaviour from our so-called "betters". Harry and his family should behave in an appropriate manner for members of a monarchy. He does not do that. As for the rest of your comment, I have already mentioned I wrote in the heat of the moment. I do not believe Prince Harry (or any of the Royals) should be shot. I believe in a peaceful transition to a republic and allowing the Royal Family to live in peace. Do you ever have the red mist descend, when you're particularly riled by something and happen to write something that you would not, in normal circumstances do? Are you really that perfect? Sure, maybe it was a bit over the top, but what's done is done.

We live in a free society. I am entitled to my views. You are entitled to yours. Each person's views are just as valid. You may not like my opinions. So be it.

Will you be admonishing Peterkro for his "hang 'em from the lampposts in front of the Apple Store" comment? I look forward to reading your views on that post.

Apologies to Kettle and all for the length of this rebuttal.
 
Lord Blackadder said:
BTW, those of you wishing to see Nazi humor in it's proper place, check out the Three Stooges film "I'll never Heil again". Moe plays Hitler, Curly Goering, and Larry Goebbels. It was filmed before America entered the war, and totally rips on Hitler and the axis. The best part was Hitler was known to have watched Stooges shorts, so it is slightly possible that he saw this parody.

Moe was actually placed on Hitler's death list for that one. Apparently, Hitler wasn't too fond of the Stooges although he knew of them.
 
hob said:
1. So he chose to go as "the master race" :rolleyes:
2. Maybe it was a bit of a Bridget Jones moment... He turned up in a Nazi uniform, expecting some kind of Military re-enactment only to be told "oh, didn't anyone call you to tell you we changed the theme?"

Sorry, I know this whole thing's been quite offensive to some people, but it's gettin really old really quick... He's apologised, I think he should be left well alone...

Hob

I agree - if the Board of Jewish Deputies can accept the apology and move on then I don't see why the media can't.

Hilarious quote earlier from someone saying British soldiers died to protect our freedoms and this is a big insult etc etc. Errrm - wouldn't one of those freedoms be to act like a pillock?

For me the irony is that the biggest critics of Harry are the usually guardedly anti-semitic left-wing media (Grauniad, Indie, BBC) who never miss a chance to try and nail Israel. Oh well.
 
Prince Harry is not a Nazi, But you are a Hypocrite.

To everyone here pointing their fingers at Prince Harry and saying 'How awful' I have to ask this: have you played Medal of Honour or Call of Duty and selected to fight for the 'Axis' online? If the answer is yes then you have no right to think yourself better than Prince Harry.

This is a press-created scandal. They took a photograph out of context (a military-themed fancy dress party) and printed it on their front pages next to big letter headlines. Is it any surprise that Jewish organisations and Israel are upset about this? No, of course not. Would they be equally upset if the story was about Prince Harry playing as an 'Axis' soldier in Medal Of Honour? You can bet on it.

Prince Harry is not the anti-semite the media has made him out to be. Dressing up as a Nazi in a fancy dress party does not say anything substantial about his political opinions. Likewise, attending a fancy dress party wearing the Scream mask does not make you a serial killer, but it would upset anyone who has been affected by such a killer as much as Jews are upset about the costume Prince Harry wore.

Royal scandals like this are politically motivated. In England a lot of people resent the Monarchy and stories like this give them the opportunity to express their opinions.
 
It's amazing that any (non-Nazi) members of the western world would still consider wearing a Nazi outfit not to be in anything but incredibly bad taste. On the other hand, it's amazing what you see people wearing in places where the Nazis were never really an issue:

macauguy.jpg


Yes, that says "White Power", and yes, that guy is Chinese. I took that photo (a bit blurry because I needed to take it quickly before the guy disappeared) in Macau over the summer - the guy was just walking around, and no one seemed to notice or care what he was wearing.

There's a Hong Kong clothing company called "http://www.izzue.com/" that, about a year or two ago, decided to do a series of military-inspired designs. They did US Army Rangers, then went straight to WWII Germany. Their stores were decorated with giant swastika banners and most of their clothes had some sort of Nazi insignia on them. The Israeli and German consulates were both *very* unimpressed, and demanded the company stop selling the clothes. The company's response was "the only people who care a foreigners", and only after a week or two of haranguing did they switch their designs to something else.

I'm sure some day I'll hear a report of some poor Hong Kong teenager getting beaten up after wearing his Nazi gear, quite unaware of its meaning, on an overseas trip.
 
spikeovsky said:
It's amazing that any (non-Nazi) members of the western world would still consider wearing a Nazi outfit not to be in anything but incredibly bad taste. On the other hand, it's amazing what you see people wearing in places where the Nazis were never really an issue:

macauguy.jpg


Yes, that says "White Power", and yes, that guy is Chinese. I took that photo (a bit blurry because I needed to take it quickly before the guy disappeared) in Macau over the summer - the guy was just walking around, and no one seemed to notice or care what he was wearing.

There's a Hong Kong clothing company called "http://www.izzue.com/" that, about a year or two ago, decided to do a series of military-inspired designs. They did US Army Rangers, then went straight to WWII Germany. Their stores were decorated with giant swastika banners and most of their clothes had some sort of Nazi insignia on them. The Israeli and German consulates were both *very* unimpressed, and demanded the company stop selling the clothes. The company's response was "the only people who care a foreigners", and only after a week or two of haranguing did they switch their designs to something else.

I'm sure some day I'll hear a report of some poor Hong Kong teenager getting beaten up after wearing his Nazi gear, quite unaware of its meaning, on an overseas trip.

its unfortunate that some people arent senstive, i wouldnt dare wear any thing like that ever.
 
Mechcozmo said:
Moe was actually placed on Hitler's death list for that one. Apparently, Hitler wasn't too fond of the Stooges although he knew of them.
I have to see that! :D

And on the Producers, Springtime for Hitler was the name of the musical produced by the main characters (played by Zero Mostel and Gene Wilder in the movie). The audience was disgusted, until "Hitler" came on stage. For those who haven't seen it, just try to imagine this: Hitler, speaking like a hippy. ;)

As for the "royal" family, we got rid of that problem 230 or so years ago, and look where it's gotten us :D



oh **** look where it's gotten us :(
 
Sol said:
To everyone here pointing their fingers at Prince Harry and saying 'How awful' I have to ask this: have you played Medal of Honour or Call of Duty and selected to fight for the 'Axis' online? If the answer is yes then you have no right to think yourself better than Prince Harry.

This is a press-created scandal. They took a photograph out of context (a military-themed fancy dress party) and printed it on their front pages next to big letter headlines. Is it any surprise that Jewish organisations and Israel are upset about this? No, of course not. Would they be equally upset if the story was about Prince Harry playing as an 'Axis' soldier in Medal Of Honour? You can bet on it.

Prince Harry is not the anti-semite the media has made him out to be. Dressing up as a Nazi in a fancy dress party does not say anything substantial about his political opinions. Likewise, attending a fancy dress party wearing the Scream mask does not make you a serial killer, but it would upset anyone who has been affected by such a killer as much as Jews are upset about the costume Prince Harry wore.

Royal scandals like this are politically motivated. In England a lot of people resent the Monarchy and stories like this give them the opportunity to express their opinions.

I haven't seen any reports calling him anti-semitic(at least in the broadsheets in U.K.) they are just pointing out what a ignorant **** he is.As several people pointed out what sort of people have a colonist and native themed party,These people dont live in the real world.By the way that photo was taken by one of his yahoo mates and touted round the tabloids with the Sun buying it and then flogging the rights around the world.So the dirty digger is the main player.
 
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